One in three nurses 'do not want swine flu vaccine'

[Hannah Bell]

Almost a third of nurses will refuse the offer of immunisation against swine flu because they have fears about the vaccine's safety, according to a new survey.

The initial response from frontline health staff, one of the government's priority groups for vaccination this autumn, was dismissed by the Department of Health, however, as irresponsible and ill-informed.

The apparent reluctance to be among the first to receive the new vaccine emerged in a survey of 1,500 nurses carried out by the weekly Nursing Times. Overall, 30% of respondents to the magazine's online questionnaire replied 'no' when asked if they would seek to be immunised when the vaccine became available; only 37% said 'yes', while a further 33% remained answered 'maybe'.

The opinion poll, released less than a week after the health department revealed its timetable for immunisation, appears to reflect anxieties about receiving a vaccine not yet licensed for public use. That approval is expected to be given by the European Medicines Agency by the end of September or early October.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/18/nurses-swine-flu-vaccine-safety

[katkat]

1. be wary

Speaking as someone who suffered permanent neurological damage from my first flu shot, I caution everyone to become informed about the consequences of vaccinations before deciding about them. The medical profession acts like these are risk free and glosses over the complications.

The New York Times had an article just within the past few days on the effects of the cervical cancer vaccine, which you may recall some states were rushing to make mandatory not so long ago (I forget if any actually did):

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/19/health/research/19vaccine.html

"Of the total number of reports, 6.2 percent, or 772 reports, were considered serious events, including 32 reports of death."

[Joanne98]

2. My son and I got the swine flu shot in 76'. No problem at all.

In fact there was a benefit. Neither one of us got a cold for 5 years. It was great.

[surrealAmerican]

44. Flu shots do not offer any protection from colds.

The fact that neither of you got a cold for 5 years was completely unrelated to the swine flu vaccine.

[ejpoeta]

3. i am not getting any vaccine for this. i really am not concerned with getting it

anymore than with the flu. i find interesting a news story they did this morning about how ill equipped the county is to handle such a feat. last year they tried to give shots to 20,000 people because of a hepatitis b outbreak and they could not really handle that.... and trying to do a mass vaccination for swine flu that would be exponentially larger... . they don't think they can handle it.

[boobooday]

4. I work at a university, and we have been warned about the number of cases expected

I am also in a group that is always encouraged to get the flu vaccine, including this one. I'm not sure yet what to do. For some reason I feel more concerned about the vaccine than the flu . . .

[TheWatcher]

5. "For some reason I feel more concerned about the vaccine than the flu . . ."

You should.

[LeftishBrit]

12. Similar situation to yours...

and in fact I usually don't get the flu vaccine. My policy has been to only get it in years when a major outbreak is predicted. As this is the case with the swine flu, I think I will get that one, when it becomes available.

[S_E_Fudd]

31. I get a flu shot every year....

And I will happily take the place of anyone that does not want to get their Swine FLu shot this year...

[Warpy]

36. Perhaps you and the nervous nellies the Guardian is citing

will feel a bit better about the whole thing once the vaccine has gone through the appropriate testing and has been licensed.

This is not the 1976 vaccine, not even close.

Even the name "swine flu" is misleading since pigs got it from infected people and not the other way around.

It was only slightly better than calling it the Mexican flu after the first hot spot. Mexicans have enough problems already.

Even though I probably have a partial immunity left over from a similar flu epidemic in the early 50s, I'll get this one.

The last flu I got damned near killed me.

[boobooday]

38. This nervous nellie would definitely feel better

after appropriate testing.

[stray cat]

6. How many people get seriously ill or die from the flu versus a shot? Be informed!

and do your homework. Otherwise you are no better informed than those we condemn on free republic. Read the science literature and legitimate sites with real data instead of places with reputations worse than fox news.

As a nurse - you are risking the life of your patients who are already suffering conditions that make them more susceptible. Nurses and health care providers are often the most dangerous to patients. You spread virus even before you feel sick and for days after you think you recovered- a regular typhoid mary. Should doctors with active TB meet with you when you are sick in the hospital?

