Ohio Attorneys to Assert RICO Claim Against Karl Rove for Orchestrating Theft of 2004 Election

[helderheid]

Written by John Michael Spinelli
Election Lawyers, in Refocus of 2004 Ohio Election Lawsuit, Ask US AG Mukasey to Save Rove’s Emails, US Chamber to Name Complicit Contributors, In Effort to Protect Integrity of 2008 Election
OhioNewsBureau

By John Michael Spinelli

COLUMBUS, OHIO: Plaintiff attorneys for a lawsuit filed in 2006 that sought voting records to prove whether their suspicion that Republicans conspired to suppress the votes of two active Democratic demographics that helped President Bush win the state and a second term in the White House, changed the focus of their lawsuit Thursday, saying they will now focus on learning more about the roles played by Karl Rove, Bush's political architect, and a long-time Bush family confidant and Information technology guru – now working for Sen. John McCain – who as an information technology tradesman, built various computer systems that produced election irregularities that favored Republicans and whose work, if not ferreted out and stopped now, may do the same this year for McCain as it did for Bush against Kerry four years ago.



Ohio became famous, or infamous depending on your political persuasion, for catapulting George W. Bush into a second term as the nation’s president. In 2004 the state was run by Republicans, who held all statewide offices and controlled both houses of the legislature. The Secretary of State at the time was Kenneth J. Blackwell, an African American from Cincinnati who previously had served as State Treasurer and was in his second term as the state’s chief elections officer. At the time, Blackwell was also the co-chairman of the Bush-Cheney re-election committee. When the narrow election was over, Bush won Ohio from his Democratic rival, Massachusetts’ Sen. John Kerry, by the slim margin of about 118, 000 plus votes, or few than a dozen votes for each of Ohio’s 11,000 polling locations.
Email, Documents Asked to be Held to Reenergize, Refocus 2006 Election Lawsuit

Cliff Arnebeck, the lead attorney in the King Lincoln Bronzeville lawsuit, was accompanied by Henry Eckert, a former public utilities commissioner, and Bob Fitrakis, a political science professor at Columbus State College and election integrity advocate who manages the Columbus Free Press, a progressive news sources, and who has made failed attempts to run for Congress and governor.

Arnebeck, who spoke to reporters including the OhioNewsBureau at a press conference held Thursday in Downtown Columbus, presented letters he has sent to Michael B. Mukasey, US Attorney General, and Matthew Kairis, an attorney with the Jones Day law firm, asking them to hold certain named documents that would be used to reenergize and refocus the King Lincoln Bronzeville Neighborhood Association vs. Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner now pending before Federal District Judge Elgenon Marbley. The purpose of the lawsuit, filed in August of 2006, was to “preserve the ballots and related materials for the 2004 Ohio presidential election with respect to which the 22-month retention schedule was about to expire.” The broader purpose of the lawsuit, however, was the “protection against an ongoing conspiracy to interfere with the voting rights of African American and college student voters that was evident in the 2004 Ohio presidential election, and with respect to which this court ordered relief on Election Day 2004 in an action brought by the Ohio Democratic Party.” Arnebeck’s memorandum in support of his original motion stated that the original complaint “sought intervention of the court through appointment of a special master to oversee the integrity of the 2006 Ohio election and protect against interference with voting rights in that important election.
Ohio RICO Claim for Rove, US Chamber

Arnebeck told Mukasey he wants to “assert an Ohio Corrupt Practices Act/RICO claim against Mr. Karl Rover and others based upon their activities in 2000 to illegally use corporate treasury money and government power to establish single faction dominance in the United States, military dominance in the world and generally undermine the rule of law as it had developed over the course of the past century.

MORE>>>

http://thejournal.epluribusmedia.net/index.php/state-news/ohio-news/34-ohio-news/121-ohio-attorneys-to-assert-rico-claim-against-karl-rove-for-orchestrating-theft-of-2004-election

[indepat]

1. Boy, if they could just get Rove: now that would be special

:D

[jtrockville]

2. I suspect he'll squeal like the pig he is. Bring 'em all down, Karl..

[helderheid]

4. wouldn't THAT be sweet!

[MissWaverly]

33. it would be even sweeter to nail supremes for theft 2000

then some of those activist judges would have to resign.

