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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 01:48 AM
Original message
Obama as Messiah: The Myth of the Birth of the President
I am going to attempt to dissect Obamamania. It is always hard to analyze a trend while it is happening, so wish me luck!

What is fueling his popularity? It isn’t just the corporate media. They told us Rudi would be the GOP nominee, and the Republicans made liars of them. It can’t be just his good looks or voice. If looks were everything, Romney would be far ahead of his rivals. Is it his brains? Ha! This is the country that trusted Reagan, because he wasn’t too bright.

Maybe a different line of questioning would help. What do we, as Democrats, feel most strongly about? That is easy. We hate George W. Bush with a capital H, and we want him out of office, and we want everything he did undone ASAP. Christian, Jew, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Wiccan, atheist, agnostic, many of us share one thing in common, something we learned from our Christian cultural forebears----we believe that a Superman will come to slash and burn present corruption, making way for something better, something new.

Before there was Superman, they had a different word for the phenomenon. They called that kind of hero a "messiah".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messiah

A messianic figure is a person who is viewed as having a number of the characteristics of the Messiah in the eyes of a particular group. These usually include that the person is charismatic, influential, develops a power base, is appealing to a large group that views itself as oppressed in some way, and appears to offer a way to overthrow that oppression.


“What is to be done, O Moslems? for I do not recognize myself.
I am neither Christian nor Jew nor Gabr nor Moslem.
I am not of the East nor of the West nor of the land nor of the sea.
I am not of Nature’s mint, nor of the circling heavens”
Rumi, From Primitives to Zen Eliade


Jesus said “If your leaders say to you, ‘Look the (Father’s) imperial rule is in the sky’, then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they say to you , ‘It is in the sea’ then the fish will precede you. Rather the (Father’s) imperial rule is inside you and outside you.”
The Gospel of Thomas, The Complete Gospels



Barack Obama’s childhood could easily have been included by Otto Rank in The Myth of the Birth of the Hero . Son of a White American woman and a Kenyan college student, he was born on Hawaii, an island in the middle of the Pacific. I mention this, because water is important in these legends. His parents separated when he was still a toddler, depriving him of his natural father and his paternal heritage, just as Moses, Cyrus, Hercules and the rest were deprived of their fathers. His mother remarried, this time a man from Indonesia, sending young Barack into exile from his homeland, his seat of power. In Indonesia, he went to school with other Indonesian children and spoke their language, and yet, still he knew that he wanted to grow up to be the president of the United States, just as the child Cyrus knew that he had the qualities needed to be King of the Medes, even though he was being raised by shepherds. At the age of 10, he returned from exile to the United States to live with his mother’s parents and to attend a series of expensive, elite schools---schools fit for the leader he would one day become. The outcast hero had finally been acknowledged, as young Cyrus was acknowledged by the same grandfather who had once tried to have him murdered. Or as the child Jesus was finally accepted back into Nazareth, after years spent in exile in Egypt, on the run from the paranoid wrath of Herod.

Using the same facts, Barack Obama’s childhood could be told in other ways, but none of the stories would be as satisfying. “The myths are not constructed by the hero” Rank wrote “Least of all by the child hero, but they have long been known to be the product of a people of adults. The impetus is evidently supplied by the popular amazement at the apparition of the hero, whose extraordinary life history the people can only imagine as ushered in by a wonderful infancy.”

In The Hero With a Thousand Faces Joseph Campbell describes the hero as world redeemer. “’ Don’t think I am in the east, south, west or north. The earth is my body. I am there. I am all over. Don’t think I stay only under the earth or up I the sky, or only in the seasons, or in the other side of the waters. These are all my body.”

The hero must become larger than any one human being (with a single human being’s limitations or fears) for his task is to kill a tyrant----or to change the world, to put it in language that Obama supporters will understand. “I come not to send peace, but a sword” (Matthew 10:34).

