Former President Carter reveals Israel has 150 Nukes!

[KoKo]

http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/536641/1799480

Carter says Israel has 150 nukes
May 27, 2008 7:57 AM
Former US President Jimmy Carter has said Israel holds at least 150 nuclear weapons, the first time a US president has publicly acknowledged the Jewish state's atomic arsenal.

Asked at a news conference at Wales's Hay literary festival on Sunday how a future US president should deal with the Iranian nuclear threat, Carter put the risk in context by listing atomic weapons held globally.

"The US has more than 12,000 nuclear weapons, the Soviet Union (Russia) has about the same, Great Britain and France have several hundred, and Israel has 150 or more. We have a phalanx of enormous weaponry...not only of enormous weaponry but of rockets to deliver those missiles on a pinpoint accuracy target," he said, according to a transcript of his remarks.

While the existence of Israeli nuclear weapons is widely assumed, Israeli officials have never admitted their existence and US officials have stuck to that line in public for years.

The Nobel Peace Prize winner said Washington should talk directly to Tehran to persuade it to drop its nuclear ambitions.

Years of US policy, including sanctions and a debate about the possibility of military strikes, have not persuaded Iran to abandon its ambitions to produce enriched uranium.

President George Bush has branded calls for negotiations with Iran's president as comparable to the appeasement of Adolf Hitler before World War Two.

A former Israeli military intelligence chief criticised Carter's comments and said they would do more harm than good.

"It seems to me that in his last tour of the country and the region, he was apparently so offended that he thought it proper to say things which I think are irresponsible," said Aharon Zeevi-Farkash.

"The problem is that there are those who can use these statements when it comes to discussing the international effort to prevent Iran getting nuclear weapons," he said.

more......
http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/536641/1799480

[K Gardner]

1. I j ust saw this on CNN and went WTF? Came here to see if it was under discussion..

something doesn't sound quite right about it. But its not a good story.

[Arctic Dave]

2. Isreal was pissed at him after writing his book,

now there really going to be bent out of shape over this.:rofl:

[Disturbed]

3. Why is it so important that Israeli Nukes be kept secret?

Mordechai Vanunu spent 18 years in prison, including more than 11 years in solitary confinement. Vanunu was released from prison in 2004, subject to a broad array of restrictions on his speech and movement. Since then he has been briefly arrested several times for violations of those restrictions, including giving various interviews to foreign journalists and attempting to leave Israel.

http://www.counterpunch.org/goodman08182004.html

http://www.zmag.org/znet/viewArticle/8839

http://www.peaceheroes.com/MordecaiVanunu/mvanunu.htm

"I have sacrificed my freedom and risked my life in order to expose the danger of nuclear weapons which threatens this whole region." --- Mordechai Vanunu

[Ezlivin]

5. Because Israel is not a signatory to the NPT

If it had admitted it had nuclear weapons there would be great pressure put upon it to sign the Non-Proliferation Treaty (as Iran has).

What's ironic is that Iran is under close scrutiny because it signed the NPT.

[havocmom]

8. Thanks for that info and perspective. Always wondered myself

Why is it OK for some, but even thinking about it gets others into so much trouble? Any leader worth his salt would look at the way nations bully and invade non-nuke holding nations and figure they should at least do some research just as a way of protecting their own populations.

Never understood why it was fine for us to have them and not fine for others. We're the only ones who have actually used the damned things.

[ChristianDemocrat1]

18. And why does America favor a non-signatory with military aid, diplmatic favoritism & annual gifts?

One would think that if America really did not want the proliferation of nukes
that America would not favor a country who refused to sign the nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty.
One would think that being a NPT signatory would bring a country closer to America's heart
if America really had non-proliferation of nukes at heart.