[LeftishBrit]

11. I got the 1968 pandemic flu from a doctor when I was a small child in hospital for a different

problem.

Fortunately I recovered without serious consequences; but I'm sure this sort of thing happens a bit too often.

[dana_b]

19. excellent points

we have already had two healthy nurses get it after taking care of patients with H1N1. I wonder how many people they cam in contact with the day or two they worked before becoming ill including their other patients?

I too am, a nurse and will definitely be getting and giving the vaccine.

[truedelphi]

37. Perhaps you don't know this, but in many cases,

Since the shot can infect the person with an illness, you can spread disease after having the vaccine.

For instance, the many many nurses who put their careers on the line to protest the decision to have the smallpox shot should be commend4ed. That vaccine would have resulted in patients in the hospital contracting the disease and dying - just from the exposures they would have received from being around the smallpox vaccinated people.

People who have organ transplants are on meds that impair their bodies ability to slough off disease exposure. So do those on certain cancer drugs. So do AIDS patients.

In the end, the many nurses and other health practitioners prevailed and the Donald Rumsfeld decision to aid Big Pharma with mandatory smallpox vaccinations was dismantled.

[LeftishBrit]

43. This is only a risk when live viruses are used

The smallpox vaccine involves not smallpox but the live virus of the much milder related disease vaccinia. So no one could get actual smallpox from the vaccine, but for a few people even the mild virus could be dangerous. I understand that people were recommended not to have the vaccine if they had serious immunity problems or certain other conditions such as severe eczema. As regards risk to others: I believe that people who have had the smallpox vaccine should avoid contact with those at risk from it for about a week after being vaccinated. However, it isn't a long-term effect. In any case, hardly anyone does get the smallpox vaccination nowadays. The disease has been eradicated - which means that in this case the vaccine *is* nowadays a greater risk than the disease to the vast majority of people.

I am baffled about when nurses refused to have the smallpox vaccination. As I understand, it ceased to be recommended for health workers in the mid-1970s - long before Rumsfeld came on the scene. The only people who still get it are some people in the military, who could be at risk from biological warfare; and some medical researchers who may come across the virus in lab work. Not nurses.


As regards the flu vaccine: this involves killed, not live, viruses, so it cannot lead to a person catching or spreading the flu.

[NNN0LHI]

7. Being a nurse doesn't automatically mean someone is all that smart

I doubt that the fundie nut anti-choice nurse who lives next door to me who doesn't believe in Global Warming or getting her her daughter vaccinated with GARDASIL, and who's daughter was recently treated for cervical cancer, would want to get the swine flu vaccine either.

She is a true fruit loop.

Don

[Hannah Bell]

8. the daughter has cervical cancer? then what would be the point of vaccinating her?

[NNN0LHI]

9. She should have got the daughter the vaccine when she was 12 or 13

The daughter is in her 20's now.

The point is the daughter wouldn't be being treated for cervical cancer right now if the nurse mother had her vaccinated when she was younger.

Don

[LeftishBrit]

10. While I am strongly pro-vaccination...

in this case, the daughter's cancer cannot be blamed on her mother's opposition to vaccines, as Gardasil was not yet generally available 10 years ago when she could have benefitted.

I do hope she'll be OK.

[seabeyond]

18. and you know the vaccination would have prevented this particular cervical cancer? cause you

understand the vacciantion only hits a particular cervical cancer and there are other cervical cancers out there?

[NNN0LHI]

25. The father was at my house last week telling me he regretted that she didn't get the vaccination

So I assume it was the right one.

Don

[seabeyond]

27. an assumption. maybe, maybe not. parents would like to believe could prevent all things

not a reality

hope all turns out for the gal. if caught early, it is curable

[JeanGrey]

41. Then he is crazy, too. The vaccine was NOT available

when she was "12 or 13".

[Hannah Bell]

28. mmm - your story smells. the overwhelming majority of women get cervical

cancer in middle age & later. 20% in women over 65.

there was no vaccine until a few years ago. it was approved in 2006.

vaccination is recommended for girls 11-12, prior sexual debut.

no benefit shown for those who have already initiated sexual activity. most cervical cancers initiated by virus transmitted through sexual contact.

if cancer not initiated via hp virus, vaccine doesn't prevent it.

