Are we changing our goal from health care reform to health insurance reform? If so, why?

[timeforpeace]

[DJ13]

1. It looks like it

The why is probably because our spineless Dems dont want to anger either the insurance companies (too much) or the Republicans.

Our political system is so fucked up they arent scared of the voters, they're scared of the money brokers and the MSM supporting opposition party.

[timeforpeace]

9. I agree, the insurance companies will be the big winners in this, not us.

[babylonsister]

2. Why don't you tell us? Are we? What's your goal? nt

[dana_b]

3. because that's all the politicians will hear of??

it sems every time we write to them, call them, etc. they don't want to hear of single payer or an other health care reform. At least that's been my experience.

They are protecting their own sources of income.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

4. In the words of the sage, "Follow the money."

[Autumn]

5. I believe it is health care finance reform.

Seems to be a lot of misleading crap from various members of the Congress and Senate,and the media.

[flyarm]

6. i just posted this on another thread and will repeat it here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4007584&mesg_id=4007664

see here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=8575361&mesg_id=8575376

"There is so much disinformation out there AND the plan isn't complete yet."

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

am I the only one who keeps seeing this Meme here at Du?


so if the plan is not complete..how can our congress critters be out at town halls selling something that is not complete?

That is like the car salesman telling you you must buy this car..he doesn't know what the model IS , or make is..he doesn't know what color it is..but you must buy it..Because it is sooooooooo damn good for you!! He says .."TRUST ME"....

Seems I remember hearing that "Trust me "bullshit before..over Tarp and the the Wall street bail outs..how are those mortgage foreclosures going in your neck of the woods..are we the people getting all that help promised???????

shhhhhhhhh some here at DU don't want you to know about this........ahhh Franky..seems the hero worship for you here at DU will now want to see you under the ...very crowded bus!!


http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/09/opinion/09rich.html?_r=1

Is Obama Punking Us?
By FRANK RICH
Published: August 8, 2009

snip:

Yet there is real reason for longer-term worry in the form of a persistent, anecdotal drift toward disillusionment among some of the president’s supporters. And not merely those on the left. This concern was perhaps best articulated by an Obama voter, a real estate agent in Virginia, featured on the front page of The Washington Post last week. “Nothing’s changed for the common guy,” she said. “I feel like I’ve been punked.” She cited in particular the billions of dollars in bailouts given to banks that still “act like they’re broke.”

snip:
It’s a cynicism confirmed almost daily by events. Last week Brian Stelter of The Times reported that the corporate bosses of MSNBC and Fox News, Jeffrey Immelt of General Electric and Rupert Murdoch of News Corporation, had sanctioned their lieutenants to broker what a G.E. spokesman called a new “level of civility” between their brawling cable stars, Keith Olbermann and Bill O’Reilly. A Fox spokesman later confirmed to Howard Kurtz of The Post that “there was an agreement” at least at the corporate level. Olbermann said he was a “party to no deal,” and in any event what looked like a temporary truce ended after The Times article was published. But the whole scrape only fed legitimate suspicions on the right and left alike that even their loudest public voices can be silenced if the business interests of the real American elite decree it.

You might wonder whether networks could some day cut out the middlemen — anchors — and just put covert lobbyists and publicists on the air to deliver the news. Actually, that has already happened. The most notorious example was the flock of retired military officers who served as television “news analysts” during the Iraq war while clandestinely lobbying for defense contractors eager to sell their costly wares to the Pentagon.

The revelation of that scandal did not end the practice. Last week MSNBC had to apologize for deploying the former Newsweek writer Richard Wolffe as a substitute host for Olbermann without mentioning his new career as a corporate flack. Wolffe might still be anchoring on MSNBC if the blogger Glenn Greenwald hadn’t called attention to his day job. MSNBC assured its viewers that there were no conflicts of interest, but we must take that on faith, since we still don’t know which clients Wolffe represents as a senior strategist for his firm, Public Strategies, whose chief executive is the former Bush White House spin artist, Dan Bartlett.

[timeforpeace]

8. They aren't out selling, they're listening to constituents. There's nothing to sell, as you say.

[flyarm]

19. I didn't say there was nothing to sell..others here at DU keep saying there is no complete plan..

go read my post again..

And the congress critters are not listening..because what is being so called proposed is Health "insurance profit" reform,..

whats the rush..get it right the first time and Get us Real Health care reform..not insurance company profit protection!

