The Chrysler deal sucks, for the workers & the retirees. It's not "ownership".

[Hannah Bell]

UAW’s Chrysler Equity Is Small Comfort as Union’s Power Wanes

"the union’s retiree health-care fund had accepted a 55 percent stake in Chrysler in return for cutting in half the automaker’s $10.6 billion cash obligation to the fund...Its Chrysler equity could turn out to be worthless, leaving retirees with curtailed health insurance"

So the shares in the company (which the rank & file don't see) cost the rank & file $5.3 billion in health care. Man, what a deal.


"While the UAW gained representation on the Chrysler board through the agreement, its power will be limited because shares owned by the trust fund will be voted by INDEPENDENT TRUSTEES"

The UAW (bureaucrats) get a seat on the board (but not a majority of seats on the board representative of their shares) - and even the bureaucrats (who have to be at least somewhat responsive to the rank & file) don't vote the shares UAW supposedly "owns"? WTF? Where's the "win" here?



"The union’s new contract at Chrysler preserved the current $28-an-hour pay scale for active UAW workers, plus maintains their current health-care benefits. It contains significant concessions in other areas. The contract reduced the number of skilled trades classifications, which the UAW used historically to keep work in-house. The contract also has a provision that as much as 25 percent of the total Chrysler-UAW workforce will make $14 to $16 an hour. This increased from 20 percent in an earlier contract."

When production resumes, the company will be operated by partner Fiat SpA with a new nine-member board. On Wednesday, workers voted yes because UAW leaders said the new contract could prevent a bankruptcy and help keep factories operating, said Paul Thayer, 47, a welder repairman at a Chrysler stamping plant in Warren, Michigan. “Obama said none of the plants would close, and two hours later they sent us home,” said Thayer, a 17-year Chrysler veteran. “So now, whom do we call a liar, the president, the UAW or Chrysler, or are they all in bed together?” Thayer asked."


All you guys who kept saying, ain't it grand, the workers now own the company, & obama stands with the workers - i think it's not the case.

This deal sucks. What a set-up. Mark my words.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=ashM7Ku7j3ZQ&refer=home

[John Q. Citizen]

1. Workers have risk and liabilty while investors and management are liability free.

When the company they ran fails they aren't personally liable, yet the workers are liable to lose their health care coverage.

Why can't the workers sue the individuals who made the decisions or their heirs for damages?

[leftstreet]

2. "...or are they all in bed together?"

Yep.

K&R

[Hannah Bell]

3. Getting so obvious, even a caveman could see it.

[Hannah Bell]

4. Chrysler declares bankruptcy

(edited for copyright purposes-proud patriot Moderator Democratic Underground)

Chrysler — the third largest US automaker — filed for bankruptcy in New York Thursday, announcing that it would close its manufacturing facilities until it emerges from a Chapter 11 reorganization. The move threatens the livelihoods of 54,000 hourly and salaried workers in the US and Canada and hundreds of thousands of retirees and workers at dealerships, parts suppliers and other related companies in Michigan, Ohio, Illinois and other states.

It is impossible to say how many, if any, of the closed factories will ever reopen again. Under the terms of Section 363 of the Bankruptcy Code, big investors can pick and choose what factories and assets to buy, while discarding others. Any workers who remain at a downsized Chrysler will be subjected to near-poverty wages and backbreaking conditions under the terms of the agreement signed by the United Auto Workers and rammed down the throats of Chrysler workers on Wednesday...

Under a so-called “363 sale,” a new buyer—known in financial circles as a “stalking horse” — can purchase the most profitable factories and assets, while leaving the company’s undesirable parts, including the tens of billions of dollars in pension and health care obligations owed to Chrysler’s 125,000 retirees and their dependents, to languish in bankruptcy courts for years.

At a noontime press appearance yesterday, Obama cynically portrayed the bankruptcy of Chrysler and its planned merger with Fiat as a new “lease on life” for the firm, which would “save” tens of thousands of jobs. The bankruptcy process, the president claimed, would be “quick and efficient”—lasting only 30 to 60 days—and would not “disrupt the lives of people who work at Chrysler or live in the communities who depend on it.”

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2009/may2009/chry-m01.shtml

[Hannah Bell]

5. kik

[Hannah Bell]

7. again

[Hannah Bell]

8. and again.

[Hannah Bell]

9. and again.

[Hannah Bell]

19. and once again for the folks who think chrysler's workers are going to own the company.

[Hannah Bell]

27. once more.

[Romulox]

6. "Ownership" of an insolvent company represents a liability, not an asset, for one. nt

[blindpig]

10. The UAW leadership has lost all connection with the shop floor.

Yes, they are all in bed together, and it's as ugly as one might imagine. But no worries, the President 'stands with the Chrysler workers'.

That and a buck will get ya some bad coffee at the convenience store.

k&r

[Hannah Bell]

11. and all the folks who were tearing up at the prez's noble words just don't want to know

the details of this "worker ownership" (cough) plan they were praising.

silence = deafening.

or death, for detroit & some of its residents.

[SammyWinstonJack]

34. Yes Indeed!

:thumbsup:

[stanleycup1987]

12. obama said none of the plants would close..

he also said lets bail them out and they wont go under. he said that all these bailouts would stop unemployment from going up. didnt really happen that way did it...

[TheKentuckian]

13. Pretty loose interpetation there

[stanleycup1987]

14. well thats how i understood it..

i was scared by the media that we could never be great again unless we helped these corporations out and gave them money... what i was told by the news is that if we give them money they will be fine.

[ColbertWatcher]

15. I always read what you post because I am certain to learn something.

I usually agree with your arguments.

I was one of the people who thought this was a great thing.

Now I'm not so sure.

Thank you for keeping me thinking.

