New Rules with Bill Maher, Democrats have become Republican Lite

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5WLSrpTqt4

[Buzz Clik]

1. And Bill Maher sits on the sidelines throwing stones.

You know, Bill, when the only thing you stand for is opposing the status quo (regardless of the status quo), you really don't stand for anything.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

2. IMHO, his last new rule was dead on and those thoughts are often expressed here on DU, including

by myself.

[Buzz Clik]

3. I guess that explains why you posted it.

[Bandit]

50. .

[question everything]

93. Myself included

from last week

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=5838733

[defendandprotect]

108. Of course liberals and progressives would all agree with Maher...

we here do that every day --

Who is it here that doesn't want an end to these wars?

Cutting down of the MIC?

Progressive taxation on the rich/corporations?

I do notice that the real stone throwers stay away from making their positions clear-- !!!

Bill has made his positions clear and anyone who wants to criticize what he's saying --

and I'm all for criticism -- should deal with the what he is saying rather than engaging

in personal attacks.

[Enthusiast]

164. +1, defendandprotect! nt

[Upfront]

133. Hey By myself.

No you are not, I agree with Bill as well.

[cornermouse]

5. Maher's analysis is, unfortunately, accurate and correct.

[Buzz Clik]

9. Despite his confidence, it's merely his opinion. And, I think he's wrong.

:shrug:

[cornermouse]

11. Maher's right.

It's about the democratic party going down the same road (placating those with money, placating the religious right)I watched the republican party go down once Reagan got into office which, by the way, is when I became a democrat. The democratic party is making a strong move to the right. They are trading long held democratic principles for money and what they hope will be a solid voting block.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

12. Reagan successfully made Liberal a dirty word and since then the party, that I was

born to has since moved right of center, and as Bill said, right of that are the crazies.

I was always a Liberal Democrat and my politics and philosophy hasn't changed in decades and yet now, I'm considered part of the "far left".

[spiritual_gunfighter]

27. and you are considered a traitor to the Democrats

Bill is 100% correct, it is surprising (or maybe it isnt) that people on DU and other so called liberals want to villify Maher and not villify the true villians to our cause the supposed Democrats in congress and other supposed Dem leaders who indeed are just center right corporate stooges.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

38. Ain't that the truth.

[ihavenobias]

54. Amen. Let's get this featured in the video section!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x326890

Huge K & R

[Buzz Clik]

89. Newt and Karl use that kind of language, not true Dems

We're an undisciplined bunch and subject to differing opinions. No one is a traitor and no one is a villain within the Party.

Mahr conveniently distances himself from all parties, thus freeing himself from actually committing himself to anything. It makes him smaller than Maddow, Stewart, and even Dennis Miller.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

140. I dont care what Maher calls himself

he is correct on this, and is getting thrown under the bus for doing so. If he is a "true" Dem or not.

[Enthusiast]

167. You are completely wrong

Bill correctly observes that the Democratic Party has abandoned their principles for temporary power and monetary gain and he is right the fuck on. You want to lump him in with Dennis Miller? I have to question your motives. Maddow? Stewart? There is nothing small about those two. They are also right the fuck on.

[Buzz Clik]

186. Wrong, wrong, and wrong. And, you misread one of my comments.

Bill is WORSE than Miller -- so he is clearly set apart because Miller at least took a stand. Miller took the risk that the country was swinging right with the election of Bush, and he found himself trying to entertain "crowds" of rightwingers who didn't understand the words coming out of his mouth. He became intellectually lazy and uninformed, and now he appeals only to the same group of idiots who love O'Reilly.

Maher is trying to keep his highly educated, highly active audience on his side by also reminding us how much he hates the right. But, he hates the Democrats, and he isn't a Libertarian. So, he only kinda stands for something. He claims to hate corporations and their influence, but he works for a corporation that pays him quite handsomely. So... he bites the hand that feeds him. I guess that's better than doing their bidding, but I certainly don't agree with his assessment that Democrats have morphed into Republicans.

[mcollier]

132. It is our responsiblilty to identify

weak elected officials, communicate our concerns we have with them along with issues important to us. If all else, campaign for a better candidate. When we reduce our "political action" to merely complaining on blogs then well we may be viewed as insignificant in the eyes of the politicians. Have we not learned from the last election that the down in the dirt political strategy is the old school way, not nearly as effective as intelligent sincere proposition of solutions to the challenges we face....

Call the bull shitters for what they are... And keep focused.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

142. They don't need us. The corporatists fill their coffers.

[pasto76]

144. because Presideont Obama is the real villian, not some hack who only waxes poetic.

its liek all these people (mostly republicans) who "know" what war is about.

Really? cause I was there and they werent.

Same mechanism. Isnt Bill mahrer a comedian? Like Dennis Miller

[Enthusiast]

166. No vilifying here.

He is right the fuck on!

[Buzz Clik]

13. ... in your opinion.

We have had a DUer announce today that he has given up on the Democratic Party to become a Democratic Socialist.

I guess we can expect the same from many others quite soon.

[cornermouse]

14. In your opinion.

If you're right I guess we can continue the democratic party to continue its march to the right. I recognize quite a few similarities already.

[ooglymoogly]

82. When building straw men, you need exactly the right type of straw

The straw you are using does not even resemble an argument let alone a believable straw man. It is more like a scarecrow who's straw is long gone and all that is left are sticks and rags to prop it up.

[Maat]

104. Include me in that.

I re-registered as an independent about a month ago.

[ekwhite]

110. Yes we can

I may do the same thing. My nephew was way ahead of me in voting Green last year. I voted Obama, knowing he was no better than a centrist. He may take Bill Clinton's title as the "Best Republican President Ever," but he is certainly no Eugene Debs or Emma Goldman.