What we are being told is this won't even go into effect until 2013..so we are being told to support what isn't even a complete plan??????????

That is like your insurance company selling you a policy you can't read or that isn't complete..will you buy insurance that way?????? I sure as hell won't!

I lost a home in an earthquake and had to deal with insurance for 2 years of my life..I read every line in my insurance policy , and i make sure every "t" is crossed and every "i" is dotted..and then have my lawyers read it to make sure i am getting what i am paying for, and covered for.

I will never support anything unless i see it in full and understand it and it is complete!

And anyone who does support a plan incomplete is a damn fool!

[Cleita]

13. Considering that the plan isn't complete yet or isn't out there is a plus, however,

what seems to be shaping up as the plan isn't promising. There is too much Medicare Part D kinds of negotiating going on and as a senior citizen I can tell you the Medicare Part D is a hugh success for the PhRMA companies because now they are getting Medicare money for their overpriced product and it's draining the program dry along with Medicare Advantage programs. I personally and many other seniors can't afford the $30 extra premium, the donut hole and quite honestly the copays on top of what we pay for Part B that comes out of our SS. So for seniors it sucks. I take very few drugs my doctor wants me too and I shudder if I get cancer, how I will pay for it. Why should failed programs continue to be resurrected in different Frankenstein forms just because the corporate world and RW nut world like it that way?

[Autumn]

18. No you are not the only one.

I am not trusting enough to believe WHEN the plan is completed we will get any meaningful health care plan, I just don't believe the powers that be will bite the hands that feed them. Finance might be just a word, but I know the meaning of the word without looking it up in a dictionary. Yeah I think we have been punked for a long time.

[quiller4]

7. Because it is a significant reform and it is time to focus on the possible.

[Cleita]

10. Because Congress wouldn't investigate all sides of the issue and only

wanted to concentrate on letting the insurance companies continue to offer health care coverage. Also, it doesn't help that Zeke Emmanuel, Rahm's doctor brother, is also in favor of corporate health care and he is advising Obama on this. Insurance reform maybe can help, however, I don't think we should be throwing taxpayer's money at them. If people can't afford to buy insurance or get it at work, or if they just don't like their coverage, the government should allow them to enroll in any one of the government health programs available that may be a good fit for them. But, I don't think we will get this either. So we will keep getting inadequate coverage and it will cost the tax payer a lot more. What is happening is another Medicare Part D fiasco, where the PhRMA companies came out on top getting all that federal taxpayers' money in addition to their overpriced drugs and money they get from the private sector. Senior citizens are still short changed. I'm really pissed off about this. I keep writing emails to Obama telling him to look at the consequences of Medicare Part D and does he really want to walk down that primrose path. I doubt if he gets any of the emails. It will take a deluge to get his attention.

[Greyhound]

11. K&R. It's already been changed and the Democrats will suffer for it. n/t

[OHdem10]

12. Obama and Senate keep saying this will be acceptable, that will

be acceptable.

When Ceci Connelly WaPo and Mara Liasson can confidentally
exclaim---Obama will be HAPPY to SIGN a Center Right Bill.
what can anyone believe, but they are changing their tune.

Were they ever serious about Health Care Reform???? It is beginning
to appear that Obama is there to reform Medicare thus appeasing
the Elites and GOP.

"Obama will be happy to sign a Center Right BILL.

There is a heck of a difference between Center and Center Right.
It is a chasm. Tom Delay should stand and take a bow. He proudly
moved all legislation during his reign Center Right, --just a few
steps and you are far right.

And I thought the Democrats won the election.

[Cleita]

14. It's Medicare Part D, the prescription drug benefit for seniors, all over again

that was written by PhRMA company lobbyists. Now we are going to get the same wolf in different sheep's clothing with health care reform written by corporate health insurance and for profit industries lobbyists. Whoopee!

[timeforpeace]

15. Ding ding ding! The winner! Surprised more people don't see this. It will be the precise opposite of

what people want and thought they would get. The rush was so people wouldn't figure this out. Now they are.

[Scarsdale Vibe]

16. Pro-choice vs. Pro-abortion. It's framing.

People generally like their health care, but hate health insurance companies.

[ellenfl]

17. it has always been about reforming the health insurance industry.

they are just changing verbiage to reflect the real issue and to bring confidence to the electorate that we are not trying to change anyone's health care. it should have been called health insurance reform to begin with.

ellen fl