So I am thinking...they really don't know what is killing our animals...What if it was GM??

[hang a left]

I remember reading a study about GE corn I think it was that was causing kidney and liver disease in lab experiments.

That certainly would be why they would want to blame the Chinese wheat gluten wouldn't it. Wouldn't it also be why they aren't talking about the American distributor.

There is definately some kind of cover-up going on of massive proportions.

[MonkeyFunk]

1. why is there

"definitely" a cover-up of massive proportions?

There's zero indication that this has anything to do with GM food. For that matter, there's no evidence that GM food is killing off bees.

In fact, there's no evidence that tainted gluten has entered the human food supply.

And Wolf Blitzer's name isn't Leslie.

Sorry, I just got rolling on a list of things Duers know to be true that ain't true.

[gravity]

12. Stop spewing corporate propoganda

The fact that there is no evidence for a cover up proves that the cover up is working. Duh

And Wolf Blitzer's name is Leslie

[Eurobabe]

53. You are wrong. Read this article from a Biologist and Beekeeper in SF Chron

Could genetically modified crops be killing bees?
John McDonald, Special to The SanFran Chronicle
Saturday, March 10, 2007


With reports coming in about a scourge affecting honeybees, researchers are launching a drive to find the cause of the destruction. The reasons for rapid colony collapse are not clear. Old diseases, parasites and new diseases are being looked at.

Over the past 100 or so years, beekeepers have experienced colony losses from bacterial agents (foulbrood), mites (varroa and tracheal) and other parasites and pathogens. Beekeepers have dealt with these problems by using antibiotics, miticides or integrated pest management. While losses, particularly in overwintering, are a chronic condition, most beekeepers have learned to limit their losses by staying on top of new advice from entomologists. Unlike the more common problems, this new die-off has been virtually instantaneous throughout the country, not spreading at the slower pace of conventional classical disease.

As an interested beekeeper with some background in biology, I think it might be fruitful to investigate the role of genetically modified or transgenic farm crops. Although we are assured by nearly every bit of research that these manipulations of the crop genome are safe for both human consumption and the environment, looking more closely at what is involved here might raise questions about those assumptions.

The most commonly transplanted segment of transgenic DNA involves genes from a well-known bacterium, bacillus thuringiensis (Bt), which has been used for decades by farmers and gardeners to control butterflies that damage cole crops such as cabbage and broccoli. Instead of the bacterial solution being sprayed on the plant, where it is eaten by the target insect, the genes that contain the insecticidal traits are incorporated into the genome of the farm crop. As the transformed plant grows, these Bt genes are replicated along with the plant genes so that each cell contains its own poison pill that kills the target insect.

More...

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/03/10/HOG5FOH9VQ1.DTL

[MonkeyFunk]

57. That's not evidence

it's speculation.

[hang a left]

58. and your anecdote is not??

Spare me.

[MonkeyFunk]

60. What anecdote?

You're not making sense.

[Eurobabe]

61. Oh and like Mad Cow (TSEs) isn't in the food chain already?

Sure, okay. :eyes:

Maybe you've already eaten too many GMO foods to think straight.

[Tesha]

66. You forgot "Chemtrails". And Poland.

You forgot "Chemtrails". And Poland, but everybody's
always forgetting Poland.

But your main point is very correct; on some threads
here, it seems like half of DU needs anti-paranoia
medication.

Tesha

[yellowcanine]

2. Do you have a link for the GM corn/kidney disease study?

[hang a left]

3. Maybe someone around here does.

I read it not too long ago here in GD. Maybe a month or two ago.

