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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:14 PM
Original message
The religious right and corporations are powerful in Dem party as the power shifts.
In the battle for gay rights and women's rights the religious right view is showing. In the nodding to the power of corporations, their donations are taking root.

More from the world of women's rights recently shows what I mean.

Southern Baptists, Catholic Bishops, Dems for Life endorse Casey's Pregnant Women Support Bill.

The spokeswoman for Democrats for Life, Kristen Day, calls those of who who have doubts about it...abortion "absolutists."

I think our party has weighed the rights of women and gays in the balance, and they have found us wanting as a reason to fight. I think that they feel these are expendable issues and that bringing the religious right on board is more important. I think we will later find that is a sad mistake that can not be undone.

This is a bill put forth by two Democrats, Bob Casey of PA and Lincoln Davis of TN. The bill apparently aims to provide for "economically distressed pregnant women".

The bill does not mention family planning. How can you have a bill that fails to mention contraception as an important step?

A similar bill which failed in 2006 gave grant money for tracking the number of abortions and all details about them. A very scary thought. I don't know if this bill has that.

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h109-6145

(a) Grants- The Secretary, acting through the Director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, may make grants to States for collecting and reporting abortion surveillance data.

(b) Reporting Requirement-
(1) IN GENERAL- The Secretary may make a grant to a State under this section only if the State agrees to submit a report in each of fiscal years 2008 and 2010 on the State's abortion surveillance data.
(2) CONTENTS- Each report submitted by a State under this subsection shall, with respect to the preceding 2 fiscal years, include--
A) the number and characteristics of women obtaining abortions in the State; and
(B) the characteristics of these abortions, including the approximate gestational age of the unborn child, the abortion method, and any known physical or psychological complications.


I just looked up the bill introduced by Bob Casey in May of this year. S. 1032. Yes, it does call for an abortion database.

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-s1032/text?version=is&nid=t0:is:30

(A) the number and characteristics of women obtaining abortions in the State;

(B) the characteristics of these abortions, including the approximate gestational age of the unborn child, the abortion method, and any known physical or psychological complications.

(3) PERSONAL INFORMATION- A report submitted by a State under this subsection shall not contain the name of any woman obtaining or seeking to obtain an abortion, any common identifier (such as a social security number), or any other identifier (including statistical information) that would make it possible to identify in any manner or under any circumstances an individual who has obtained or seeks to obtain an abortion.


At least the report submitted will not contain names. Keeping track of abortions not a good idea.

This bill has strong support of Catholics.

Cardinal Rigali Urges Support for 'Pregnant Women Support Act'

"In a case like the one just mentioned, when it is not possible to overturn or completely abrogate a pro-abortion law, an elected official, whose absolute personal opposition to procured abortion was well known, could licitly support proposals aimed at limiting the harm done by such a law and at lessening its negative consequences at the level of general opinion and public morality. This does not in fact represent an illicit cooperation with an unjust law, but rather a legitimate and proper attempt to limit its evil aspects.”

We offer the good Cardinal’s letter to encourage support for the Pregnant Women Support Act. as well as to demonstrate to all Catholics, other Christians, and all people of good will in public office how to proceed while they work without compromise to bring an end to the reign of the Culture of Death in the current positive law in the United States"


I do not like the term Culture of Death used against people who believe in the rights of women. I find it insulting to characterize good people that way.

It appears even Planned Parenthood is not actually coming out against the bill. They oppose parts of the bill, but they appear to be giving in.

Source: White House Leaning Toward Pregnant Women Support Act

Congressional sponsors of the Pregnant Women Support Act, which aims to reduce abortions by providing assistance to economically distressed pregnant women, are growing more optimistic about prospects for White House support. The bill is backed by antiabortion groups like the Southern Baptist Convention and the U.S. Council of Catholic Bishops and by Democratic groups like Democrats
for Life.


It was introduced this year by Pennsylvania Sen. Bob Casey and Tennessee Rep. Lincoln Davis, both Democrats.

Planned Parenthood opposes parts of the bill that are designed to influence women to decide to forgo abortions; the group says it wants to inform pregnant women of options but not influence them either way. But Planned Parenthood has not officially come out against it.

