The billionaires will not suffer in this crash. We will. I do not want to see

[Raven]

another "kiss your ass goodbye" post here. I have no answers for this but I can tell you that I don't trust the chicken little economists that never said a word until now and I don't trust people here who seem to be dying for Armageddon. We are in the water, manning the lifeboats, I'm looking for some constructive ideas. I will swim, not sink and I'll do it with this President. Anybody with me or am I out here on my own? Remember, the Republicans want us to kiss our asses goodbye. Let's find a better way to deal with this.

[Warpy]

1. Oh, they'll suffer. They will be busted back to being millionaires

and will feel the cold clench of fear in their guts as they realize they can no longer afford the lifestyle they have come to feel entitled to.

The things they bid up during this latest gilded age, the art and antiques of the last one, will have lost most of their value. They'll only be able to see what they've lost, not what they still have.

Such is the nature of great wealth. It's never enough.

[Raven]

3. Not like we'll suffer! Enough of this fixation on them. Time to save ourselves.

[Greyhound]

23. The fixation is right where it belongs. It is they that do this to us, they that cause these

boom-busts and profit from them, they that set up the system ensuring this cycle. If we forget or ignore them they will just do it again.

What is coming is inevitable, there is nothing we can do to prevent it, but what we can do by fighting the class war that they've been waging for our entire lives is to prevent it from happening again. In chaos there is opportunity, wouldn't it be better if this time we seized that opportunity to establish an equitable system, or would you rather we just continue this cycle so that your kids or grand kids can go through it again?

[cali]

9. most of them won't, alas, be busted back to being millionaires

and no, art won't tumble. In fact, the highest price ever for a Matisse was paid just last week at the YSL auction- some 47 million bucks.

.

[Raven]

10. It does not matter about their art. This is about US!

[MercutioATC]

2. Buy dry goods and ammunition?

Seriously, getting your finances lean and mean and starting to think differently will do more to save your ass than anything else.

Forgoing the little luxuries like the morning cup of Starbucks and eating out less often actually works. Combine that with using the money saved to pay down debt and picking up some extra canned goods each time you go to the store and you're on your way. The only saving measure I wouldn't recommend would be moving to a less desirable neighborhood to save on housing expenses...crime's going to increase.

[Raven]

4. Exactly! I haven't heard Obama telling us to go out and shop.

[Pale Blue Dot]

21. By saying that we need to "free up the credit markets"

that is essentially what he's saying.

In the meantime, no one is bothering to ask "Why do we need to free up the credit markets? Why is more debt the answer?"

[girl gone mad]

24. Someone has asked.

It's a great read if you have the time..

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/business/story/0,28124,25115869-643,00.html

[northernlights]

26. no it's not

the credit markets allow day-to-day business to function. Such as food being distributed to the grocery store, the grocery store making payroll, etc.

The credit markets also allow students to get the loans they need to finish school. With frozen credit markets, people could be halfway through a program and unable to finish.

Credit markets allow people to buy a car if their current car is on it's last wheels. They do eventually need to be replaced, even Honda Civics die.

Credit markets allow people who want to buy a home to go ahead and buy it.

[Taverner]

7. Crime might not however, what if there is nothing to steal?

A good reason there is no crime in Cuba

[luvspeas]

16. not so sure about this one...

"The only saving measure I wouldn't recommend would be moving to a less desirable neighborhood to save on housing expenses...crime's going to increase."

Crimes already high in poor neighborhoods. The places it will increase are in higher income communities. People in poor neighborhoods do more for one another than you might think. My neighbors wouldn't know or care if I was dying in my driveway. They are too scared about hanging on to what they have.

[MercutioATC]

19. I live in a relatively affluent suburb...

Crime has increased here, but we still have the money to field a damn good police force. We may be a target now, but security is good and response times are excellent.

