I just saw a TV ad against single payer

[OmahaBlueDog]

patientsunitednow.com

Canadian woman talks about how she had to wait 6 months to see a specialist and that she would have died if she didn't travel to the US to get World Class healthcare.

I'm guessing counter ads with happy Canadians and HMO nightmare stories will ensue.


....and I had hoped for a year free of political ads
:eyes:

[imdjh]

1. That's good, I think

It means that someone is talking about it, other than in here.

[MrModerate]

2. I'd think that counter-ads would be an appropriate tactic . . .

And I think the days of "a year free of political ads" are long gone.

One thing single-payer advocates have going for ourselves is that a plurality of people know that our healthcare system is absolutely frakkin' broken, and will recognise these horror stories from Canada as cynical and false outliers that can be told of any health system.

[OmahaBlueDog]

5. It'd be interesting just to show a montage of fliers for benefit cookouts

In my part of the world, I see these all the time..... barbeques or chili cookoffs or pancake feeds for people (or parents of people) trying to pay medical bills for cancer treatment, or injuries in accidents.

[MrModerate]

9. Or one on the theme of processing the paperwork and staying up nights . . .

Figuring out how to pay for it all.

[RaleighNCDUer]

16. And all the counter jars at quick stops, imploring people to donate

for young _____ ______ who is fighing leukemia...

[OmahaBlueDog]

21. Yessir...that's what I'm talking about

Usually with a smiling picture of the child taped to the jar and a 8.5 x 11 sheet hearby with a synopsis of the kids and parents story....young __________________ was diagnosed at age 2 with __________________.


I saw a flier in Nebraska with a picture of a 30-40 something man. They were holding a cookout to raise money so he could fight Lymphoma (I think)....the flier said he is a Nebraska State Trooper. If he doesn't have decent healthcare, who the Hell does??

[Cary]

3. Maybe the Canadians need an ad from our 20,000 people who do die each year

because they have no insurance?

[area51]

24. Try 100,000.

We have 100,000 people die in the U.S. per year due to lack of healthcare.

Lurkers, are you bombarded with nazi lies about single-payer healthcare? Get the facts here.

[Cary]

26. I stand corrected.

But 1 would be 1 too many IMHO.

[Selatius]

39. The first link was a very valuable essay. I read it. Thanks for posting it. nt

[SidDithers]

44. The Canadians don't need any ads at all...

We already know that we love our health care.

Sid

[Rosa Luxemburg]

4. we could become part of Canada then we wouldn't have to worry!

[ColbertWatcher]

6. I call shenanigans on that Canadian woman's claims. n/t

[OmahaBlueDog]

10. That thought occurred to me as well

One gets the idea there might be more to the story...or that the ad is a "Jimmy Story"

Long story short - if that's their best argument, they are in big trouble. Millions can tell HMO horror stories of denied treatment and delayed treatment. Americans don't just want to hear "that's a bad idea" on this issue -- they want (and need) to hear what better idea oponents would propose.

[ColbertWatcher]

13. And don't forget the video of that woman dying in the emergency room. n/t

[Oregone]

19. If you NEED a surgery, you get it!

Thats the *bottom line*. Maybe she needed a hip replacement or something.

[Progressive_In_NC]

27. I met a mom and a kid coming into the US flying from Toronto to Chicago to get care

He had a rare disorder, and his life was in danger. The wait for the one specialist in his part of Canada was over 9 months. There was a doctor in Chicago waiting to do his surgery. Other than rare cases, his family was VERY happy with their primary care.

[OmahaBlueDog]

33. As you say, their system is not perfect.

..and I think we all need to be aware of potential trade-offs. I would also assert, though, that even a highly skeptical viewing of Michael Moore's "Sicko" demonstrates similar flaws in the HMO system. I will readlily grant that some of the stories in Sicko are not particularly the fairest or best examples, but it does show the major pitfalls of the current system.

[The_Casual_Observer]

7. And she has a whole lifetime to pay for it now.

[defendandprotect]

8. Why are you watching TV . . . or TV ads . .. ???

Actually, I saw an ad tonight -- for yet another new movie about a woman

being tortured!!!

Advertisers support programs that are watched ---

if you watch, you are helping them stay afloat.


Where you are is relevant -- where they are is irrelevant.

[OmahaBlueDog]

11. Ummm...okay

I was watching HGTV, minding my own business, and this ad came on. I had never seen it before, so I thought it might make an interesting topic.

[defendandprotect]

30. It was kind of a pretend . ..

chiding --

It is a dilemna -- but I think it would be much less of one without TV's

and I'm just trying to get people to think about that a little -

My apologies --

[RaleighNCDUer]

18. They don't know what I watch, and I don't purchase anything I

see advertised. You think they got majik or something?