The White House won't comment on its view of the Pregnant Women Support Act. Obama aides are still working up what they say will be a common-ground policy plan on abortion and related reproductive issues. But a congressional source close to the legislation
E-mailed me this status report:

"Earlier this year, the White House office of Faith Based and Neighborhood Partnerships reached out to our office at the staff level for information on the Pregnant Women Support Act to begin what would become a larger dialogue on the issue of abortion reduction. Since then, we have had ongoing correspondence with their office, and a meeting is scheduled in the coming weeks between White House Administration staff and Congressional staff to discuss the issue further. I don't want to get in to reading the tea leaves on the White House's position or strategy for this issue, but I would call their interest in the Pregnant Women Support Act significant"


Kristen Day recently said that by 2006, the party had moved aggressively, recruiting Bob Casey, a candidate opposed to abortion. In 2008 she further said the party has not only gone to great lengths to recruit such candidates, it has also provided them significant financial backing.

More from her.

Kristen Day says Abortion ‘absolutists’ blocking bill to support pregnant women

This Democrats for Life group is gaining much power in the Democratic party. They are the group that refused to endorse John Kerry in 2004.

Washington D.C., Jun 2, 2009 / 06:54 am (CNA).- Kristen Day, executive director of Democrats for Life of America, has criticized the lack of support among the more “absolutist” Democratic supporters of abortion rights for a bill that aims to reduce the number of abortions by helping pregnant women. Day claimed the bill’s opponents think the bill “goes too far toward common ground.”

Day authored a May 22 essay in Newsday, titled “Is there a middle on abortion?”, explaining the provisions of the Pregnant Women Support Act (PWSA) and the proposed legislation’s political reception.

A “minority of Democrats on the pro-choice side” object to a provision requiring that abortion providers offer women the voluntary option of receiving pre-abortion counseling to learn of the risks associated with abortion, Day said.


That option she speaks of is referring to the pregnancy crisis centers which are not at all like Planned Parenthood, and they do not offer abortion as an option. They are religion-based groups.

So Kristen can count me among the "absolutists" who oppose these groups and oppose funding them.

Kaine okays funding Pregnancy Crisis Centers

Crisis pregnancy centers (CPCs), also known as pregnancy resource centers, are non-profit organizations established by pro-life supporters that work to persuade pregnant women to give birth rather than have an abortion. Most CPCs are in the United States. CPCs are usually affiliated with pro-life Christian organizations; two such organizations are Care Net and Heartbeat International. CPCs are distinct from pregnancy options counseling, which offers secular, medically-based information about choices concerning pregnancy, including information about abortion.


The Christian right is gaining a strong foothold in our party, and women are giving up their rights one by one. The president's new faith-based rep to the HHS is in a powerful position now, and she is anti-choice. Natasha Chart at Open Left found these words of the new appointee, Alexia Kelley.

This Round Goes To Terrorists, Intractible Believers

As others have picked up and as Sarah Posner has reported, Kelley wrote in a 2008 book that, "Each abortion constitutes a direct attack on human life, and so we have a special moral obligation to end or reduce the practice of abortion to the greatest extent possible."

Now, while I'm sure that Kelley would never support any violent action, and while I've been assured that she's quite the humanitarian on poverty issues, read that statement again. These are the words of a moderate, sane, well-balanced, fully functional and competent human being who just so happens to believe that all abortion is categorically an attack on human life.

Where's the woman in that equation? Nowhere.


So when Kelley says things like this, (via Sarah Posner, via a thoughtful essay on compromise and common ground at Pandagon,) I'm inclined to believe her:

... Kelley and CACG have made clear they are committed to Catholic doctrine on abortion and birth control. CACG has supported the Pregnant Women's Support Act, aimed at stigmatizing abortion and making it less accessible. In discussing legislation on reducing the need for abortion, Kelley has written that various pieces of legislation concerned with women's health "are not all perfect; some include contraception-which the Church opposes." ...

It's because I believe her that I'm inclined to think that she shouldn't be allowed within a mile of deciding other people's medical care options, particularly relating to HIV prevention and family planning for low-income families.


In 2007 Kelley and CACG came out in favor of the Supreme Court's ban on "partial birth abortions".