Instead of cowering when someone calls universal health coverage "socialism," I prefer to say "damn right"! So are Universal Education, Fire Departments, Public Libraries, Public Roads, Rural Electrification, and a lot of other benefits Americans enjoy. Access to health care should be a right, not a privilege. The sooner we realize that, the better. If the Democrats only give us half measures, it is time to go elsewhere.

[Selatius]

157. So, to answer the question, you DON'T believe Reagan made "liberal" a dirty word? nt

[Enthusiast]

165. Maher is right and you are right, cornermouse.

We might as well say it.

[OwnedByFerrets]

48. Then name more than 5 Senators out of 100 who are

actually progressives. Real Progressives and not Repug lite.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

64. Are there even 5? Russ Feingold, Bernie Sanders (Ind), Tom Harkins. I used to think Barbara

Boxer until she hasn't opened her mouth up about the Senate voting to keep the torture photos from seeing the light of day.

[hfojvt]

79. Harkin does some good things

but he also endorsed Boswell against a more progressive primary opponent.

Other good Senators - KENNEDY, Kerry, Byrd, Whitehouse, Durbin

Probably none of them has perfect records, but that doesn't put them in the same league as Johnson, Baucus or the Nelson brothers. Much less any supposed 'moderate' Republican. Can you name 5 moderate Republicans in the senate? - Collins, Snowe, Specter, ? ? You think any of them vote on our side even as much as the Nelson brothers do?

[handmade34]

129. Leahy

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

188. self-delete

[Buzz Clik]

88. Sure. That's easy.

Every Dem Senator south of the Mason-Dixon line and every Dem Senator west of the Rockies.

[Selatius]

158. Senator Claire McKaskill is more progressive than Senator Bernie Sanders!?

By what definition of progressive are you flying from?

[OwnedByFerrets]

187. HUH?? Name names. Name Progressives. Real Progressives.

[rhett o rick]

148. Plez don't leave us hanging. You think he is wrong because ......................... ??? nm

[warren pease]

67. Yeah, I have to agree... And I really don't even like Maher much because...

... he's such a smug little prick so much of the time. But he's a good observer, at least good enough to know it when a gigantic lemon hits him square in the face with a "splat" heard in the next county.

It's like they're still operating on that old fantasy slogan: "Vote Democratic because we don't suck quite as bad as the GOP."

But they're catching up in a hurry, it seems. Obama refuses to admit he's on record (like there's actual TEE-VEE footage from when he was an Illinois legislator) advocating for single-payer as the only realistic way to kick the parasites and serial killers out of the medical insurance scam and replace them with patient-centric health care.

His pal Baucus flatly refuses to do the peoples' business until the people make his personal discomfort their own business, too.

Pelosi's fucking table, AKA unilateral disarmament.

Reid's hand-wringing and the giant bulls-eye painted on his ass, the former Marine destroyed by the Stockholm Syndrome.

Feinstein the philistine war profiteer.

Jane Harman, richest member of the House, Rand Corp co-dependent and one of the Gang of Six briefed in 2002 by the CIA on "enhanced interrogation techniques" -- and who, along with Ms. Nancy and four other "need to know" types -- approved of this country's unspeakably horrible decision to return to 15th century Spain, where Torquemada and his toys await new visitors.

Steny Hoyer and fellow DLC cohorts caught on TV laughing their asses off last session when they passed yet another Bushie-inspired war "emergency appropriations bill" -- all giggly that the people who voted for democrats expected these entrenched pricks and lying fuckers to actually deliver on even one single campaign promise.

The list of abuse is endless but the solution is pretty simple -- keep Wexler, Kucinich, Waters, Lee, Woolsey, and a few others in the House; keep Sanders, Feingold, Merkley, Kennedy, Franken (if Reid ever lets him take his seat), Burris (just because he pisses Reid off), maybe Harkin, Boxer (on her better days), Klobuchar the same ...

Add a few more of the rarest political breed of all -- the true progressive -- and get the hell rid of the rest.

So yeah... What's so tough to swallow about Maher's read on the current state of this woeful collection of rich collaborators who fit the very definition of an honest politician -- one you can buy and who stays bought.

In my view, this is just another of those ridiculous "keeping the powder dry" exercises in which the gun powder is allowed to sit so long it loses its explosive properties.


Tell me I'm completely wrong -- please. I'd really prefer it.

sf

[Stardust]

150. Tell it, bruthah! (or is it sistah?)

:fistbump:

[warren pease]

183. It's actually "old curmudgeonly bastard" according to my wife... n/t

[asteroid2003QQ47]

161. Perfect! You won't get a "wrong" from me!

I especially love this line--
"...advocating for single-payer as the only realistic way to kick the parasites and serial killers out of the medical insurance scam and replace them with patient-centric health care."

[warren pease]

184. Thanks, and...

... this corporate shake-down racket called "health care" in this backward country is a national tragedy and an an international joke. I've been at war with the fuckers for decades, for all the good it's done.

If you're interested and haven't maxxed out on my rather wordy writing style, please have a look through my DU journal and archives. I'd say at least 1/4 of all saved posts are about some aspect of our shameful for-profit medical scandal. And a good number of those contain links to sites worth knowing about and examining their data.

If you're not already furious beyond any possible compromise, you may well end up that way inside of half an hour of clicking and reading.

You might also have a look at my articles on single-payer and related issues at Online Journal and OpEdNews. They start there, then usually get picked up elsewhere. I'm particularly proud of one piece that ended up as the top story on Al Jazerra's English language news/info/op-ed web site.