:-)

[defendandprotect]

89. Wonder what's boys club the discussions were held at . . . ???

The Gang of 5 . . . should be in jail ---

And, I think if anyone gave it even a simple try, they could nail Scalia for a thing or two ---

[MissWaverly]

95. there have been rumors for years

I wish we could resolve this so that we can heal and move forward with justice for all as opposed to the "just us" club.

:-)

[defendandprotect]

96. If we can regain control, we're going to have to impeach them . . . or add a whole new bunch on . ..

Move the court to 15 or more ---

After all, we're a country of 320 million . . . ???

Is that the figure now?

[MissWaverly]

97. well, remember FDR stitch in time saves nine

the Supreme Court tried to totally obstruct minimum wage, outlawing child labor, establishing the 40 hour work week until
FDR threatened to change the Supreme Court from 9 to 15 justices to help enact this legislation. Suddenly one of the Supremes became convinced that these reforms were not unconstitutional, sound familiar?

"The change of one vote would have thrown all the affairs of this great nation back into hopeless chaos. In effect, four justices ruled that right under a private contract to exact a pound of flesh was more sacred than the main objectives of the Constitution to establish an enduring nation."

"In one case holding the New York minimum wage unconstitutional, Justice Stone said that the majority were actually reading into the Constitution their own "personal economic predilections," and that if the legislative power is not left free to choose the methods of solving the problems of poverty, subsistence, and health of large numbers in the community, then "government is to be rendered impotent."

FDR Fireside Chat March 9, 1937 quoted in the book FDR's Fireside Chats, page 85, page 88, edited by Russell D. Buhite and David W. Levy, Oklahoma Press, 1992

[defendandprotect]

100. Often I go back to records of FDR era to try to figure out . . .

what's going on now . . .

[MissWaverly]

101. not a bad idea

esp. since those in office want to serve the people not corporate masters

[NightWatcher]

3. Rove will declare "executive privledge" till his bloated ass is lowered into the ground

and he WILL get away with it

[JerseygirlCT]

15. I'm afraid you're right

Does that hold in state courts as well, though?

[The Wielding Truth]

70. The whole country is sick of these criminals. Their house of

cards is falling down around their crooked ears.

[defendandprotect]

90. I think Constitutional privileges are a higher principle . . .

and we have to find some way to bust up the cry of "national security" . . .

which really produces national insecurity . . . !!!

[90-percent]

5. Torture

I think Joe Wilson and Valerie Plame should torture Rove.

Not to extract information. Retribution. On behalf of the American public.

-90% Jimmy

[lonestarnot]

6. A ghost from Christmas past! You just damn go Cliff Arnebeck.

Do you need a free __________________edit for nevermind your own business. :D

[zbdent]

7. screams of "Get over it!" by the people who

still scream about "Kennedy stole the election in 1960!" ...

[quiet.american]

8. God bless Arnebeck, but good luck getting Mukasey to do anything. nt

[helderheid]

9. Trying to think positively!

[quiet.american]

12. :) I hear you, helderheid. nt

[defendandprotect]

92. Yeah . . there's that name again --- Mukasey ... !!

[libnnc]

10. kicking

[ladjf]

11. Sooner or later, one of the numerous attempts to bring Rove to justice

will break through is "executive privilege" defense.

[calimary]

25. I hope so. ONE of these has to work, especially if we keep throwing them at him.

ONE of them is going to find its way to the bull's eye. We just have to keep at it.

Remember how long and how hard the bad guys scrounged until they FINALLY nailed Clinton on something? Granted, it was a stupid frickin' blow job that they got him to lie about under oath, but they finally got him.

WE have to do the SAME THING with kkkarl rove. NOTHING lasts forever. Not even rove's perceived "invincibility". Look how much of a woman's right to choose has been worn down and chipped away, because these fuckers just wouldn't give up. They've finally whittled away at it til it's on the verge of collapse. Well, that's the SAME approach we MUST take against rove. Chase him to the ends of the earth. If we keep at it...

Richard Clarke said not long ago (I believe it was on "Countdown" before Keith went on his latest vacation) that these people should not be allowed to reenter polite society again. They should NOT be able to go back to their ritzy board rooms and cozy collaborator-think tanks and their fancy expense-account lobbying lives and their lucrative speaking engagements.

[L. Coyote]

13. Remember the last False Flag these characters raised?

Or, for that matter, the long series of false flags??

Let's see, first, Ohio 204 was NOT about computers, but about punch cards in 3/4ths of all precincts ..... .....