[rumpel]

51. May not exactly be the kidney study but

http://www.ucsusa.org/food_and_environment/

Genetic Engineering Basics
What Is Genetic Engineering?
What Is Biotechnology?
Genetic Engineering Techniques
Engineered Foods Allowed on the Market
Gone to Seed
Environmental Perspectives on Agricultural Biotechnology
more...
Pharmaceutical & Industrial Crops
Protect Our Food | Take the Harm Out of Pharma Crops
UCS Uncovers Lax Oversight of Pharma Crops
Pharma and Industrial Crops: A Growing Concern
FAQs: Pharmaceutical and Industrial Crops
Substances in Pharma and Industrial Crops
UCS Pharma Crop Database
more...
Alternatives to Genetic Engineering
Economics of Pharmaceutical Crops
Alternatives to Genetic Engineering
World Food Supply
Biotechnology and Sustainable Agriculture
Risks of Genetic Engineering
Risks of Genetic Engineering
Potential Benefits of Genetic Engineering
Genetically Engineered Crops & Pesticide Use
Biotechnology and the World Food Supply
Environmental Effects of Genetically Modified Food Crops -- Recent Experiences
Health-Enhanced Food
Genetically Engineered Salmon
more...
EPA: Rootworm Bt Corn 2002
Government Oversight of GE Crops
UCS Comments on Kansas Pharma Rice
UCS Comments on Pharma Safflower
UCS Comments on Deregulation of GE Rice
USDA: Commercialization of GE Bentgrass
USDA: Implement NAS Recommendations
EPA: Renewal of Bt-Crop Registrations
EPA: New Bt Crops
EPA: Registration of Stacked Bt Genes in Corn
more...
Resources
Agricultural Biotechnology on the Web

[Eurobabe]

54. New study reveals signs of toxicity of GE maize approved for human consumption

From Greenpeace Europe Website
http://www.greenpeace.eu/issues/news.html

New study reveals signs of toxicity of GE maize approved for human consumption

Greenpeace demands immediate withdrawal of high-risk GE products

Berlin/Paris, 13 March 2007 - Laboratory rats fed with a genetically engineered (GE) maize produced by Monsanto have shown signs of toxicity in kidney and liver, according to a new study (1). This is the first time that a GE product that has been cleared for use as food for humans and animals has shown signs of toxic effects on internal organs.

The study, published today in the journal Archives of Environmental Contamination and Toxicology, analysed results of safety tests submitted by Monsanto to the European Commission when the company was seeking authorisation to market its GE maize variety MON863 in the EU (2).

The data shows that MON863 has significant health risks associated with it; nonetheless, the European Commission granted licences to market the maize for consumption by both humans and animals (3).

The incriminating evidence was obtained by Greenpeace following a court case (4), and passed on for evaluation by a team of experts headed by Professor Gilles Eric Séralini, a French government expert in genetic engineering technology from the University of Caen. (5)

In a joint press conference with Greenpeace at Berlin, Professor Séralini said, "Monsanto's analyses do not stand up to rigorous scrutiny - to begin with, their statistical protocols are highly questionable. Worse, the company failed to run a sufficient analysis of the differences in animal weight. Crucial data from urine tests were concealed in the company's own publications."

Greenpeace is demanding the complete and immediate withdrawal of Monsanto's MON 863 maize from the global market and is calling on governments to undertake an urgent reassessment of all other authorised GE products and a strict review of current testing methods.

"This is the final nail in the coffin for the credibility of the current authorisation system for GE products. Now it's known that a system designed to protect human and animal health has approved a high-risk product despite clear evidence of its dangers, we need to start 'strip-searching' all GE products on the market, and immediately abort this flawed approval procedure," said Christoph Then, Genetic Engineer campaigner, Greenpeace International.

The data in question has been the subject of fierce debate since 2003, when significant changes were identified in the blood of tested animals fed on MON863. The European Commission approved MON863 in spite of opposition by a majority of EU member states, which raised concerns over the safety of the maize.

Professor Séralini's analysis now scientifically confirms these concerns. As the study states: "with the present data, it cannot be concluded that GM corn MON863 is a safe product". And yet, MON863 has been authorised for the markets of Australia, Canada, China, Japan, Mexico, the Philippines and the US, besides the EU.

"This is an international emergency alert, requiring a global response," concluded Then. "Only a complete withdrawal from all markets will curtail the possible damage."

Notes to editor:
1. The article is published online (http://www.springerlink.com/content/1432-0703) by the American journal Archives of Environmental Contamination and Toxicology; it will be printed in May (2007). A Greenpeace briefing on the study is available here.

