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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 03:35 PM
Original message
true or false: much of our law is grounded...
in the Judeo-Christian tradition
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SharonAnn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 03:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. False
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mondo joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 03:44 PM
Response to Original message
2. False.
For we know that the common law is that system of law which was introduced by the Saxons, on their settlement in England, and altered, from time to time, by proper legislative authority, from that, to the date of the Magna Charta, which terminates the period of the common law, or lex non scripta, and commences that of the statute law, or lex scripta. This settlement took place about the middle of the fifth century; but Christianity was not introduced till the seventh century; the conversion of the first Christian King of the Heptarchy, having taken place about the year 598, and that of the last about 686. Here, then, was a space of two hundred years, during which the common law was in existence, and Christianity no part of it. If it ever, therefore, was adopted into the common law, it must have been between the introduction of Christianity and the date of the Magna Charta. But of the laws of this period, we have a tolerable collection, by Lambard and Wilkins; probably not perfect, but neither very defective; and if any one chooses to build a doctrine on any law of that period, supposed to have been lost, it is incumbent on him to prove it to have existed, and what were its contents. These were so far alterations of the common law, and became themselves a part of it; but none of these adopt Christianity as a part of the common law. If, therefore, from the settlement of the Saxons, to the introduction of Christianity among them, that system of religion could not be a part of the common law, because they were not yet Christians; and if, having their laws from that period to the close of the common law, we are able to find among them no such act of adoption; we may safely affirm (though contradicted by all the judges and writers on earth) that Christianity neither is, nor ever was, a part of the common law.

The Writings of Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Memorial Association of
the United States, Published 1904, pages 90-91.
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Flarney Donating Member (512 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. You pretty much said it all, but an additional note worth mentioning...
...is number of the 10 commandments that are "on our books" as law. Just the "kill" and "steal" ones, right? Case closed.
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A HERETIC I AM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Bearing false witness (Perjury)....
is part of common law. Adultery has been illegal in a number of states in the past, though I don't know if it still is anywhere (I bet it is, but I'm not sure)

The rest of the Ten Commandments however, you're correct. Little more than Bronze Age crowd control.
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Ediacara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. Being against perjury, murder, and robbery are hardly unique to the Judeo-Christian tradition....
So I'd give them 1/4 point each due to happenstance...
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unc70 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #15
28. In some states, adultery and/or coveting neighbors wife
Still criminal in some places, even if rarely enforced. "Stealing" someone else's spouse is a civil offense in some states.
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mondo joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. PS: There is no "Judeo Christian" anything.
That's a fiction.
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shain from kane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
3. The law is promoted by the propertied class to protect their property.
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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
4. That's a very complex issue.
Christian tradition co-opted earlier traditions, including those of Judaism.

Much of our law in the United States is grounded in English Common Law. Is English Common Law grounded in Judeo-Christian traditions? Yes and no. Common law goes way back to before the Romans brought Christianity to the British Isles. In fact, Roman traditions existed long before Christianity.

If we talk about Judeo-Christian traditions that are that ancient, we're really talking about *Eastern* traditions.

I don't think that present-day fundamentalist Christians understand that when they invoke "Judeo-Christian" traditions as the foundation of the United States, they are actually invoking ancient eastern mystical traditions, which were carried to the west over thousands of years.
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sinkingfeeling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 03:50 PM
Response to Original message
6. False.
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alittlelark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
7. Certainly False, The Supreme Court Building was designed
to include almost all customs of accepted law - from Hammurabi to Moses.

My Great-Uncle, Cass Gilbert was the architect. He was commissioned to include them...Aesops fables are even included. He snuck himself in as a sculpture of 'Liberty Enthroned guarded by Order and Authority'


http://www.nps.gov/history/history/online_books/butowsk...

<snip> On the east front of the building is a sculpture group by Herman A. McNeil and the marble figures represent great lawgivers, Moses, Confucius, and Solon, flanked by symbolic groups representing Means of Enforcing the Law, Tempering Justice with Mercy, Carrying on of Civilization and Settlement of Disputes Between States. The Architrave bears the legend: "Justice the Guardian of Liberty."

http://www.usscplus.com/info/building.htm

<snip>Directly above the Bench are two central figures, depicting Majesty of the Law and Power of Government. The group at the far left represents Safeguard of the Rights of the People, and Genii of Wisdom and Statecraft. The far right group represents the Defense of Human Rights. -To the right is a procession of historical lawgivers including: Menes, Hammurabi, Moses, Solomon, Lycurgus, Solon, Draco, Confucius and Augustus. They are flanked by figures symbolizing Fame and History. -To the left are later historical lawgivers including Napoleon, John Marshall, William Blackstone, Hugo Grotius, Saint Louis, King John, Charlemagne, Mohammed and Justinian. Figures representing Liberty and Peace and Philosophy appear at either end. -Symbolized on the back wall frieze is Justice with the winged female figure of Divine Inspiration, flanked by Wisdom and Truth. At the far left the Powers of Good are shown, representing Security, Harmony, Peace, Charity, and Defense of Virtue. At the far right the Powers of Evil are re
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watrwefitinfor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #7
20. My God. If the freepers ever learn Mohammed is up there
they will start a movement to raze the building.

Wat
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The Stranger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:12 PM
Response to Original message
9. False.
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Smith_3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:12 PM
Response to Original message
10. I always thought it is grounded in enlightened humanism. nt
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baldguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
12. Slavery is part of the Judeo-Christian tradition.
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. so, our laws are? nt.
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baldguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. No, just that not everything in the Judeo-Christian is desirable.
Laws should be made to fit the society they govern, not the other way around.
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IndianaJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. got it. nt.
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Ediacara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
14. Absolutely positively false
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
16. I'll add another "False" to the piling-on...nt
Sid
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SteppingRazor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
19. True. As shown by the mural of Moses on the SCOTUS building, our laws are grounded in biblical...
tradition. Only through a constant striving to create a more-moral, values-based society can we ...

:rofl:


Sorry, sorry. Couldn't keep it up.


Um, false. Our laws are based on common law, which is based on the notion of stare decisis.
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Kashka-Kat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:15 PM
Response to Original message
21. False - pagan all the way! Besides afore-mentioned origins of common law, democracy etc dont forget
Edited on Tue Jan-22-08 05:16 PM by Kashka-Kat
Bill of Rights - was lifted almost word for word from the Iroquois.
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:17 PM
Response to Original message
22. Only 3 of 10 Commandments even reflect modern law...
And those three: Don't kill, steal, or lie (perjury), are so basic to humanity that it's silly to pretend they came from any specific religion/moral code.
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
23. Define "much," "grounded in," and "tradition."
:shrug:
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:21 PM
Response to Original message
24. What Great Timing! I Was Just Reading My Bible Today And Couldn't Believe It When I Read In Ezekiel
"the lord frowneth upon those who can't drive 55"
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LSK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. DUzy right there!!!
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I work for workers Donating Member (551 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:21 PM
Response to Original message
25. False. At least 90% of it is grounded in bad ideas
that nobody understands the point of but will die to keep in place.

...

I guess I'll sit back and wait for someone to hit that softball out of the park.
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Jed Dilligan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
26. That's exactly what our law skips,
combining, as it does, Anglo-Saxon ("Common") and Roman legal traditions.
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