The pet poisoning shows our vulnerability to mass poisoning

[alfredo]

of the human population. What if that toxin had been in wheat gluten for human consumption?

You know our enemies paid close attention to how long it took to ID the poison.

I don't think it was an act of sabotage, but the whole affair offered up a lot of useful intelligence. If it was a proof of concept, we didn't do that good.

We need to ask hard questions about the safety of our food supply.

[MadMaddie]

1. V-Vendetta anyone?

If you have seen the movie you know what I am talking about.

If you haven't seen it rent it and you will understand.

[whistle]

2. And also how naive and dumb we are to believe only a dozen pets

...have died as a result

[nuxvomica]

9. It may be several hundred. This article from 3/21 says 241

http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=alerts_recalls&id=5135682

[whistle]

15. May be several thousand but official MM news reports still maintain

..."just over a dozen" pets have died. I hope they change their reported numbers real fast now

[catgirl]

38. 845 was the total given 2 days ago

by veternarians. These were the dead and sick. I agree
that we are vulnerable to a mass poisoning (of humans).

[KG]

3. no kidding. makes taking off your shoes at airports seem rather ridiculous, don't it?

[Kagemusha]

4. Do you really think food for human consumption has equally lax standards?

and no, I'm no huge fan of the FDA in recent years either, but there is very explicitly less testing for pet food, except I'm thinking of the meat here. Food expressly permitted for pets probably isn't for humans. I say probably because it's not my industry and I'm no expert.

In spite of my concerns, I try to see this poisoning for what it's not, as well as for what it is.

[MadMaddie]

5. What I think is that these organizations have been corrupted and

they do not enforce the law like the should or used to against mega-corporations.

I think the FDA knew about this tainted dog food and did nothing about it.

[demobabe]

7. Did you happen to notice the peanut butter recall recently?

One DUer had a family member die from it. Salmonella poisoning affected Peter Pan peanut butter and ConAgra had to recall.

That wasn't rat poison, but even so, both the pet food and peanut butter fiascos show how the distribution chain could easily put poisoned food everywhere...

People have been saying for quite a while the most obvious terrorist attack would be to poison the food chain. It wouldn't be that hard.

[aroach]

20. No PB

There was no peanut butter at all on the shelf when I went shopping yesterday. No brands at all. Nothing but empty shelves. Did the stuff get recalled again?

[demobabe]

21. Not that I've heard of...

I just heard about the tainted pb from a few weeks back.

[kath]

24. We do not know that PB caused that death - I did not see any culture results positive

for Salmonella, some symptoms did not sound at all characteristic of Salmonella, and it is very atypical for a young, otherwise healthy person to die of it. Typically the very old, the very young or the immunocompromised.

[pnwmom]

12. It doesn't have to be equally lax. We know that it's not thorough enough.

And that the standards have considerably weakened during the Bush administration. This is a good wake-up call. Are we doing everything we should be?

[Kagemusha]

17. I'm gonna skip past the more paranoid replies and just say I agree with you

It's not thorough enough, even if it isn't equally lax (which I do not believe it to be). This food was never destined for the human food chain. Therefore, it wasn't subject to the more rigorous - but far from perfect, and far from good enough as the peanut butter issue proved - standards.

Like I said, just trying to see this for what it is and what it's not.

[pnwmom]

28. The rat poison was in wheat. How do we know humans in China and

elsewhere haven't consumed it?

Does China have special fields and warehouses for wheat going to human versus pet food?

Just because that batch of wheat gluten went to a pet food company doesn't mean that it also didn't go into human foods. Does it?

[Kagemusha]

32. Hard to say. Whatever our issues with the FDA, China's reporting sucks worse.

They'd tend to think nothing of covering up a poisoning scandal with humans to try to quietly deal with the problem. Now that the rat poison thing's out, one must wonder what'll happen.

For example, is Google China censoring the story? No idea myself but, I wonder if some facts like that would come out over the weekend...

[pnwmom]

33. I've only read one China-based article, and it didn't mention anything

about the wheat gluten coming from China . . . so you wonder.

I certainly hope it hasn't gotten into their food supply. Small children would probably be the first affected. At least wheat isn't the big staple that it is here -- but couldn't rice be contaminated as well?

[TechBear_Seattle]

13. The FDA is irrelevant with imported foodstuffs. Thank you, Bill Clinton

The World Trade Organization treaties specifically prohibit an importer country (such as the US) from testing the purity or quality of goods imported from a WTO signatory country (such as China) if the exporter has already certified the purity or quality. I am fairly certain this has already been tested and upheld by the WTO regulatory body empowered to enforce the treaties and levy fines for violations.

It would be trivial for a terrorist organization to get into a packaging plant in, say, Chile or China or some other country with lax standards and taint tons of foodstuffs bound for the United States. As long as the Chilean or Chinese government says that the food is safe, there's absolutely nothing the US can do execpt pay the price.

[pnwmom]

35. TechBear, thanks. I think this deserves its own thread on Saturday.

I'd really appreciate it if you could start one. I'd never heard about this.

And if you start one, please let me know so I can recommend it.

:hi:

[whistle]

16. You betcha maybe even worse

[drm604]

18. Do you really think that they test wheat gluten for aminopterin contamination

even if it's intended for human consumption? They may start testing for it now, but how many other things are there that nobody's thought to test for?

The problem is that we're importing large amounts of our food from places outside the reach of our regulatory systems. Of course our internal regulatory systems are also crippled at the moment which makes things even worse.

[Kagemusha]

19. Well, even if I knew the procedure I wouldn't know if it's followed properly

I see what people say about WTO stuff but, I don't know if they let Chinese wheat into the US for human consumption, intent of the WTO be damned. People have been focused on other aspects of this case. (I don't blame them.) Hopefully more details will emerge.

[alfredo]

23. It wasn't the fact that the poison got through it was the

response time, and the inability to find the toxin. If such a think happens to our food supply, how many will die before we recognize a problem. How many before we figure out the culprit? How long before we deploy countermeasures?


It seems that the USDA might have some jurisdiction here with what was a agricultural product for feed. Wheat Gluten is used in a wide range of products. Who ensures the safety of ag products coming into the US?

[Kagemusha]

31. I'll keep my ears open for when your questions get answered in full.

Because to me, your last question is not a rhetorical question. Someone does ensure that safety, and that issue needs examining. There's an actual answer and it needs to be evaluated.

I don't believe in pure alarmism. Has to lead to results. But hopefully, it will. So take care.

[alfredo]

37. There are other issues to consider.: Self regulation and

consolidation of industries. Allowing companies to self regulate is bad enough, but self regulated/unregulated monopolies magnifies any effect of mistakes or wrongdoings.

Menu supplied 95 brand names. What if they only supplied 10 brands and other companies supplied the rest?

[nadinbrzezinski]

30. Recent incidents, such as Spinach and PB should

give you pause.

I know it gives me pause

[southerncrone]

6. Our food supply is ripe for sabotage.

Look at the ecoli spinach, Taco Bell onions, Chilean grapes, etc.

The average American "trusts" that our food is safe. Just think about how much food is consumed daily in this country.

We trust vendors "do the right thing". Let's hope they do.

[DeepBlueC]

8. think how vulnerable we all are

to The Hamburger? The Icon of American Cuisine becomes the weapon that destroys from within. Young men and women of military age hit the hardest, high schools, college campuses crumble under the weight of a massive public health emergency. The National Guard and ready reserves unfit for response. Washington should be okay though... congressmen and lobbyists will be the core survivors responsible for repopulating our country. The interns will probably be gone, though, which some of them are going to take really hard...

[sandnsea]

10. The spinach situation took a while too

Then we had the peanut butter. It used to be lunch meat and hamburger recalls. It's only a matter of time before we have something really serious in some product we all eat, like corn tortillas or something. Maybe the younger generation just doesn't know we really did used to do better than this.

[ben_meyers]

25. Mission Organics Spinach

Locally grown "organic" spinach! Who can you trust?
Country of origin labeling on all products, not just food, would be a big help.



http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/03/24/america/NA-GEN-US-Tainted-Spinach.php

[pnwmom]

11. That's exactly what I've been thinking.

Scary.

[havocmom]

14. How much of our foods come from abroad?

Corporate farming is a threat. Seeds with kill genes are a threat.

The new world order of corporate domination is poisoning everything.

[KT2000]

22. And it was the state of New York

that found the culprit. Where exactly was the federal government on this? FIguring out how to make the hotline useless and cover the asses of some corporation.

[catzies]

26. I worry about it A LOT MORE than I worry about "terrist attacks"

Seriously - when I thin of safety I think of food, water and products that I don't want to kill me.

But that's bad for business.

[Laurier]

27. It shows more our vulnerability to mass media.

Thousands of PEOPLE are dying every day in Darfur and elsewhere but it doesn't make the front page (or even page 20) and nobody talks about it much, if at all. Yet, a dozen dogs and cats dying spawns a hundred threads of outrage.

We need to ask hard questions, all right, about our priorities.

[nadinbrzezinski]

29. Yes but food safety is part of it

it is not just this act, but spinach, need I mention Peanut Butter?

Should I go on?

Our wonderful laize faire view of the world has actually opened our food supply to some serious problems

As to Darfur, yep you got a point about the media, but before I conflict the US, I will convict the West for not acting... yep, that includes us

[pnwmom]

34. How do we know that humans aren't being sickened by contaminated

wheat right now?

Just because this particular wheat gluten ended up in pet food, how do we know that it hasn't also ended up in our food supply? Or in the food supply in China or other countries?

http://www.timesreporter.com/index.php?ID=65763&r=0

SNIP

The FDA believes the drug was used only in animal feed but has asked the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention to watch for any uptick in human cases of poisoning.

“This is very, very precautionary. We have no reason whatsoever to believe this chemical has entered the human food supply,” Sundlof told reporters.

The FDA has said the investigation into the pet deaths was focused on wheat gluten in the food, and Sundlof said it remains the suspected source of the contamination.

Paul Henderson, chief executive of Ontario, Canada-based Menu Foods, confirmed Friday that the wheat gluten was purchased from China.

SNIP

[orleans]

36. late night k&r n/t

[riverdeep]

39. What amuses me are the security clutchers

that believe Bush has kept us safe. How many of the 9/11 commision recomendations have been undertaken? None.

[alfredo]

40. To think otherwise would be too much to bear. Best to believe the

lovely lies than face the truth.