2. The tested GE maize named MON 863 produces a new insecticide called "modified Cry3Bb1", able to kill a pest insect in the soil (Diabrotica virgifera). This GE maize also contains a gene coding for antibiotic resistance.

3. The European Commission granted a licence for MON 863 to be used in feed in August 2005, and subsequently approved it for human consumption in January 2006.

4. For details, please refer to the Greenpeace paper: "The MON863 case -a chronicle of systematic deception"

5. The analysis team was headed by Professor Séralini from the University of Caen and included experts from the French independent scientific organisation CRIIGEN.

For further information, contact:

[yellowcanine]

65. Thanks, The gene must be expressed in the grain to do this. That alone should have been reason

enough to keep it off the market.

[Bluestar]

56. Here is a link

I read about it about a month ago. This is a different article but it is from Scientific American (Reuters) so I think it is reliable. Apparently Monsanto shipped this GM maize to Russia for people to eat, even though their own test animals died from kidney failure. Frightening.

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?alias=gmo-corn-causes-liver-kid&chanId=sa003

[originalpckelly]

4. Personally, I'm not eating anything, I'm worried that I might start turning green...

or start mooing (well, more than usual.)

[whistle]

8. Green might be a good thing especially if humans could start

....producing food from CO2 and sunlight in our own bodies. It is called photosynthesis and would take man back to his blue-green algae period. In fact, I think Paul Wolfowitz, Richard Perle, Donald Rumsfeld, John Bolton and Dick Cheney all have blue green algae running through their veins.

What the hell, all the PNAC signers are suspect:

Elliott Abrams Gary Bauer William J. Bennett Jeb Bush

Dick Cheney Eliot A. Cohen Midge Decter Paula Dobriansky Steve Forbes

Aaron Friedberg Francis Fukuyama Frank Gaffney Fred C. Ikle

Donald Kagan Zalmay Khalilzad I. Lewis Libby Norman Podhoretz

Dan Quayle Peter W. Rodman Stephen P. Rosen Henry S. Rowen

Donald Rumsfeld Vin Weber George Weigel Paul Wolfowitz

[Corgigal]

5. ah

My friend and I are researching that topic..

Look what we found...spooky alert

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:jOkwT5kdKBkJ:www.geocities.com/globalnet_newsflash/monsanto.html+roundup+ready+wheat+sent+to+china&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=us&ie=UTF-8


http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:xzeuIJKEoCsJ:www.cfsan.fda.gov/~rdb/bnfm080.html+roundup+ready+wheat+seeds&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us&ie=UTF-8


IF this is what happened, we are all in an evil mad scientist experiment.

[hang a left]

7. OMG!!!!

I betcha it is GM wheat. That has to be it. This will never see the light of day.

[Codeine]

18. Umm, why does that "have to be it?"

Are you saying you have evidence that it isn't the Chinese gluten, or are you just making stuff up?

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Codeine]

22. So, it doesn't "have to be it," then -- right?

I mean, you said it "had" to, which meant that there was simply no alternative -- so clearly you should have had some reason to say that, correct?

Or maybe it "just might" be it? Perhaps "Hmm, that's a possibility" is actually what you wanted to say? Because, obviousy, it doesn't "have to be it," now does it?

And I don't bite on the first date, sweetie.

[hang a left]

25. Yeah, I guess I could have said that.

I am a paranoid person. It is what DU has done to me after a number of years.

LOL. You don't bite on the first date? Touche.

[Corgigal]

26. Monsanto Roundup Ready® Wheat Event MON 71800

6.6 Gluten
Celiac disease (gluten-sensitive enteropathy) is caused by a specific immune response to antigens present in gluten in susceptible individuals. Gluten refers to a mixture of glutenin and gliadin proteins present in wheat, barley and rye. Monsanto measured gliadin levels and calculated gluten levels in event MON 71800, parental MON 71900, and 22 other commercial wheat varieties. Gliadin and gluten levels in event MON 71800 are comparable to those of the parental and other commercial varieties tested.


http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:xzeuIJKEoCsJ:www.cfsan.fda.gov/~rdb/bnfm080.html+roundup+ready+wheat+seeds&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us&ie=UTF-8

[TheWraith]

34. What does that have to do with anything?

You are aware that gluten is a naturally occurring part of those plants, right? And that celiac disease is nothing new?

[hang a left]

37. Whaaaaaa????

WTH are you really trying to say. I didn't get your response.

[TheWraith]

70. I was asking the relevance of what you posted.

How exactly does that blurb about Monsanto's crops have anything to do with wheat gluten or celiac disease? Wheat gluten is a naturally occurring part of wheat, and celiac disease isn't a new phenomenon. So I can't imagine why you'd seem to indicate a link between them and Monsanto's wheat products.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

71. I think it's that missing 9-11 plane.

You know, the one that didn't crash into the Pentagon.

That's what's killing the pets.

[Richard Steele]

6. I've been thinking that since week one.

We've seen the GM corn damaging liver/kidney tissue in lab rats,
the GM cotton plants killing sheep in India....

And we've seen that the so-called "safeguards" to limit and track
GM products in our food supply are a sick JOKE- NO ONE is paying
any attention to where this shit is going, and it's EVERYWHERE in
our food. Everywhere any group has bothered to test food products,
they find it.

[misanthrope]

9. Why would General Motors kill our animals?**nm

**

[RC Quake]

68. GM stands for General Motors?

Oh, thank God! I thought they were trying to pin this on my spouse! ;)

[southerncrone]

10. The mad scientist mentality of these greedy corporate pariahs

could be the downfall of all of civilization. No joke. Even if you plant non-GMO crops, but a neighbor down the road plants GMO, his GMO can "pollinate" your non-GMO & you end up w/nothing, or reduced production. No one can control the wind. At a time when we need more food production, these GMO seeds could actually drastically reduce total output. Ironically, GMO seeds were tauted as helping to improve total output.

As usual, we are told exactly opposite of what WILL happen. It's the Neocon way.

We need to go back to raising our own food like families did b/4 WWII. Corporate food production is not a good idea.

[SoCalDem]

11. Good luck finding seeds without the 'terminator genes" in them n/t

[southerncrone]

13. You have to order them from individuals or seed saver groups.

The mass market seeds are virtually all GMO now. Most folks run to their nursery supply or hardware store & are clueless to what they are buying. That only compounds the problem.

Illiteracy in our country is a byproduct of the corporate-controlled media. Not the lack of brains.

[Psephos]

14. The burden of proof is upon those who make arbitrary claims

I remember reading somewhere that the moon of Pluto is made of chocolate pudding....

There is definitely some sort of cover-up going on in government astronomical circles.

Seriously, when you make an arbitrary statement, it's up to you to prove it. For the same reason it's not acceptable for me to say Charon is made of pudding and expect you to believe it, it's not acceptable for you to say the dog food problem is a cover-up of unknown GM side-effects. Please explain the science that supports this claim, or don't make the claim. Science is not politics.

Remember, it's nobody's responsibility to disprove arbitrary statements once they've been made. Because it's impossible to disprove a negative, attempting to do so eventually leads to accepting any ideas, no matter how arbitrary they are.

Since arbitrary ideas are by definition groundless (because they are presented without evidence), there's no way they can be integrated with the rest of one's knowledge. (Knowledge, based on facts, is different from beliefs, which are based on tenets of faith.) Furthermore, if knowledge does later come to light that contradicts the arbitrary idea, that knowledge will be biased for dismissal. This is how a conspiracy theory begins.

The proper response to an arbitrary statement is to ignore it.

Nothing personal. :-) This is what's taught in a 100-level epistemology class, and is one of the basic critical thinking skills every person should acquire, to avoid being fooled by others who likely are promoting their interests over yours.

[arikara]

32. Monsanto says that GM is safe

They have not proven it. So wouldn't that be classed as an arbitrary statement?

If the Precautionary Principle was followed as it should have been all along - but was not - people would have nothing to be worried about.

[KT2000]

49. Well said

Monsanto's track record indicates our blind trust would be most misplaced.

[Psephos]

67. Does Monsanto offer evidence with their statement?

If so, we can evaluate that evidence, and decide whether the statement has merit based on the facts. If not, then it is an arbitrary statement and should be disregarded.

Personally, I prefer to eat natural foods, not foods modified by scientists. I've arrived at that preference without reference to Monsanto.

We could avoid a lot of problems (and a lot of xenophobia) if we followed epistemological principles. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening. Instead I see ignorance on the rise as people increasingly rely on their dogmas and their angers instead of critical thinking skills. It's no accident that public discourse has become crude and political as these skills erode, and that most people have no idea how to evaluate scientific claims.

Peace.

[TheWraith]

15. Not this conspiracy theory bullshit again.

There is no evidence that genetically modidified crops, no matter what other negative attributes you may think they have, are even remotely capable of doing any such thing. Period.

[hang a left]

16. I put it out as an idea, makes sense to me.

Off of my thread!

[Codeine]

19. Off of your thread?

Are you completely out of your mind?! Seriously, WTF?

[hang a left]

21. Yeah that's right.

Plenty of other topics around.

[Codeine]

23. But I like this one!

It's so deliciously stupid.

[hang a left]

27. Some people might disagree. eom

[Name removed]

36. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Codeine]

41. I'm a FreepTard because. . .

I enjoy boardgames about historical warfare and because I'm from Colton? Yeah, we're all just a bunch of white-trash rednecks out here because we don't live in a sufficiently "nice" city. I'm not sure why an interest in conflict simulations would make me a freeper, but I guess you must know better than me.

[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Codeine]

45. All hobbies are weird in some way.

It's relaxing, social, and allows me to apply some of the knowledge I glean from reading about history. A few hours around a map with a friend and a voluminous rulebook is quite a pleasant way to wile away an afternoon. What's weird about that? No stranger than any hobby I can think of... :shrug:

>>And Colton is a den of rednecks.<<

In reality, Colton is not a redneck town anymore; like most of the Inland Empire a combination of rising property values and an influx of Latin American immigrants has reshaped the demographics quite a bit.

>>I am sure you don't socialize with your neighbors.<<

My neighbors are a nice Salvadoran couple with a little boy who loves my dog -- one of the first things he learned how to say was my dog's name.

>>Hit a nerve, did I?<<

Actually, yes -- I dislike people who judge folks on a basis of their income or socioeconomic status; assuming a person from a working-class town must be a redneck speaks ill of your dedication to progressive ideals, no?

[hang a left]

46. puhleeeze...I judge no one based on their social-economical backround...

I am a looney lefty. Just about as far left as you can get.

I just didn't understand your attacking of my posts.

Are you trying to pick a fight?

Really. Threads I disagree with I just walk away from.

I live in freeperville, and can still maintain my humanity.

I am sure you can too.

[Codeine]

47. Attacking your posts?

I just think telling somebody "off my thread" is out of bounds, and I don't buy into the completely unfounded hysteria that recent events related to the gluten/pet food thing has brought out in some people.

And yes, when you belittle someone for being from a small town as being a Freeper you are most assuredly judging them based on socioeconomics. Some of us are poor and live in traditionally poor towns -- that's always been true and thinly-veiled contempt for such people has always been a weak-spot for the Left in my opinion.

And bringing in the comment about consims was just . . odd.

[hang a left]

48. Ok this is the last response you are getting from me...

First of all: Demanding someone off my thread, which I have done several times with people looking for a fight, is not against the rules.

Second of all: The "unfounded hysteria" regarding the deaths of at least a thousand pets in not unwarranted. Especially in the light of the fact that the FDA is remaining silent.

Third: Don't give me the wo is me I am from a small town and she is contemptuous of me because I'm poor bs. I volunteer to feed and clothe the homeless. I support all afflicted peoples of this earth who have not the resources or empathy of people that should be concerned.

Forth: I don't like war games. I think they are despicable and cannot understand their entertainment value.

[Codeine]

52. Well, you won't respond, but what the heck . . .

1. It's not "your" thread, it's "a" thread; people are allowed to participate at their leisure. Starting a thread doesn't give you ownership rights or the ability to move people on or off at will. Disagreeing, even passionately disagreeing, is part of the discussion board process, and demanding someone leave is quite nasty.