The savior figure who eliminates the tyrant father and then himself assumes the crown is (like Oedipus) stepping unto his sire’s stead. To soften the harsh patricide, the legend represents the father as some cruel uncle or usurping Nimrod. Nevertheless, the half-hidden fact remains. Once it is glimpsed, the entire spectacle buckles; the son slays the father, but the son and the father are one. (Campbell)


Stated in direct terms: the work of the hero is to slay the tenacious aspect of the father (dragon, tester, ogre king) and release from its ban the vital energies that will feed the universe. (Campbell)


There is no worse dragon than the Bush/Cheney combo, along with their Neo-Con pals. The “slaying” I am referring to here is all figurative, of course. America, especially its Democrats and Independents wants these men stripped of their power. And it wants it done yesterday, if possible.

The United States has a strong Christian evangelical tradition. Even among agnostics and atheists, there is a tendency to mimic the behavior of our forefathers, especially when we decide that it is time for “out with the old and in with the new.” Let Europe debate and argue and bargain. We like clean, decisive breaks with the past. Therefore, it is no wonder that we have seen Messianic presidencies before during times of political unrest. I can recall two in my lifetime. The most obvious example is Jack Kennedy, who died for our sins, but not before he inspired young people all across America to make different choices than their parents. Ask people what Kennedy’s achievements were, and that last--- inspiration will probably be number one on the list. It might be the only thing on the list, but to many people it is enough to rate him as the all time greatest president.

The second most recent President as messiah is not remembered so fondly, probably because he was crucified through dirty political tricks, not an assassin’s bullets. Jimmy Carter was derided by Gore Vidal for taking his initials too seriously when he was running for president in 1976. Certainly, what he offered the country---change, honesty, morality, compassion---minus any actual experience required a leap of faith from the electorate.

In the wake of the Watergate and Viet Nam, Americans were more than willing to make that leap. They were eager to jump on board the Jimmy Carter band wagon. He could proclaim his outsider status---his hick southern accent, his credentials as a peanut farmer---as proof that he would never wiretap his political opponents. He admited to lusting after women in his heart, and therefore you just knew that he would never lie to the American people about a matter of national security.

No one cared to know how he was going to get the job done . It was clear that his status as an outsider, his words attacking the status quo, his promises of change were all that were required—along with enough votes come election day, and that would happen if only the people had enough faith—to bring about redemptive transformation.

Barack Obama is even more qualified than Jimmy Carter, the hick Georgia peanut farmer and Jack Kennedy, the energetic young Catholic, to serve as an agent of change. Like the heroes Rank describes, he fits the model of hero as redeemer to a T. Though clearly a man of the elite now----he has a Harvard law degree, a million dollar home and a job in the U.S. Senate---he has lived the other side of the dream. Broken family, third world exile, nonwhite, non citizen father and stepfather. While other candidates offer up plans or time tables, Obama offers up himself, his life story as sufficient reason to believe. He is Barack Obama, and therefore he can tear down the old, and in its place something new must spring up.

Jesus said “I have cast fire upon the world, and look, I’m guarding it until it blazes.”
Gospel of Thomas , The Complete Gospels


It is not true, as some have said, that Obama offers no specific plans or policies. His campaign website is full of them. Plans and polices are irrelevant to his campaign, and you will not see the corporate media pay much attention to them. The press is fascinated with Obama the Redeemer. With Huckabee spoiling the RNC’s game, I expect that the mainstream media will want to focus even more attention on Obama’s messianic qualities in the days to come, in order to boost McCain’s chances.
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monktonman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 01:55 AM
Response to Original message
1. I'm not gonna read this
your just wasting your time.
Next time keep it short and sweet.
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Helga Scow Stern Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:00 AM
Response to Original message
2. Good analysis of the mythic underpinnings.
Thanks. Makes sense to me.

Myth is what makes the world go 'round and we ignore understanding its powerful currents at out own peril.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:08 AM
Response to Original message
3. Incisive analysis
Did you compile that yourself? :thumbsup:
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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:15 AM
Response to Original message
4. Mr. Carter was a Georgia senator and the Governor of Georgia.
President Kennedy was a war hero, gravely injured during the war, a Congressman, almost a VP nominee in 1956 and a Senator.

I really do not get your point that somehow Senator Obama's background makes him more uniquely qualified to bring about change.
People have been working for years to bring about change.
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NOLALady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #4
28. Maybe it's the perception of some people
that he's more uniquely qualified to bring about change.
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:17 AM
Response to Original message
5. Unconvincing.
Cramming a square peg into a round hole here.

"Water is important in these legends?" -- come on.

"His seat of power?" -- What power?

All you seem to offer here is an explanation of why Obama is the candidate most likely to win--people just love the guy.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:39 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. I had to summarize Rank's work.
Here is a link. While I do not necessarily agree with Rank's psychoanalytic interpretation of the myths themselves, the compendium of myths at the beginning is priceless for anyone studying comparative mythology.

http://www.sacred-texts.com/neu/mbh/index.htm
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:45 AM
Response to Reply #5
10. Not love. Adore.
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DFLforever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:23 AM
Response to Original message
6. Well done.
rather brilliant synopsis of Obama as a transformative figure.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:40 AM
Response to Original message
8. So instead of Bushies, we have Obamies?
And what change would that be?
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The Traveler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:43 AM
Response to Original message
9. The heroic template
is something we foist from time to time on real men who try to rise up to real challenges. Obama is armed with the right rhetoric, fueled by the right ideals, and has surfaced at the right time to evoke this response from us. The mythic template is not something he claimed ... rather the conditions are such that the people want the mythic hero to arise. He issued a call for the transformation of politics. We responded with the imposition of the mythic, heroic burden.

Obama's campaign website is indeed full of plans and policies. No one is saying it isn't. Rather, the complaint is that it is difficult to extract from those plans and policies any indication of change commensurate with the rhetoric and the meteoric expectations. The cynical have described this as "change lite" ... but I have begun to suspect something else is operating here.

I have finally realized that first and foremost Obama seeks to build a transformational movement that reshapes the basic ground of the debate. John Edwards grabs a big fucking wrench and approaches the system with the intention to rudely rearrange its parts. Obama seems to be rather considering the question of how to go about redesigning that system and identifying its new requirements. That is a task of considerably greater scope and subtlety. If my suspicions are correct, then Edwards is best described as a reformer, and Obama is best described as a revolutionary.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:47 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Uh huh. And what will change?
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The Traveler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:56 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. Difficult to predict
Especially if there is successful construction of a movement, a successful reshaping of the basic groundwork of the debate.

And because it is difficult to predict, there is no way of saying if any of us will like the final product.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:43 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. Movements stand for something. This is a cult of personality.
In a movement, if a leader falls, there's another to replace him. Obama is just himself. He stands for nothing but loose pretty words.

And I'll tell you something else: Messiahs don't bring hope. They bring death.

A messiah is walking into the most powerful White House in history and you're all sunny and smiling. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. That goes for gods.
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Bicoastal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 04:33 AM
Response to Reply #16
23. Can not for the life of me figure out why you, aquart, are so SCARED of Obama.
Background and appearance aside, he's really not too different from Edwards. The outlook and policy differences we quarrel about are minute compared to the GOP opposition.

He's just more popular right now, that's all.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #23
34. I'm scared of the way people are reacting. TERRIFIED.
Nobody questions messiahs. There are people on this board saying if you don't vote for Obama, you're a "roadblock to history." That kind of thinking doesn't scare you?

The presidency as it stands right now, with Bush's power untouched and unchecked is like a kingship. We add godlike adoration to that?

When people are worshipping a man instead of honoring an institution, they don't pay attention to what's really happening. Anyone who wants to liken Obama to JFK, THINK ABOUT THAT.

A cult mentality has sprung up overnight based on the Iowa returns and the NH polls. What happens to this "cult" when it gets a crushing victory in New Hampshire? What happens to the democratic process?
Who can compete with God's anointed?

Absolute power corrupts absolutely. What happens when the "messiah" starts to believe that's exactly what he is? (I'm sorry, of course he's too perfect and wonderful to ever get a bad thought and whatever he does he WILL be doing it for the best. I must have faith. I WOULD RATHER HAVE CHECKS AND BALANCES.)

I feel like a character in Ionescu's play "Rhinoceros."



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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #34
43. Obama isn't W. He won't get corrupted. He just needs extra Secret Service
because people that inspire strong emotions in their followers also attract the crazies (like O'Reilly lol). And he is at greater risk than the average politician of experiencing a decline in his poll numbers after the honeymoon is over.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:57 AM
Response to Original message
13. very interesting, although the water and the step-father do not seem necessary
unless they are part of the fuel in the ambition. This line rang true

"While other candidates offer up plans or time tables, Obama offers up himself, his life story as sufficient reason to believe. He is Barack Obama, and therefore he can tear down the old, and in its place something new must spring up."

Also, seems to me he is telling a Horatio Alger story which steals Hillary's thunder of 'renew the American Dream'.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:21 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. As I said above, if you read the collected hero birth tales, you will see
how the details of Obama's life mirror these stories. For instance, Joseph was a step-father to Jesus. Many of the messiahs were raised by surrogate fathers since their real fathers were either tyrants who tried to kill or abandon them or else gods. It is their separation from their natural father which enables them to come into their power free from the shackles of old conventions and beliefs--and this will ultimately allow them to destroy the old order.

Water is a natural/supernatural image that occurs frequently as with Moses in the water, Romulus and Remus in the water etc. Hawaii is mentioned often as Obama's birth state, and I believe that this is not an accident. Hawaii, though a state, has an "otherness" about it as well as associations with the ocean. Anytime you are dealing with messiah type issues, water indicates baptism or a natural medium through which change can occur, especially mental or spiritual change.
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Mithreal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:27 AM
Response to Original message
15. He's a storybook man?
Osama the Destroyer versus Obama the Redeemer? I get it that Americans love secular and religious superheroes, but at the most Obama as messiah viewpoint could only be held by a minority of individuals and maybe subconsciously at that. Whoever wins the nomination can be our "Champion" but I prefer that more Americans realize that each of us is a powerful agent of change and responsible for protecting this democracy. I enjoyed the ideas though.
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intaglio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:47 AM
Response to Original message
17. This OP could have been worshipful or derogatory
Instead there is a thoughtful analysis of legends and how they still shape our dreams and actions. Obama does have the stuff of legend about his history and this is to his benefit.

McCamy Taylor has missed some in this analysis and including peculiarly American ones. There is the story of the Tall, Gangling Lawyer from a backwoods state. There is the hopeful youngster giving up a career as an esteemed academic for an uncertain future serving his country. There is one that Hillary Clinton tried to use against him, the child who wanted to be President. This was a huge error in political terms as it just added to the mythic history.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:53 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. This wasn't worshipful? It wasn't profoundly disturbing?
Everyone here is all right with this?

Just what we need. A sacrificial king cult running the government. Or didn't she mention that part of it?
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DFLforever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 04:25 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. It's a matter for imagination
People keep going on about substance vs form with Obama, issues vs fluff, style vs content.

The OP is attempting to explain the power behind the Obama phenomena.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #19
35. I got that. How do you impeach a god?
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 03:31 PM by aquart
Here's a scenario for you: We didn't impeach white criminal treasonous bastard thief Bush. Messiah Obama is elected in a joyous landslide. The young people of this country would carry him on their shoulders thru every one of the fifty states if the Secret Service would let them. He gives his oath and walks into the Oval Office where he has the power to kidnap, torture, and hold without trial, to write notes saying he isn't going to enforce any law he chooses, to award contracts to anyone he likes...just like George because we have chosen NOT to stop George. He has the power. Any incoming president has the power, but this one is the Messiah.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely. We are going to need to ride roughshod on whoever becomes President. BECAUSE we didn't impeach George. If Obama comes to believe he IS the Messiah? If he exercises one tenth of the powers he has to support that?