Still, for all time and effort and fury I've put into this war, I'm running out of both years and patience. If these sons of bitches pretending to be democrats can't manage to flip off their corporate employers just one damn time and at least pretend they're dedicated to serving the interests and improving the lives of their constituents, it's going to be obvious that the only remaining strategy is evacuation.

Canada remains my preference, with one of the Southern Gulf Islands the featured destination in my long-running expat dream. Gabriola, Galliano, Salt Spring, Mayne, Pender...

I've spent time on all five, and a few more as well and, imo, it's worth considerible time, trouble and effort to relocate there. Nearly bought a cabin on Galliano in 1999, back when the Canadian dollar was only worth about $.66 to the US buck.

I've still got the bumps and bruises from bashing my forehead into the wall during the past 10 years, knowing I could have been living on one of these islands -- rather than watching horrified from south of the 48th parallel, then in a blind red rage, as the Bushies destroyed as many bodies, hearts and minds as eight years of stolen elections would permit.

I've always wanted to play the Maple Leaf Rag on a guitar, and maybe having one on my new national flag might help. In fact, while I'm thinking about it, have a look here to see how Canadian DUers in 2007 viewed the horrors of their own provincially administered health care system.

sf

(the blabbermouth formerly known as Warren Pease now writing as Steven Franklin cuz that's like, I mean, kinda like, y'know, 2/3 of my, like, real name, eh?)

[inna]

172. an absolutely brilliant post! thanks :) nt

[warren pease]

185. And thank you for the kind words...

Particularly coming from someone in my home town.

I appreciate it.


sf

[rug]

40. Pass the Gatorade.

[Bucky]

76. Is it in you?

I think you meant KoolAid.

[Bandit]

45. Susan B Anthony ring any bells?

Agitate, Educate, Organize

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

46. +1!

[bvar22]

56. And Buzz Clik sits on the sidelines....

...throwing rocks at Bill Maher.
And bvar22 sits on the sidelines throwing rocks at Buzz Clik....

So much easier to attack the messenger.

[Buzz Clik]

95. Mahr is not just any messennger.

He is highly paid by a big corporation. Is he a corporate whore? Clearly not.

But he has a big stage with a big audience. He is not immune to criticism simply because some people agree with him.

[defendandprotect]

103. Well, if it's a shock to you that the Democratic Party has been co-opted by corporations . . ..

they I don't know where to send you for a check up but perhaps the DLC????

That's the corporate-wing of the Democratic Party . . . ring any bells now?

[Buzz Clik]

120. Corporations are not inherently evil. They pay the freight for a lot of good people.

Now, when they have undue and/or illegal influence, that's a bad thing. The suggestion that every Democrat is a corporate whore is simply misguided.

[defendandprotect]

128. Unregulated capitalism is merely organized crime --

Corporations do not "pay the freight for a lot of good people" -- they exploit people.

And are you suggesting that corporations don't have "undue or illegal influence" . . . ????

Where have you been?

Democrats have to prove themselves to the voters --

They can do what they were elected to do in '06 -- end the wars.

Stop funding the wars!!

[Buzz Clik]

130. Is this boiling down to a debate of socialism versus capitalism? I'll pass.

[defendandprotect]

138. It boils down to, at the minimum, RE-REGULATING capitalism . . .

And, as far as I can see the world has never been fooled by capitalism . . .

any more than it has been fooled by communism . . . they are both exploitative systems.

Capitalism is a ridiculous "King-of-the-Hill" system, intended to move a nation's

wealth and natural resources from the many to the few. And, it has succeeded at that

very ably all over the world.

Every nation practices some form of socialism -- fire departments, postal services,

Medicare -- and most other nations have national health care for ALL citizens.

Let me know when you get tired of bailing out capitalists -- !!!

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

175. Go to opensecrets.org and you'll see what corporate whores they are. The amount

of money they receive from corporate donors far exceeds those from the serfs. Who do you think they'll listen to?

[Buzz Clik]

96. Mahr is not just any messennger.

He is highly paid by a big corporation. Is he a corporate whore? Clearly not.

But he has a big stage with a big audience. He is not immune to criticism simply because some people agree with him.

[defendandprotect]

136. And you thought Maher's message was pro-corporate??????

Maher is not immune to criticism . . . any more than Obama and the Democrats are

immune to criticism.

However, personal attacks aren't criticism -- criticize the policies you agree or

disagree with --

[Buzz Clik]

137. sigh.

I believe I took care of that in my post.

[defendandprotect]

139. Maher is against the wars and for taxation on rich, for national health care . . .

let's see some specifics from you --

sigh . . . sorry to make you break a sweat but throwing rocks at Maher

isn't being specific about where you disagree with what he said . .

[ooglymoogly]

83. real big ones nt

[Buzz Clik]

121. big stones can be thrown errantly ... like ... in this case.

[ooglymoogly]

134. They can also be thrown for the causes of a just society...as in this case...

though I am beginning to suspect, you have no clue as to what that is.

[Buzz Clik]

135. ... and here come the insults.

Later.

:hi:

[ekwhite]

106. Him and the Democratic Party make two...

The Democratic Party no longer stands for anything. Bill Maher is spot on. I don't call someone who appoints Wall Street types to solve the financial crisis, who throws gays under the bus, and takes the public option and single payer off the table a Progressive. He would just barely make a Rockefeller Republican.

I only support the Democratic Party because there is not a viable alternative. We need a new Socialist Party in this country - one that supports not only the ideals of Roosevelt, but those of people like Eugene V. Debs, Mother Jones, and the IWW. If we close our eyes and ignore the evidence that we have only a choice between far right and center right, we are not doing our country a service at all.