[stanleycup1987]

16. we the american people

lost 4 billion by giving chrysler money so they would not have to go into bancrupcy. we are there now. with nothing to show for our money

[Hannah Bell]

18. and chrysler's workers lost 5.3 billion of the 10 billion chrysler owed their

health care fund, in exchange for "55% of the company" which gives uaw one lousy seat on the board & no vote, & shutdown, layoffs, & more give-backs for the workers.

[ColbertWatcher]

20. That's only if the company continues EXACTLY as it is now.

I'm hoping that the company goes in a direction that will benefit the employees.

[Hannah Bell]

17. Thank you for your unfailing civility. Very much noted & appreciated.

[ColbertWatcher]

21. You're welcome, and thank you for your threads.

They're always interesting and not the run-of-the-mill subjects.

[1]

22. when the union turns chrysler around you will sing a different tune. mark my words...

[Hannah Bell]

25. "The union" won't be turning anything around, because this deal doesn't give them

any power to do so. Except to force more concessions from the rank & file.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5579783&mesg_id=5579783

"55% of the auto maker will be owned by a retiree health care trust fund and not the union itself.

'It's this independent trust that will own these shares,' UAW President Ron Gettelfinger said...

'The VEBA is CONTROLLED BY THE OUTSIDE INDEPENDENT DIRECTORS who have been appointed by a judge to serve on that,' he said. 'We have less UAW representation on the VEBA. And as far as the board seat that the VEBA is going to get with the approval of the UAW, the voting will be done by independent directors...'"

[JVS]

23. what a goddamned clusterfuck!

[Political Heretic]

24. Proud to give 5th Rec. It's a goddamn mess. But on the other hand, what choice was there?

"While the UAW gained representation on the Chrysler board through the agreement, its power will be limited because shares owned by the trust fund will be voted by INDEPENDENT TRUSTEES"

This is another one of those things that smells like its for show only.... Obama makes great sound bytes today, that all of us - including myself - give praise for. And then, when you start looking at the details, it starts to stink, like so many other things...

[marketcrazy1]

26. this shit is getting old!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

K/R!

[ProSense]

28. Two things

1)

DETROIT - UAW members at Chrysler have ratified a settlement agreement with Chrysler, Fiat and the U.S. Treasury.

Eighty-two percent of production workers and 80 percent of skilled-trades workers voted for the agreement in balloting that took place at UAW Chrysler locations throughout the United States. Ninety percent of office and clerical workers voted in favor of the agreement, and 94 percent of UAW-represented Chrysler engineering workers voted for approval.

link

2)

Employees from all eight plants would be offered jobs at other company facilities, said Max Gates, Chrysler spokesman.

“All of the employees would be retained and moved to the new company that emerges from bankruptcy,” Gates said.

The Kenosha factory will temporarily close, as will all Chrysler manufacturing sites, starting at least by Monday and reopen when the bankruptcy case is resolved, possibly within 30 to 60 days, Gates said. Some plants closed on Thursday when suppliers stopped delivering parts because they were worried they wouldn’t get paid, reports said.

Manufacturing would resume after the temporary closure, he said.

Reports said some 20,000 hourly workers would be put on temporary layoff and be paid 80 percent of their take-home pay during the shutdown starting Monday.

Chrysler’s employee buyout program has been extended to May 25, so that will affect the number of Kenosha engine plant workers who would lose their jobs here, Gates said.

Gates said the company’s goal was to reduce its workforce by 3,000 by the end of this year. “We anticipate the buyout program will achieve that goal,” he said.

link

[Hannah Bell]

30. as i said in the other thread & documented with links to bloomberg,

wsj, nyt, wsws:

1) the rank & file were given less than 24 hours to read the deal before the vote. they were told if they took the deal it would save jobs & prevent shutdown. immediately after the vote, chrysler declared bankruptcy, closed 5 plants for good, started procedure to sell off assets to fiat, & put their workforce on indefinite furlow. each of the sources quotes workers saying they were misled.

2) get back to me when they find jobs for 5 plants' worth of people, & the bankruptcy is "resolved". The deadline to submit a reorganization plan is august 28, 4 months (120 days) from now - not "30 to 60 days" - which, you'll note, the spokesperson hedged with "possibly".

[bridgit]

29. Whaaaa, all those dudes losing their viva viagra bene's

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601110&sid=aqd8wRD7JOvo :cry:




They should have been planning for the future and not just their next vaca in Vegas ALL OF THEM!!

[Hannah Bell]

31. what a stupid article, & what a stupid comment. they gave up $5.3 BILLION

DOLLARS Chrysler OWED the workers & retirees' health care fund, HALF the fund, not just some money for boner pills.

[bridgit]

32. If it weren't for 'boner pills' we maybe could be further down the road to the cancer clock

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umhEoIdKYm8 Check your Big Pharma...they're everywhere you don't think they are

[DainBramaged]

33. Now the problem of parts supply comes into play

Besides the workers yet again getting fucked, if Chrysler shuts down for 60 days, and YOU have a car in service that needs a part, warranty or otherwise, and it isn't available, YOU ARE FUCKED. Dealers with outstanding warranty claims, THEY ARE FUCKED. And this will scare the shit out of an already shrinking customer base.

Thanks President Obama, you bought yourself a car company. Do you know how to assemble a front end?

[scarletwoman]

35. Thank you for this thread, I'm really sorry I saw it too late to give it a rec.

The workers get the shaft coming and going -- from the bosses and from their union leadership.

We need to do what the workers have done in Argentina and Bolivia and elsewhere, take over shuttered plants and run them ourselves.

sw

[scarletwoman]

36. This needs a kick -- there's way too much ignorant crowing going on about what a great deal this is.