[defendandprotect]

31. The advertisers by time on programs which have high ratings . . .

if you're watching, you're helping the show's ratings --

You don't have to purchase anything to be helping the ratings --

[RaleighNCDUer]

35. Ratings are extrapolated from the Nielsens, I don't know that it is

possible for the networks, especially, or cable/sattelite companies to track what is being watched at any given time. The signal only runs one way. All they know about me is what package I'm paying for, therefore that I'm NOT watching HBO or Showtime. They have no way of knowing if I am watching History or SciFi.

[defendandprotect]

42. Whatever the system used, you do know that shows are RATED....????

Granted, you alone are operating under everyone radar -- congratulations!

HOWEVER, advertisers seem to know what programs are popular and they buy time

on those programs.

[RaleighNCDUer]

43. OK, it's majik.

Not very good majik, though, because they always cancel the shows I watch, and keep crap like American Idol on.

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. My knee is messed up because I did not see a specialist in time

but I am sure my story would not make even a dent.

[OmahaBlueDog]

15. I dunno - I've heard many a knee replacement horror story

You never know what will resonate.

[nadinbrzezinski]

17. Wasn't replacement... though that will come some day

Long story bad knees, suffice it to say it needed surgery, by the time I got to see the specialist it had "healed" to the point that therapy was a better option to surgery.

When it gets cold I feel it, and I have to stick to really low impact for exercise. If I abuse it... it hurts, like the dickens.

In fact, I could easily qualify for a disabled placard if I wanted one for those two weeks of the year. I now own canes, one lives in the car, permanently.

Of course I have a good sense of humor about it... after all I do have really bad knees. When I fell in mexico and hurt my other knee, we were laughing, as it was the OTHER one for a change.

[Cleita]

14. So the slaughter begins. When you research these stories of

disgruntled Canadians you find out that often they have mental problems and have refused care, which leads to the delays. Of course, it's possible that it's all lies with an actress saying so. I had a personal friend of mine a former Canadian, who became an American, tell me a story about how surgeons in Canada could only do two surgeries a week. When I researched it, it turned out to be entirely untrue, and it turned out she got the information from a friend, who told a friend, etc.

[slipslidingaway]

20. Single-payer is not even a consideration in the US, but they are

attacking it anyway.

I gave a rec for more exposure, not because I agree with the ad.



http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=3733

FAIR Study: Media Blackout on Single-Payer Healthcare
Proponents of popular policy shut out of debate

3/6/09

"...The FAIR study turned up only three mentions of single-payer on the TV outlets surveyed, and two of those references were by TV guests who expressed strong disapproval of it: conservative New York Times columnist David Brooks (NewsHour, 2/27/09) and Republican congressman Darrell Issa (MSNBC's Hardball, 2/26/09)..."

[OmahaBlueDog]

22. Let me be clear, I don't agree with the ad

I have misgivings abut single payer, but attacking Canada's system is a fool's errand. Whatever they have in Canada beats no coverage (the reality for many Americans) and is at very least as good as most US HMO options.

If they have a better idea, they should tell us what that idea is, and why it is better. Hint to ad sponsors: "let's stick with the status quo - the current system is swell" won't cut it.

[slipslidingaway]

32. Thanks, although I did not think you agreed with the ad....

but I find it interesting that they are attacking a system which is not even being considered here in the US.

I also have a few doubts, but I do know that we are in a better position to fight for the best HC system if we all start with the same basic coverage.

:hi:

[moobu2]

23. My co-workers and I listen to AFA radio every day at lunch

AFA= American Family Radio (we call it crazy christain radio) Anyhow, we get a good laugh and make fun of them etc…


They usually balance the daily hour long show with an equal mix of anti-homosexual marriage, anti-abortion and anti-global warning and anything they can think of to criticize President Obama over. But today, It was clear something was very different. The entire show was dedicated to scaring their audience about the horrors of single payer health care and how the Canadian system was a disaster and they even talked about that woman who claimed she would have died (of a brain tumor I think) if she hadn’t crossed the boarder to escape the Canadian healthcare disaster.

I imagine all the RW radio shows are pushing the Insurance industries talking points.

[zbdent]

25. but if we countered with the documented cases of hospital errors and people having

the wrong limbs amputated and such under "for-profit" healthcare, it would be dismissed as fictitious ...

[L0oniX]

28. No one has said we would have it exactly like the Canadian system.

There are other SPHC systems out there that we could select the best features of to make our own system.