[Buzz Clik]

127. The Democratic Party stands for many, many things. By its nature, ...

... it is diverse with a multitude of pet issues. Not everyone shares every issue as a high priority, but we generally are passionate about at least a few.

For instance, I don't hate all corporations simply because they are big and make lots of money. Many Dems do. But, I am passionate about civil rights for everyone, health care reform, fixing the financial mess, and the environment.

[ekwhite]

145. The Democratic Party used to stand for many things

Not any more. They are just part of the oligarchy that rules this country. It certainly isn't the Democratic Party of Franklin Roosevelt.

[Buzz Clik]

174. It's also not the same country.

Oligarchy? Really?

[ekwhite]

178. It most certainly is not the same country

We have made racial and social progress, but we are an oligarchy. Do you honestly think, in this day and age, that we ARE not run by corporate interests? Do you honestly think that we have not undergone over the past 8 years a massive transfer of wealth? Do you honestly think that the "millionaire's club" in the Senate is operating in the best interests of the working poor? Let's hear your counter-argument, or is all you have is snark?

[orleans]

162. do you *really* think the dems have done all they could & done the

right thing with our party, the people and this country? do you really NOT think the dems legislate toward the right?

if so--then *how?* how can you believe that? what are you seeing that i'm not?

[Buzz Clik]

173. I'm supposed to explain why you perceive things differently than I?

Um.... because we're different people?

I'll acknowledge that, perhaps, your expectations are different than mine. Perhaps that is the key.

[defendandprotect]

107. Bill Maher is no exception if you pay any attention to the criticism of Obama . ..

the world of liberals and progressives are shocked that we're pretty much
making no progress against the roll back of Constitutional rights that Bushco
brought ... or war. Where is the end of these wars? We elected Democrats in
'06 to end the wars!

Dems have been refunding them -- for whose benefit? -- for more than two years!!!

Unfortunately, Bill made very clear that he stands for a liberal party - Democratic Party --
which will end wars.

And where do you stand on that point? Just that one point?

[defendandprotect]

109. Bill made clear what he stands for . . . what do you stand for?

Are you for ending the wars?
Stopping the funding of the wars?
Cutton down on military spending?
Progressive taxes on the rich/corporations?
National health care?

Just what is Bill saying that you are so opposed to???????

[rhett o rick]

147. Just because we might not particularly like Mr. Maher doesn't mean he isn't right.

The Democratic Congress is screwing the middle class. That's a fact. Now what do we do.

[RagAss]

4. LOL...Moved from the right into mental hospitals !

[WeDidIt]

6. Okay, I actually watched this one

He's spot on.

[lib2DaBone]

7. Well.. this week Obama gave more power to the Federal Reserve...

I think he's going in the wrong direction. (imho)

He should close down the FED.. which is just a bunch of foreign bankers who are robbing the United States, not give them more power?

Obama also sent Billions of dollars overseas.. at a time when we need it desperately at home.

I know world economics are complicated and there are things going on behind the scenes we are not privy to.. but lately I've been scratching my head and going... "Huh?"

Bring back our jobs.. no more cheap Chinese junk.. enough already.

[SammyWinstonJack]

52. +1

[defendandprotect]

111. Agree with you . .. and I've been too nauseated to even read the stories on what Obama did . . .

The FED should be shut down -- or at the least put under Treasury.

The trade agreements should be overturned --

Have we had even one word from Obama about the homeless and poor among us -- in America!!!!

[laststeamtrain]

8. Headline: Mr. Obvious wakes up after 20 year coma & says "What Happened?"

"Opposition party". Quaint phrase from the past.

[Zodiak]

10. Bill is dead-on in this analysis

All the personal attacks on him for these criticisms are rhetorical chaff that only underscores his point.

The Democrats as a party have become waaaaaaay too Republican. Our entire political debate is red-shifted far away from where the bulk of America stands.

[Mari333]

15. thank GOD someone is saying it out loud!!

right on Maher!!

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

18. I literally cheered when I heard him say this last night!

[defendandprotect]

124. That's the reaction of those who want truth . . . about wars, MIC, and progressive taxes . . .

but there are many here who don't want truth --
they want comfort and a pat on the head by a guy they'll look up to
no matter what he does.

IMO, it's fear of the unknown .... when they have no idea of where they
would be heading if they had to face reality about Democratic Party,
they want to block reality.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

179. Excellent post but I think you left out another possibility..

that the people who disagree with Maher are Republican Lite and think that the status quo is perfectly fine. After all, there are many here that think Bill Clinton was a great President. I've said for years that he was one the greatest Republican Presidents we've ever had.....

BTW! I really EnJoy reading your posts!

:hi:

[paulsby]

16. channeling nader circa 2000 and 1999 and 1998 and 1997...

:)

or michael moore pre-2000 as well

[bvar22]

58. And that is Nader's or MM's fault?

If the Democrats move to The Right, it leaves the Left wide open.
A vacuum WILL BE filled.
If not Nader, then someone else.

Maybe the Democratic Party should Wake The FUCK UP and provide some representation for those Mainstream Democrats who have been abandoned by The Party.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

59. Bravo!!!!

[Raineyb]

61. Exactly! Spot on!

:applause:

[paulsby]

69. of course not

i don't think it was ever nader's fault.

all chad/counting issues aside, it was not NADER's fault that bush was handed the election.

it was nader VOTERS, not nader.

nader has no power to make people vote for him. the choice rests witht he voters, thus the responsibility rests with the voters.

i was referencing the fact that nader and moore were quite vocal that there was little difference between the parties, much like the op is saying now

[bvar22]

86. And The Democrats have been busy proving Nader right since 2006.

N/T

[paulsby]

90. yes.

i am waiting for him to say "told you so. "

should add a couple of "neener neeners" in for good measure.

[defendandprotect]

112. Yes --

[ekwhite]

146. Exactly

I am getting sick of these so-called Democrats that espouse Republican principles.

[Webster Green]

160. Nader was correct about everything he said.

The only difference between the dems and the pukes is how fast they get on their knees to their corporate masters. :smoke:

[bread_and_roses]

17. oh, bull's eye.

i wonder if O's justice department came up with their silly "daily show" arguements for secrecy after getting a preview of this? i'd be laughing if it weren't too weep for.

[Mari333]

19. knr

[mdmc]

20. who could argue

we have a center right party and a bat shit insane party..

[H2O Man]

21. An apologist.

No one else.

[mdmc]

34. sho'nough

sure enough my friend

[alarimer]

22. Become? They've been that for years.

I blame Clinton and the DLC. Corporate whores, the lot of them, maybe especially Obama. They can all go to hell as far as I am concerned.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

28. Right on

They dont speak for me, I have no voice in the political process the way it is right now except Kucinich and Sanders at least we have them.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

33. You know that and I know that but they don't even try to disguise it now. It is Blantant and

unapologetic.

[Raineyb]

36. Yeah I think Maher got the verb tense wrong. n/t

[SammyWinstonJack]

53. 'especially Obama'

:thumbsup:

[spanone]

23. so after six months, bill is reaming the dems?.....fuck off maher

[edhopper]

25. No

the Dems have run Congress for 2 years.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

30. Maybe if you listened

and paid attention you would agree with him, but go ahead and feel free to villify Maher when you should be doing the same to the DINO's which at this point is almost the entire Democratic party including Obama.

[Kansas Wyatt]

31. What have the Democrats done for the "People" in those 6 months?

Now compare that to what the Democrats have done for Corporate America in the last 6 months.

Excuse me, but didn't the American People vote for the Democrats to control the House, the Senate, and the White House, because the Democrats were suppose to represent the "People" over Corporate America?

So please tell me again why Corporate America gets all the help, while the "People" get the chump change... Again.

The bottom line is that it looks the same as 'trickle down economics,' even though it's call 'change is coming.'

Yes, Bill Maher is right... Today's Democrats ARE yesterday's Republicans.

[bvar22]

60. Actually, Yesterday's Republicans were quite a bit to The Left....

..of Obama and the Democrats.

I would Jump for Joy to have an Eisenhower back in the White House.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

72. I wonder what Barry Goldwater would think of his party now?

[bvar22]

80. I wonder what LBJ, JFK, and FDR would think of theirs?

:patriot:

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

81. lol! Close your ears! LBJ is cursing away from the grave!

[bvar22]

85. Despite his many faults, LBJ was a LEADER,....

...and managed to get much "Democratic" good done in spite of fierce opposition.

I would LOVE to see how LBJ would have handled the traitorous "Blue Dog"/DLC coalition.
Can you imagine Joe Lieberman standing up to LBJ and blocking HIS agenda?
or Harry Reid?
or Evan Bayh?
:rofl:

Obama needs to find his inner LBJ to STEAM ROLL a robust Public Option through the Senate.
Obama already HAS everything he needs to do so.
Overwhelming public support.
Plenty of Political Capital.

The only thing missing seems to be The Will to Use it.

(There may be an OP in this.)

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

91. He also had a great Lieutenant in Hubert Humphrey. They were titans of change when it came to

Domestic issues. I will never forgive LBJ though for Vietnam.

BTW...just wanted to add. He seemed to be a nice man. When I was 10 I wrote to him and mentioned that I loved horses and he sent me an 8x10" glossy with a personal message to me. He was sitting on top of his Tennessee Walking Horse. Kind of cool.

[defendandprotect]

105. Last I heard he thought the party was too close to the religious right . . .

but then again, organized patriarchal religion is patriarchy as in GOP - Grand Old Patriarchy.

In fact, the GOP gave start up funds for the Christian Coalition!

Why, because the revolution by young people in the 1960's had kicked most of patriarchy,

organized patriarchal religion and capitalism to hell . . . where it belongs!

And here's Mae Brussel on that revolution and all it meant . . .

QUOTE --
I knew in the summer of '67—this was the spring when it was happening—that something very big in the United States was coming to ahead. Because I live in the Peninsula here; I'm close to a movement that was growing. Going back and forth from San Francisco to Big Sur, spending my summers at Sur, I could see something really good in a true Judao-Christian tradition of people making it, sharing their housing, sharing their food, rapping. I realized that in this country we had a revolution. There was a revolution of hair-style, clothing, cosmetics, transportation, housing, value system, churches—there was an economic revolution. It effected the cosmetic industry, canned foods, grocery revolution, dietary habits, dwellings, the use of land. No longer needing dwellings; meeting outdoors, no high rent for each separate family; sharing one place. People were delivering their own babies instead of spending $250 for the obstetrician. They were recycling old clothes; going to the Good Will, making their own things, wearing burlap, sharing, doing without, withdrawing from spectator sports or amusements; they weren't sitting and watching people throw a pigskin ball back and forth.

These are revolutions: economic and sociological. They were breaking the boundaries where white and black could rap. They lived together. They slept together. You didn't know somebody's background, if they were rich or poor. You didn't know if they were Jew or Gentile. Those boundaries were thrown out the window in '67. Greece was putting them back, but America was throwing them out the window. And the country club thing was going by the wayside. Zoning laws were ignored; if you have a zoning place in a fancy residential , the children are leaving those homes. They are living where there is no zoning. They are up on the land in the communes. They've left their parents in their big homes and they leave the zoning laws behind; they just split. Real estate values are effected because the kids aren't going to buy the house with the picket fence any longer and live two people in that dwelling.

Now this was an economic, sociological necessity in our system as it existed in terms of capitalists, and whether to survive. The Rand Corporation and other think tanks in America decide what to do for the United States of America.

This was the year of the Beatles. It was the summer of Sgt. Pepper, the Monterey Pop, Haight Ashbury, the Renaissance, make your own candle, turn off your electricity, sit and turn on with your friends and rap it over: What is life about? The generation was born with an atomic bomb over their heads. They weren't going to live long anyway, so there wasn't that much time for hate. They were really making it. My car was filled with kids; hitch-hikers everywhere; I picked strangers off the streets. They slept in our home, slept in the yards, too. Monterey Pop came that weekend. We were there everyday and I picked people off the road and our house was filled. It was the most beautiful thing. I still have yard furniture; they all painted chairs and tables and everyone pitched in. It was just—it was human beauty and they were making it together.

But that isn't the way it was meant to be made by U.S. Steel and General Motors and Kaiser Aluminum. They want to sell you your own car, your own house, and your own washing machine and dryer.UNQUOTE

If you want to read more about her understanding of what was happening in Greece and how
that social repression could eventually be brought to America . . .

http://www.maebrussell.com/Transcriptions/16.html

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

182. Thank you again defendandprotect. I have saved the link to read the rest later. I remember

those days well.

[G_j]

41. after the "last thirty years"

is what he said.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

42. That's what happens when people comment without watching/listening to what is actually said.

[defendandprotect]

113. You think the Democrats have been co-opted by corporations for six months?????!!!!!

The world has been talking about this for decades --

and you think it's been six months --

and Maher is being unfair????

[edhopper]

24. He hit it.

And he wasn't just talking about Obama. There is almost no viable Democratic left in Congress to pull us in a progressive direction. The more progressive Dems seem ineffectual. Everything starts at a Centrist position and then the DINOs push it right.

[glitch]

55. The more progressive Dems get no support and are often attacked by their own party.

And progressive Dems are most often challenged in primaries.

They are made to seem ineffectual, and become so.

[newspeak]

65. I agree,

the Progressive dems will usually not get the support of the main Democratic Party--it will be the DINO over a progressive. And, corporate media, I believe, influences the selection. They will discount and ridicule those who they wish to "push out" of an election. Look what they did to Dean and Kuccinich. MSM wanted * to win--so unlike, the ongoing ridicule Kerry received about his military history (yeah, let's give access to the Swiftboat liars and turn Kerry's heroism into villiany)and the MSM did a great job attacking Kerry's wife--Gore was a liar, didn't you know cause the MSM told me so --* got a free pass on alleged insider trading, drug and alcohol abuse, military records, and driving record purge. If a journalist had the nerve to even strongly question his past, the information was downplayed or the journalist attacked. Every station, as I remember, was parroting the same shite-"* is the man you'd like to have a beer with", "* doesn't want to influence the kiddies, so it's okay he doesn't answer usage question", "*'s MIL lost money on that deal so we don't have to further investigate his 848,000 dollars alleged trading."

I'm looking for any democractic challengers who mirror ideas of Wellstone, Feingold, Boxer, Kuccinich or an independent like Sanders. They'll not only get my vote but my action. If an independent comes along, like another Sanders, I'll be voting for them, too.

[glitch]

84. I'm with you

"I'm looking for any democractic challengers who mirror ideas of Wellstone, Feingold, Boxer, Kuccinich or an independent like Sanders. They'll not only get my vote but my action. If an independent comes along, like another Sanders, I'll be voting for them, too."

[defendandprotect]

114. The DLC is running the party . . . the corporate way . . . and evidently Obama, as well --

The DLC is corporate poison -- and we've just had Clinton celebrating them!

Btw, C-span had a DLC affair on this evening -- I haven't watched it.

If anyone else did, a report would be nice.

[glitch]

117. I don't get cable anymore, so a report would be nice.

But my gut tells me it'll probably be awful. :scared:

[defendandprotect]

122. Absolutely . . . that's why I didn't watch . . .

I can only stomach so much of this crap --

:scared:

I'm with you --

[spiritual_gunfighter]

26. Thank You Bill Maher

This is absolutely correct, it is just too bad supposed Democrats want to villify you instead of going after the real villians to our cause, the DINO's which at this point looks like it is the entire Democratic party, fucking pathetic. Please talk more about this Bill.

[kentuck]

29. The hardest thing to accept is that they don't even try...

They let the opposition Party and the media and the polls determine whether or not they even bring something up for a vote. That happened with Hillary in '93-94. They never even went on record with a vote.

[LWolf]

32. Nice that someone finally says it where it counts. nt

[Mari333]

35. k

[pleah]

37. I said that Clinton and Obama were Rethug lite from the very beginning and

was thoroughly smacked around for it.

K&R

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

44. It isn't just them, it's the majority of the party. A vast majority of House Dems this week

voted to continue to fund our endless wars, and the Repukes voted no! We are now on record as being part of the war party.

And in the Senate, by unanimous consent this week, a bill was just passed to prevent the release of torture photos.

[pleah]

47. My "hope" is long gone for this party or any other.

:-(

We will have to take to the streets if we want real "change". If people would just band together and grind this country to a halt, maybe they will finally listen to us. It would be easy to do, if everyone would just stay home from work one or two days or more, our elected officials and the corporations would have to sit up and listen.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

62. Frankly, I don't even think most people know what the heck is going on.

They are doled out their news which they get in sugary doses from network "news". You have to realize, that most DUers are much more educated than the "average" American, who is just trying to cope with his/her own life. People are also conditioned into accepting what they are told on the "news" as the whole truth.

[pleah]

66. So true.

I keep forgetting that. Thanks.

[defendandprotect]

123. We've been being told for decades of co-option of Democratic Party . . .

HOW COULD THEY NOT KNOW????

[newspeak]

68. "band together and grind this country to a halt?"

Hell, if the economy keeps going down, we all will have plenty of time--and probably won't be many jobs left to walk out on. Hey, at least for all those who lost their great salaries, benefits-(mostly those between 40-60)--yep, too young to retire, too old to be hired, it seems.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

70. My ex, whom I reside with, just lost his job. He's been a well paid tax accountant for years and

he falls in your age bracket. It seems most firms are hiring younger, less qualified people to fill the positions of tax manager. He can work per diem and has a few leads and he just interviewed for a promising one. The big problem is that it is per diem, and no where near what he was just earning when benefits and vacation time would be included with full time. And frankly, I can't see him taking to the streets while having to drum up meaningful employment.

I'm self-employed, and sell mostly on eBay and this economy is making me take a hit in my earnings. I'm still selling but so much less in net income, that I can't take the time off to "grind this country to a halt". There are bills to be paid.

[bvar22]

87. It is worse than that.

Obama and Rahm Strong Armed enough AntiWAR Democrats into supporting the additional War Spending.
Anti-WAR Democrats were told that they would be "locked out" of the White House, and that "we will come to your districts and campaign AGAINST you."

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

94. Thanks for enlightening me. My own Rep. John Hall

I'm sure, made a deal with the devil (Rahm) when Hall discovered he was put on the Congressperson to beat list issued by Karl Rove. That list came out in a Congressional hearing. In 2000 Hall had only won the district by a nose against an incumbent Bushbot, Sue Kelly. This is John Hall, a former rock star, an environmental activist and whom I believed to be Progressive. No one of substance was put up to run against in him in the last election (Dem or Repug) and he won by almost a landslide in a previous GOP district. When I saw how he voted on the war funding I got sick to my stomach and since wrote to him that he will no longer have my support.

It also makes sense as to why Maurice Hinchey, a very strong Progressive voice for my state in Congress also voted yes. Hinchey's vote surprised me the most.

:puke:

[defendandprotect]

115. But, WHY IS THIS A SURPRISE TO ANYONE .... ?? We've known about this for decades--!!!!

[G_j]

39. that was sharp! Obama a Socialist?

He's not even a liberal....

:applause:

[AlinPA]

43. The way the health care issue is moving now (no public plan) and the several

Democrats on the republican side shows Maher is right (on this issue).

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

49. Maher is just speaking the obvious. K&R

"Not as bad" doesn't equal "good".

[blue_onyx]

51. Doesn't his show usually go on hiatus in May?

I haven't been watching Real Time much this season. Anyway, Bill is absolutely correct. It's sad that the Democrats aren't pushing a liberal agenda. If we were going to get universal health, now would've been the time. Obama and other Democrats, however, are standing in the way. Higher taxes on the rich is something I didn't think was controversial but many Democrats (including on DU) are against that too. Sometimes I don't understand what the Democrats are thinking.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

57. I think in a week he'll be going on hiatus, but I'm not sure. As to the way

Democrats think...My guess is that the ones that feel that the party is now in a good place grew up (physically/politically)in the Reagan and Clinton era. So being center and right of center is something they've only really knew. Then there are others like myself, at the age of 57, always a Liberal Democrat and knew what it was like before Reaganistas made Liberal a dirty word. These people consider me a "leftist" or "far leftist" Democrat. My politics never changed, but my party has.

Then you always have those who show blind loyalty, their party, right or wrong. Placing faith and trust in those who never really earned their faith or their trust through their actions.

[Raineyb]

63. I grew up in those eras

And I most certainly don't think that way. But then even as an 8 year old I didn't like Regan. Thanks to Regan we had some tough times. He embodies everything that is wrong with our politics today. (And frankly it's his policies that are responsible for our current clusterfuck. They were continued by subsequent president but it was Regan who started this shit and it needs to end.)

[troubledamerican]

71. How much of the 2008 election was U.S. turning progressive vs. U.S. reacting against Bush?

Obama is correct to be wary about appearances of a leftward lurch which would give the GOP opportunities to stoke a backlash.

And yes, I am a progressive. I'd rather be living in Venezuela or especially Iran right now. But I know that the average American doesn't give a fuck about democracy at home.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

74. Did you actually watch the video?

[troubledamerican]

77. Yes -- Olive Garden IS dumpster food.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

177. The reason why I asked you if you watched the video was that Maher was talking

about how much the Dems have moved all the way to the right and you're saying that Obama has to do it for his political life. So how much further to the right does he have to go?

[defendandprotect]

116. What "leftward lurch" . . . Obama is mainly over to the right -- !!!

Wiretapping? You think liberals approve of wiretapping?

Secrecy . . .

In fact, Obama's rhetoric was anti-secrecy, if you can recall it!

[sce56]

73. The whole show is posted here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=385&topic_id=326960&mesg_id=326960

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

75. Thanks for the link! It was one of the best shows this year.

[ProSense]

78. Yeah, even Kucinich is voting

for Repub bills on Iran

[ChiciB1]

92. Bill Maher... Keep Talking For Me!! At Least He's Not Afraid To Say It

OUT LOUD!! Sorry, flame away!!

[Dramarama]

97. Agree with his Nader and Chomsky quote

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

100. That was a good one.

[boppers]

98. Obama fails Maher's purity test?

Color me shocked. (or not.)

[defendandprotect]

118. Only if you want to end the wars, have national health care, increase taxes on corporations!!!!!

Cut down military spending?

If you're against those things, then, yeah -- Maher has a "purity test" -- !!!!

:eyes:

[boppers]

125. That's not enough.

...especially considering Obama's trying to end the wars, have national health care, increased corporate taxes, and cut military spending.

Maher also wants marijuana legalized, churches taxed, etc.. he lays out a mini-list in his rant, but Maher and Obama are two totally different animals when it comes to their objectives and beliefs.

[defendandprotect]

126. And who's asking for the "purity test" . . .

If you want to see an end to wars -- cheer it!

If you want to see cuts in MIC -- cheer it!

If you want to see progressive taxes on wealthy -- cheer it!

If you want national health care -- cheer it!

Who is it who has the "purity test" . . . ??

Let's see . . . you don't cheer these things but throw rocks at Maher . . .

because he also wants to legalize marijuana?

And that's not a "purity test" -- ??

On the other hand, why would you want this phoney drug war to go on?

It's corrupting government and police enforcement - and creating violence????

And why wouldn't you want a church's real estate holdings and their investments taxed?

Or are you in favor of taxpayer support for organized patriarchal religions?

Which would do violence to Separation of Church and State, btw . . . !!!

[boppers]

131. Who's asking for a laundry list to be met?

Not I.

[defendandprotect]

143. This is either your "purity test" or a nonsense test . . .

Obama doesn't have to "try" to end the wars --
DEMOCRATS WERE ELECTED MORE THAN TWO YEARS AGO TO DO JUST THAT--!!!

Nor do I see Obama "trying" to deliver national health care for all --
MEDICARE FOR ALL would do that in two minutes -
What we see is Obama playing footsie with insurance companies and health care industry --
those who PRE-BRIBED him to represent their interests!

Where is RE-REGULATION of capitalism?
Where are the increased corporate taxes?
Where are the meaningful cuts in MIC?

Where is any discussion of our homeless -- of America's impoverished --

Where is the overturning of the trade agreements which are doing such harm to America?

And you're complaining about legal Marijuana and taxing churches -- ????

The phoney drug war is spreading violence and corruption -- not only throughout our
police enforcement but throughout government!!!

Churches should be tax example as far as the church and their surrounding property --
soup kitchens, etal. NOT FOR THE REAL ESTATE HOLDINGS AND NOT FOR THEIR INVESTMENT PORTFOLIOS!

[ooglymoogly]

99. Bill Maher is speaking up for us....O, not so much. kr nt

[FLAprogressive]

101. K&R

[Chisox08]

102. About time somebody said it out loud

[defendandprotect]

119. Good to see Maher against the wars, for universal health care, higher taxes on rich --

ending wars and cutting back on military spending . . .

Amazing that so many supposed Democrats don't support those values!!!!

Evidently, because they feel the crack of criticism of Obama by Maher more than they

feel the injustice of Obama's policies--!!!!

It's their little upside down world!

[LAGC]

141. He's right on everything except...

"Gun control." I fail to see how this is a "progressive" cause.

[Enthusiast]

168. That's because he is a "city boy"

He simply doesn't understand.

[JamesA1102]

149. Bill fell short

on one of the culprits, the media. Conservatives still out number Liberals on cable and the Sunday shows allowing them to frame the debate. Even on the supposed liberal network, MSNBC, their anchors adopt GOP talking points and let's not even talk about the 'Fox & Friends'-lite morning show.
Bill complains that real liberals are not featured as much but how often does he feature real liberals? Instead he regularly gives a platform to people like P.J. O'Rourke and Frank Lutz.

[Touchdown]

154. He's had Chomsky, Nader, Sanders, Kucinich and Moore on.

Maher's is the only TV show I've ever seen Noam Chomsky. Never even knew what his voice sounded like before that show.

[Enthusiast]

170. Well, this is true.

Wouldn't it be something to get to hear actual progressive voices on the MSM?

[Enthusiast]

169. Good point. nt

[dana_b]

151. and many of us

agree with him.

[BrklynLiberal]

152. One of the best things Maher has done in a long time.

[omega minimo]

153. Great job Bill. Too bad Women's Reproductive Health and Privacy didn't make 1st Party wish list.

[Touchdown]

155. Let me guess, Virgo, right?

;)

[omega minimo]

156. Not quite as vital as legalizing marijuana.

[Touchdown]

159. You are right about the slight, but the Virgo thing. I do that too.

I got a friend who's always throwing that "Typical Virgo" in my face. Basically it's because I can find something left out of just about everything, and apparently it's a Virgo trait. Who knew? I didn't mean it as snark on you. :hi:

And nothing is as important to Maher as legalizing pot. Love his show, but that does get old.

[jamesatemple]

180. Do you really think that?

I'm inclined to believe that his admonition to "legalize pot" is just a symbolic gesture for our Country to take a close look at the insane "War on Drugs" that has enriched drug czars of Latin America and the U.S., swelled the prison population for petty crimes, cost the American taxpayers billions and billions of dollars, and hasn't slowed drug usage by one whit. Perhaps, as you suggest, he merely is reflecting self-interest. But, I feel that his common-sense proposals for progressives belie self-centered motives.

Just my two cents.

[meowomon]

163. I agree

And I am thinking of changing my registration to Independent.

[Enthusiast]

171. If enough of us did it, it might send a message.

What a mess we have on our hands.

[pf99]

176. And there is no difference between George W. Bush and Al Gore

Wake up people.

Remember that line there is no difference between George W. Bush and Al Gore.

Anybody still believe that?

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

181. Another strawman being constructed. Did you hear what Maher had to say or are you

having a knee jerk reaction?

According to Maher there is a difference.