[Taverner]

5. Repeat history: we need to study the Unemployed Councils of the 1930's

Together, we can mitigate the suffering

[FrenchieCat]

6. I agree with you Raven!

Those who do not understand how why the big banks need to be saved should listen to this "Big Banks" 101 explanation from this radio show. It is not opinion, it is a primer explained in elementary terms.

http://audio.thisamericanlife.org/player/CPRadio_player.php?podcast=http://www.thisamericanlife.org/xmlfeeds/375.xml&proxyloc=http://audio.thisamericanlife.org/player/customproxy.php

available at this website: http://www.thislife.org/Radio_Episode.aspx?episode=375

[girl gone mad]

25. The big banks need to be nationalized and broken up.

They've been a drain on the real economy for too long. The sooner preprivatization happens, the sooner we can begin to recover.

[grannie4peace]

8. they get scared easier than us little folks do--because we have HAD to survive

they've been cruising along !

[cliffordu]

11. Maybe it's time to make them suffer.

strip them of everything.

[Raven]

12. Maybe we should focus on taking care of ourselves...deal with them later?

[cliffordu]

13. how?

[Raven]

14. I don't know, that's why I posted. I do know that positive energy is

better than negative energy any day and that hating something steals your energy. So...someone on this thread talked about paying down debt and saving. Getting community growing going to feed people is an idea...I am not Alan Greenspan, that gasbag, but I am looking for some positive energy and optimism and self help and less of the negative vibes. I really don't think they do anyone any good.

[cliffordu]

17. And I'm tired of being exploited by rich scumbags.

[luvspeas]

18. Al Greenspan is what got us in trouble...

I say right now, try to be happy with what you've got. Work hard and save all the money you can. Think about others and (this last one is important) think about the older folks now more than ever. It's going to get really bad for them soon. Even the ones that thought they had enough.

[On the Road]

15. Some Billionaires Will Make Out Well

by buying up cheap assets. Others will see a big decline in their worth, or in some cases have already been wiped out.

I do agree with you about the chicken little economists. During my memory, economic doom has been pronounced repeatedly on an enormous range of economies all over the world. None that I can think of have been fulfilled.

[Pale Blue Dot]

20. Constructive ideas MUST START with admitting the truth, Raven.

Even if it's not the truth you want to hear.

We must go back into our communities and come up with community solutions to these problems, because the federal government cannot save us. I'm doing this at my school right now. I'm sorry that you don't want to hear this, but I think the truth is more important than a convenient fiction.

[Raven]

27. Amazing that you would say this to me! Go back to my post...I think

that what I said is what you are saying. Why would you think I do not want to hear what you are saying?

[Pale Blue Dot]

30. Maybe I have a thin skin.

I've been called a "chicken little", a "doom and gloomer", and today, a "freeper".

When you say "I don't trust people here who seem to be dying for Armageddon", well, I've been accused of that on numerous occasions when I've tried to explain how bad things are going to get. There is not one person on this board who is "dying for Armageddon." There are, however, many people who see the reality of the situation and who are trying to get people to find solutions for that reality.

If you say that the above statement was not directed at people like me then I believe you and I'm sorry.

[anonymous171]

22. Oh they will if it gets bad enough. Mostly because the poor will kill them. nt

[Raven]

28. That is not my idea of a solution to this mess.

[anonymous171]

32. It's not mine either. nt

[Evoman]

33. Damn good solution....if they hoard food and other things.

They create the mess, they deal with the repercussions.

[handmade34]

29. cooperatively buy land and homestead

give extras to people that need it... just bought 5 acres and I am working on garden plans

[Greyhound]

31. The dissolution of the world-wide banking system will indeed hurt them, badly.

It also happens to be a solution for the rest of us, the problem is fear. Fear of losing what you have (look around you, it's gone), fear of the unknown (what will replace it?), fear of your fellow human beings.

"There are none so free as those with nothing to lose" is true. The time to change is when we're at the bottom when few have anything left to lose and we are approaching that point.

You asked for answers, but what question are you asking? What is best to do at this point? How can we preserve this system that cycles us through this hell every generation of two? Where's the best place for me to invest my horde of gold once the market hits bottom?

[onethatcares]

34. I'm with ya.

it's too late in my life to jump overboard and drown. I've been reducing needs for a while now, it's time to slow things down even further. If it takes beans and rice, so be it.