Instead of the "Pull the Troops from Iraq" argument, how about "re-deploy to Afghanistan before..."

[Up2Late]

...we lose that one too?

Wouldn't that be a better argument that might actually get our Military out of this the middle of the Civil War+ that Bush started?

That way, we could reinforce the fact that Iraq IS a hopeless cause and that we are about to lose in Afghanistan too, because we pulled out of there before the job was finished.

I mean, we know that Bush won't listen to us (Democrats) on the Iraq War strategy, and most likely, he won't listen to us on "...re-deploy to Afghanistan" either, so what do we have to lose if we go on the attack (against Bush), which will show how childish and stubborn (and down right lame) Bush is being with his stupid arguments on how we can never leave Iraq without being seen as losers. :shrug:

I mean, Iraq is a hopeless now, Afghanistan might be salvageable if we re-deploy sooner than later,
and we can make Bush look like an even bigger dork as a bonus.:think:

So what do ya all think? I'm just throwing out a few new ideas here.

And if some of you are happy with the way things are going, you don't have to participate in the discussion. And if anyone here just wants to say something nasty and negative just because you enjoy doing that, save it.

I'm looking for new ideas here.

[Kiouni]

1. I think your on to something

I agree that a redeployment is a plausible option. I personally think a total with drawl of troops and leaving Iraq on its own will be a death sentence for the majority of its citizens and like it or not we made our bed. I cannot accept that all those people have to die. I think we should remove a majority of the troops, leaving behind enough to protect key iraqi headquarters and an american base. Invest heavily into building iraqi infrastructure like business and buildings but, here's the key, these projects will be carried out with iraqi labor only. Pay to have them build it and not some outside contractor at 500% the price and maybe they won't blow it up the next day. National pride only comes from a nation that you helped build. Good luck and Keep up the think tank up2late

[meatloaf]

2. Slight modification...

Before "he" loses that one too.

[Up2Late]

3. Good point!

Though he will still try to blame all of us.

[ConsAreLiars]

4. Arguing that the occupation and subjugation of Afghanistan is a desirable thing seems

to me to be a very bad idea. The idea that ideologically driven slaughters can be stopped by the invasion and occupation of any one country, or any number of of countries, is insane, to put it kindly. Quite the contrary. Such actions increase the influence of bin Laden types.

[Up2Late]

6. I don't think you're quite getting it, the goal is not to actually re-deploy the troops...

...the goal is to point out to the 30% who still support this bozo that Bush is about to lose the "hearts and minds" battle in Afghanistan too unless we re-allocate reconstruction and infrastructure resources soon. Plus, if done right, it would force the MSM to continuously repeat that Iraq is a lost cause that we need to get out of.

I mean, he ignored the Baker/Hamilton Commission, he's ignoring the Congress, he's ignoring his Generals, he's not going listen to this either, he's much too stubborn for that.

If he actually does bow to the pressure and shifts some of the troops there (which I doubt he will), that's a bonus, because it's a step in the right direction, but mostly the strategy is to apply pressure and demonstrate how foolish Bush is being about this whole mess. Ultimately, the goal is to destroy the myth that Republicans are the party that is "protecting America."

[ConsAreLiars]

7. Your goals are fine, but implying that murdering more Afghans in the service of

Corporate Imperialism (or whatever you want to call it) is a desirable thing or "a bonus" seems to be buying into the PNAC delusion of world conquest as a worthy goal.

[Up2Late]

8. No, you are completely mis-reading this, "the bonus" is to get the troops out of a War Zone...

...and back home to there families, instead of in this "war on terror" war without end.

"Corporate Imperialism" is the goal of Bush and his Military Industrial Complex buddies, my goal is to destroy the power of the Republican Party and the control they have over the American News Media.

As a Buddhist, I care just as much for the people of Afghanistan and I do for my own Mother.

You should check out the FRONTLINE/World documentary about Afghanistan that was on tonight. It showed the current situation very well and was what inspired this post, here's the link to more about it:

<http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/afghanistan604/video_index.html>

The website says that video will be available April 12, 2007, but it could still be yet to air in your area.

[bananarepublican]

9. Agreed. Don't forget the Taliban offered to give up Bin Laden...

... provided the U.S. govt. could provide proof of his involvement in 911! All they got in return was the noise of crickets chirping!!!

[mattclearing]

10. Don't forget fat Elvis Bin Laden. n/t

[bananarepublican]

12. His best hit was 'Crying in the Mosque'! n/t

[Marrah_G]

13. The alternative is giving it back to the Taliban

Would you really wan to see that happen to Afgani women again?

[IChing]

5. As a general, I told him Stalingrad was lost, but he fired me long ago

and replaced those generals who would follow him.


when I challenged him in North Africa and he didn't give me the troops and support
I needed he said do it with the troops you were given.

Now I am left to defend the Atlantic Ocean to protect Western Europe
from the horde..

And we had the best fucking army in the world.
No doubt.

[Up2Late]

11. kick n/t

:kick: