The toddler was filled with demons

[krispos42]

<snip>

Dan Robinson, a local volunteer fire department chief, told The Modesto Bee that at first glance, he thought the child was a dead animal in the road. He said when he realized it was a child, he tried to stop Aguilar.

He said Aguilar had a "total hollowness in his eyes" and talked calmly of the boy being filled with "demons."

Witness Lisa Mota told the San Francisco Chronicle that Aguilar told people who tried to stop him that the boy was "trash."

<more>

http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/06/17/toddler.killed.ap/index.html?eref=rss_latest

"Demons".


Son of a bitch. :puke:

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. You got it right

[ikojo]

2. Is this 2008 or 1208?

Do people REALLY believe in this crap?

[Schema Thing]

5. It may as well be 1208 for billions of people

myself included for most of my life.

[krispos42]

11. Too many do

"Let's flay the skin off with red-hot irons to drive the demons out!" or some shit.

What a load of evil.

[Arugula Latte]

14. Religion often has a terrible effect on people

It makes them believe the stupidest irrational crap ... with terrible consequences.

[Occulus]

15. Some people say religion itself is stupid irrational crap

and when you hear about things like this.... one wonders.

[Arugula Latte]

16. Well, I'd tend to agree with "some people."

But, of course, I'll probably be flamed by the holier-than-thouers. :)

[KittyWampus]

31. this is about mental illness not what any one sane person "believes" about anything

[Canuckistanian]

42. This is about fundamentalist religions ALLOWING and CONDONING bizarre behavior

Or at least denying the mentally ill to seek the help they need.

They're so convinced that their "Faith" will allow them to solve all problems, that they will seek NO outside help and thus actually reinforce their illness.

Just my opinion. Yours may vary.

[LiberalAndProud]

3. Horrific.

One has to think that drugs were involved.

demons

[ingac70]

8. No drugs needed for religious fruitcakery. n/t

[TrogL]

10. Nope - religious addiction

Which is basically religion-fuelled dopamine and seratonin jollies.

[Schema Thing]

25. yep

[Bluerthanblue]

38. so what is domestic abuse that ends in murder? "fuck addiction"?

I'm angry that some people continually saddle "religion" with all kinds of negative aspects- yet don't seem to see the ways in which "faith" has bound people together for GOOD.- Work to bring out the BEST in one another- to care for the needs and intrests of ALL.

Like ending slavery- like the AFSC- who have quietly and peacefully worked to end violence and injustice- like the food kitchens and emergency shelters- hospitals and orphanages.

Are there toxic 'religous' communities? hell yeah- but there are many toxic secular groups as well.- And many hate filled groups which have absolutely NOTHING to do with "faith" or "god" but who find the mantle of either of those a great 'cover' for their malicious power trips.

:shrug:

"human'kind'"

:shrug:

[Fumesucker]

13. Yeah, it does sound like something a drunk would do.. n/t

After all, alcohol is the most violence inducing recreational drug there is..


Mean drunk.

Barroom brawl.

Don't listen to him it's the liquor talking.

Ten feet tall and bulletproof.

[Schema Thing]

4. Bad beliefs kill

when combined with mental illness.

[otherlander]

17. Evil is not a mental illness.

Please stop it.

[Bluerthanblue]

18. do you mean to say that you believe a

healthy SANE person would ever honestly choose to do such a thing?

If so, we have very different notions of what a healthy mind is all about.

peace~

[Schema Thing]

23. er...uhmm, ok. But that dude in the OP? He was mentally ill.

Please stop trying to get in the way of saving children from the mentally ill. At some point, you'll become a collaborator, and well, frankly, that's evil.

[otherlander]

39. I don't believe he killed the child *because* he was mentally ill.

Correlation is not causation.

[Bluerthanblue]

20. PEOPLE kill-

some people do things to others that fall just shy of killing, and do it over and over and over again.

Some people even convince others that doing harm to others is actually "good".

I can't blame 'beliefs'- I can't insulate myself from the fact that I too am completely human- and as such vulnerable to doing something as terrible as this sorry man did- as unthinkable as that may feel. I can say I'd never do it- but none of us really knows what we are truly capabile of, and thankfully, most of us never have to find out-

How sad for the child. What a tragic and terrifying little life he had.

I feel for the officers who were faced with the decision to have to kill him, and as bad as this sounds, they actually did him a favor- the man is not going to hurt anyone else, not even himself.

peace~

[Schema Thing]

24. It's beliefs along with mental illness.

If this man did not believe that demons exist, his kid would likely be alive.

If Deana Shlosser did not believe that God talks to people, her child would likely still be alive.

Same for about 5 other cases in about as many years I can think of, just in the state of Texas. I know there are many more worldwide.