[bertman]

26. L.Coyote, please to explain. I'm very dense-ish today.

[L. Coyote]

29. Who flew the SmartTECH flag? Who ate up all the money to recount Ohio? ....

when there was real fraud to investigate?

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

38. All of your posts are intriguing and you are clearly very knowledgable

Why not just make a comprehensive posts that covers all the points you keep cryptically alluding to? I would guarantee you that I would be happy to read it.

[L. Coyote]

42. Nothing cryptic. It is all online stuff.

Google "keyword coyote site:democraticunderground.com" using your own keyword.

[KoKo]

51. I wish you would do a paragraph about your reservations because

nothing you say makes any sense about "false flag" operations and "eating money" for investigations. If you lived in Ohio and were involved then it might seem you would know something about this "on the ground" but you live in Oregon and so what is your interest in dissing Arnback and Fritakis?

[L. Coyote]

61. My interest is in election fraud investigation.

You are characterizing my interest in your own way. I am directly involved in Ohio election fraud investigation, in the litigation, with the State, and independent of any economic benefits like royalties, contracts, settlements, or attorney fees.

The false flag I refer to is SmarTECH. While it was an actual contract and event, the "FALSE" aspect was ridiculous speculations that somehow votes were altered by posting them to a server owned by a Republican. People fall for this misinformation and it detracts from real inquires. That, of course, is the intention of the disinformation surrounding this topic. At the same time, some players are in the "business" of election reform to make money, and money on the Internet is correlated with attention. I'm sure I need not explain that one! Those of us who knew how votes were switched in Ohio also knew the recount was a waste of effort and that the switched votes just recounted the same. Sometimes "personal" or "political" interests override public interests. It is important to keep some perspective in mind and not just get carried away by any claim anyone propounds. To not do do is defeatist in an atmosphere of deceptions and cheating, and the cover ups of deceptions and cheating.

[KoKo]

63. I understand your point about Fritakis...but you also are skeptical

of Mark Crispin Miller. What's your problem with what he's exposed? :shrug:

[L. Coyote]

67. I am skeptical 24/7/365, and everyone needs to be, to say the least.

That is not a "problem" in the environment in which we operate.
I think it is essential and this story illustrates why.

Should Mark Crispin Miller's writings get a free pass? I say,
"HELL NO! Everyone should be treated equally; everyone is subject to critical review."
That is in our own best interests, in the best interests of democracy, and in Miller's too.

[AntiFascist]

14. K&R n/t

[MadrasT]

16. Pleeeze...

Oh, pleeeeeeze somebody put that beast in 'cuffs...

:kick:

[Eurobabe]

17. Oh, I so want to see how Warren Co. BOE is involved in this scam

those bastages locked down the BOE building with their fake FBI-AlQaeda's gonna bomb Kings Island alert on election night eve. :nuke: :nuke:

[L. Coyote]

31. Warren County is another False Flag at best.

That tiny Repulican County voted Republican as usual. But, they sure diverted a lot of attention when attention should have been focused on the stolen votes in huge, Democratic counties.

Watch the unseen hand, not the one they want you to watch!!

[Eurobabe]

68. I still think those fuckers did something

they are way too tight and close to the DIEBOLD scammers, the 23%ers.

[L. Coyote]

71. Warren County was Triad punch card voting, not Diebold electronic voting

All too often, computer fraud is invoked as a possible fraud in Ohio, even when the voting was not electronic.
In fact, after the state switched to Diebold, Dems won Ohio back from the Rs! Was punch card theft TOO EASY??

[katty]

18. Great, go get Karl!!

[ooglymoogly]

19. This is a slapdown that really needs to happen.

but as we have seen in the past, the pugs have all their bases covered and loaded with thugs.

[drm604]

20. K&R

Damn! These stories are popping up all over the place today! :bounce:

[fascisthunter]

21. Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes.....

[jazzjunkysue]

22. If nothing else, the press coverage will wake people up who refuse to accept the idea of election

fraud.

Even if all the judges are bought and sold and the "evidence" miraculously disappears, the press alone will damage the GOP beyond recussitation.

There's just no bad side, here.

These people will be the hot underdog lawyers who saved the constitution. They will be heroes.

Did anyone say, Oprah? How about Leno? just let the mdeia try to ignore this lawsuit.

[RoccoR5955]

23. They should bring the whole of Bushco, Inc. up under RICO.

:kick:
It's high time that the lot of them did time for their crimes!

[NBachers]

40. RICO is the key

It can be applied against them the same way it's been used against drug offenders, organized crime, and corporate crookery. Wait, that sounds like the Bush Administration. Yup, RICO would work.

[spag68]

43. The best things about RICO

are the rules covering confiscation of property. That would get little george and his crime family in a wad. Imagine the whole bunch of them living in a shelter somewhere in say Houston with some Katrina victims. Wouldn't that be fun?

[mdmc]

24. Nader and someone else actually brought lawsuits in Ohio

Anyone know what the dems are doing about this? Hopefully not the old "roll over" and play dead thing.

[L. Coyote]

30. Along with the Dems.

[mdmc]

41. I was talking about the 2004 election

did the dems go to court back then?
did they go to court in 2006?

[L. Coyote]

44. Yes, the Dems went to court and did filings in 2004.

[defendandprotect]

27. Want to STRESS that we should all note that they STEAL elections . . .

because they know this is a liberal nation and if Americans have the choice, they don't

vote for the GOP ---

[aquart]

28. Where is Karl?

Is he back from his sudden trip yet?

[L. Coyote]

32. Acts of Desperation? Are they losing their lawsuit against Ohio?

Did these litigants get it wrong and make the wrong claims?
Are they now getting desperate for evidence to support their assertions?

Remember, this is abut a awsuit and what they have in their pleadings.
Do not for one minute confuse this with any movement for election reform or real investigations.
This is about one law suit as filed long ago.

The place to start to understand this is the lawsuit:
http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/electionlaw/litigation/klbna.php

Case Information

Current Court: U.S. District Court for the Southern District of Ohio (Case 2:06-cv-00745-ALM-TPK)
All Courts: U.S. District Court for the Southern District of Ohio (Case 2:06-cv-00745-ALM-TPK)
Topic(s): Improper Election Administration
Date Filed: August 31, 2006

Issue: Whether the rights, privileges, and immunities guaranteed to Plaintiffs by the Civil Rights Act, and the First, Thirteenth, Fourteenth, and Fifteenth Amendments to the U.S. Constitution have been violated by the past and ongoing conduct of Secretary of State J. Kenneth Blackwell in connection with past elections in Ohio.

Status: Order issued directing County Board of Elections to preserve all ballots from the 2004 Election. Answer filed 10/25/06. Motion for TRO filed 11/3/06. Opposition to TRO filed 11/6/06. Motion to dismiss as moot pending. Proceedings stayed until 4/9/07 to allow settlement negotiation. Stay extended to 9/21/07.
Summary

Individual voters and three voters' rights groups sued Ohio Secretary of State Kenneth Blackwell alleging that Blackwell allocated election resources in a racially discriminatory manner and instituted racially discriminatory procedures for provisional voting, purging voters from the statewide voter registration database, and maintaining the chain of custody of ballots. The complaint alleged that these actions led to the dilution and/or cancellation of plaintiffs' vote due to ballot cancellation and tampering, long poll lines, mechanical difficulties with voting machines, and unclear precinct boundaries. The complaint claims that plaintiffs reasonably fear these problems will recur in the November, 2006, election, and asks the court to appoint a special master to perform Blackwell's election administration duties in that election.
District Court Documents

* Complaint pdf file (filed 8/31/06) http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/electionlaw/litigation/documents/KLBNA_Complaint.pdf

.............

[helderheid]

34. k

[helderheid]

36. k

[cliffordu]

35. Someone should snatch Rove and waterboard him till he confesses, on videotape,

all the sins of this Administration.

Pay per view alone would pay off the War debt.

[a la izquierda]

49. You're absolutely right...

because the whole world who could afford to would pay to watch that.

[Vidar]

37. Be still my heart! Great news, hh. Thanks.

[Tutonic]

39. Mukasey is Bushes Butt Boy...don't look for this empty suit to do

anything that would upset Rove. And as I always say you can thank Chuck Shumer for Mukasey. Yeah when Schumer isn't busy shutting down savings and loans he's out recruiting friends for high government jobs.

[Ellipsis]

45. The tangled web we weave... K&R

[bjobotts]

46. Mukasey works for Bush and Rove not the American public.

[bjobotts]

47. Mukasey is as corrupt as the rest and will proect Bush and Rove at all costs

[No DUplicitous DUpe]

48. Admins - Can You Pin This Thread At The Top Of GD, For A Few Weeks?

Everyone should read it.

K&R!!!

[MannyGoldstein]

50. Pardon Me, But...

Won't Rove be pardoned?

