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So the Pope doesn't want us to pull out of Iraq

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medeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 03:28 PM
Original message
So the Pope doesn't want us to pull out of Iraq
as per CNN ... what was the Bush/Pope connection a few years ago...was it Jeb or Neil? I remember something unsavory?
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Thepricebreaker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
1. The Pope is against the war... been said many times..
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medeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. CNN just said "for humanitarian reasons"
He wants us to stay?
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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Maybe now that we've screwed up so many lives...
And all those people are hanging in the balance with no country or leadership.
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #3
14. Maybe he means "You break it, you buy it."
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screembloodymurder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. It's part of the Just War Doctrine.
The use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated. Can't leave until we fix it.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. Have to give the Vatican credit for that. They were/are VERY against the Iraq War. nt
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medeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #8
19. that was previous Pope... n/t
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. Cardinal Rat is also against the war. nt
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Zynx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #1
16. Don't let that get in the way of some good ol' unprovoked Pope bashing.
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DJ13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
2. He's a wonderful example of a man of God
:eyes:
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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #2
21. WOW - making excuses for a NAZI... how nice...
I guess the NAZI's invoked "god" in what they did - you're right on that point...
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Submariner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 03:35 PM
Response to Original message
4. That piece of shit pope
started the church's swiftboating of Kerry in the summer of 2004. This ex-nazi asshole passed the word to catholic bishops not to give communion to those who stand up for a woman's freedom of choice. He is attributed with swaying the votes of more than a few knuckledragging believers to vote for Bush. Bush is the pope's main crusader-guy.

Anything anti-war out this shitheads mouth is just a pile of BS.
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medeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. yes! And how was he with the Bush's before becoming Pope?
all right...I KNOW he was affiliated with Bush family before becoming Pope...read it here years ago...any old DUer's recall?
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Lars39 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Didn't Dubya meet with Ratsy before he became pope?
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sinkingfeeling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 03:52 PM
Response to Original message
7. It was Neil. Here you go ...
http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/world/ny-wochar214226829apr21,0,6705480.story

WASHINGTON - Neil Bush, the president's controversial younger brother, six years ago joined the cardinal who this week became Pope Benedict XVI as a founding board member of a little known Swiss ecumenical foundation.

The Foundation for Interreligious and Intercultural Research and Dialogue was founded in Geneva, Switzerland, in 1999 to promote ecumenical understanding and publish original religious texts, said a foundation official.

Gary Vachicouras, a theologian and foundation official in Geneva, would not explain in a telephone interview yesterday why Bush, who has no clear public connection to religious causes, was on the first board.

"He was interested at that particular time," said Vachicouras of Bush. But like some other initial board members, Bush is no longer involved, Vachicouras said. Ratzinger also left a few years ago and was replaced by Archbishop Michael Fitzgerald, who is responsible for ecumenical relations for the Vatican, said Vachicouras
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medeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 04:46 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. yes! thank you! n/t
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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 04:06 PM
Response to Original message
9. Bush owns the Pope
http://www.snapnetwork.org/snap_press_releases/2005_press_releases/031005_letter_condoleeza.htm

Sexual Abuse Victims Write to Condoleeza Rice


They Ask Her to Expose and Rebuff Vatican Efforts To Nix Lawsuits


SNAP's Letter Prompted by Church's Recent Move to Squelch Class Action Suit


Leaders of a support group for clergy sex abuse victims are writing Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice, asking that she expose and rebuff efforts by Vatican officials to interfere in molestation lawsuits in the United States involving the Catholic Church.

Their request is prompted by a report last Thursday in the National Catholic Reporter (NCR) that Vatican Secretary of State Cardinal Angelo Sodano asked Rice “to intervene in a U.S. lawsuit naming the Holy See as the defendant in a sex abuse case' during her Feb. 8th visit to Rome.

The case, a class-action lawsuit filed in Louisville KY, names the Vatican as the lone defendant.

The NCR is an independent weekly newspaper whose Vatican correspondent, John Allen, is perhaps the most widely-respected American journalist at the Holy See.

The support group, the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests (SNAP), wants to know whether similar requests have been made in the past, and wants Rice to pledge to disclose and oppose any such moves in the future.

"We urge you to expose any such Vatican efforts ' past and future - and to 'just say no' to any such secretive moves to undermine the American justice system and deny justice for those who have been raped and sodomized by clergy," said Peter Isely of Milwaukee. Isely, an abuse survivor, is on the Board of Directors of SNAP, a Chicago-based support group.

According to the NCR, this is not the first time, according to (Vatican) observers, that the Vatican has asked the State Department for help on a legal matter.'

http://www.fpif.org/fpiftxt/4610

Overlapping Agendas

Things haven't always been tense between Bush and Benedict. They share similar views regarding abortion, gay marriage, and other hot-button conservative issues. Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger (as Benedict was known before becoming Pope in April 2005) even helped Bush secure the White House for a second term.

Specifically, after Bush visited the Vatican in June 2004, complaining that "not all the American bishops are with me," Ratzinger sent a letter to U.S. bishops, ordering them to refuse communion to "a Catholic politician … consistently campaigning and voting for permissive abortion and euthanasia laws" – a thinly-veiled reference to John Kerry. Ratzinger added that any person even voting for this Catholic politician “would be guilty of formal cooperation in evil and so unworthy to present himself for Holy Communion." Probably no surprise, then, that Bush increased his margin among Catholics by 6% from 2000 to 2004.

In an interesting twist, Ratzinger also partnered with George W. Bush's brother Neil in a foundation "to promote ecumenical understanding and publish original religious texts" in 1999. Oddly enough, business credit reports listed the foundation as a "management trust for purposes other than education, religion, charity or research," leaving the true nature of the Neil Bush/Cardinal Ratzinger venture unclear.

In 2005, Ratzinger was named as a defendant in a U.S. lawsuit suit accusing him of conspiring to cover up the sexual abuse of minors. At the center of the controversy was a May 2001 confidential letter he had sent Catholic bishops across the world ordering them to keep evidence of the sexual abuse of minors by clergy secret until 10 years after the child had reached adult status.

Soon after becoming Pope, however, Ratzinger was dismissed from the case. A U.S. federal judge decided the lawsuit would be "incompatible with the United States' foreign policy interests."

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medeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. forgot about the Kerry thing!
ugh...it's just deplorable
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smokey nj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #13
22. What makes it especially deplorable is that Catholic politicians who support the
Edited on Wed Apr-16-08 11:03 AM by smokey nj
death penalty get a free pass from the Vatican.
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JCMach1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 04:12 PM
Response to Original message
11. But I thought it was Church Policy to PULL OUT
Damn could have been using something else all along. :grr:
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
17. maybe he still believes the crusades were a good thing..i don't care what the pope thinks
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MiniMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-15-08 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
18. I thought withdrawl was the only method the Pope advocated
:shrug: :evilgrin:
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Fireweed247 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 01:32 PM
Response to Original message
23. Pope John Paul spoke out strongly against the war
and the Bush catholics didn't like it.

This guy...well...someone like him put into power during Bush's reign....I don't trust him!
Although I did have a dream last night that I gave him a back massage...I wonder what that means!
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