Cassius Clay sure could box, man.

[jpgray]

That Robert Zimmerman can sure play the harp, boy howdy! As for Jon Leibowitz, fuck me if he's not the funniest fuck in this whole fucking world! I'm no fan of Gordon Sumner's these days, but I loved his phlegmy, whiny singing back in '79! Willard Romney sure is a flip-flopper! Flippity-floppity! Ha ha ha ha ha, I kill me.

(Why engage in childish name-calling over superficial shit, for no reason? Calling Piyush Jindal by his chosen name, Bobby, in no way lessens the opportunity for mockery or criticism. Nothing's lost, that is, unless focusing on his "otherness" is the sort of thing that floats your boat. Yeah, you can do it, I'm not telling you you can't, but -why- do it? What can you (or anyone else) gain by this behavior?)

[Richardo]

1. Archibald Leach was one of my favorite actors

He was dreamy :loveya:

[Kalyke]

45. Are you talking of Cary Grant or John Cleese.

;)

[mitchum]

2. Wrong...Robert Zimmerman really really sucks at playing the harp

Sonny Boy Williamson was right

[jpgray]

4. I don't believe you. You're a liar!

You could also say "Jon Leibowitz is not the funniest fuck in the whole fucking world," and also be right. :D

[mitchum]

27. LOL!

nicely done :)

[RufusTFirefly]

39. Ditto! Loved it!

You've gotta be a big Tedham Porterhouse fan to get that one.

[kwassa]

3. and don't forget the Joseph Levitch Telethon

he just one that humanitarian Oscar the other night.

and his old comedy duo buddy, the singer Dino Crocetti.

I think most of showbiz could fall in this category, the name changers.

[Seeking Serenity]

5. That's a great picture of Ellas McDaniel (ne Bates) you've got, too.

He was cool.

[jpgray]

12. :-D

[adadem]

6. And there is Ralph Lifshitz

who is a fabulous designer

[Javaman]

7. meh, I'll just call him by his given nickname...

Pishy.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pishy

[TlalocW]

8. Reginald Kenneth Dwight sure can play the piano

TlalocW

[Seeking Serenity]

11. And so can Stevland Judkins. And him being blind, too.

Pretty amazing.

[jgraz]

33. Ditto for Armando Corea

[slackmaster]

9. Mocking a person based on traits over which they have no control

e.g. their given name, how they talk, how their spouse dresses, etc. constitutes douchebaggery.

If that trait happens to be associated with the person's race, the mockery constitutes racist douchebaggery.

I think most of us agree that a racist douchebag is more worthy of contempt than a garden-variety douchebag.

[malaise]

10. Even when Mohammad Ali formally changed his name

the right wing media hacks called him Cassius Clay. If Bobby Jindal is arrested tomorrow, that warrant will have Piyush Jindal as his name. I don't understand the fuss. For me the more important issue is why does he believe that he has to change his name to be accepted.

[RadiationTherapy]

13. Exactly. He remained 'Bobby' so he can court the racists.

[jpgray]

14. This is all very well, but is it any reason to call him jeeringly by a name he doesn't use?

[RadiationTherapy]

15. I am definitely not a jeererer.

I don't even talk about the guy. I am here for the meta-topic.

[jpgray]

16. Let's turn it into a pata-topic, and discuss your intent for discussing it.

:P

[RadiationTherapy]

18. New term for me!

The answer is: to not work.

[jpgray]

21. With the Dali avatar I thought you'd be familiar with pataphysics

:D

[ozu]

23. It's quite common in Indian households

One of my best friend's given name is Naresh and that's that name on all his legal documents.

His family has called him Nick since he was a child. Pretty sure they don't do it to placate racists.

[RadiationTherapy]

28. Is Nick running for office?

Does he belong to a racist party that would never elect a Naresh?

[Occam Bandage]

29. He decided to court racists when he was four years old? nt

[paulsby]

38. you mean

"why did the 4 yr old jindal believe"

he changed his name when he was a frigging little kid.

it's a non-issue and people claiming he is some kind of ethnic denier are being silly imo.

criticize him for his dumb policies and his poor speechifying.

[Greyhound]

17. What the hell are you all so worked up about?

Including that poor imitation of Jimminey Cricket in the same category as those greats you list is more absurd than his hiding/denying his background.

I really don't care one way or the other, this is a non-issue, but it certainly has a bunch of people upset.

[PVnRT]

19. How do you feel about people saying "Barack Hussein Obama"?

[jpgray]

20. Depends on context, as it does for Jindal

Usually the intent is completely unambiguous. The two cases aren't really comparable, since the middle name is usually superfluous, unless you are being very formal, trying to disambiguate between two who share first and last names, or you want to draw attention to it.

But my post here was trying to basically say that if someone prefers another name be used and goes by it in almost all cases, in general there's no reason to stubbornly refuse to do so.

[PVnRT]

22. I think I misunderstood the purpose of the thread

Previous post withdrawn.

[Hepburn]

25. Context?

:shrug:

[HughBeaumont]

24. Times like this really make me miss Henry John Deutschendorf.

And Wladziu Valentino Liberace.

Hey, at least Mladen Sekulovich is still alive.

[Ichingcarpenter]

26. Most of those people you mentioned legally changed their names- Jindal

didn't legally change his name to Bobby.

Don't really care about this DU issue.

[specimenfred1984]

30. Peeeeeeeyussssssssshhhhhhhh, something smells around here!

It must be the total lack of a sense of humor.

[XNASA]

31. That Julius Marx fellow was quite the comedian.

And so were his brothers, Leonard and Adolph.

[Seeking Serenity]

35. Except that Adolph later switched to being called "Arthur." (n/t)

[XNASA]

43. I usually ridicule those who mindlessly correct me.....

But since it's Lent, I'm giving you a free pass.

[jpgray]

44. Yours is not a proper ellipsis in the preceding.

:patriot:

[Seeking Serenity]

47. Actually, it wasn't mindless.

I don't believe Adolph Marx ever legally changed his name to Arthur (if he did, I stand ready to be corrected). But that lack of legal change had no affect on his desire to be called, and his friends to call him, Arthur, not Adolph.

So my correction was actually on point here. Keep the Lenten discipline going, all the same. :hi:

[XNASA]

48. It had no affect on anything.

So why did you have to do it? :cry:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

32. So you're saying "Piyush" is his slave name?

And he's chosen the name "Bobby" in order to reflect his true identity despite the racist society which hates it?

Interesting.

[jpgray]

34. Nope. Just that one's choice of name should be respected

When Obama went by "Barry," doubtless anyone who wanted to emphasize his "otherness" could have called him "Barack." One could make the argument that Obama was wrong and cowardly to go by "Barry," submitting to a racist and bigoted standard, but one would be a stupid douche in that case, as intent doesn't really matter. You either respect someone's reasons or you don't, but stubbornly forcing them to submit to their birth name, refusing to call them what they prefer to be called, is childish and douchey.

In any case, no matter what name someone chooses, a douche will remain a douche. :D

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

36. This is pretty much the opposite of what Mohammed Ali did.

And there's no reason whatsoever to respect Jindal.

[jpgray]

37. In other words, Jindal has no right to go by "Bobby," because you don't respect him

Therefore, those who didn't respect Obama could say he had no right to go by "Barry" and would have been perfectly justified. He -chose- to go by a slave name! Dead to you, then? His name choice unworthy of respect back in those days?

Those who don't respect Jon Stewart or Bob Dylan may say they have no right to go by their chosen surnames instead of Leibowitz/Zimmerman, and be perfectly justified? Cowards, submitting to a noxious yoke of cultural anti-Semitism in order to get ahead?

I lump Ali in there, because there are widely varied reasons and intents involved in choosing a name, and if you don't want to be obtuse or absurd, it's best to respect the change rather than determine by fiat the worthy and unworthy name choices based on who you like and don't.

That's just me, though.

[TheTimmer]

40. A guilty pleasure,

but I've always been a big fan of Chaim Witz, Stanley Eisen, Paul Frehley, and George Criscuola

[J-Lo Biafra]

41. This thread reminds me of that old MDC song "Marion Morrison Was a Nazi."

[hfojvt]

42. Irony alert! Irony alert!

Just now reading "Today in History" in my local paper and it says

"Today's Sports: In 1964, Muhammed Ali, then known as Cassius Clay, defeated Sonny Liston to win the heavyweight boxing crown."

This has been a message from the Irony Detection Department. We now return to your regularly scheduled flame-war.

[BlooInBloo]

46. It's just a cute way for white folks to never let us forget that we've got a brown person with us...

But yes, indeedy, Piyush is his given name. No doubt about that.

EDIT: Funny how the "given name" thing didn't matter so much when Clinton people were calling Obama "Barry", eh? Only when they started going with "Hussein" did they magically discover the "it's his given name" argument.

Moral: The "it's his given name" defense is a complete load of bullshit.