[Hannah Bell]

29. there was no vaccine when she was 12. approved in 2006.

[JeanGrey]

40. She's 20? er, I don't think Gardasil was available eight

years ago!

[blindpig]

13. I'm with those nurses

This bug doesn't seem too nasty, it seems there's a lot of fear mongering.

I'm in my 50's, never had a flu shot and have no intention to unless things get hairy.

Eat mo' garlic, if anything else the vampires won't bother ya.

k&r

[PVnRT]

15. Do you come into constant contact with people whose immune systems are compromised?

[dana_b]

20. period.

that is all that needs to be said.

[blindpig]

22. No n/t

[blondeatlast]

30. Exactly. I have insulin dependent diabetes and have since age 7.

I'll damn well insist, if hospitalized, that anyone treating me be vaccinated--if they aren't, why should I believe they are dedicated to making me well?

[JeanGrey]

42. I'm an organ transplant and I have cancer.

I will NOT be taking the flu shot!!! A flu vaccine gave me the flu for two weeks once. That would be all I need.

[Odin2005]

14. Those nurses are morons who are a danger to public safety.

This technophobic stupidity will kill a lot more people than any side effects will.

[ismnotwasm]

16. I'm getting the vaccination.

I'm a nurse in the minority evidently. I've already seen the swine flu in my hospital, I've already had a co-worker who's had it.

It's the fucking flu. It can be relatively benign, or deadly, just like any other flu.

I've never had the flu in my life. I get the flu shot every year. I don't want to expose my patients to it, not do I want them giving it to me and just like any other illness, I want to minimize risk.

[HamdenRice]

24. I was living in the epicenter last outbreak and knew someone who died, so I'll get it

My son's former assistant principal, Mitchell Weiner, was the guy who died here in Queens during the earlier outbreak, and a nearby Catholic school, St. Francis Prep, was the school where the kids brought the flu back from Mexico. The toddler who died was also from here in Queens, New York.

If it's as bad as the earlier outbreak, I'll get it.

[TZ]

35. Thank you!

Those who say "I don't need a flu shot cause I never get it" are fucking selfish typhoid mary types.

[katkat]

39. typhoid mary, I think not

If everyone ran out and got a flu shot as you suggest, it would be immaterial to them if other people were vaccinated. So you can't try to force vaccinations on the unwilling in the "defense of others." Let the "others" risk their well being by getting the shots.

Meanwhile, this thread seems to be overlooking the scientific fact that most people in their fifties or older are believed to already be immune to swine flu because of their exposure to similar strains in their youth.

[watercolors]

17. My husband and I have never had a flu shot

we are in our mid 70's. we have never had the flu either, in fact no one in our extended family has had one!! We are basically quite healthy, use proper hygene, lots of hand wipes and washing, and stay out of large crowds during the flu season. My mom who is 95 has never had one either and my sister who is a nurse will not get them!

[dana_b]

21. so I take care of immunocompromised children

on a cancer ward. If any of you naysayers were the parents of one of these kids, would you be comfortable if I didn't get flu vaccine(s)?

[Johonny]

23. Nice more Vaccine available for me

[Jennicut]

26. I am torn over getting it because I have a compromised immune system

but I want to know its completely safe too. I will see how others do with taking it first.

[redqueen]

32. There are a lot of dumb nurses. (nt)

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[TZ]

34. OH FFS!!

It's not the same as the shot back in the 70's. I am gonna be privy to the saftety data on it and I can tell you this says MORE about how ill educated SOME nurses are.
Honestly most flu shots are safe. Considering how many people have already DIED from H1N1 (particularly pregnant women) that anti-vax attitude is gonna seriously hurt or kill more than any fucking vaccine (many of which will have NO preservative for the thimerosol fear mongerers) will.
I would NEVER EVER want to be treated by a nurse who is more scared of a vaccine than by a proven lethal vaccine. They are not scientists and shouldn't be allowed to practice medicine. Let them go sell magic water somewhere.