America's shielding of Israel over this issue undermines America's moral authority (respect) on matters regarding nuclear weapons.
Such hypocrisy makes it evident that the summation of American nuclear policies is to permit nukes to her friends while attempting to keep nukes from her opponents ---> all this wrapped in the thinly vieled argument that we don't want nukes to spread. But its so thinly vieled that everyone but the blind see it the naked truth of it -- and it ain't pretty. Little wonder so much of the world turns away with disgust from American foreign policy. There's only so far you can go bribing friends and bombing eniemies before the money runs out. And then, having neither means nor dignity, only those who pity you will help you -- on their terms.

Is it not better that America return to the moral high ground now rather than later?

No nuclear proliferation.
No military aid to non-signatories to the nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty.

No more double-standard for Israel.

[Hippo_Tron]

4. ZOMG@!#$!@!

Israel has nukes? I had no idea!!!!

[bananas]

6. "150 or more" - probably a lot more.

I'm surprised he used such a low estimate.

[KoKo]

13. Maybe Israel has "overestimated" to put it out to International Community so no one Messes with them

:shrug: Sort of like Saddam had "WMD" but it was all bluster and fake?

[liberal N proud]

7. That's OK, but don't you dare let the others in the area have them

The US gets to decide who does and who doesn't get nuclear weapons.

:sarcasm:

[NutmegYankee]

10. There are special circumstances.

We know the Israelis would only use them for self defense in a "push into the sea" situation. I think all of us can understand that the IDF are not just defending their country, but literally defending their families and children. If they were beaten, any Israeli who didn't escape before the Arab army arrived would be killed. No Arab country is in danger of being slaughtered like Israel.

And that is no joke.

[shance]

14. Why are there always special circumstances for Israel?

While our schools disentegrate with neglect, we have non-existent healthcare, more and more funding is shipped to Israel.

Please explain to me why are they more special than the US citizen?

[NutmegYankee]

17. Really Really off topic.

Smells like a rotten Red Herring!

The comment was why the world accepts the Israelis having nukes, and not say, Iran.

[shance]

19. How is it off topic?

n/t

[NutmegYankee]

30. You bring in schools and other issues.

The point was why the world overlooks Nukes in Israel.

[Chulanowa]

22. Israelis = upstanding perfect and righteous, Iranians = slavering murderous subhumans

Way to go. I thought shit like this was restrained to the Ethnic Cleansing I/P forums

[NutmegYankee]

29. Once again. Making shit up.

For starters, the Iranians are Persians, not Arabs like I referred to in the original post. And I never implied the Israelis are perfect, just that they indeed fear for their lives. Israel doesn't make comments like the Arabs made in previous wars about pushing all the other nations citizens into the sea like Syria did. Iran's leader has threatened to destroy Israel.


Try remembering that everyone else in the region is bigger than Israel. We know they would only use it for defense.

However, I agree that both Israel and the Palestinians are responsible for their present situation. Neither is blameless.

[Chulanowa]

34. Normally I would agree to disagree. However, you're so full of shit that I can smell you from here

First, you display your ignorance out there in the open, with the assumption that Iranians are Arabs. Kudos on realizing otherwise, but still, it plainly displays a "fuck it they're all the same" attitudefrom you.

Israelis fear for their lives as much as your average New Yorker, and probably have less chance of biting it in an untimely manner. Israeli pavement may be at risk, but it's only within the last few months that any attacks have actually notched up notable numbers of deaths. This is while the Israelis - fearful for their lives! - have hte absolute peak military in the entire region - or even futher, the whole Mediterranean and have international carte blanche to do whatever the fuck they want. You want to see people fearful for their lives? It ain't hte Israelis milling about in their malls with vacant expressions, same as any American or European. It's hte poor bastards behind the fences that have guns pointed at them 24/7, who suffer regular mass reprisals, destruction and theft of property, and settler murder squads.

Israel doesn't need to make such threats - It can just drop a few bucks into AIPAC nad suddenly American bombs are mauling the shit out of whoever they want mauled. or at least, there is absolutely no intervention on the part of the United States. Two soldiers illegally crossing into Lebanon who get kidnapped justify the lost of how many thousand Lebanese lives? Fuck 'em, they're Arabs, right? Any dumbfuck with three ounces of sense - which I am coming to assume the members of the knesset are not -understands the Arab art of warmaking is basically "make a lot of noise and hoe the other guy runs away" - And it's rather ironic, given Israeli attempts to shove large populations of people into the sea on one side and the River Jordan on the other.

Iran's leader? Khameini? Oh sorry, in your ignorance you're assuming Ahmedinejad is the leader ('cause you know those dumb fucking arabs persians with their single head of state...) and further that "brushing the occupying regime from the pages of history" is identical to "destroy Israel." By this logic, DU is a website dedicated to the destruction of the United States, because (I assume, people like you give me doubt) we seek to see Bushco thrown out on their asses, buried under their own excrement, and left in the historical dustbin for future generations to go "Wait, who?" about.

Everyone else is bigger than Israel? Now you're just being fucking stupid. Apparently square acreage infers military might. Which is of course why Kazakhstan is a superpower and Great Britain nothing more than Great Russia's dickpuppet, right?

Of course they would only use them defensively. Nuclear weapons are defensive weapons to start with. But what the fuck would they be defending against, exactly? Palestinians with their chunks of cinder blocks? Syria, with Kalashnikovs? Three hundred Iranians running up and throwing a missile over the border? The only rational thing to use nuclear weapons to defend against... is someone else's nuclear weapons. And the only reason for THEM to have nuclear weapons... is to defend against yours. Technically there's no real difference between having nuclear arms and not having nuclear arms...

Unless you're vacing off against a crazy fucking nuclear-armed government bent on expansion and conquest, in which case there's a vast difference, and one you'd be wise to try to leaven out. Thus why I would definately not blame Iran if htey were seeking nukes - they have three nations nearby who aren't in the NPT but are armed with nuclear weapons, none of the three being exactly the most level-headed of world nations. Fuck yeah I'd try to get some "Don't nuke me bro" nukes, in that situation.

The "current situation" is mostly the result of people like you back in the 40's going "fuck the Arabs, they have plenty of desert!"

[NutmegYankee]

35. What the hell...

My first post was referring to the wars of 1948, 1967 and 1973 etc with Syria, Jordan, etc as the "Arabs". Hell, the war of 1948 is even called the "1948 Arab-Israeli War". WOW!!! I had not mentioned Iran at all. You then come along, and distort my comments and make it look like I mentioned Iran. I then commented that I was not talking about Iran. Hence my Persian comment. You then went on this hilarious rant. LOL.

You make a rant about Ahmedinejad as a leader. But hey, the Queen actually runs Great Britain and not the Prime Minister, Gosh, Silly me. Thatcher and Blair would be surprised.

As for military, the Arab world outnumbers Israel in men and tanks, and it was only the better fighting skills of the Israelis and the disorganized attacks of her neighbors that saved her in past wars. Properly led, with all neighboring states attacking, they could win another war, barring that nuke issue...

But hey, every Israeli house and apartment has a safe room because they are not in any danger whatsoever. :eyes:

[Chulanowa]

36. Might want to re-research your Iranian political structure

The Supreme Leader calls the shots. He's not called the Supreme Leader because it sounds neat, you know. The President handles the signing of treaties, the appointment of ambassadors, and has some influence on the state budget. It's the Supreme Leader who calls the shots, not the President. I suppose that doesn't mesh well with your attempt to paint Ahmedinejad as some terrifying threat, which is why you ignored it. I'd rather believe you to be a shameless propagandist, rather than just dumb as a sack of hair.

Explain to me, please... why all the Arab states, properly led, would even try anything with Israel? You're living in the same militaristic wank fantasy as those dumbfuck rightwingers who think "Red Dawn" is a documentary / how-to guide. Fearmongering is just that fun, I guess.

[LeftishBrit]

26. Do you seriously think that the military aid to Israel is the reason for your lack of funding for

public services?

You don't get adequately funded public services because successive governments have ideologically opposed 'socialized' services, not because your country can't afford them.