2. A thousand pets? I think not. And immediately assuming GM is to blame, sans any supporting facts, is hysterical pretty much by definition. Your mileage may vary, and you are free to disagree. I won't even tell you to leave the thread, how's that grab ya?

3. Then why bring up the town I live in at all? How was it germane to the discussion? The fact is you made a nasty, judgemental little decision about who I must be (white-trash redneck) based on the fact that I live in a poor town. Dance and spin all you want, but you've been exposed on this point.

4. I don't care if you think wargames are despicable; my advice would be to avoid playing them. In fact, you're the one who brought up my conflict simulation hobby in the first place, as if it sheds some sort of light into my dark, hidden psyche. Wargamers, like any other group, hold political beliefs that span the whole spectrum. In fact, I've been pleasantly surprised to find that the majority of gamers are decent, liberal folks with no love for war but a passion for history.

[semillama]

72. Well said.

Good response to an ad hominem attack.

My favorite war game was Britannia, by the way. Guess that makes me not only a psychopath, but an Anglophile.
http://www.strategypage.com/strategypagegamestore/britannia.asp

Actually, it's great game for learning about early British ethnogenesis.

[SidDithers]

63. 1. It's not your thread, it's your OP...

you make the original post, then anyone is free to respond, however they want, as long as they stay within the rules. The only thing you "own" in this thread are your own posts.

2. Unfounded hysteria is only increased by unfounded speculation and unscientific bullshit. You may want to re-examine some of your posts in this thread to see if you've engaged in any unfounded rumour mongering, or if your posts are based on science and evidence.

3. Good for you.

4. Historical war games are difficult to play, and generally require an inquisitive and logical mind. The fact that you don't like them is not surprising.

Sid

[Codeine]

42. Not to pre-judge or anything

but because I'm from a small town in the Inland Empire I must be white-trash Freep material. Not that you're being prejudicial or anything...

[Eurobabe]

62. Beg to differ. Someday soon you will have egg on your face. n/t

[Jcrowley]

17. So you don't trust Monsanto?

Monsanto has concluded that Roundup Ready® wheat event MON 71800 is not materially different in composition, safety, or any other relevant parameter from wheat now grown, marketed, and consumed. At this time, based on Monsanto's data and information, the agency considers Monsanto's consultation on Roundup Ready® event MON 71800 wheat to be complete.


Sorry to offend the apologists and otherwise glib rationalizations.

http://www.vivelecanada.ca/article.php/20070315125946920

http://www.actionbioscience.org/biotech/pusztai.html

Pribyl was only one of many FDA scientists asked to provide input during the formulation of the FDA’s policy on genetically engineered food. According to Druker, records show that the majority of these scientists identified potential risks of GM foods. Druker was the main organizer of the lawsuit that forced the FDA documents into the public domain. His nonprofit organization, the Alliance for Bio-Integrity, was the lead plaintiff. Having sorted through tens of thousands of pages of FDA documents, he described the opinion of the agency’s scientists as follows: “The predominant view was that genetic engineering entails distinct risks and that its products cannot be regarded as safe unless they have been confirmed to be so through appropriate feeding studies.” Druker says several scientists “issued strong warnings.” <24>

The Toxicology Group, for example, warned that genetically modified plants could “contain unexpected high concentrations of plant toxicants,” and described the reasons why these might be very difficult to identify. <25> Their director wrote, “The possibility of unexpected, accidental changes in genetically engineered plants justifies a limited traditional toxicological study.” <26>

The Division of Food Chemistry and Technology outlined four potential dangers:

1. “Increased levels of known naturally occurring toxins”
2. “Appearance of new, not previously identified” toxins
3. Increased tendency to gather “toxic substances from the environment” such as “pesticides or heavy metals”
4. “Undesirable alterations in the levels of nutrients”

http://www.wanttoknow.info/deception10pg

[lonestarnot]

28. Not one sunflower seed worth of my trust.

[hang a left]

29. Are they GM too??

Exactly where is a list of all this frankenfood??

My baseball playing family is going to be bummed.

[lonestarnot]

30. Poisoned too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankenfood

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monsanto

[hang a left]

33. I didn't see sunflower seeds or oil mentioned in either of those two links

Just soy, cotton, wheat, corn. I am not saying that you are wrong. Maybe I should google.

