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sabra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 11:40 AM
Original message
Richard Clarke: "many people are already dead because of Bush"

http://www.nydailynews.com/opinions/2009/01/08/2009-01-08_president_bush_saved_us_lives_thats_only.html

President Bush saved U.S. lives? That's only more Karl Rove-style spin

By Richard Clarke

Thursday, January 8th 2009


George Bush, still President, is engaging in a legacy tour of media outlets. This comes despite his earlier having said he did not know how history would judge the Iraq war "because we'll all be dead."

Actually, many people are already dead because of Bush, and that is the point to keep in mind when he talks about his legacy.

Among the themes Bush is striking are that through action at home and fighting "them" over there, not over here, his administration stopped terrorist attacks and prevented another 9/11. There is a surface plausibility to those claims, as there has often been with the messaging served up by the Karl Rove spin machine. But let's look beneath the surface of the assertions.

...

But even if taken on its face as true, should having stopped terrorist attacks earn this President a Harry Truman-like reassessment down the road? I can attest from firsthand knowledge that the Clinton administration stopped numerous terrorist operations that would have resulted in American deaths. Yet I don't hear Bill Clinton running around boasting about that. Clinton has other things to lay claim to - a balanced budget, huge job growth and eight years without a major war. If you don't think the Clinton administration stopped a major terrorist attack in New York City, you might want to talk with the blind sheik, who was involved in a plot to blow up the United Nations, the Lincoln and Holland tunnels, the George Washington Bridge and a federal building housing the FBI. But that would be tough to do because Omar Abdel-Rahman is in solitary in a federal prison in Colorado.

There wasn't a second 9/11? That's obviously true, but it misses the point. First, we must remember that Al Qaeda terrorists are patient, deliberate planners who often wait years between strikes. Second, there was the first 9/11 - and it happened on Bush's watch. Without rehashing the entire 9/11 Commission Report, the historical record is pretty clear by now that Bush did virtually nothing about the repeated warnings to him that those cataclysmic attacks were coming. Unfortunately, I can personally attest to that as well.

Bush saved American lives? Tell that to the families of the 4,200 U.S. military personnel who have perished in the needless war in Iraq. While they served heroically and deserve the great thanks of the American people, the tragic truth is that they were engaged in a war we should not have been fighting and which was sold to the Congress, the media and American people with exaggerated and even false claims.

Beyond the needless American deaths that are Bush's legacy, there are the Iraqis we almost never think about. Iraq Body Count is an ongoing human security project that claims to maintain "the world's largest public database of violent civilian deaths during and since the 2003 invasion." They say their data "encompasses noncombatants killed by military or paramilitary action and the breakdown in civil security following the invasion." Currently, their estimate - conservative when put alongside other totals - is that between 90,253 and 98,521 Iraqis were killed because George Bush invaded that country. That's thirty 9/11s.

Let George Bush keep pushing the buttons on the spin machine. That cannot change the facts. His administration's actions on terrorism, including Iraq, killed many more Americans than U.S. intelligence agencies saved in the past eight years.

Clarke was a counterterrorism adviser to former Presidents Bill Clinton and George W. Bush. He is the author of "Against All Enemies" and "Your Government Failed You."
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FSogol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 11:42 AM
Response to Original message
1. K & R. n/t
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w4rma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
2. Clarke should be in the Obama administration. (nt)
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. KO said last night he was offered the Director of CIA position but turned it down.
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PassingFair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #11
22. Is there a link somewhere for that info? n/t
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PassingFair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #11
23. Nevermind, mod....found this:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-panettajan07,0,2704035.story

snip>Former intelligence officials close to the Obama team said there would be an effort to persuade Kappes to stay.

Obama aides declined to comment on whether anyone else had been offered the post before Panetta. But former intelligence officials said several other candidates, including Clarke, had been approached.

Clarke, a former senior counterterrorism official in the Bush administration who became an outspoken critic of the president after the Sept. 11 attacks, acknowledged he had been approached "repeatedly" about various national security positions.

"It wasn't so much this position," Clarke said of his rejection of the CIA post, "as it was that I didn't want to go back in right now."

The only surprise about the Panetta nomination, Clarke said, "is that he's willing to take it." >unsnip


If this is true, then I feel better, but I'd like to see Clarke expound
on his comments.
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elleng Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. Isn't/wasn't Clarke expert in tech
as it relates to security? THAT's where he should be, wherever that is, imo.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #28
31. He headed up nat'l infrastructure protection after he left the White House counter-terrorism slot
Infrastructure covers everything from the Internet to gas pipelines.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
3. Glad someone finally mentioned it.
And why aren't we calling Bush The Butcher of Baghdad?
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bobd0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 11:49 AM
Response to Original message
4. K&R Richard Clarke
Bush should have given the Presidential Medal of Freedom to Clarke instead of Bremer , Franks, and Tenet.
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Poiuyt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. Don't forget Peter Pace. And Bush will be giving them out to Blair, Howard, and Uribe
All of his war enablers
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bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 11:50 AM
Response to Original message
5. will be hearing more reports like this.
and how can anyone let these criminals go free?? we need Vincent Bugliosi to never give up on his quest.
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
6. That's what serial killers do best, kill.
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rvablue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:00 PM
Response to Original message
7. I take no issue with Panetta, but I would have prefered to see Clarke heading up the CIA. n/t
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. He was asked first, and turned it down.......it was reported.
Perhaps he didn't feel like having to be an asshole 24/7 in his later years...which is what the job would require.


Panetta was not Obama's first choice for the job. A number of candidates, including former U.S. counter-terrorism official Richard A. Clarke, declined the post.
http://www.thecollegepress.com/news/us/obama-defends-choice-for-cia-chief-20090107.html
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rvablue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Thanks for the info FC, didn't know this. Panetta will be good though.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. I think so. Perhaps even better,
as he is more even-tempered than Clarke, who was a Republican after all, and appears to be perhaps a bit more harsh in his approach to things. "Harsh" is OK when someone was talking against Bush; in fact welcomed....but maybe not so much when having to deal with areas of Budgeting, personnel and morale.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. I like Clark, but he's not an administrator and Panetta is. I think we lucked out here. nt
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:30 PM
Response to Original message
10. i know of over 4000 soldiers and tens of thousands of iraqis who are dead due to bu$h*
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 10:50 AM
Response to Reply #10
36. way over a million Iraqi's have been slaughtered and many, many more millions maimed for life.
Edited on Fri Jan-09-09 11:06 AM by ooglymoogly
with life threatening and severely crippling injuries. Some (organizations who's job it is to calculate these things) are estimating many more millions. I do not know why folks shrink from saying this with the meme of 10's of thousands.
* IS the Butcher of Baghdad or the Pol Pot of Mesopotamia, or the Dracula of the middle east; Take your pick. He is responsible for untold millions of ruined and completely destroyed lives. If we do not prosecute these insanely dangerous thugs; Does anyone really believe this will not come back violently to haunt every one of us into perpetuity. Apparently O does not get this obvious reality.
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Stuart G Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
13. K and R
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:56 PM
Response to Original message
15. Many dead? THAT's a fucking understatement!
When does MANY equal almost two million?

Four million if you count the maimed, crippled and wounded who otherwise wouldn't have been but for him.

Many...
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endlessfugue Donating Member (22 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. I think a Bush body count thread is in order
I bet we could derive a pretty good estimate of the total dead and injured due to Bush/Cheney action and inaction:

Starting with 9/11 = 3000+ (ignoring warnings,hoping it would happen in my opinion)
Afghanistan: Estimated number of civilians killed in military action?
Iraq: Estimated number of civilians killed in military action (over a million imho)
Katrina: Im sure the real number of dead will never be known but I believe the last number I saw was about 1200?
Mining incidents due to deregulation
US deaths from extreme weather due to global warming. The Bush/Cheney refusal to even acknowledge a problem puts those deaths on their hands.
Deaths in Lebanon by Israeli terrorist attacks sanctioned and blessed by the Bush/Cheney crime family
Deaths in Gaza and broader Palestine by Israeli terrorist attacks sanctioned and blessed by the Bush/Cheney crime family.
Deaths in the Georgia/Russia conflict which was probably a Rove political stunt to begin with.


My guess is it would end up in the 1.2-1.3 million range...probably more. And if you wanna count the injured it would be more like 4-6 million.

This regime will eventually be mentioned right along side Pol Pot, Rawanda and other "killing fields" over the last 50 years.

God bless America.

EF

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Overseas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
17. K&R !! //nt
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RiverStone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 03:50 PM
Response to Original message
18. Sad K&R
I hope Clarke gets some position within the Obama administration. He is a great example of speaking truth to power.

I hope history books will say it like it was!
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
19. K&R n/t
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Edweird Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
21. Awesome post! K&R
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DeepModem Mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 07:11 PM
Response to Original message
24. K&R
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MasonJar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 07:29 PM
Response to Original message
25. Kudos to you, Richard Clarke. You are an example of a truly patriotic citizen.
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quiet.american Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 07:57 PM
Response to Original message
26. Clarke had me at hello.Had just watched Chris Matthews heartily agreeing with the GOP spin/revision.
Couldn't have hoped for a more excellent rebuttal to the nonsensical, "at least there hasn't been another terrorist attack" meme.

Before I read the article, I was going to post my outrage about that meme, but Richard Clarke's words say it all for me.
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90-percent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 08:36 AM
Response to Reply #26
34. Michael Moore
Mike made his first TV visit on Jay Leno's show after the 2004 election. Obviously a bad electoral outcome from somebody like Mike's perspective. I remember Mike telling Jay something like; "Oh well, at least he prevented another 9-11." approximately.

I always found that an odd comment for Mike to have made.

-90% jimmy
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quiet.american Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-10-09 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #34
41. Yes, I remember reading about that appearance. It was very strange.
Completely un-Moore-like.
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Generator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 08:45 PM
Response to Original message
27. Blessed are the truth tellers
All those years in the dark propaganda spin, so few that dared. This is excellent. I hope he tours the cable sites.
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donheld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
29. K & R
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machI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 06:33 AM
Response to Original message
30. But they died for Big Oil!
We need that oil to keep our econonmy running on all eight cylinders.

:sarcasm:
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 07:47 AM
Response to Original message
32. k&r
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olegramps Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 07:55 AM
Response to Original message
33. Problem is that the major media will ignore him.
The majority of the media has refused to acknowledge Richard Clarke. His audience is limited to a fraction of the American public that desires to know the truth.

This is the major problem in our nation. The press is being manipulated solely for the sake of profit. Those who control the media will go to any extent to not alienate as many of their customers as possible. If the Fourth Estate was during their job the PNAC neo-cons would have never been able to get Bush, their trained chimp, elected to any position, let alone the presidency.

Just how many people are aware of what Clarke has had to say about how the neo-cons took us to war? You would think that what this man had to say would have been on the front page of every newspaper in America and he would have been on every major TV station.

The Fourth Estate rather being the watchdog of the Republic is populated with spineless cowards.
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Broadslidin Donating Member (949 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 09:28 AM
Response to Original message
35. May the conservative Communist Chinese Government stop further financing our imperial empire.
:nuke: :patriot: :nuke:
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AzDar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 11:00 AM
Response to Original message
37. K & R
:kick:
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disndat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
38. The Bush answer is
"So what?" as he did to the CNN reporter, Candy Crowley, when she corrected Bush about AlQueda in Iraq, his reason for the Iraq war, a true psychopath. He seemed unconcerned and pleased with himself yesterday as he strutted down the military line at the Fort Meyers tribute to him.
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haw river Donating Member (22 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
39. KEPT US SAFE BALONEY
three attacks "on usa soil" in 50 years.

Worst One. Avoidable.

It was very simply--ONE MAN'S REVENGE--

It was not big attack on us. ONE MAN.

OBL said on Videotape--

"I HAVE HAD NIGHTMARES SINCE WATCHING TALL BUILDINGS FALL FROM USA SHELLINGS. I HAVE DREAMED OF WATCHING TALL BUILDINGS FALL IN AMERICA"

It was not international Terror but ONE ONE ONE MAN getting revenge.

PNAC(Hebrew) Neocons played it up to remove Saddam.. Chalabi admittted in Iran Interview he had lied about WMD and said "but I got what I wanted the removal of Saddam"

He was to be new President of Iraq.

He was paid $330,000 per month on Cheney/Wolfowitz payroll to lie.

clarenceswinney
cswinney2@triad.rr.com
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90-percent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-09-09 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. Chalibi
That fat lying fuck called himself "A hero in error" because he got the war he wanted even if his information that was used to start the war was completely bogus.

Richard Clarke is the only member of the US Government that ever publically apologized for 9/11. Nobody in government even lost their jobs as a result of 9/11 EPIC FAILURE.

Keith Olbermanns Monday comments about Cheney's revisionism says it all; "Now listen you flatulent fat son of a bitch......."

I got to go dig that up at youtube and share it will my entire email list!

-90% Jimmy
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