[sweetpotato]

29. Just need a short ad to counter

here is the copy:

Health insurance was intended to save a family from financial ruin in case of catastrophic illness. Do you think insurance still meets its intended goal?

I'll tell you this - it can be done in this country - how do I know? A couple of months ago, I had surgery for a work related issue. It was paid by worker's comp. I NEVER saw a bill of any kind. Not even for prescriptions, and I was refunded my original payment at the university's health center.

If workers comp works as "single payer" then why can't it work for all of us?

The "government" managed to handle my care very well. I saw the best specialist in town.

Government CAN do this. I've seen it myself.

[redqueen]

34. A year free of political ads? WTF?

Healthcare was always going to be one of the first big fights Obama would have to participate in... you do remember Harry and Louise right?

Well that was when neither single-payer nor a public option was an issue... now that they are being discussed, you can expect even more ads than last time around.

[OmahaBlueDog]

36. I can dream, can't I????

After the Presidential election, we had a Mayors race here...on top of that, I get the don't tax oil commercials every 5 minutes

[redqueen]

38. Hahah... yes, you can.

:)

But damn... it's gonna get really ugly. *sigh*

[MrMickeysMom]

37. This could be the ad placed by the devious Rick Scott

I got a heads up from my Credo Phone e-mail about what was going to appear on NBC this Sunday from him...

Rick Scott is the Chairman of a group called Conservatives for Patients' Rights, and he has a history of disseminating lies and misinformation. According to the AP, Scott is "the former head of Columbia/HCA health care company who was ousted amid a fraud investigation that ultimately resulted in the firm pleading guilty to charges of overbilling." His "documentary" looks to be an extended version of videos he's been promoting over the last few weeks, which FactCheck.org characterized as "misleading" in part because they misrepresented the opinions of a doctor who actually favors the public option.

If it is him, send an e-mail to NBC News President Steve Capus: Tell him not to air Rick Scott's health care propaganda.

[DailyGrind51]

40. "The Canadian Waiting Room"

"Tuesday, July 24, 2007 11:17 PM
Within 10 Minutes I Was in a Bed

From: Al
Date: Wednesday, July 18, 2007 8:51 AM
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Hospital Care in Canada

Hello Mr. Moore,

Great job as always with Sicko! It was very interesting to see the way your
health care system operates. I have many friends that live in the US, and it
makes me sad knowing they may end up in a situation like the ones shown in
your movie. I had always presumed that if you had health insurance in the
US, you were covered. I didn’t know about all the red tape that comes with
it.

I would like to share a story about the health care system in Canada. Please
know that this is not a criticism on your system, but a clarification on our
system. While my story isn’t as drastic as some of the others on the site,
it does point out the incredible care that I received.

I was rushed to the hospital last year when I had severe stomach pains. My
wife took me into the emergency room, and within 10 minutes I was in a bed
getting treatment.

After a preliminary exam, the doctor was under the impression that I had
appendicitis. I was brought upstairs, and underwent an ultrasound. When the
doctor looked at the results, he concluded it was indeed appendicitis.
However, just to be absolutely sure, I was sent for a CT scan. I was brought
back down to the emergency room, and within 1 hour I was back upstairs
getting prepped for surgery.

I spent the night in the hospital, and had a wonderful nurse that came and
checked on me every few hours to make sure I was ok, and if I needed
anything. The next afternoon when she brought my lunch (I skipped
breakfast), I informed her that I was a vegetarian and she apologized and
took my lunch away and brought a new one that I could eat.

The doctor checked on me, asked if I thought I needed to stay an extra day,
then gave me a prescription, a note for time off work to recover, and made
sure I was ok when I got into my wife’s car on the way home. He even called
me at home a week later to see how I was progressing.

Within 24 hours, I was admitted to the hospital, had 3 exams, surgery, and
was released. If this is what is considered waiting time, I’m more than
willing to accept it.

While I was watching your movie in the theatre, it made me think back to my
experience, and I realized that I was able to rest and recover at home
without the fear of upcoming medical bills. This is something that I had
never thought of before. Medical care has always been 'free.'

I would hate to be afraid to get medical treatment or take the prescribed
medication because I can not afford it. I would also be horrified to know
that anyone else is being put in that situation. I am more than willing to
'pay' a little more in taxes for that piece of mind for myself, my family,
and my fellow citizens.

Keep fighting the good fight!

Al
Montreal

This and much more (or should I say "Moore"?) at:
http://www.michaelmoore.com/sicko/canadians-tell-you-the-truth/index.html

[rucky]

41. How about that one where the Canadian is denied coverage and files bankruptcy?

oh yeah, that doesn't happen in Canada.