During the years immediately after WW2, the UK was living under 'austerity'. Food and clothes were still being rationed. The UK was MUCH poorer then then the USA is now. But the Attlee government introduced a National Health Service in 1947, *because it considered it as a priority* (and sadly some later British governments have run it down to varying degrees because they didn't!). So have many other countries that did not have that much money to spare.

I generally support - anywhere - more spending on public services and humanitarian aid, and less on war and military aid. But I don't think Israel should be the scapegoat for America's RW economic and social policies.

[madmom]

31. I didn't necessarily read it as blaming Israel, but as asking why they get more

attention from our government than we do? I'd like to know that answer also, and no I don't believe it's off topic at all.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

27. "No Arab country is in danger of being slaughtered like Israel."

Uh... Iraq?

[lonestarnot]

11. I mean we invented an used 'em first afterall.... hmmmf

What crap hugh?

[cyclezealot]

9. Is he not saying unofficially

what the world already knew, unofficially. What's the big deal. His national security briefings are only superficial.

[KoKo]

12. Cnn's Blizter was really worked up over this...saying that neither Bush Administration nor

Israeli's would confirm or deny Carter's estimate. Said that Dena Perino (Bush Spokeswoman) refused to Comment along with high Israeli officials.

They promised "updates" ...but I turned it off and went to GOOGLE to search. It was already out there...:shrug: What's Carter up to doing this?

[T Monk]

15. i imagine he's attempting a discussion that will lead to reductions and an ultimate scrapping

[Indenturedebtor]

23. What it will lead to is an increased likelihood that Iran will get nukes

This was a really stupid move by Carter. I can see no real good coming from it. Israel will not get rid of it's nukes because the nukes are likely why it hasn't been invaded ever other year of the last 60.

When Israel starts screaming that it wants to "Wipe Iran off the map." perhaps I'll support disarmament. :eyes:

But then again to many on here Israel can do no right, and is responsible for 50% of America's wrongs; and no Arab country can do any wrong. If they do wrong it is only because the Joos made them do it.

[Clark2008]

24. And then there are those of us who try to correct

the misinformation in our US media that always favors Israel.

Look... no country is perfect, but when all US citizens hear is how "awful" those Arabs are and how Israel is our BFF (despite spying on us, dragging us into unnecessary wars, etc.), some of us go a little overboard in trying to point out what's wrong with Israel and what's right with the Arab nations.

It doesn't mean that we hate Israel or love, say, Saudi Arabia. We're just trying to fill in MASSIVE gaps in US reporting regarding that region of the world.

[Indenturedebtor]

25. But fill them in with facts please.

And the people who say that Israel dragged us into Iraq are the same people that claim it was responsible for 9/11. It's just Henry Ford rearing his ugly head.

I think it's more the sentiment towards Israel that people don't like. The media does mention the illegal settlements, the power shut offs, the buldozing do they not? That's where I learned of it.

They also mention the school bus bombings, the cries of "Death to the jews", the partying in the streets on 9/11, the refusal to recognize Israel as a state etc.

What are they not mentioning? And please don't say the spying. Nations only call each other out on spying as a slap in the face. We spy on every country on the planet.

It seems that many on this site won't be happy until all the pundits are screaming for Israel's annihilation.

[KoKo]

16. Just up at Josh Marshall's TPM...a BBC article that's better than the one I posted...read here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7420573.stm

[ThoughtCriminal]

20. Probably accurate

http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/israel/nuke/

100-200

[FourScore]

21. Thanks KoKo01, k&r n/t

[alittlelark]

28. Modechai Vanunu (nuclear technition) exposed them in '86.

He was then kidnapped in Rome, imprisoned for 18 years in Israel, got out of prison, thrown back in.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mordechai_Vanunu

[Disturbed]

32. Do those 150+ Nukes really protect Israel?

Jus wonderin'......

[Virginia Dare]

33. Gee, do you think maybe that's why Iran wants one?

:think: