The Politico: Some Offended by Rove Rap

[DeepModem Mom]

Some Offended by Rove Rap
By: Helena Andrews
April 1, 2007


Karl Rove ‘performs’ at Saturday night’s correspondents dinner in Washington, D.C. (AP photo)

The YouTube-bound rappin' debut of MC Rove “rocked the house” and even “stole the show,” according to the next day’s papers.

But in the days since, there has been growing unease over Karl Rove’s rap and the media blitz that followed. Among those who weighed in online, including several black journalists, many cringed at the performance and the media’s rave reviews of it.

“My first reaction was… uh,” said Tavia Evans Gilchrist, 27, a journalist in Washington. She saw the clip from the Radio and Television Correspondents’ Association Dinner on NBC’s "Today Show."

A popular listserv for the younger members of the National Association of Black Journalists (which this reporter is a member of) was abuzz early Thursday morning: Was it funny, offensive or just stupid?

Some compared the sketch to a modern-day minstrel show, others tried and failed to muster indignation against it and still others wondered whether the critics were simply over-thinking....

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0307/3377.html

LINK TO VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ln5RD9BhcCo

[waiting for hope]

1. It was just plain creepy -

the part about tearing the tops off animals was enough to gross me out - I wonder if PETA is going to go after him?

[helderheid]

4. CREEP - Y

[originalpckelly]

20. AHAHAHAHAHA!

:rofl:

[CatWoman]

2. I was one of the offended

[opihimoimoi]

8. Me too, WTF was he trying to do??? Dracula music is more his beat

[MADem]

19. Well, it wasn't HIS idea. It was that lame "NO POLITICS ALLOWED" two 'entertainers' they hired

because they were scared shitless of a Colbert-ish performance.

He was plucked from the crowd by those two. They nailed him. He would have seemed ungracious and surly, and disgraced the Dunce, if he'd refused. That's why he was less than cooperative when the two clowns asked him prep questions to prepare the impromptu rap. No 'nickname?' The fucking WORLD knows he's 'TURD BLOSSOM.'

[opihimoimoi]

49. A Rove set up??? He practiced those moves...clearly obvious...I don think he was "Plucked" from the

crowd....

[MADem]

63. Oh, total NONSENSE. If it were a setup, they would have done A BETTER JOB.

Sometimes, ya need to leave the tin foil at home.

That was a LAME performance, because Rove was UNWILLING and UNCOOPERATIVE.

But go ahead and think it was a grand conspiracy. If that makes ya happy.

[opihimoimoi]

92. LOL, ya give him too much credit re"They would have done a better job"

I just happen to think thats the best they can do given what I think was to small of a time frame for dance lessons...just sayin....and yes, it was lame...

[CatWoman]

42. Opi shoots!! He scores!!

:hi:

[opihimoimoi]

52. The World of BushCo has been reduced to a small Fort...Bush hiding in the Bunker

trying like hell to look presidential but miserably failing at every turn for the past 6 1/2 years...

Its all over but the shoutin....

[underpants]

3. It was lame. Anything other than pointing and laughing shows the press's weird

fear of this moleman

[Name removed]

97. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Sammy Pepys]

5. I'm trying to put myself in other peoples shoes, but...

...if you were offended by that what doesn't offend you?

I think it was pretty clear that it was more a lampoon of Rove than anything else.

[ComerPerro]

14. this is exactly the kind of feelings Politico and Drudge are trying to incite

[MADem]

21. I'm with you. It was a bit creepy, certainly stupid, and if it did anything, it DIMINISHED the

asshole, rather than raised him up.

[CatWoman]

44. I just have a problem with people who treat blacks so abysmally

poking fun at them.

Yes, I know there are "white" rappers, however, when one thinks/talks about rap, who really comes to mind?

Plus, I think uncool, stick-up-their-ass white people who fall over themselves trying to look hip are disgusting. AND stupid.

[Quantess]

56. Good point.

Where was Rove (and his ilk) when Katrina struck? He certainly wasn't hanging with the hip hop crowd then.

[Sammy Pepys]

57. "uncool, stick-up-their-ass white people"

Uhh...I think that was the basis for the joke. Rove is an old, balding fat white guy.

White guys trying to do the hip hop/rap thing is a running gag. Entire movies have been made around it.

[Bluebear]

59. Good, let actors make the movies then. We don't need federal officials "rapping"

with journalists. It was a disgraceful juxtaposition of a criminal and those that should be "reporting" on him.

[MADem]

66. This was not a federally funded event. It was a private club having their annual party.

I really think there's a bit of over-reaching going on here. Just because you work for the Feds doesn't mean you can't accept an invitation to an annual party put on by a private club with whom you interact on a regular basis. The doggone GRIDIRON has been in business since the late 1800s, and the White House Correspondents since beginning of last century, starting up the dinners in the mid 1920s. Hell, Calvin Fucking Coolidge went to the WHCA dinner.

GRIDIRON: http://www.gridironclub.org/grid/DesktopDefault.aspx

WHCA: http://www.whca.net/

If you didn't like the first one, you'll hate the second one, which happens this month (21st)--they've dug up RICH LITTLE for it. Mark your calendars and have those remotes at the ready!

[Bluebear]

71. Sorry, I think it's disgracefully improper. "Those WMD's must be here somewhere! HAHAHAHAHA!

Uggh.

[MADem]

84. Well,, that happened at the White House Correspondent's Dinner.

Which was the same venue as the Colbert business. And the IMUS business.

The WHCA dinner is April 21st this year, FWIW. Mark your calendar so you can avoid it.

This event was the Radio and Television Correspondent's Dinner.

It's like confusing WALMART with TARGET.

Different organizations, different agendas, different goals.

Both are PRIVATE organizations, though. They owe no fealty to you or me. The people who join them have to meet membership criteria and pay dues.

I have to say I am surprised at how many so-called "progressives" can be so damned intolerant at times. So much for live and let live, I guess.

As Barney Frank has succinctly said, Free Speech laws are for ASSHOLES...they aren't for the regular people amongst us. It's an American thing that people can offend and not be sanctioned for it or hauled off to jail. They can even be stupid and inappropriate, and even more so when they are at a private event after working hours.

If you think it is "improper," that's a good opportunity for you to make better use of your time, and make use of your TV remote. It beats trying to censor people.

If you watch it and are offended, and continue to watch it, well, that ball is in your court.

[Bluebear]

85. Yes, I am a "so-called progressive" and horribly intolerant.

P.S. We won't be running into each other here anymore.

[MADem]

89. Whatever. Suit yourself. NT

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

64. "Entire movies have been made around it."

Those movies aren't making fun of black people.

[MADem]

67. And neither were those two IMPROV idiots. NT

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

68. suuuuuure.

[MADem]

82. Suuuuure? Jesus, you're pretty accusatory. Those two guys are from that IMPROV TV show

Whose Line Is It, Anyway? One from the BBC version, the other from the US version. You know, the one Wayne Brady is on? I'll bet he'd be shocked to learn that his coworkers are racists.

Why don't you send him an email and let him know?

I'm trying to figure out why it makes you happy to think those guys are racists, and I just can't fathom it.

Other websites with verifiable lefty credentials don't think so, like, say CROOKS AND LIARS

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/03/28/give-it-up-for-mc-rove/

They thought it was funny.

So did HuffPo: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/eat-the-press/2007/03/30/brian-williams-burpoff-_e_44615.html

But hey, enjoy being "offended" if that's what does it for ya.

[MADem]

65. Hunnnnh????? Since when is Rap "Black Owned" anymore???????

Not since that asshole Ice Ice Baby, from way back when....and that was eons ago. And then there's that clown from Detroit who is always rapping about killing his wife...M and M, or whomever.

I spend a lot of time in other countries besides America, and the concept of rap as "black" has gone by the wayside (everywhere but here in provincial America apparently). You can hear French, Italian, Spanish rap all over the world...most of it fucking lousy, as much rap is.

And have you been to your average suburban 75% white American high school lately and seen the absurd outfits some of these nitwits are wearing? There's nothing more pathetic than seeing a fat white pimply boy, wearing overlarge clothing, a cap askew, absurdly expensive and stupid looking shoes, all capped off with some 'rhinestone' what's-it-pathetically-called 'BLING' for good measure.

You're living in the past. This is a fashion and a musical style that has transcended race, and has for a long time. It's like the Mexican Zoot Suit, which spread across the land like wildfire way back when. It's like crossover country music, no longer relegated to the Grand Ole Opry.

The bottom line is, Rove looked foolish, because he's old, the guys doing the rap FOR him are old, and the routine stunk because he was uncooperative. But that's fine. He deserved to look like an idiot.

But to toss a racial bomb, suggesting that the purpose of the act was to POKE FUN at Black people, on that lousy act is just ABSURD. IMO. It wasn't ABOUT Black people. It was about a musical style that is now, like it or not, ingrained in the American culture, from sea to shining sea, and has taken off around the world, from Spain to France to Italy to the Arab world to Japan...and on and on.

Here's rap reality in the big bad world-and this is just the tip of the iceberg:

http://www.reuters.com/article/musicNews/idUSN0629384320070107

http://www.italianrap.com/masterfr.html

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/203044/arab_rap_hip_hop_morocco/

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0721/p11s01-wome.html

http://mp.blogs.com/mp/2005/06/on_indian_gujub.html

http://www.hiphopjapan.com/

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0721/p11s01-wome.html

[bryant69]

6. Lord almight i just watched that

I think I hurt my brain.

I think it was stupid and offensive. But not funny.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[devilgrrl]

7. Why do people keep quoting "Politco"?????

Drudge and the Politico -- poisonously joined at the hip

(Updated below - Update II - Update III - Update IV)

The new online political magazine, The Politico, is a pernicious new presence in our media landscape. As I noted the other day, it really is nothing more than the Drudge Report dressed up with the trappings of mainstream media credibility. Today, Will Bunch of the Philadelphia Daily News writes on his blog about what is merely the latest episode (of many) proving how closely coordinated The Politico is with The Drudge Report. It is not hyperbole to say that the former is all but an arm of the latter.

Last night, The Politico's Mike Allen published a petty, trite hit piece on Barack Obama -- entitled Rookie Mistakes Plague Obama -- claiming that Obama "has also shown a tendency toward seemingly minor contradictions and rhetorical slips" and referencing "imprecise or incomplete statements by Obama over the years." As Bunch noticed, Allen's story was "highlighted on the Drudge Report no later than 18 minutes after it was filed by Allen (how does he do it!)." Drudge continues prominently to promote The Politico's story today:

More: http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/03/27/politico/index.html

http://salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/03/30/harris/index.html
http://salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/03/30/harris_replies/index.html

[ComerPerro]

12. yeah, its propaganda

[MADem]

23. Because the TEE VEE does it!!!!! And that's because they don't fucking know any better.

We should and can do better!

[TwilightGardener]

9. I was offended because these are serious times, and the main

agents of our demise as a nation are shown yukking it up on TV while our soldiers die for their fucked-up policies.

[WiseButAngrySara]

18. I share your view. It was as offensive as B*'s search for WMD's. ....n/t

[Zookeeper]

53. Yes...

Given the horrors wrought by BushCo, I don't think anyone in that administration is entitled to act free-spirited. I'm sure Chimpy's WMD search and Rove's dance routine are just hilarious to the grieving families of dead American soldiers. :mad:

[TexasLawyer]

24. well said!

I second that take on MC Rove.

[MADem]

26. You've never seen that annual event before? Did you see the Colbert skewering?

How about the Imus rant on Clinton?

It's a tiresome tradition. It continues through war and peace. You can easily avoid it--CSPAN's the only one that covers it from dessert to the Monkey and Laura leaving.

But there was nothing to be offended about this year. The "No WMDs under here" thing that Bush did a few years back WAS offensive. But this year, it was just stupid--save Bush's speech, which was 80 percent brilliant, and 20 percent pandering and lame. It was the best appearance he's had so far. Whoever wrote that speech is the only clever person on his staff, IMO.

All recent Presidents have done this BS, even before the cameras covered it. Even Nixon, with his back against the wall, attended and yucked it up (a bit, anyway)--this is not copyrighted material, so it can be quoted in its entirety:

Richard Nixon
Remarks at the Annual Dinner of the White House Correspondents Association.
April 14th, 1973
President Knap, President Poe, distinguished guests, and for tonight, friends:

It is a privilege to be here at the White House correspondents dinner. I suppose I should say it is an executive privilege.

I am reminded, of course, that tonight a year has passed, and in that year many things have happened. But all of us know that in that year, two men, who, in their period as President of the United States, were honored x e times by the White House correspondents, have since passed away, and Mr. President, with your permission I think it would be appropriate this evening that everyone would rise in a moment of silence for the memory of President Harry S. Truman and President Lyndon Baines Johnson. Thank you.

It is always the special opportunity of the one who is honored at this dinner to speak for all the guests in congratulating those who have received the awards of the evening, to congratulate the officers who have retired and those who are being initiated into their new positions, and also to express appreciation for the splendid music that we have heard from the Mike Curb Congregation, whom we have heard here tonight--also at the inaugural, at the White House, and at the Marine Stadium in Miami last July.

I would like to say a word, too, tonight for a man who has what I have called the most difficult job in this country, the Press Secretary to the President. That has changed. Two years ago, I said the most difficult job in this country was being Press Secretary to the Vice President.

But I have followed, as you have, the press briefings by Mr. Ziegler. His job is difficult because he must serve two masters: He must serve the President of the United States, and he must serve the press. He must serve each with equal loyalty and devotion, and I believe that Ron Ziegler, with great poise, with great patience, with great courtesy has met that dual responsibility. He has been loyal to the President and loyal to the press, and I am glad to pay that tribute to him tonight.

I must say you have really worked him over, however. This morning he came into the office a little early, and I said, "What time is it, Ron?"

He said, "Could I put that on background?"

Needless to say, I am very touched by the gift that has been presented. It is one that will find its way into the Presidential library at an appropriate time but between now and then will be on the Presidential desk. It particularly is meaningful because of what it symbolizes, not simply what Jefferson said about a President wanting peace more than anything else, but what Jefferson said about all Presidents wanting peace above everything else.

And tonight, I think it was very appropriate and, to me, quite moving that Ted Knap referred to the fact that whatever our differences are--and we will have them and should have them in a free society on many, many domestic matters-our desire for a world of peace, our willingness to work for a structure of peace, is one that unifies us all.

He mentioned the trips we have taken, the one to Peking and the journey to Moscow.

I thought that tonight I might be able to have an announcement for another trip this year. I haven't quite made a decision on it yet, but there is one that I am seriously thinking about. You won't need a visa, but I may need one--I was thinking of going up to the Congress. After 4 years of confrontation, it is time for an era of negotiation.

Over these past 4 years, as I am sure all of you will understand, there have been many. times when hard decisions had to be made, but I thought the most difficult time to be President of the United States was when the Nation was at war. And now that burden has been lifted, and I realize the truth, that what David Lawrence, who was a charter member of this club 59 years ago, said to me a couple of years ago is very true: "There is only one more difficult task than being President of this country when we are waging war, and that is to be President of the Nation when it is waging peace."

What he meant, of course, was that the United States has been through many wars--in this century, four of them. And the tragedy is that too often after war we fail to build the structure for lasting peace that will avoid another war.

I would not suggest that there was any fault on the part of those who were presiding over the country in those peacetime years, but I do suggest that all of us have begun a great adventure together. In our trip to Peking, in our journey to Moscow, in reaching a peace agreement on Vietnam, we have laid the foundation, not just for ending a war but for building a peace that will last.

This journey having begun, we now have the great privilege and the challenge to continue it, to continue not only our negotiations with the great super powers that I have mentioned but to continue to build that structure of peace in all the continents of the world, between all nations and all peoples, whatever their differences may be as far as systems of government are concerned.

There is naturally a tendency at such a time, when America has gone through its longest and most difficult war, for so many of us to perhaps wish to relax, not to face up to the burdens of leadership in the world, to cut back on our defenses, to cut back on our efforts, to enjoy the peace that has been so difficult to win.

But this we cannot do, and this we will not do. We cannot do it, because in the whole free world today, as everyone in this room knows, there is no other nation that can provide the leadership for peace in the world. Others have the good intent, but only America has the power, only America has the wealth. And if peace is not kept, if a structure of peace is not built, the responsibility will be ours.

But putting it the other way, if we are able to build a new structure of peace in the world, of a peace that will last, not just for a generation but perhaps longer, then we can all look proudly to that great achievement.

We can do it. It will require the best that is in us. It will require military strength and economic strength and, above all, as I have emphasized on many, many occasions, spiritual strength--spiritual strength in terms of courage, heroism, self-sacrifice, love of country, and faith.

The four returned prisoners of war that all of you have honored so greatly tonight, and who have honored us with their presence tonight, have reminded us of what they and their colleagues have done to reinstill in this country a sense of faith, a sense of patriotism. And I would simply say that any nation that could produce such men as these will not fail to meet the challenge of greatness that destiny has placed upon us.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/print.php?pid=3810

[TwilightGardener]

29. With the showdown in Congress looming over the war, and Rove

facing scandal, I just felt sick to my stomach to watch him being given the stage to act like an ass for the enjoyment of the press, who were laughing WITH him, not AT him--sorry, it's not rational. I understand this press thing goes on every year--this year it stuck in my craw. Not saying you're wrong, but offense is subjective.

[MADem]

34. Well, it's an insider thing. It isn't really FOR 'us'--it's for the press.

We have this tendency to insist that organizations pander to us when they are doing their annual "Let's Pat Ourselves On The Back" events but we have no right to do it. The only reason we get to see the mess is because so many Hill creeps attend.

It's like the Oscars. They have nothing to do with the films the PEOPLE like (that's your People's Choice awards) but people insist that the event somehow conform, and they get angry when members of the Academy, who are the voters, don't pick what they want.

This stupid event is annual, and its stock in trade is that it IS, in fact, STUPID. It went on when 58K were dying in Vietnam. FDR went and gave speeches during wartime, too--and I daresay those wars were a bit more meatgrinder-ish than this one. In 1941 he used it as a platform to prepare the nation for war. http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=16089

However, a few years earlier, as this ancient TIME article notes, he too was full of 'high jinks:'
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,788193,00.html?iid=chix-sphere

In any list of Franklin Roosevelt's noteworthy qualifications for his difficult job, one that should not be overlooked is his amazing capacity for sustaining the antics which Washington's otherwise highly judicious newspapermen consider to be comic. Rated according to ordinary standards, many a quarter-hour of the semiannual Gridiron Club shows displays a lack of grace, pertinence and dexterity sufficient to horrify the least critical beholder. Gridiron Club high jinks are by no means the only such doings by which the President's endurance is regularly tested. Last week, his principal social relaxation after five working days in which 1) the directors of TVA carried their family squabble into his White House office (see p. 14), 2) the nation's deepening Recession was abetted by the shocking business failure of an old Grottie, and 3) Adolf Hitler threw Europe into a panic for the second time in a month, was the annual White House Correspondents' dinner.

Fun at the Correspondents' dinner consisted of a burlesque news reel, showing the President as a "Doctor of Doctrines" singing a song to monopolistic big business interests, cracking a whip over Congress, and greeting small businessmen. The high point was a tableau exhibiting the discovery of the tooth which the President had extracted last autumn strung on the watch chain of a visiting Elk. The entertainment also included a glimpse of Vice President Garner shooting a cow instead of a deer.

If Franklin Roosevelt, whose failings do not include lack of aptitude for satire, found all this strikingly inept, he did not say so. Instead, with a superb show of good manners, he thanked his hosts and went home. After the National Press Club's dinner last November, Franklin Roosevelt retired to bed with acute indigestion. Last week's frivolities left his health unimpaired.

The point is, this event is NOT ABOUT US. It's not a public event. It's a private club, of dues-paying members, that puts on a shindig every year. Because the President, who works for us, is invited, we get a peek at it.

If it bothers anyone, I recommend the prompt use of this device:

[rebel with a cause]

41. You know, I don't watch the show and would not say anything

but your post prompts me to add this. If the press was doing their job and reporting the news objectively and without favoritism to anyone, then this would not be so objectionable. Heck, if they were really even reporting all the news would be an improvement. Unfortunately this is not the case, and they are not doing their job.

What causes people to react in this way is that this private party highlights what we already know, much of the press is in bed with this administration. They are mostly all members of the good ole boy club, even if some of them are women. There are good journalist that are caught up in the corporation media and not allowed to do their job, but many are doing exactly what they want to do. Sitting back and relaxing, just reading the talking points the WH sends them, and not looking for the truth. JMHO

[MADem]

70. I'm sorry, I think these are separate issues. Personally, I think most movies suck, but I wouldn't

go so far as to suggest that a PRIVATE club, the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, should 'disband' because most movies suck.

If you don't like the news, you can do several things. You can complain about the coverage. You can vote by cancelling your newpaper subscription, or voting with your remote for lousy TV news. You can write letters, emails, make phone calls.

But you CAN'T tell these people they can't have their private club, and their private party. You just can't. One has NOTHING to do with the other. They don't need our 'permission' to have their foolish little party. It's THEIR little celebration, and it's for THEM, the dues paying members of Gridiron and WHCA, not us. Because some people enjoy it, and because so many political types attend, CSPAN is on it. I'm glad they cover it, myself....even when it stinks.

If you don't enjoy it, don't watch it. But it's rather disturbingly authoritarian to suggest that if the press doesn't "get the spirit" that they shouldn't be "allowed" to have their PRIVATE club.

That's just....well....un-American. Even mediocre people have a right to assemble.

[rebel with a cause]

80. I don't have a newspaper subscription nor

do I watch news on tv.

I was not telling anyone that they cannot do anything, and nowhere did I say they could not have a private club or party. I was just explaining why some people have a problem with the interaction between the right wing and the press. I don't know where you get that I was saying they should not be allowed to do anything. In fact I am baffled by your whole response. Oh, I already stated that I don't watch this program so there is no need to tell me not to. Nowhere did I say the press should "get the spirit" (what does that even mean?) but I did suggest they should do their job. Gee what a novel idea. I never said they shouldn't be "allowed" to have their private club, so I think you are just making things up here.

As far as you calling me un-american. All I can say is thank you, I have no desire to be an "American". I am a citizen of the United States of America.

[MADem]

87. Look, I said I think the two matters are SEPARATE issues. You can't squish them together and make

one 'conditional' on the other. And that is how your post reads. "IF" this, "THEN" that.

You said: If the press was doing their job and reporting the news objectively and without favoritism to anyone, then this would not be so objectionable. Heck, if they were really even reporting all the news would be an improvement. Unfortunately this is not the case, and they are not doing their job.


My point: They have the right to assemble in their private club even if they do a LOUSY job. Even if they MAKE UP the news, if they lie like rugs. It's their organization, they pay dues to join it, and it is not an organization that is federally funded or maintained. Even the coverage of the event is from CSPAN, which is funded by the cable and satellite companies of America. Their annual event takes place AFTER business hours. See, we aren't the "deciders" on what they do. They have every right to be mediocre, or to stink, if they so choose. And it doesn't matter if we like it or not, because it isn't FOR us. It's for them.


You said: What causes people to react in this way is that this private party highlights what we already know, much of the press is in bed with this administration. They are mostly all members of the good ole boy club, even if some of them are women. There are good journalist that are caught up in the corporation media and not allowed to do their job, but many are doing exactly what they want to do. Sitting back and relaxing, just reading the talking points the WH sends them, and not looking for the truth. JMHO

My response: This proves absolutely nothing of the sort. When the press was all over Nixon, when they were up Reagan's ass, the mood of the soirees was essentially the same. It's a night where, historically, the old adversarial nature of the relationship was put aside. I am not suggesting that the press ISN'T in bed with the WH nowadays, but there's no difference in these dinners as a result of it. There just isn't. You can look at the old tapes going back to when CSPAN started covering this, and you can read the speeches prior to that. And with or without collusion, it JUST doesn't matter--as I said, this event isn't funded by or for we, the people. It's a private event that is covered on CSPAN because of its political nature.

And as Barney Frank said, Free Speech is for assholes. That's who is protected by those laws. I'm not ready to go into "Watch what you say" mode, even if it means my ears are occasionally sullied with absolute tripe on occasion. If it gets to be too much, I vote with the remote.

[rebel with a cause]

96. Okay, whatever. We are not going to agree on this at all.

"when the press was all over Nixon" they were also reporting negative things about him. They were also reporting negative things about Reagan when they were buddy buddy with him at this dinner. It doesn't make any difference that there was no difference in the way they acted at the dinner, what does make a difference is in the way people feel about it. If the press was reporting fairly on the actions in Washington, then it would be funny that they were all together like this on the one night, having to make nice nice with each other. But when the people feel like they are being lied to by not only the government but also the press, that is what makes them resent what goes on there. And how it proves it is in our minds, not in reality. For example, a women might see her husband talking to a woman who is an acquaintance and think nothing of it, but she might see him talking to an old girl friend and immediately think it proves something is going on. It is in the history of the two people and in her perception of them that proves it in her mind, not that it really proves anything other than the two people are talking to each other.

As I tried to make clear, I was not talking about censorship or controlling other people's behavior even. What I was talking about was the reason people felt the way they do. Oh, they also have freedom of speech to talk about these feelings. As far as I am concerned, I quit caring a long time ago about any of these things. My remote works just fine and I chose not to watch anything that has bush or the right wing talking points on it. I watched the clips of Colbert last year, but that is all. I have family that works in journalism, and they feel the same way I do about this. They don't even buy the newspaper they work for.