[lonestarnot]

38. No, not the sunflower seeds

lol :rofl: just the size of a sunflower seed.

[hang a left]

40. I don't get it??

Pass the pipe dude.

[lonestarnot]

64. ROFL

It's no big deal.

[Corgigal]

31. thanks for trying

I posted some interesting links at post 5 about Monsanto you might be interested in. Especially the second one. They might have shipped the seeds to China who in turn shipped the product to us.

[gravity]

24. Good use of the Cavuto mark

Jon Stewart Explains the 'Cavuto Mark'
Reported by Judy - September 14, 2006

Stewart's real target, however, was Fox News. He strung together a number of examples from Fox News' Neil Cavuto's "Your World" show to demonstrate how Fox News uses questions to ask attack questions about Democrats and other news media and supportive questions about Republicans. Examples: "Have the Democrats Forgotten the Lessons of 9/11?" "Is the Liberal Media Helping to Fuel Terror?" or "The Best President?"

"Technically that's not really a question mark at the end of that. It's a similar punctuation symbol known as the 'the Cavuto.' It's named for the 'journalist' who pioneered its use," Stewart said.

"...Cavuto's not saying these things. He's just asking, like, 'Is your mother a whore?' What? I'm not saying she's a whore. I'm just wondering out loud if she is a whore. All I'm saying is that reasonable people who have banged your mother for money can disagree."

http://www.newshounds.us/2006/09/14/jon_stewart_explains_the_cavuto_mark.php

[arikara]

35. I recommended your thread

it is definitely something to take into consideration. Let them call it CT if they want, who cares what closed minds think?

[hang a left]

39. Thanks

Would it not be freaky if that is what is making animals sick?? Just think except for the gluten intolerant, we eat that stuff everyday.

[arikara]

44. It wouldn't surprise me at all if GM is a factor

and perhaps the deaths are due to a lethal combination of ingredients. They really don't seem to have a handle on the cause yet, either that or they're not admitting they know the whole story.

A good example of what I mean is someone I know with asthma who was set off by a combination of being around cats and having coffee to drink. One or the other wouldn't cause an attack, it took both together. It took us awhile to figure it out and the doctors certainly never would have. They do their little allergy tests for one thing at a time only.

BTW... have you noticed how many people are gluten intolerant these days? Enquiring minds would like to know why...

[Autumn Colors]

50. I do transcription for two large gastroenterology practices

And all I can say is that I am seeing a lot more people being tested for and diagnosed with celiac disease. It strikes mostly in people of European descent. The doctors always note the ethnic background of the patient and if they're of Northern European descent, they'll look in that direction.

So, I'm not offering any statics, just my own observations from transcribing for these practices for the past 8 years. Definitely more now than when I first started.

[hang a left]

55. Thanks for your input. nt

[hang a left]

59. Found this in LBN

Source: Toronto Daily News

There was no evidence of Aminopterin in the tissues of animals who had died from consuming food from Menu Foods, researchers claim.

Researchers from Syntrix Biosystems, Inc. and The University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey announced today that there was no evidence of Aminopterin in the tissues of animals who had died from consuming food from Menu Foods, the manufacturer of the many brands of dog and cat food that are currently the subject of a nationwide recall.

"We became concerned when Aminopterin was implicated as the toxin in the recent pet food recall. The clinical pattern did not fit the known toxicology of Aminopterin," said John A. Zebala, M.D., Ph.D. President and CEO of Syntrix Biosystems, which claims there was no evidence of Aminopterin in the tissues of affected animals.

"Aminopterin persists in the liver of animals for months at levels that are readily detected," said Barton A. Kamen, M.D., Ph.D. Professor of Pediatric Oncology at UMDNJ. "Whatever is causing the renal failure, it is not Aminopterin."

Read more: http://www.torontodailynews.com/index.php/SciTechNews/2...

[TZ]

69. wait I know..

the CIA is testing poison on our pets so it can see if it will work on the populations of cities that didn't vote for Bush, right?:sarcasm: :tinfoilhat: