Human Missing Link - FOUND

[NoodleyAppendage]

Source: Sky News

Scientists have unveiled a 47-million-year-old fossilised skeleton of a monkey hailed as the missing link in human evolution.

This 95%-complete 'lemur monkey' is described as the "eighth wonder of the world"

The search for a direct connection between humans and the rest of the animal kingdom has taken 200 years - but it was presented to the world today at a special news conference in New York.

The discovery of the 95%-complete 'lemur monkey' - dubbed Ida - is described by experts as the "eighth wonder of the world".

They say its impact on the world of palaeontology will be "somewhat like an asteroid falling down to Earth".

Researchers say proof of this transitional species finally confirms Charles Darwin's theory of evolution, and the then radical, outlandish ideas he came up with during his time aboard the Beagle.

Sir David Attenborough said Darwin "would have been thrilled" to have seen the fossil - and says it tells us who we are and where we came from.



Read more: http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Missing-Link-Scientists-In-New-York-Unveil-Fossil-Of-Lemur-Monkey-Hailed-As-Mans-Earliest-Ancestor/Article/200905315284582?lpos=World_News_Carousel_Region_0&lid=ARTICLE_15284582_Missing_Link%3A_Scientists_I

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Take that! Creationist idiots! CHECK AND MATE.

[Cronus Protagonist]

1. It seems the jury is still out on this fossil

Other reports point out that it's not been officially confirmed yet by a consensus of scientists.

[NoodleyAppendage]

6. Simply means that they didn't suck up to the paleontologist mafia at Nature prior to the annoucement

It's a confirmed fossil, whether its features are as touted is probably the point for debate. Frankly it sounds like someone is jealous...of course we know that never happens in science. <rolleyes>

[RJ Connors]

17. Not to mention it has already been dismissed by the experts

over at Freerepublic. As I'm sure it will be dismissed by all the evangelicals.

[NoodleyAppendage]

18. Oh, well...if the Freepers say it ain't so, then that's the gospel truth. Hee, hee. n/t

J

[TwilightZone]

2. Re: Creationists...

They'd just address it in the same way that they address everything else that is proof of evolution: God put it there to make us think.

[Heidi]

4. Let's not jump to conclusions.

How about we join hands and pray about it first?

[rd_kent]

12. Nope

They will say it was "planted" by libruls to disprove god

[ColbertWatcher]

52. I thought Satan put fossils there to test our faith. n/t

[Tutankhamun]

57. I always heard that God planted all the dinosaur bones to test our faith.

Maybe God and Satan both planted false evidence in a effort to outdo each other. Those cheeky monkeys!

[ColbertWatcher]

60. I wouldn't put it past them. n/t

[Heidi]

3. There's GOTTA be a mistake. The whole universe is only 6,000 years old.

Somebody better check their math. :clutching my pearls:

[mike_c]

5. whoever wrote that article needs to go back to college...

...or find a biologist to consult.

Yes, it's an important fossil. But it is certainly not a missing link in HUMAN evolution, except in a pretty indirect way. Rather, it's a basal species (at this time) in PRIMATE evolution, way down the cladogram from Homo and our close relatives.

[NoodleyAppendage]

9. It doesn't demonstrate "intermediate forms"????

This "intermediate forms" (or apparent lack thereof) is what the creationists/intelligent design folks always latch upon as a chink in the Darwinian armour. I thought this fossil puts that point of debate to rest. Maybe?

J

[mike_c]

13. oh yes, it's an intermediate form....

But it's intermediate at the base of the anthropoid primate lineage, not at the base of the human sub-branch. It's transitional between prosimian primates (lemurs, etc) and anthropoid primates (monkeys, apes, and humans). There has never been much credible debate about that relationship. It's just nice to find the piece that fits the cladogram there.

on edit-- it fits at the base of this cladogram, between lemurs (prosimians) and new world monkeys: http://www.indiana.edu/~ensiweb/lessons/cl.mo.cl.pdf

[RaleighNCDUer]

30. It's not like there are no other transitional fossils out there.

This one just happens to be in the primate line, that's all. There are plenty of transitionals in other species, and there will undoubtedly be more found in the future - just as Darwin predicted.

[NoodleyAppendage]

37. A transitional fossil in the primate line is VERY significant in combating the creationists/ID jerks

The creationist/ID crowd has used (until today) the lack of evidence of a transitional primate fossils to support their claim that hominids were "created whole."