[MADem]

101. I guess not.

I did note that it doesn't MATTER if the press is GOOD, or BAD, or in bed with the WH. The things I am concerned about, speech and association, are absolute in my mind.

You just can't make free speech "conditional." You can't make freedom of association "conditional" on "appropriate" or "acceptable" behavior.

That's what the GOP does. They suggest that IF the Democrats don't behave in a certain way, THEN there will be DIRE consequences.

I hate that type of language.

Particularly when there's a plain alternative to having to observe the objectionable activity (taking place in a PRIVATE venue, too). If things on the TV are objectionable, we have the freedom to use the remote to rid our ears and eyes of it.

I do it when Donald Trump comes on the screen, for example. But I'd never suggest that the twit doesn't have the right to bloviate--he just can't do it at me, because I've already pushed the button.

[KoKo]

54. Somehow I can't see anyone in FDR's Admin advocating pulling heads off "small animals" like Rove did

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3188295

[MADem]

72. But that comparison is irrelevant. There's no RULE that says that the

entertainment at these events, these PRIVATE events, has to be either good OR clever.

It actually CAN SUCK. Without ANY consequence beyond the nattering of the observer class.

That's America for you. Private citizens have the right in this country to assemble if they so desire, for whatever purposes.

And they even have the right to make stupid or "objectionable" speech at these events. Sucking in America is not YET a crime.

Vote with your remote if it troubles you, that's my advice.

[Cha]

77. Precisely!

It's rubbing the noses of the AMerican People into the deaths of Soldiers and the Iraqis. The WAr On IRaq wouldn't have happened without the bushit lies and the co-conspiracy of the corporatemediawhores.

[ComerPerro]

10. so, basically politico is RW bullshit and propaganda, then?

Honestly, it seems like they are trying to agitate racists by turning legitimate complaints about the "rap" into a PC, oversensitive, "some people need to lighten up" issue.

Interesting that they never mention the most offensive aspect of the rap: The reporters and supposed journalists are right there, clapping and laughing along with a man under investigation for serious crimes, laughing as he jokes about the crimes he committed.


Not. Funny.

[valerief]

11. It was up there with "no WMDs under this table." nt

[The_Casual_Observer]

13. Rove is offensive, period.

[jackstraw45]

15. What is OFFENSIVE to me is the reaction of the press corps...

...to a man, STILL with top secret clearance, who found political opportunity in outing a CIA OPERATIVE.

Rove should be a pariah. Instead, the Washington Corporate Media establishment gave his little performance a standing ovation.

[MADem]

16. Overthinking, creepy AND stupid.

Offended? Naaah. Old people, and old white people especially, should not rap. All I can say is, I want to live to be a hundred and change, because it's gonna be funny as hell seeing the "whippersnappers" in the Old Age Home doing that shit while dealing with arthritis, flashing their tattoos, and trying to keep their piercings in their drooping, paper thin skin!!!!

But OFFENDED? Certainly not. The guy has done OTHER, IMPORTANT things that offend. Serious things. Like outing CIA agents.

I liked hearing the brutal and hideous truth of his ripping heads off small animals, though. He thought that was HUMOR.

That was....telling.

[Captain Hilts]

17. The Gridiron Dinner is a lot of mis-guided self-congratulatory tripe. nt

[Bitwit1234]

22. I have seen a lot of rap performers on TV and darn I never ever ever

saw anything like what rove did....

I tell you the truth if it had not been so embarrasing to watch I would have laughted AT him and now WITH him.

[alcibiades_mystery]

25. It was absolutely a modern-day minstrel show

Here's my post on it:


Note to MOST over-40 white guys: DO NOT yuck it up pretending to be an MC. In fact, resist the urge to perform any mimetic operation with respect to hip hop culture, period.




Do not try to use the slang. You'll get it wrong and sound like an ignorant jackass.
Do not use the hand gestures. You'll make yourself look like a racist imbecile.
Do not rock the mic.

AND please please please please please, do not at any time attempt to

1) dance
2) groove
3) pop (including any variation of the worm)
4) get up a-get-get-get-down
5) pimp limp
6) hustler stroll

DO NOT, under any circumstances, chicka-chicka nod ya head ta this. And please note, with respect to the Mashed Potato, that, as Ice Cube once noted, that ole shit been played out back in nineteen sixty seven.

It's just racist and embarrassing. Not like 'offensive' racist. Not like separate water fountains racist. Just weird and sad and embarrassing racist, you know? Like your fifty year old white middle class uncle pretending to have a mic in hand and starting out with "My name is Gary and I'm here to say..." and then going into some human beat box routine racist. Gnaw mean? Just clueless and pathetic and thoroughly not cool like dat racist.

You ain't down by law. So just. Fucking. Stop it.

[DeepModem Mom]

27. Great post -- thanks for reposting. nt

[TahitiNut]

32. Well, it doesn't come close to burning crosses ...

... but it certainly portrays more than a hint of an arrogant, dismissive, condescending and demeaning attitude towards forms of 'pop culture' not aligned to Perry Como and Frank Sinatra. All I have to do is try to imagine an equivalent lampooning of some evangelical minister, a country singer, or a crooner like Perry Como to understand that the 'humor' was more than a little mean-spirited.