You tell me who will have the guts to tell him NO!
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autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 04:44 AM
Response to Reply #17
24. McCamy didn't miss much.
I don't think you can apply the Lincoln template to Obama but I may not know enough about Obama.

Lincoln grew up an outsider with very deep regrets that he had to school himself and that he lacked
the opportunity for an education equal to the qualities of his mind. Giving up a career as an esteemed
academic seems much less of a task than suffering in the back woods without the intellectual
stimulation and absent the growth that true peers would offer. I remember a passage about Lincoln
teaching himself Latin or something in the middle of a corn field bemoaning his lack of a path to
formal learning.

Interesting stuff though.



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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 04:27 AM
Response to Original message
20. Jimmy Carter, the hick Georgia peanut farmer
Wow.

Bigotry knows no bounds. Good luck with your messianic posturings. :rofl:
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autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 04:32 AM
Response to Original message
21. K*R Erudite, at the very least!
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 04:36 AM by autorank
Of course, I find your reference to Otto Rank entirely appropriate for Obama and also, the less
original, but clearly stated Campbell, entirely on target for analyzing the ephemeral
character that is Obama. He has a mythic quality to him. There are so many gaps unfilled by
information and it's a long time until the convention. I don't know nearly enough about him to
even think of supporting him in the primaries. At the same time, I believe that you've captured the
phenomenon of the campaign and man in the most original and thoughtful analysis I've seen.

Having said that, it will end badly. It always does with mythical candidates.

There are two additional factors operating that are worthy of your consideration - projection and
hubris. The Obama supporters, a fair number anyway, are projecting their hopes and dreams onto
this man in an uncritical way. That's the essence of projection. You take all of the qualities
that you revere and create your own character in the form of the candidate. The risk here is that
any major flaw or series of minor but significant flaws causes those expressing their hopes and
desires to feel betrayed. It's a special type of betrayal since it's ultimately an attack on the
supporter because the recipient of the projection is never a real person in the first place. He's
just a composite of your hopes. When he fails, you fail but he gets blamed. We know some unappealing
details (Carlyle contributions, etc.).

Of more interest is Obama's very modest program. His promise: supporters' "children will inherit a
planet that's a little cleaner and safer." If it's not a whole lot cleaner, we're all doomed. If
you're a messiah, why not promise something grand?

The interesting factor though is hubris. That's an after the fact judgment. But the way he handled
HRC over the false charge and the apology and the swipes at the other Democrats, e.g., Gore & Kerry
turning off 50% of the population, might be a sign of that deadly flaw. Why rub it in when you can
do much more damage by noting then dismissing the lie, as in the case of HRC? Why take a poke at
people who aren't even attacking you, like Gore and Kerry who are tragic figures due to the
stolen elections?

He may not falter. He many not have any more skeletons. And he may have someone who can talk with
him about being less regal and more efficient when confronted with dirty tricks. Who knows?

But this is one outstanding post.

My thought is the winning candidate will have experienced something like this:

Those who seek should not stop seeking until they find. When they find, they will be disturbed.
When they are disturbed, they will marvel, and will reign over all.
Gospel of Thomas

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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 04:33 AM
Response to Original message
22. Pretentious claptrap
with a predictable punch line.

It's fun to tack a template to a candidate, but you're missing sooo much with this fascile exercise.

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puebloknot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 04:56 AM
Response to Original message
25. Your use of the word "Messiah" makes me cringe. My greatest concern...
...about Obama is his too-close association with right-wing religious groups. We've had "God" in the form of George Bush for lo, these millions of years (it seems). We don't need someone else who channels God -- albeit with more savoir (that's not a misspelling of "savior") faire.
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Myrina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #25
40. I second that - STRONGLY!
:applause: Note to both parties: please keep your spiritual savior out of my government. Thank you.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #40
42. You could substitute "superhero" for "messiah". Obama is a secular savior.
Nondenominational.
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ConsAreLiars Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 05:17 AM
Response to Original message
26. Jung's archetypes, repeated in a more modern variant in Chomsky's
studies of linguistics, along with Campbell in a popular variant and Mircea Eliade in a more abstruse form, all looked at the same reality from different perspectives. The human mind and the social consciousnesses it generates work very much in the way you described. It is not rational, but it has allowed us to survive so far.