J

[mike_c]

41. Ida is not part of the homind line....

It's most likely outside the catarrhines, i.e. a sister group to the tarsiers. Or maybe even a derived prosimian.

[hvn_nbr_2]

36. Not mention "search has taken 200 years" and "eighth wonder of the world"

200 years ago, "Origin of Species" was still fifty years in the future.

"Eighth wonder of the world"? That's just silly.

[Kerrytravelers]

7. This is science- which means that the creationists won't believe it, no matter what.

Why they can't have science and religion is beyond me. :shurg:

[RJ Connors]

19. Like you I don't see a conflict

Two different areas of study with two different objectives, that is when everybody stays in their own field.

[NoodleyAppendage]

20. Sounds like someone just saw "Angels and Demons" n/t

J

[RJ Connors]

24. Nope, I just never had seen a conflict between the two

Actually, when the Bible is interpreted correctly, it can dovetail nicely into science. I also do not keep up with populism, what is Angles and Demonds?

[Zhade]

44. You're kidding, right? The two couldn't be further apart.

Science deals in facts and evidence.

Religion has none.

[RJ Connors]

45. Correct, they are two different studies

Science is about the mechanics of creation and Theology is about the whys of creation. And when both disciplines stay in their respective fields things work fine. But when theologians try to pretend they are scientist or scientist try to pretend they are theologians then we many times have a problem.

When I use the term theologian I mean those who are the real thing and understand the Bible in it's correct context, that of mythology, and not those who are the Bible College grads who have no clue what the bible is about.

[Ghost in the Machine]

61. "Actually, when the Bible is interpreted correctly, it can dovetail nicely into science."

Yes... and it also dovetails nicely into alien creation...

Just sayin'...

[onehandle]

8. Creationists are idiots?

How so?

[rd_kent]

14. I hope thats a rhetorical question

[mike_c]

22. see # 15....

:rofl:

[smoogatz]

28. By definition, pretty much. n/t

[smirkymonkey]

10. How hard could it have been?

He's only been holed up at a "ranch" in Craford, TX for the last 8 years and occassionally seen skulking around the White House.

[NoodleyAppendage]

11. LOL. Cute n/t

J

[bunnies]

15. Dark Sided!!!

:rofl:

[rucky]

16. Cool...but what's with the long tail?

[Duer 157099]

21. It was found 25 years ago? What have they been doing all this time?

With her human-like nails instead of claws, and opposable big toes, she is placed at the very root of human evolution when early primates first developed features that would eventually develop into our own.

Another important discovery is the shape of the talus bone in her foot, which humans still have in their feet millions of lifetimes later.

Ida was unearthed by an amateur fossil-hunter some 25 years ago in Messel pit, an ancient crater lake near Frankfurt, Germany, famous for its fossils.

[NoodleyAppendage]

23. It was languishing upon some collector's wall until it showed up at a fossil market.

Go figure.

J

[Thothmes]

56. Remained in a private collection for most of those years

the scientist that brougth the fossil to light and studied it paid a million bucks for it at a fossil sale.

[harun]

25. One fossil does not proof make.

Very interesting though.

[mike_c]

26. proof of what?

See #13. The OP is a bit misleading, IMO. I suspect the author-- a journalist-- is in over his or her head.

[Duer 157099]

32. Considering that what they're looking for is extremely rare

One is a whole lot.

[truthisfreedom]

33. Cautious we are!

Interesting our posts.

[Warpy]

27. She must've been a pretty little thing

That tail alone is magnificent.

[truedelphi]

29. Do I sense an entire publication

PlayLemur of the month? Published by Hugh Gibbonner?

And of course,other fossilized lemur monkeys would only subscribe for the articles, not the photos.

[AnneD]

31. I see more asses in the family tree than monkeys...

maybe I am mistaken, but I think not:spray:

[Bacchus39]

34. it is evidence that there was a lemur like creature in existence 47 million years ago

"According to fossil evidence, the primitive ancestors of primates may have existed in the late Cretaceous period around 65 mya (million years ago), and the oldest known primate is the Late Paleocene Plesiadapis, c. 55–58 mya. Molecular clock studies suggest that the primate branch may be even older, originating in the mid-Cretaceous period around 85 mya."



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primate

[NoodleyAppendage]

35. BIZZZZ. WRONG. It's an important fossil demonstrating an "intermediate form" between lower & upper

...primates.

It is the MISSING LINK between the lowest of the primates and our HOMO branch. It is evidence of evolution on a MACRO scale; a big issue for the creationists and intelligent design numbnuts, who until today used to be able to argue that there wasn't a link between lower and upper primates.

J

[Bacchus39]

38. it is?? seems to have the same traits as lemurs of today

Except for the Indri, all lemurs have long tails that they use for communication with each other and balance when leaping between trees. They have opposable thumbs and long toes adapted for gripping tree branches. Lemurs have nails rather than claws on all digits except the second toe of each hind foot, which has a toilet-claw for grooming. All lemur species have a tapetum, the reflective layer over the retina that enhances night vision.<4> Lemurs are thought to have limited color vision.<4> Lemurs depend heavily on the sense of smell and have large nasal cavities and moist noses.<4>


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemur

[mike_c]

42. I think the big debate, in coming years...

...will be about whether Ida is a sister group with tarsiers (outside the catarrhines) or a derived prosimian like a lemur. That'll keep primate phylogenists busy!

[Bacchus39]

43. anyway to differentiate between an extinct line versus an ancestrial line??

I just find the "missing link" claim to be quite an exaggeration. this particular "lemur" could also represent a line that went extinct rather than one that evolved.

[mike_c]

46. in a word, no....

In practice, we can guess, based on shared and derived characteristics with other species in the cladogram, but that's about the extent of it. It's the anagenesis vs cladogenesis problem. The ancestor is ancestral in either case, of course, and Ida is clearly an extinct species, but your question is whether Ida might represent the direct anagenetic ancestor of a modern prosimian, maybe the lemur? I'm sure the primate folks would be saying so if that was likely. I suspect that Ida appears to be a dead end.

[Bacchus39]

49. any thoughts on sudden and rapid evolution as opposed to gradual?

seems to me that early animals would be more alike gentically than modern life forms even if morphologically varied, and, therefore, "interspecies" breeding would have been possible if not common amoung earlier life forms. the offspring would then seemingly be new species to our modern eyes.

[mike_c]

40. take a look at two figures....

One is a cladogram PDF and the other is a big image of primate phylogeny, so I've linked them rather than displaying them inside this post. Of course, neither includes the Ida fossil yet.

In the cladogram, which is the same one I linked in #13, Ida falls between prosimians (i.e. lemurs) and the new world monkeys, at the bottom of the cladogram, a LONG way from Homo. Note too that the other lines on that cladogram are compressed, i.e. they represent whole higher taxon lineages, not species. I'm not sure whether this cladogram accurately represents consensus about the placement of new world and old world monkeys-- it's not my field-- but Ida falls below both.

The phylogenetic tree is even more telling. In it, Ida would be a sister group with tarsiers or somewhere similar, i.e. OUTSIDE the catarrhines. Although physically close to humans and other hominids on that tree, the evolutionary relationship is rather distant.

Frankly, I don't understand all the excitement Ida is generating, other than the cool story about its provenance. There simply isn't much disagreement-- that I'm aware of-- about the relationships of the major primate groups, so a transitional species that fits the current consensus and doesn't change much is not a world shaker by any means.

[nashville_brook]

48. thanks for the insight -- we know lemurs exist; so this is lemur 1.5 -- not quite the

slam-dunk we're looking for to lay creationism to rest.

[ColbertWatcher]

53. The only thing that will put creationism "to rest" is education.

Without it, the superstitious will continue on their ignorant way.

[mike_c]

54. ain't that the truth....

:thumbsup:

[AngryAmish]

39. Nice photo of the Missing Link

[santamargarita]

47. Ever seen a Freeper's head explode?

:woohoo: :rofl:

[ChaoticSilly]

50. I've been here the whole time

Wait, you mean that missing link. Never mind. :silly:

[konnichi wa]

51. To the Cretinists, each found 'missing link' just creates 2 more.

:shrug:

[Occam Bandage]

55. And in doing so, created two more "missing links."

Filling in a missing link doesn't really mean much. It's cool to find new fossils, but it's not like this was The Last Piece Of The Puzzle or anything.

[alarimer]

58. It is not a human "missing link".

That claim has been greatly exaggerated. For one thing it is 47 million years old. It is maybe (and there are some questions about the methodology) a link between different types of primates.

There is really no such thing as a missing link anyway. There are plenty of links in the fossil record.

[DatManFromNawlins]

62. You're right

It isn't a missing link to anything except perhaps monkeys and apes. It certainly isn't between apes and humans, which is what the "missing link" is really all about.

[brettdale]

59. KICK

KICK