Something definitely happened in Ohio - it was obvious by the way that fuck Blackwell was behaving that night. But nobody will go to jail except possibly Bush himself, because bush can't pardon himself.

[merh]

52. This operation itself being conducted in the White House on

election night '04 is illegal, a violation of the Hatch Act.

Rove was not on GWB's payroll as an employee of the admin, he was his campaign manager.

This operation being conducted from the White House violates the law. Remember the hell they gave Gore for allegedly making phone calls asking for support while he was VP and in the White House.




Oh, you may want to save this image as like images seem to be disappearing from the net. There is one of Rove on the phone at his laptop that is not longer available. You get a thumbnail of it when you google but you can't access or link to the image.
http://images.google.com/images?gbv=2&ndsp=20&hl=en&q=rove+election+laptop&start=0&sa=N

Edited to add image - I did save it to my photobucket

[helderheid]

54. Saved. Wish we had the larger version. Maybe a DUer saved it before it disappeared. Remember this?

[merh]

55. yes, I remember that

had to go to confession after first seeing it, now will have to go again - no thought crime involved but definitely a thought sin :evilgrin:

:hi:

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

53. K&R.

[SusanaMontana41]

56. So we haven't lost our country altogether or our backbones

What a perfect first thread to read first thing in the morning! Thanks so much for sharing this. Go get him, Arnebeck!

[DFW]

57. Ordinarily, I WOULD say Mukasey will try to bury this, BUT.......

Now that there is a decent chance the AG will be a Democrat starting January, 2009,
Mukasey could find himself behind bars for obstructing justice if he takes deliberate
inaction. He no doubt remembers the name of John Mitchell. If he doesn't, I'm sure his
own attorney will remind him.

[PinkyisBlue]

58. We need a Kenneth Starr and $60 million to investigate this mess.

If we can seriously investigate the extramarital activities of the President, we can certainly investigate allegations of election theft.

[rocktivity]

59. I've been suggesting using RICO

for for years.

:headbang:
rocknation

[lala_rawraw]

60. You guys

Bev Harris is at it again:
read the comments at BradBlog:
http://www.bradblog.com/?p=6189#comment-360089

What is wrong with her?

[L. Coyote]

62. Very sensible attitude by Bev Harris, actually.

from: http://www.bradblog.com/?p=6189#comment-360082

"It may be that the game plan this fall will be to muddy up the waters, suckering in prominent figures in the election reform community and providing just enough disinformation that, when they stick their head in the honey pot to eat that information up, their error can be used to taint them later on. Exactly like they did to Dan Rather, but going after the currently credible Internet bloggers.

"I'm not here to attack anyone, but I've seen enough to throw up a cautionary flag on this."

I'd add that the false flags in all this are honey to sucker in journalists and activists too!
Some already have their heads in the honey. Albeit, the prominent disinformation is more directed
at disabling or detracting from investigators and inquiries, and misdirecting attention to false causes.

Any assessments of this issue need to account for the particulars of the litigation, and what serves the legal case of the litigants. They have a burden of proof that requires them, by their own choices in making claims, to provide proof of their basic claim against Ohio, that Blackwell acted in a conspiracy under the color of law. They are working to "fit" the Ohio election irregularities into the self-created mould they are now stuck with, their pleadings. If the actions that deprived the litigants of their rights under the suit were in fact abridgements due to other causes, that does harm to their case. I do not expect the litigants to be working on the election integrity fronts that are against their interests as litigants.

Given her experience on the election fraud front, I'm not surprised the smell test on this ruse rises to her detection levels.

[KoKo]

64. You do understand the "low creds" Bev Harris has with anyone on this site who

"helped her" when she started out, don't you? The many hours and volunteer time that went into helping Bev expose the DRE machines. She's not any more credible than those you think are exploiting the issue to "muddy the waters" or for "personal gain," in the view of those who knew her.

[L. Coyote]

66. Who cares? Try to deal with the facts, I say.

Those who cannot deal with the facts because of personal bias against individuals are self-disabling!!
How the HELL am I supposed to predicate my actions on what others perceive as credibility?
That would be both ridiculous and impossible. So, I'll stick with the facts instead.

from: http://www.bradblog.com/?p=6189#comment-360092

I'm saying, watch out for coattail-hangers bearing so-called gifts.

Wonder how Spoonamore ended up in that press conference at all --- whether he maneuvered himself in, or they asked him. No matter. The short story on Spoonamore and the Georgia patches is that he appears to have both his timelines and his patches mixed up, which components of the system were patched, and when. His analysis of the clockfix patch references a GEMS patch. (clockfix was for the touchscreens, and didn't happen until later.) If he actualy looked at the clockfix patch, he would know that it's for CE, and the language file patches are for the GEMS server, which was running on NT. That's pretty hard to miss, and that kind of gaffe looks pretty embarrassing to me. As in, he never even looked at the clockfix patch at all. Instead, he looked at the robgeorgia patch, which was not a clockfix and was implemented before the clockfix problem surfaced. And further, he's blabbing on about the auditory language files and fails to mention the elephant in the room, that robgeorgia replaces Accubasic files, which are the files identified in all the studies as the tampering mechanism.

There now. I've provided enough information for someone to climb out of the hole they just dug themselves into.

So, those with the background to understand what she is relating should see why there are concerns about this "expert" showing up now in very, very, very old new story. You have to ask, "Why drag this out now in relation to Ohio punch card voting?" ??

Did E-Vote Firm Patch Election?
Kim Zetter Email 10.13.03
http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/2003/10/60563

Diebold Election Systems has had a tumultuous year, and it doesn't look like it's getting any better.

Last January the electronic voting machine maker faced public embarrassment when voting activists revealed the company's insecure FTP server was making its software source code available for everyone to see.

Then researchers and auditors who examined code for the company's touch-screen voting system released two separate reports stating that the software was full of serious security flaws.

Now a former worker in Diebold's Georgia warehouse says the company installed patches on its machines before the state's 2002 gubernatorial election that were never certified by independent testing authorities or cleared with Georgia election officials.

If the charges are true, Diebold could be in violation of federal and state election-certification rules. ...........

[KoKo]

72. Spoonamore could well be a plant...someone to get blog attention

and then be discredited by others whose agenda is to discredit any new revelations about Election Manipulation.

[lala_rawraw]

78. um...

the guys does not need attention. he is a well respected expert for crying out loud. even Congressional Quarterly ran my article, which they never do. he has a stellar reputation and is risking a great deal. you guys then wonder why no Republican will come forward? because they get swiftboated by the left just as they do by the right. we should be thanking this man for putting his name on the line. he is not leaking as an anonymous source. he held full court press and presented his credentials and his concerns. at times like this i am ashamed to be a member of this community. we should thank him, not hang him.

[KoKo]

88. Larissa....not dissing your article...just saying "naysayers" might have a point

in being skeptical of the timing he picks to "whistleblow." This doesn't mean you shouldn't have reported this...it's a BIG story...and we get so little news from the Left to drive the news to the Right.

It's my questioning about folks questioning.

[lala_rawraw]

93. ah... mkay

I am also not saying that I would bet my life on him telling the truth. I am simply saying that I can't think of someone committing character suicide like this and what could account for it. Having said that, I am not his champion. He is public and can defend himself. I just wanted for us to give him the benefit of the doubt is all:)

[libnnc]

65. From the way back machine...

I trust Bev Harris about as far as I can throw her...

http://www.whiterosesociety.org/bev_randi.mp3

How much money did she steal again?

[L. Coyote]

74. The Truth About the Rob-Georgia File = 10 July 2003

The Truth About the Rob-Georgia File
By Bev Harris - 10 July 2003 - http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0307/S00078.htm#rob

Someone needs to get their story straight.

Diebold voting machines are used in 37 states. The entire state of Ohio is considering dumping its old system to buy Diebold. Georgia already did.

The Diebold files, supposedly secret voting machine files left on an unprotected web site for nearly six years, are unlocking the truth.

Official stories about voting machine security, acceptance testing and last-minute program changes are beginning to slide around like hot grease on a Georgia griddle.

What was the program patch known as rob-georgia.zip used for? What were they doing with that ftp site, anyway? Hang in for the first part of this article, the finger-pointing and obfuscating part, because it concludes with a straightforward explanation of what went on in Georgia that has never been made public before.

................

[libnnc]

76. Where's the money, Bev?

She's a phony and a crook.

end of story.

[L. Coyote]

80. She is an activist operating a non-profit corporation, not?

Is that what constitutes a phony and a crook? It is easy to throw that stone without explanation.
For those of us who have no idea of the basis of your personal view, this just seems like crazy rant.

Meanwhile, there are facts that people contribute to investigations of election fraud, and all the facts are important.
That includes facts uncovered by Bev Harris and anyone else, no matter your personal vindictives.

Why not stick to the facts? Why is this distraction from the facts even pertinent.

[libnnc]

81. Bev Harris is insane

But if you want to kick this thread defending her, have at it.

I'll kick this thread telling the truth about her.

Most DUers here know what she's all about.

:kick:

[L. Coyote]

82. And, I'm posting facts. And I intend to stick to facts.

Yes, I cannot stop you from using whatever forum you want to interject your hatred. Maybe the mods will though??

[libnnc]

84. LOL that's funny

Bev Harris is toxic waste-dump material here on this board.

Truth hurts.

Lots of "facts" here at this linky

http://www.whiterosesociety.org/bev_randi.mp3

Bev Harris is a dirty crook. And you know it.

[lala_rawraw]

87. LC, you need to understand the background...

There is reason for the anger and hatred. It is not just random. Please take a moment to research why it is that people are so angry. I know you mean well. I hope you mean well too.

[lala_rawraw]

75. Yes, I tend to see Bev as

As a fraud. I am rather astonished that L. C would in any way support a woman like Bev, given her past and given what people think of her. Yes, how much did she steal? She has a cult following of quite literally a cult group of nutcases who stalk anyone who might call Bev out. Does anyone ever wonder how a woman just surfing the Net suddenly locates an FTP server that just happens to have all of the Diebold files? Then, after she is invited even by the MSM to appear as a guest on a number of shows, she vanishes. Only to appear again to act as the official talking head of what is to be fact and what is to be bull. That sounds very interesting to me and always has. Plus, all of the people who worked for her either quit because of her illegal activities or walked away because of the cult-like cadre that she has collected.

[libnnc]

85. Anyone who defends BH is gonna get their clock cleaned here

What she did to Andy and to those who supported her in good faith was horrible.


And LC has the nerve to threaten me with the mods for calling him out about this.

It's bullshit.

[lala_rawraw]

86. To be fair to LC, he may not know...

the background, that is all. i have always found him to be very supportive and a good sport. so i am willing to just give him the benefit of the doubt. speaking of bev, she is over at Brad blog attacking me now.

[L. Coyote]

98. Don't expect posters to know everyone's personal enemy list, FCS!!

And, keeping personal domains separate from the discussion of facts and issues might help keep discourse objective too.

L. is right, I don't know who hates who, FCS!!!

[KoKo]

91. I've often wondered that myself, Larissa. Thanks for pointing it out.

I know how many DU'ers gave up so much of their time and "tech expertise" to help her...and how she treated them. It's not easy to forget that...but, it's not easy to forget that she "somehow" had some "info" to start off with to get folks here "hooked." HOW did Bev get that info? :shrug:

But, I still wonder about "late whistleblowers who come in 7 years later...so, while I'm glad your reported the "latest"...it's still good to check this guy out just to make sure he wasn't sent with a "backpocket agenda" that could harm the "Election Reform" movement. Just saying.

Thanks for all your great reporting, btw.

[lala_rawraw]

94. I hear you...

and who worked on the McCain campaign was the big question for me frankly. but ultimately, something small (or big) happens that flips a switch and a person just says it is time to change or stop something. i have seen this often with whistle-blowers. for example, Dr. Jeffery Wygand comes forward ONLY after he loses his job. he is still credible, although not entirely ethical IMHO. at the same time, maybe losing his job caused him to take some distance from the tobacco company and then he could see something more clearly. ultimately with whistleblowers you never know if they have not been coming forward all along as anon sources and that they finally got the courage to come out all the way. i have some of those and one did so once very publicly, although most people did not put 2 and 2 together. the point is, you simply don't know when he came forward exactly or why, but that he did and the way he did took more courage than i have. it is easy for us to say we would do any number of things, but consider what you are being asked to put into danger... not just his money, not just his home, his business, his reputation, but the safety of his family and himself as well. Dana Jill Simpson was forced off the road and had her house burned down. Karen Silkwood was murdered. these are not games. these people were not coming forward to report about espionage for example, where you might expect to see such payback. Silkwood was coming forward about the corporate negligence to the safety of workers at the company she worked for. so it is not even what the whistleblowing is about either that can put someone in actual physical danger. this takes courage, and for that, i think we all need to simply ask more from the DOJ than right now from him. i want to know if the DOJ has the patch and how long they have it. i want Conyers to demand it be handed over. that, i think, is the key point in this. to really take this thing out for a spin.:D

[lala_rawraw]

77. L, not so...

L, as you know, I am a big supporter of your work. But when you go out defending Bev like this, I have to wonder what has happened. First of all, a false-flag is not what you appear to think it is. You are clearly thinking of is a honey-pot. A false flag is the act of framing an aggressive or illegal act in such a way as to implicate another person and/or group. False flags are most often associated with state sponsored terrorism or creating an event to justify a reaction (Gulf of Tonkin).

Now, it is really remarkable to me that in defending Bev, you are avoiding the facts as presented, which she herself is not addressing. In other words, she built a straw-man and you are finding it sensible, which is fine, but has nothing to do with reality.

Here are the facts as we know them:

1. A man with a stellar reputation and career puts everything on the line. Is he a suicide truth bomber of sorts then? He is destroying his entire life in order to create a honey-pot? Usually, honey pots are far more subtle or are masked to appear to be disagreement from within. A good example of this is PUMA, which we all well know was started by a Republican claiming to be a Hillary Clinton supporter. So I would like for you to explain to me why a man would put everything on the line (remember, this is someone with Gov contracts, with a lot to loose, not just a freak-show) in order to claim that our elections are in danger? It is not like he is some hooker claiming to have given a blow-job to Barack Obama in the back of a car (in likely hopes of getting some money from the Republicans). This guys has a business, has money, has a career. And his allegations are entirely within reasonable parameters. So you tell me then why he would need to do this?

2. Is Cliff Arnebeck so stupid that he would bring on a total fraud into his case? Just curious as to how you account for Arnebeck being taken in.

3. The case filed in 2006 in Ohio has NOTHING to do with Spoonamore. He joined the case at this stage as a technical adviser because Cliff asked him to. He is not a litigant or the person with the main evidence. His only role in the 2002 GA election was that after the election, a whistle-blower gave him a Diebold patch, which Spoonamore took to DOJ. Period. But his account jives with that of the whistle-blower, whom I interviewed extensively.

4. There is no self-created mold here. Just pieces of evidence that collectively are forming a particular pattern. If you are of the opinion that election fraud is all about the machines, then you are entirely wrong. The machines are a tiny portion of the fraud. To give you an example, the bigger fraud is that after the vote rigging occurred in Alabama and Siegelman was going to file a complaint, he was indicted. When he tried to run for office again, he was again indicted. That is the far bigger fraud, but it is part of the same mechanism. So if Bev thinks that only Diebold machines and only the kind she claims expertise on are the only legit election issue, she is entirely out of her mind - which is rather obvious.

5. Bev is attacking my article and Brad's article, which she conflates into one article. I got a copy of the mailing she sent out on her list serve. She said as a matter of fact that Spoonamore is essentially lying or Raw Story got their facts wrong. She then goes on to cite parts of Brad's article, not the Raw Story article.

6. If you have issues with the Raw Story article, please list them here and I will address them. But don't play a game where Bev builds a conspiracy theory (yet again, I think the last one that included me was that I was part of the CIA) and uses nonsense to support it and smear me and Muriel, and Raw Story, and the whistleblower, and Cliff Arnebeck, and Brad Friedman, etc... So go ahead and list your issues (which I thought I had adequately responded to in our private msg) and I will address them. But don't use Bev as any sort of expert witness. She is a lunatic, perhaps more than that even, but at the very least a lune.

[L. Coyote]

79. I just agree with "I've seen enough to throw up a cautionary flag on this."

My cautionary flag is always up on this issue, of course.
But, hey, write a book about my simple comment if you must!

[lala_rawraw]

83. not one comment...

a few of them, citing her as credible when we all know here what she did to our friend, making her the least ethical person to have an opinion. my only question is why no one seems to wonder how Bev suddenly got lucky enough to get the FTP server with the secret files. if i am reacting emotionally, please understand that this woman was part of a character assassination mechanism against one of my dearest friends while he was dying of cancer. i will, until the day i day, see her as a fraud who quickened the death of my friend Andy.

[varelse]

69. One step closer...

http://sendkarlrovetojail.com/

To putting him where he belongs.

[L. Coyote]

73. Found a video of the presser

http://discuss.epluribusmedia.net/node/2126#comment-4305

[L. Coyote]

99. New Thread = VIDEO: Cliff Arnebeck, Bob Fitrakis Press Conference

Hopefully, with a more issue/facts-oriented focus!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3646499