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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:34 PM
Original message
List of channels Time Warner will cut off at midnight
Comedy Central, CMT: Pure Country, Logo, Palladia, MTV, MTV 2, MTV Hits, MTV Jams, MTV Tr3s, Nickelodeon, Noggin, Nick 2, Nicktoons, Spike, The N, TV Land, VH1, VH1 Classic, and VH1 Soul.

This has been a public service announcement. :)
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
1. Noooooooooo!
:banghead:




Where's that smiley of people running around with their hair on fire?
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Robbien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #1
49. You willing to pay 35% more for those shows? That is what they are demanding
somewhere between 20-35% more.

In a recession/depression they want to raise their take by one quarter to one third more.

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SharonAnn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #49
61. We don't know what we're paying for those channels now. They're part of a "bundle".
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hughee99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #49
81. I think it works out to an extra 2.50 per customer per month for these channels.
They're raising the rates by 20-35% for those channels, not on your overall cable bill.
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
2. The answer: Cancel cable except for the basic-basic tier
if you need it for reception. Most of these shows are available online or from iTunes, and even the once-great channels have deteriorated.

A mass cancellation might educate Time-Warner in the dangers of pissing off their customers.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:39 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. But I love HBO
:)
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Mind_your_head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #6
14. You 'love' HBO?
Getta life (w/o teevee)!

Peace,
M_Y_H
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Lex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. OMG, don't fall off your high horse.
Edited on Wed Dec-31-08 05:37 PM by Lex
You're bound to get hurt if you do. You should enjoy this Onion story, however:

http://www.theonion.com/content/node/28694



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TheWraith Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #14
26. Thank you for your purity trolling.
God forbid someone should enjoy watching high-quality original series. They should be doing something productive, like criticizing people on the internet.
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Lex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. Reminds me of
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Mind_your_head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #33
63. Gramps/Grandma....I've think you've begun to repeat yourself. n/t
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ProfessorGAC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #26
78. What The Wraith Said
Thank Wraith. Good call!
GAC
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OneBlueSky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #14
35. other than PBS, HBO and Showtime series are the ONLY things worth watching . . .
most of the time . . . Sopranos, Weeds, Big Love, Dexter, etc. . . all good stuff, and some of my favorite guilty pleasures . . .
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #14
39. Big Love
The Wire

Six Feet Under

John Adams

Curb Your Enthusiasm


I could go on but hopefully you get the idea. :)
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Pab Sungenis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #2
17. Cancel cable and put up an antenna.
With digital TV you can get more than before over the air for free, and with a better picture than cable in most places.
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Skink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #17
38. Is that true? My converter coupon is on it's way.
I gave up cable years ago.
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Pab Sungenis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #38
43. Yes, it's true.
I've had digital television for about three years now, thanks to TiVos with digital decoders in them (one with DirecTV, the next one stand-alone).

All of the digital channels come in crystal clear with less compression than you get from even digital cable.

Also, with digital TV stations can run multiple channels. With my rooftop antenna, I could get the following stations from Philadelphia:

KYW-DT 3.1 KYW (CBS) HD
WPVI-DT1 6.1 WPVI (ABC) HD
WPVI-DT2 6.2 Action News/Public Affairs/ABC News Now
WPVI-DT3 6.3 24 hour weather radar
WCAU-DT1 10.1 WCAU (NBC) HD
WCAU-DT3 10.3 Universal Sports
WHYY-DT1 12.1 WHYY (PBS) HD
WHYY-DT2 12.2 WHYY Arts
WPHL-DT1 17.1 WPHL (MNT) HD
WNJS-DT1 23.1 NJN (PBS) HD
WNJS-DT2 23.2 NJN Public Affairs
WTXF-DT 29.1 WTXF (Fox) HD
WYBE-DT 35.1 WYBE (PBS)
WPSG-DT 57.1 WPSG (CW) HD
WUVP-DT1 65.1 WUVP (Univision) HD
WUVP-DT2 65.2 WFUT (Telefutura)

Until recently, WPHL-DT2 used to have 24 hour music videos on it, and NJN used to offer 5 different channels, including PBS Kids (which was shut down). WCAU-DT2 used to have NBC Weather Plus before it, too, was shut down after NBC bought the Weather Channel.

Go to http://www.antennaweb.org and plug in your address to see what types of channels you can get for free, and what type of antenna you will need for them. Pretty much, the rule is that if your current antenna can get the analog channel, you'll get the digital channel, too.
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backscatter712 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #38
65. Got mine.
I'll be picking up a converter box for myself shortly.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:29 PM
Response to Reply #2
30. Those ARE the basic tier...which is what we have
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #30
45. I get the basic-basic tier for $12 a month
Cable companies are required to have it, but they never advertise it. Strangely, the basic-basic tier plus cable Internet is cheaper than Internet alone.

Anyway, my basic-basic line-up includes local channels (including PBS), CNN, CSPAN, a bunch of (boo, hiss) shopping channels, and public access. One of our public access channels runs NHK World (from Japan) 24/7, so I'm happy.
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backscatter712 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #2
64. I did that to Comcast.
I'm sick of paying $130/mo for 98% trash. I don't want FOX News. I don't want eMpTV. I don't want 98% of what they broadcast. So out they went.

All I need is a live Internet stream for MSNBC. blinkotv.com used to have one, but looks like it's gone. :(
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
3. List of cable companies I will be cancelling on Monday:
Time Warner
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. We have 2 alternatives here
I think it is finally time to cancel TW.
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MikeE Donating Member (637 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #8
24. I cancelled cable years ago
because they kept doing stuff like that. I have DirectTV now and love it. The only thing they have done is add channels as cable has cut them.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #24
40. I am now confused
Direct TV is NOT cable?
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K Gardner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #40
58. No, its satellite. I bit the bullet and added satellite 4 mos ago and I wish I'd done it
long ago. Figure out how much you're willing to spend on TV and look into it.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #58
59. Doesn't it go out in stormy weather?
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K Gardner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #59
62. No.. I haven't experienced even one minor glitch in mine or interruption
in programming. That's evidently one thing about satellite that's been blown out of proportion a bit, although I have read on some of the DTV forums about it happening. There are MANY many complaints about DTV and the way the "sales" department works. I had more than a bit of trouble at first trying to figure out how much my monthly bill would be and dealing with less than honest sales reps.

I bypassed them, went directly to a supervisor and hammered it all out and haven't had a problem since. I wouldn't go back to cable for anything :-) Just do your research if you decide to look at this option.
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pipi_k Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #59
72. We've had satellite TV
for almost 14 years, since moving here, and Direct TV for ten of those years.

We don't get cable out here, and we're situated in a valley so that local (and I use the term loosely) channels wouldn't come in unless the antenna was about 20+ feet above the top of the barn. Even then, the quality was just above what I remember from the olden days of rabbit ears on top of the TV set.

For the most part satellite has been trouble-free, except that we do tend to lose reception in very heavy snow or during heavy rain/thunderstorms.

Overall, I'm happy with it

:)
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Faygo Kid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
4. Bowl games.
Long as I got those the next couple of days, I'm cool.
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The River Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
5. Does This Effect Comcast
as well?
Can Humanity survive?
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. No, only TW
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The River Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. Thanks
nt
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
23. If TW gets away with this - Will Comcast be far behind?
:shrug:

Stay tuned.
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eyeontheprize Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #23
36. I would love to cancel Comcast
I hope they give me a reason.
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. Geez if you're this pissed off already - maybe you have enough now
:shrug:
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quiller4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #36
44. Why would you love to cancel Comcast?
I was thrilled when we moved 6 years ago into an area where I could get Comcast cable for TV and broadband for internet. I've been very happy with the service especially after living in rural Washington in the foothills of the Bald Hills and dealing with a dish that failed every time the wind blew.

I haven't had a single interruption in my Comcast service although storms have knocked out power and phone.

I've talked with Comcast tech service twice. They walked me through set up my a new computer.

I've also worked with Comcast employees at community service events. Few other major corporations are as engaged in the community.

What is the reason for your animosity?
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ProfessorGAC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #44
79. That's Been My Experience Too
When Comcast bought out TCI for the franchise rights, our service improved immensely, and has only gotten better.

And, the installers and office folks at our local Comcast shop are nothing but nice, all the time.

So, i understand why you asked the other poster that question.
GAC
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SeattleGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #5
46. Yes, it does. The message about the channels being cut off has
been scrolling across our TV screen all day.

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dem629 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #46
55. That's coming from the channels, not the service provider.
At this point, there is no problem with Comcast.
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ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
7. For the first time in my life, I'm really proud to be a DirecTV subscriber
:evilgrin: :patriot:
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davidwparker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. Dish Network, here. Only have cable for broadband.
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Lex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #7
20. Viacom could pull the same tactic with Dish or DirecTV too.
It's a negotiation about prices. Either TWC or Viacom will blink eventually.

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csziggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #20
57. I think they did a few years back. We lost at least one channel while on DISH
But then the companies negotiated a deal. That is what this is - Viacom runs those notices, people get upset and complain to their cable or satellite company which pressures them to ante up more money to Viacom.
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rurallib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:42 PM
Response to Original message
10. Anybody surprised that cable is owned by the networks?
You take away stuff owned by Viacom, Ge/Universal, Disney, FUX, Time Warner and I think that leaves FreeSpeechTV and LinkTV and PBS possibly
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:44 PM
Response to Original message
11. No Daily Show? No Colbert? WTF???
Direct TV
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FirstLight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
12. WHY??? what's the excuse?
They cancelled their contract with these channels or something? another corporate buyout? :wtf:

I have Charter Cable, and they better not fuck with me! :angry:
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baldguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #12
22. They're trying to extort more money out of Viacom.
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MiniMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #22
34. I think it is the other way around
Viacom was raising their contract rates 20-30%
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #34
60. It is 23 cents a month for subscribers
I am not going to complain about that.
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onenote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #22
77. boy, do you have that backwards -- TW pays Viacom
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
13. Comedy Central's the only one worth having, from that list
:)
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MikeE Donating Member (637 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #13
27. I like LOGO too
They have some great shows. You should definitely check out Rick and Steve, as well as The Big Gay Sketch Show. My brother never saw those and I had him watching them over the holiday, (I've never seen him laugh like that).
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kevinbgoode Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. I love Rick and Steve. . .
but alas. . .puppet-on-puppet sex seems to happen far more often than human-on-human in my life...hahaha.

It really is a well-done show - do they have new episodes this year?
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MikeE Donating Member (637 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 09:52 AM
Response to Reply #28
67. Yes
They are in the new season now. My favorite was the first episode of season 2 , where Evan tries to help Dana's labor along by pourin Diet Coke and Mentos into her vagina.
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:10 PM
Response to Original message
19. Is there a link to any source on this?
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Lex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. here ya go
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. Tx - Time for the Dish - phuck 'em
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Lex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. Viacom could pull the same tactic with Dish or DirecTV too.
It's a negotiation about costs between the companies.

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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:29 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. Man - Don't pee in my Easter Basket
:rofl:
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Starbucks Anarchist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:30 PM
Response to Original message
32. Daily Show/Colbert Report fans -- go to HULU.COM.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #32
41. Thank you!
I was working up a really good whimper. You saved me!
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Starbucks Anarchist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #41
42. You're welcome.
:D
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recoveringrepublican Donating Member (779 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #32
54. No closed caption. sigh, I'm going to hate it if TV ever goes away. nt
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 07:28 PM
Response to Original message
47. Why does Time Warner hate America!?




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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. They hate me more.
I had no cable or internet for most of today. It came back on awhile ago but they are just teasing me until they shut off all these channels at midnight. :)
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:14 PM
Response to Reply #48
50. I believe they are targeting me personally too.
I know they know where I live and they've been watching me, so I know they want to stop the truthiness.

But they won't.

They won't.

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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #50
51. check this out
Our cable was out most of the day. Tried to call Time Warner but the line was busy. For hours. Cable finally came back on but the onscreen guide is messed up. For example, MSNBC says 'college football' on the guide but it is Hardball. (And when has MSNBC ever aired a football game?) Family Channel guide says "America's Funniest Home Videos' but it's an infomercial.
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #51
53. They just changed the on-screen guide and I don't like it.
Half the time it doesn't even work.

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ldf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #53
66. here in the nyc
in most of manhattan time warner is our only option. and many of us don't face the direction to get satellite service.

the channels (now at all levels) constantly pixilate (spelling?), freeze, go dark, get out of sync with the audio, have no audio with video, or no video with audio.

rebooting the cable box doesn't do squat. calling them up is an exercise in futility.

now with all channels being digital, it will just get worse.

i imagine they will be able to provide a better service, but you will pay for it.

add to that the fact that many of the "high definition" channels AREN'T.

time warner is crap.

:grr:
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:29 PM
Response to Original message
52. I watch the Comedy Channel..Colbert and Stewart on the Web...and I'm a Time-Warner Cable
Subscriber who only watch three channels on the crap cables. The rest I watch on rentals from Netflix.

I don't know why I keep that expensive POS Cable from them. The crap on there isn't stuff I care about...and what I do care about isn't available and the rest I can watch Online.

Let them cut it off... Hell with it!
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csziggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:51 PM
Response to Original message
56. That is not for satellite or all cable companies
This was the notice on the DirecTV web site:

MTV Networks Still Available on DIRECTV

You may have heard that starting January 1, 2009, Time Warner Cable may stop broadcasting the channels belonging to MTV Networks. These include Nickelodeon, Noggin, MTV, VH1, Spike, Comedy Central, TV Land and many others.

Rest assured that as a DIRECTV customer, you will still receive all of these channels -- without interruption. If you see announcements on your TV screen about this issue, you can ignore them -- they affect only Time Warner Cable and Bright House Networks customers. DIRECTV customers have nothing to worry about.
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Madison knows Donating Member (81 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 10:01 AM
Response to Original message
68. Well, there is nothing on that list that I will miss.
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derby378 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 10:03 AM
Response to Original message
69. Still getting Comedy Central in Dallas
I'm assuming that a deal has been worked out, at least as far as the Time Warner market in Texas is concerned.
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SOS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 10:14 AM
Response to Original message
70. Not VH1 Classic!
How will we now keep up with the dead careers of Poison, Kiss and Turd Nugent?
Hopefully Night Ranger has a web site.
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
71. Now this is something that might upset Americans enough to get them to do something.
Take away their Soma fix and they will scream, maybe.


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NYCGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #71
73. The problem was settled a couple of days ago. Maybe you should watch the news.
:evilgrin:
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #73
82. Yes, one of the hardest things about being an American that doesn't watch TV.
I rarely know what most of the conversations going on around me are about. It seems TV accounts for 3/4 of chit-chat.


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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 11:10 AM
Response to Original message
74. I'm saving a lot of $$$ by NOT having cable
I purchased digital converter boxes for all my TV's and each TV has it's own DVD player. NetFlix is still very reasonable and the selection is growing like crazy.

I refuse to feed the greed. If I can't get it on NetFlix, there are always books... and the book is always better anyway:)
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Kajsa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 11:12 AM
Response to Original message
75. Nope, not happening.

They reached an agreement with Viacom.
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onenote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
76. Nice misinformation.
Your public service announcement was bunk. As most expected, TW and Viacom cut a deal before midnight and nothing was "cut off".

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joeunderdog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #76
80. lest the customers ask both to open their books in a big public way. nt
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