[MADem]

37. To be fair to Rove, who is NOT a fair person himself, it was NOT his idea.

He was plucked from the audience by those lame performers. He couldn't refuse.

You think David Gregory was thrilled at his chance to make an ass of himself? Of course not.

But if they grab you, you're stuck. There's fourteen frigging people at your table. If the cameras don't catch you whining and trying to get out of it, your table mates, reporters mostly, will rat you out.

If you're tagged, you're stuck going through with it.

[Bake]

50. Do you think he just did his "rap" off the cuff?

I think it was planned. Poorly.

Bake

[MADem]

62. You clearly didn't watch the show. He did NOTHING. He said THREE words

when they shoved the mike in his face. Those three words were "EM Cee ROVE." That's ALL he said during the entire evolution.

All the work was done by the two hired professionals. Lame, preformatted rhyming based on ideas they work out ahead of time.

They do it for a living. They're the IMPROV idiots on Tee Vee, after all.


Good grief, you didn't even see the thing, apparently, or you didn't pay attention as to who was doing the heavy lifting. It clearly wasn't planned. Rove looked plainly discomfited.

Sheesh.

[CTyankee]

83. what is it with these heavy handed media types in D.C.?

They can't get help when they need it for their lame attempt at "humor'? What a crock!

It was such an embarrassment, I cannot even tell you!

[MADem]

91. They were going for inocuous, painless, 'safe'

Trying to avoid a Colbert or an Imus. That was the goal.

The WHCA dinner at the end of the month is going to feature RICH LITTLE.

Oh boy, maybe we'll get his quintessential NIXON impression. Whee.

They're just too fearful of making waves.

I thought it was lamely amusing, and it served to take Rove down a peg, which works for me. It made him look a bit creepy, and that's a good thing.

[CTyankee]

61. Wow, Alcibiades, for an ancient Greek you really know your rap!

That was great! You just Revealed The Truth with that post!

I don't know much, if anything, about rap music. My guess is that Rove knows less than me and that's pathetic. He looked pathetic in the brief clip I saw in the news.

I can't disturb my beautiful mind to watch the full clip of his so called "rap"...

[MADem]

73. He only said three words--Em Cee Rove. The other old fools did the rest. NT

[CTyankee]

76. But, oh, Alcibiades did it best to describe what he did!

That was a great description and translation, it was so informative and inspired.

I got a lot of information from it and it also told me what to look out for in rap music (and not try to do what Rove did, that imbecile!).

[MADem]

90. I differ with the characterization.

I didn't see any racism at all. I saw an old fool trying to copy moves that are better left to the young. I saw a rhythmless nitwit who couldn't even keep the beat on three syllables of Emmm Ceeeee Rove.

But I thought it was funny. A bit creepy, sure. Stupid, certainly.

I thought it took the guy down a peg. It certainly didn't build him up. It stripped away a bit of his power.

IMO.

Rap is everywhere... http://web.mit.edu/condry/www/jhh/

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/routledg/cajl/2006/00000026/00000002/art00003;jsessionid=10xa6be6p7030.alice

http://www.bebo.com/Profile.jsp?MemberId=2548490898

Listen to some Iranian rap, here: http://www.pishro-music.com/

[Cabcere]

28. Take away that last word

from The Politico's subject line, and you have my thoughts on the matter. ;)

[RaleighNCDUer]

30. Oh, come on. Lighten up.

He didn't do it in blackface. This time.

[Catherine Vincent]

31. I don't think it was offensive.

Rove just looked like an idiot up there. :)

[MADem]

35. Which was a good thing. It chipped away at his thin veneer of invulnerability. NT

[rebel with a cause]

39. rove is a popsicle man.

If anyone does not know what that is, it is an overly-thin person whose head looks like a round lollipop stuck on their stick body. Kelly Ripa is called one, as is several other women in show business who are unnormally thin. I don't know how thin rove is, but he looks a lot thinner than he use to and when I saw him walk out on stage that term immediately popped into my mind. His head is big anyway, but now it is gigantic compared to the body that hangs under it. Sorry, I usually don't talk about the way people look, but I am tired of these people. Well, to be honest I am tired of a lot of people.

[la la]

33. My feeling-

you know how some terrible, creepy happenings cause a person to stare in disbelief, as in 'watching a train wreck'...?

This was a 'train wreck' that I couldn't watch. Some things are just toooo disgusting.

:puke:

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

36. Brad Sherwood and Colin Mochrie did the left a great service

by putting Rove in such an awkward spot, where it could be recorded for posterity. Whoever booked the "Whose Line Is It Anyway" players really didn't think things through; bad rap (and other musical styles) is a mainstay of the show, where improvisationists vie to strip one another of all dignity. They certainly did their jobs with Rove, and for that I thank them.

[MADem]

38. Wow, how refreshing! Someone who gets what really happened there!!

It should be the righties who are offended--their "guy" lost a shitload of cachet that night!

[ComerPerro]

93. nah, they were just whoring themselves out for a paycheck

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

94. Only the congenitally wealthy escape that fate

[ComerPerro]

95. true, but they could have really made a statement if they wanted to

Stephen Colbert sure as hell did. He took them to task for what they have done, and slammed the media for letting it happen. The uncomfortable silence that followed the shock was the sound of a bunch of supposed journalists doing some self-analysis and soul searching. Too bad it didn't take.

The "Rove rap" wasn't meant to mock or embarass him any more than their musical numbers mock and embarass any other guest on Whose Line.

There is a difference between entertainers selling all their self-respect for a payday, and regular wage earners trying just to make a living. Those two could have easily turned down BushCo and still lived comfortably.

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

99. They aren't political satirists like Colbert

They're very silly comics, which I say as a compliment. As political satirists they would have been sell-outs, but as silly comics they used the musical genre most likely to make a 50+ white man look ridiculous. That's not selling their self-respect, that's being true to who they are. Regardless of their intentions or political affiliation, the result was a picture worth a thousand words. Silly comics can do no better in my estimation.

[ComerPerro]

100. if you want to think that, whatever works

I think they've been hanging around Drew Carey too long

[Rosemary2205]

40. Color me stupid

As a black female, I have no idea why Rove doing rap would offend "black journalists" -- unless it's just that Rove is so offensive period that everything the does including BREATHING offends.

[Ninja Jordan]

43. He is a foul tub of lard.

[Vinca]

45. My first thought on seeing it (other than Rove is a pig) was

wow - that's downright racist. I'm surprised he didn't do it in black face. (Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know there are white rappers, but it's not the same.)

[ChairmanAgnostic]

46. what I found offensive was Dave Gregory and other

MSM types yucking it up with Rove and others.

This dinner has gone from being a roast, to being a rub elbows and make nice with the Media-types getting the short end of the stick. but not as short as the US public.

[MADem]

74. They were both plucked out of the audience as well.

You sit at a table with fourteen others. YOu don't go up, you're branded as a whiner, a spoilsport, a shithead.

I'm amazed at the intolerance in this thread. You'd think people would be chortling with glee at how idiotic Rove looked. Instead, we get a dissection of the "meaning" of a lame act by a bunch of has-been imrpov fools at a PRIVATE event that CSPAN gets permission to record.

I'm amazed at the rigidity here. Frankly.

And, FWIW, it's not a roast. There's sometimes ribbing, but sometimes there's music. Nancy Reagan sang at one of them. It's a night of entertainment put on by a PRIVATE club. It's for THEM, not for US.

[Faux pas]

47. I'm always offended when a**holes think their being funny. n/t

[kerstin]

48. The Rethuglican-media complex has this down to a science.

Deny, attack, obscure, trivialize, with the press whores as willing accomplices. (No offense to sex workers. Shout out to Malloy listeners there!)

[slampoet]

51. When are humans going to learn? ALL COMEDY IS OFFENSIVE!

Why did the chicken cross the road? To get to the other side.


Funny not because it was a chicken, but funny because the target is too stupid (or smart) to give the obvious answer.


Man falls on banana peal. Offensive to the clumsy.


It is not about whether any humor is offensive. It is all about how much can YOU take?

[MADem]

75. Cruelty to chickens, that. And FRUIT ABUSE!!!! Can't have THAT! NT

[maxrandb]

55. I Was Deeply Offended!!!

but not by that stupid, lame-ass, Rove impersonates Al Jolson, rap garbage.

NO!!!!

I was offended that while our sons and daughters are getting the shit kicked out them, and having their arms and legs and brains and guts blown and splattered all over the fucking streets of Baghdad, our fucking media thinks it's appropriate to joke and "cut loose" with these fuckers.

I'm offended that our media thinks felony purjury, outing a CIA agent, destroying her life and career, using the power of United States Federal Prosecutors as "bullet men" to target your political opponents, using the Commerce Department to engage in partisan political activities, selective amnesia in front of congressional committees, etc is SUCH A BIG FUCKING JOKE

Hell yes I'm offended. I'm offended by what my country, and it's once proud tradition of an independent press have become.

"Hey America.....the fucking jokes on us"!!!!

[kerstin]

60. Exactly. n/t

[Azathoth]

78. Self-delete

[paparush]

58. Ya mean like - With our soldiers in harms way, dying, getting dismembered,

how can the president's closest advisor act like such a total fucking moran?

File Under: Rich, fat, white, ultraconservative, war mongerer, does poor rap imitation while Senator John McCain strolls the peaceful Bagdhad streets (escorted by 100 troops, 3 cobras and 2 Apaches)

[Bucky]

69. It was aesthetically offensive, but is it necessarily racist to ridicule rap?

It was goofy. Let's focus on the man's real wickedness, not his lack of taste.

[Azathoth]

79. The only offensive thing about it was that Rove wasn't wearing an orange prison jumpsuit n/t

[Rex]

81. Dee dee dee.

Rove just shit all over himself and sadly it was probably his 'high point'. Rove will be remembered as a piece of shit. He doesn't even get a legacy, even after trying to 'rap' or whatever the hell he was doing.

[Bluebear]

86. Stop!

You're not progressive and intolerant! :eyes:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=559324&mesg_id=562666

[Rex]

88. I was wondering what the Dee dee dee ruling would be here in GD.

Sometimes you just have to push to find out. Well now. :rofl:

[liberalpragmatist]

98. I was offended b/c it was so bad!

Seriously. It. Was. Ridiculously. Embarrassing.

I laughed and laughed at how absurdly ridiculous it was. Then I cringed.