Catholics in Alliance for the Common Good Executive Director Alexia Kelley issued the following statement today in response to yesterday's Supreme Court decision upholding a nationwide ban on "partial-birth" abortions: "Catholic Social Teaching calls us to promote and protect human life and dignity. In this spirit, we welcome the Supreme Court's decision to ban this practice. In order to build a culture that fully values human life and human dignity we must commit to addressing the underlying causes of abortion. As a nation, and as a Church, we need to do everything we can to support women and families facing unexpected or emergency pregnancies, and to provide robust alternatives that help them choose life."


There is no consideration that there will be times when a women faces life or death situations. There is no thought for the women and their rights.

It appears the religious community is taking strong hold now in our party. It is shown in the efforts to strip women of their rights, and it is shown in President Obama's failure to uphold his clear promises about Don't Ask Don't Tell.

President Bush got into office helped along by the religious right and corporate power. Sometimes I believe the two groups are just simply switching party as the power shifts.

Women's rights are being given up in a slow but sure way. And too many are defending the ones who are taking them from us.


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get the red out Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:23 PM
Response to Original message
1. Any Democrat that is anti-Reproductive Rights
Edited on Thu Jun-11-09 01:34 PM by get the red out
Is a filthy scum-bag woman-hating Republican and should get honest about the worthless piece of dog shit they are.

I know, I just insulted dog shit.
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LeFleur1 Donating Member (973 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Attitude
Their whole ridiculous attitude does make a person want to swear, though, doesn't it?
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. I could not have said it better.
:toast:
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:31 PM
Response to Original message
3. Excellent post MadFL. They've got a toe hold, maybe more already. K & R nt
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. Make that a foot hold or more.
Toe hold is too mild a term for the power they have now.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #9
22. Yeah, you're right. How about strangle hold? nt
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rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #9
30. Would you say Emanuel is a foot hold or only a toe hold? nm
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 12:09 AM
Response to Reply #30
33. Don't get me started.
:evilgrin:
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rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #33
48. 'fraid your already into it up to yur armpits pal.
I appreciate your post. We must gain control of our party. We must oust the DINO's.
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:35 PM
Response to Original message
4. "Pregnant Women Support Act" sounds a lot like "Healthy Forests"
What bullshit
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Exactly. Cut down the trees to have a healthy forest...Bush plan
:hi:
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:38 PM
Response to Original message
6. K&R
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katandmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
8. K&R.
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Hell Hath No Fury Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 01:54 PM
Response to Original message
10. It's shit like this --
that will force me out of the party. My sig line and avatar say it all.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. "Proud member of the "Uppity Women's Club"....great sig line
:hi:
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 02:02 PM
Response to Original message
11. Birth control appears to be a major compromise in this bill.
That is unacceptable.

http://www.rhrealitycheck.org/blog/2009/02/04/can-prochoice-people-support-pregnant-women-support-act

"On the 36th anniversary of Roe v Wade, Senator Bob Casey, who opposes legal abortion, introduced what he described as a common ground bill: The Pregnant Women Support Act. He explained, "I believe there is more common ground in America than we might realize. If only we focus on how we can truly help and support women who wish to carry their pregnancies to term and how we can give them and their babies what they really need to begin healthy and productive lives together."

Pro-choice people, like myself, get a little defensive over proposals such as this, and the righteous rhetoric that accompanies them. This legislation proposes to provide support to low-income women who want to bring a pregnancy to term. Pro-choice elected officials have proposed providing more support to low-income women and families for years. But let's put aside pride of authorship for the time being. In the new age of conciliation we might file away such grievances in the hopes that having the anti-choice side think it was their idea might help get it done. That's not to say that the Pregnant Woman Support Act is perfect -- it's not. (It fails to mention family planning. Planning a pregnancy is step one to having a healthy one. And how can any proposal aimed at reducing abortion be taken seriously without including contraception?)"
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truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
13. K & R and big huge sigh.
It is always an ongoing battle, isn't it?
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
14. Posner: Religious dogma has also caused much harm.
From The Fundamentalist:

Conservative Religion and Impediments to Progressive Policy.

3.Conservative Religion and Impediments to Progressive Policy.

It's fine for Obama to offer paeans to the good that religion has done for society. But in many instances, religious dogma has done society much harm. That shouldn't be glossed over in the name of achieving "common ground." In his speech, Obama talked about how we need to "make adoption more available." But in Massachusetts, Catholic Charities of Boston decided to cease providing adoption services rather than face the "immoral" prospect of placing a child with a gay or lesbian couple. (The president of Catholic Charities USA serves on the OFBNP advisory council.)

Obama has shown signs of backpedaling on other LGBT issues in other situations, too. Obama once supported repeal of the Defense of Marriage Act, which prohibits states from recognizing same-sex marriages from other states. Now, his position is not so clear. He has forcefully advocated for repeal of the military “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy; now, he is waffling.

Obama also talked about preventing unintended pregnancies in his speech but did not specify that the best way to do that -- birth control -- is contrary to church teaching, although over 90 percent of American Catholics ignore that doctrine. (The general counsel of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops also holds a place on the council.)

The president once talked about abortion in terms of a woman's autonomy and right to choose. Now it's a "wrenching" decision with "moral and spiritual dimensions" and a "moral tragedy." That's the wrong way to frame the issue and is clearly aimed at appeasing social conservatives, rather than advancing the president's own policy goals."
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crimsonblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 04:53 PM
Response to Original message
15. this bill is a fucking HIPAA violation...
There's no way in hell that doctors can be forced to disclose such identifying information from medical procedures. It's no less intrusive than the government requiring reporting of the age, sexual activity, and penile length of males using drugs for erectile dysfunction.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #15
24. It's an outrage that the bills have requested such stuff.
It is just stunning.
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 04:53 AM
Response to Reply #15
37. No. It is not a violation of HIPAA.
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KakistocracyHater Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
16. add tracking of viagra & cialis to this bill-I hope they will
I'm soooo sick of this crap. They are crazy! Just WHY are they obsessed with getting rid of birth control? Why do they NOT care about INFANT MORTALITY in U.S.A.? 3rd World Values, that's "pro-life".
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howmad1 Donating Member (959 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #16
31. You people miss the point entirely:
Birth control, abortion and choice reduce the number of kids that priests can abuse. I don't understand what is so hard to figure out.
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CrispyQ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 05:09 PM
Response to Original message
17. "There is no thought for the women and their rights.'
Edited on Thu Jun-11-09 05:09 PM by CrispyQ
I don't understand how anyone can justify that the rights of a potential life trump the rights of a living, breathing, here-&-now human being. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
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Libertas1776 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 06:08 PM
Response to Original message
18. This is
why we need to do away with this bull shit, 2 party, catch all crap system between Repubs and Dems, if you can even call them two separate parties anymore. We need a real Democratic Socialist party like our friends in Europe have. Hell, I would love to have a center left party at this point since the Dems don't even come close to left at all anymore. We need a party that will respect woman's, gays, and all people's rights with out licking the boot of the corporate masters and Christian demi-gods in this country.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 08:21 AM
Response to Reply #18
40. !
:applause: :thumbsup:
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
19. Welcome back to the future
Time for more clinic defense, more standing against the religiously unkind.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. It is like going backwards in time.
You are exactly right on that.
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. right back to the coat hanger....
i have issues with both sides but it`s the women`s right to chose what she does.
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Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 07:52 PM
Response to Original message
23. K&R
:kick:
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
25. "Dems for Life" . . . I think they mean Dems against abortion????
Really good move picking up Bob Casey -- !!!
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. Kristen Day of Dems for Life sounds like she thinks she's in charge of us now.
I am finding some more of her statements now, and she is highly critical of anyone who supports women's rights.

On stem cells, she threatened the party:

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/new.php?n=15348

"The DFLA also warns that some backers of embryonic stem cell research advocate “therapeutic” cloning in which embryos cloned from a patient are destroyed for their stem cells.

“Recent developments may well make embryonic stem cells obsolete. At a minimum, scientists must be encouraged to harness the enormous potential of powerful new stem cells created without destroying human embryos.”

In its Monday statement, DFLA suggested the Pregnant Women’s Support Act (PWSA) would be an area of cooperation with the Obama administration.

“We believe this should be put on the front of the legislative burner,” DFLA said.

“We will work with the President to pass this landmark abortion reduction bill and we are hopeful that he will see the PWSA is a far better way to work with pro-life Democrats than focusing on divisive issues that highlight our differences on issues dealing with life and the unborn.”

Democrats for Life of America (DFLA) Executive Director Kristen Day told CNA in a Wednesday phone interview that the decision has prompted many pro-life Democrats to report that they are re-examining their recent support for President Obama as they contemplate the direction of their party."

Contraception

http://www.prolifeamerica.com/fusetalk/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=7&threadid=5893

"The feeling is mutual; pro-choice groups have been reticent to support legislation that does not make provisions for contraception. NARAL Pro-Choice America opposes the Support Pregnant Woman Act because of "the absence of important pieces, like contraception, and the presence of some parts tinged with anti-choice values," says Donna Crane, their policy director. Legislation promoting both types of reduction strategies in one bill has floundered without enough support from either camp. On the Hill, says Brown, "they're two different issues," even though they have identical goals.

The issue is so polarizing, that even if a piece of legislation does not have an overt "pro-life" or "pro-choice" label, some legislators and activists are determined to categorize it anyway. "I think the biggest obstacle is that people look at it and they're going, 'okay, what's the angle here? What are you pushing?'" says Kristen Day, executive director of Democrats for Life. "It's support for pregnant women. There's no hidden agenda here."

There is no mention of contraception, Kristen, that is a big part of the agenda.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #28
51. The Vatican is fighting for its life . . . if abortion goes down, contraception falls behind it . .
Meanwhile, it's a breath of stale air to have these religous controllers in the Dem Party . . .

and it may be the signal for me to move on.

Any votes Dems get after this from me are going to have to be very convincing debates!!!

This is a such a fundamental betrayal of women -- as we saw when George H. W. Bush took office

in calling and supporting the anti-abortionists -- that it is, indeed, fascism.

Thanks, I'm going to want no part of this in the Democratic Party!

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placton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 10:03 PM
Response to Original message
26. Obama already is selling out
see his recent HHS appointment, no elimination of dont ask/dont tell - Clinton will look like a raging liberal at the end of this 8 years - and the Dems will be in trouble because they will convince many (me already) they are sell outs - from the White House on down.
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tomp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 08:13 AM
Response to Reply #26
39. who said he's getting eight years? nt
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #26
52. The problem is -- as we've known for decades -- the BRIBERY happens BEFORE the election . . .!!!
We're going to have to have some very serious discussions here about this --

because so many know this . . . but act and vote as though they don't!

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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 10:26 PM
Response to Original message
27. If Casey is so concerned about abortion,
why doesn't he tied his dick in a knot? And promote the hell out of that idea? He makes me sick...and it makes me sick he is a dem.

I am so bored with the willful ignorant. Doesn't anyone of these people use the brains that Goddess gave them?
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #27
46. TELL IT, FEMRAP!!!
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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-13-09 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #46
57. Yeah....
I got a big mouth! Thx! You have a cool profile.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #27
53. This isn't about brains . . . this is about control . . .
Edited on Fri Jun-12-09 02:04 PM by defendandprotect
and all you need is a "god" to do it!

Patriarch :: organized patriarchal religion::capitalism

They are the three highest powers of control I'm aware of -- ????

Based primarily on hatred/warring on nature and women.

LOVE YOUR COMMENTS !!!!

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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-13-09 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #53
56. You're Right!
I can't seem to decide who I detest more...the organized religions or the corporations. And Patriarchy simply oozes around the both of them.

Supposedly all of this changes come 2012...! The Mayan calendar and all. I think we are going to see Mother Nature kick some butt between now and then.

The boyz and their machismo have certainly made a mess of things. It's time for a new paradigm...a shift.



:hug:
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Reterr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-11-09 11:09 PM
Response to Original message
29. Abortion Database-wtf???
This is intimidation plain and simple. Why do they want to collect information on women seeking abortions?
WTF??? Dems my ass...These are real Repuke-lite...
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juno jones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 12:05 AM
Response to Original message
32. K&R! n/t
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 12:19 AM
Response to Original message
34. heard this said recently, the Dems are 50% bought and paid for....
...but the GOP is 100% bought and paid for.
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Triana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 01:26 AM
Response to Original message
35. "pregnant woman support act" = "forced birth, patriarchal control over women" act
Bullshit.

Thanks for this post Madfloridian. BOOKMARKING.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #35
45. It's ridiculous how our Democrats are giving the religious right the power
over women.

It sickens me.
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Triana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #45
50. With "Democrats" like that, who needs Republicans? Pfft! n/t
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Shallah Kali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 02:21 AM
Response to Original message
36. "The fetus is the property of the entire society." Nicolae Ceausescu
http://www.ceausescu.org/ceausescu_texts/overplanned_parenthood.htm

{from Karen Breslau, "Overplanned Parenthood: Ceausescu's cruel law", Newsweek, Jan. 22, 1990, p. 35.}

Nicolae Ceausescu loved nothing better than a monument to himself. But his ministerial palaces and avenues paled next to another of his schemes for building socialism: a plan to increase Romania's population from 23 million to 30 million by the year 2000. He began his campaign in 1966 with a decree that virtually made pregnancy a state policy. "The fetus is the property of the entire society," Ceausescu proclaimed. "Anyone who avoids having children is a deserter who abandons the laws of national continuity."

It was one of the late dictator's cruelest commands. At first Romania's birthrate nearly doubled. But poor nutrition and inadequate prenatal care endangered many pregnant women. The country's infant-mortality rate soard to 83 deaths in every 1,000 births (against a Western European average of less than 10 per thousand). About one in 10 babies was born underweight; newborns weighing 1,500 grams (3 pounds, 5 ounces) were classified as miscarriages and denied treatment. Unwanted survivors often ended up in orphanages. "The law only forbade abortion," says Dr. Alexander Floran Anca of Bucharest. "It did nothing to promote life."

Ceausescu made mockery of family planning. He forbade sex education. Books on human sexuality and reproduction were classified as "state secrets," to be used only as medical textbooks. With contraception banned, Romanians had to smuggle in condoms and birth-control pills. Though strictly illegal, abortions remained a widespread birth-control measure of last resort. Nationwide, Western sources estimate, 60 percent of all pregnancies ended in abortion or miscarriage.

The government's enforcement techniques were as bad as the law. Women under the age of 45 were rounded up at their workplaces every one to three months and taken to clinics, where they were examined for signs of pregnancy, often in the presence of government agents - dubbed the "menstrual police" by some Romanians. A pregnant woman who failed to "produce" a baby at the proper time could expect to be summoned for questioning. Women who miscarried were suspected of arranging an abortion. Some doctors resorted for forging statistics. "If a child died in our district, we lost 10 to 25 percent of our salary," says Dr. Geta Stanescu of Bucharest. "But it wasn't our fault: we had no medicine or milk, and the families were poor."

snip

"Celibacy tax": A woman didn't have to be pregnant to come under scrutiny. In 1986 members of the Communist youth group were sent to quiz citizens about their sex lives. "How often do you have sexual intercourse?" the questionnaire read. "Why have you failed to conceive?" Women who did not have children, even if they could not, paid a "celibacy tax" of up to 10 percent of their monthly salaries.


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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 05:06 AM
Response to Original message
38. Well said.
Extremely interesting, thoughtful, and important OP.

Nominated.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #38
43. Appreciate that so much.
:hi:
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sallylou666 Donating Member (135 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 09:46 AM
Response to Original message
41. How about a sperm distribution database? n/t
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RadicalTexan Donating Member (607 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
42. Uh, they were always powerful
Edited on Fri Jun-12-09 09:48 AM by RadicalTexan
D.L.C.
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ihavenobias Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 10:58 AM
Response to Original message
44. K & R n/t
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
47. The Pro Compulsory Pregnancy forces aren't even trying to cover the fact that they are
anti-women's rights.

How is this happening in our party?

GET THE FUCKING RELIGIOUS FANATICS OUT OF OUR GOVERNMENT AND OUR PARTY!! This stuff makes me SICK.

Thanks for posting this, Madflo.

Recommend.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #47
58. The religious right is controlling the Democratic dialogue on women's rights.
Unfortunately. They are also doing a damn fine job controlling the dialogue on gay rights' issues.

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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 12:34 PM
Response to Original message
49. K&R
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
54. Oh, no. Oh, Hell no. If this train is stopping for the Jesus freaks, I'm getting off.
Green Party here I come!

(Well, not just yet--I gotta see it happen first.)
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DaLittle Kitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-12-09 10:27 PM
Response to Original message
55. KICKKICKKICKKICK... IT!
THIS IS FURTHER EVIDENCE THAT IS SUPPORTIVE OF THE MONEY PARTY CONCEPT!
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