That whole Abraham offering up Isaac story was a piss poor choice for the Bible's editorial board to include, and it just goes downhill from there. Throw in wacky fundamentalist thinking that every word of the Bible is god-breathed, an unhealthy dose of guilt, angst, and dispair, top off with a firm belief that death leads to a reward and ends the suffering found here on earth, and you've got yourself quite a recipe for disaster if a person's brain starts backfiring (and how could it not, with all that cognitive dissonance?)

[Bluerthanblue]

27. I agree that teachings and culture

contribute to a great degree- but the instances you cite are instances that most people with ....relatively healthy- or at least functional thought processes world recoil from.

People can be ...'brain-dirtied'(washed would imply cleaned)- but these are isolated incidents of mental breakdowns.

How many people have been killed for sex/love? I don't know current statistics, but back in 2000 here in the US, three women per day were murdered by their husbands or partners.

I'd like to point to one single aspect of society and blame it for all our ills, but the only one I can think of that would be fair, is our existance as a species. :shrug:

peace~

[DS1]

6. Thanks for the spoiler

:grr:


sorry, gallows humor. glad this person is put down.

[lame54]

7. If it turns out the man was an illegal immigrant - O'Reilly's gonna explode

[marshall]

9. Why kill his "anchor baby"?

That will only confuzzle Bill.

[malaise]

12. Sick fugg

:puke:

[frebrd]

19. Every article I've seen about this

has mentioned "People who tried to stop him".

I wonder how many people there were who together couldn't stop him.

How many people does it take to kick the son of a bitch in the balls, for christ sake? I'm 72 yers old and I guarantee I would have.

Absolutely incredible!

We are indeed a nation of victims.

Disgusting!

:grr:

[gatorboy]

21. From what I keep reading there were 12 standing around.

12!!!!

Is it because the victim was spanish? I can't comprehend why more wasn't done. I mean they sat there and watched for who knows how long. :puke:

[Bluerthanblue]

22. even if they could have stopped him-

I'm not sure the little one would have made it.

I think, living with the knowledge that they didn't- having to go through life with the images replaying themselves over and over in their minds, will be a kind of self imposed punishment- I don't envy them-

What a world this is.

What a sad sad world.

peace~

[Sequoia]

26. Hell, because they were afraid he had something in his pocket.

What...the...!! All those people standing around...I don't get it. No one had a crowbar to slug him with?!

[niyad]

29. that was what I wondered as well. didn't anyone have a really heavy object? I mean,

my purse would have taken him out. or, as you said, kick him in the balls.

this is just so horrible.

[27inCali]

28. I bet he was an evangelical

those people are sick: they see demons everywhere, even in their own children.

[My Good Babushka]

30. To everyone blaming the bystanders

From what I've read, the child was unrecognizable by the time anyone saw him. It was a dark, rural road, and at first, it seemed it was a "roadkill" or other small animal. Certainly, a small child was probably the last thing you would imagine you were seeing. It's horrific, for sure. Mental health services should be available to everyone.

[KittyWampus]

32. and to those blaming this on religion... STOP IT! This is mental illness or crystal meth

It's threads on sad, disturbing stories like this where the anti-religious DU'ers feel free to display their bigotry.

[Bluerthanblue]

34. even non-religious people

speak of evil.

I agree- this didn't have anything to do with religion- certainly nothing to do with "God"-

I is just being used as an opportunity to place blame somewhere-

Why do we need to place blame??? Is it because the reality that life is un-predictable is just to terrifying???

peace~

[Fumesucker]

36. I seem to recall reading of "demons" in the OP

Which makes it highly unlikely that the killer was an atheist.

I can't think of any atheists right offhand that believe in any supernatural beings at all, including "demons".

Oh, and why does it have to be "meth" and not "alcohol"?

[KittyWampus]

37. how many homicidal schizophrenic atheists do you know? It's the hearing voices, seeing things

not the religious beliefs.

[otherlander]

40. That's not really a fair question.

Because, unfortunatley, many people who are schizophrenic feel the need to hide it due to societal stigmas, and so most people have no way of knowing how many schizophrenics they know.

[Fumesucker]

41. We don't know, and most likely never will

Whether the killer was schizophrenic.

We do know they mentioned demons.

I have a whack job in my family that thinks the devil is as real as the chair I'm sitting on... And will lecture you for hours about him/it..

[Bluerthanblue]

33. it's also much

easier to imagine how we might react from the comfort of our keyboards, and quite another to have been faced with the situation in reality. I think most of us would like to believe we could have done something.

I can't imagine the self recrimination that I would feel if I'd been a bystander.

peace~

[My Good Babushka]

35. that is the truth

There was a toddler killed not far from my house, by the mother's boyfriend, and over and over I think of how it could have been prevented. All it would have taken would be crossing that space, those very few streets, to stop it... if someone had known.. but that's just the thing, you can't know. And these things happen everyday and everywhere. It takes more than a person, or a little gaggle of bystanders to make a dent in this kind of child abuse. It takes a system, where no one is left out. We should be building that system instead of blaming the unlucky witnesses.