Brilliant work. I don't see this as a puff piece for Obama, as some who oppose him have claimed (simple-minded partisans think that way - too bad), but as a very insightful look at how he has become more than mere rationality would have predicted.

If you have the stomach for it, maybe take a look at the anti side, the dark side contenders, and share your thoughts. Also maybe look at how the other players, Edwards and Clinton, fill out this playlet, this myth.
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RBInMaine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:10 AM
Response to Original message
27. We NEED to BELIEVE again !
This is too lllllllllllllllong. Shorten it up to no more than half as long. We don't need a sermon.
Obama could sort of be characterized as a messianic figure, most notably through his running as much on hope, vision, and imagination as detailed policy proposals, and this is GOOD! For too long Democrats have run on logic and policies while the R's figured out that you have to run on broad statements and narratives of values and vision. Obama has raised the bar to a much higher, very inspiring narrative about who we are as a people and what is possible, and it's REFRESHING and it is WORKING ! People want to believe again. People want national leadership that makes them feel good inside again. Obama is giving people this, and I think very genuinely. He is right. It is TIME for this in our country, and it is definitely time for this in the Democratic Party. I love it ! VERY refreshing. Hope it continues. Reminds me of the Kennedy days. We Americans need to BELIEVE again that great things are possible. We need to come together again, especially after these last horrid years under Bush/Cheney. The presidential vote is the most personal vote. It is about much more than "policies" and "long Washington experience." It is about capturing the national imagination. Obama is doing that. Good for him !
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
29. Thanks for all the comments. I didn't expect so many people to pay attention to
this journal, which I thought was a little dry. It is, after all, just a theory about why Obama's personal history makes him suited to capture the popular American imagination at a time when people are looking for a messianic Democratic presidential candidate to redeem us after the corruption of the Bush administration. Huckabee's success can be explained in the same way.

This theory explains why race does not seem to have harmed his campaign one bit, but rather seems to have propelled it---mixed insider/outsider status is a plus for a transformative figure.

I have not commented about whether or not his perceived heroic qualities help him as a candidate. Obviously, they help him. This is America. Many people vote based upon emotions, not reason.

I also did not comment about whether or not Obama himself is consciously cultivating the image of messiah. How could I know? I would like to think that he would reject the methods of Elmer Gantry on a conscious level--meaning that his campaign is the creation of some subconscious part of his psyche that believes that JFK "inspired" America and that this should be our goal again. On the other hand, a smart campaigner could look back at previous winning Democratic presidential campaigns--those of FDR, JFK, LBJ, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton---and extract the winning elements. Obama can not be all these candidates, but he is uniquely qualified to be the redemptive messiah who must be (at least part) outsider--which means JFK and Jimmy Carter. Isn't it interesting that JFK was the remedy for Eisenhower/Nixon which was tainted by the HUAC and McCarthy and other Nixonesque unAmerican activities, while Jimmy Carter was the remedy for the real Richard Nixon (Watergate, Cambodia, CIA assassinations) and now Obama offers himself up as the remedy for Dick Cheney's Nixon II administration? Nixon and his followers wanted to become tyrants. The nation rebelled (rebels) and demanded (demands) a savior. If you look at it this way, maybe Obama is being forced to run the campaign that he is running by us . Perhaps as a natural leader, he is looking around and seeing what people want and need and his instinct tells him to supply it. If that is the case, he could get chewed up and spit out by the demands of public office, because he will never be able to satisfy everybody. Even his own supporters will quickly become disenchanted, when he fails to solve the problems that make their day to day lives unbearable.
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intaglio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:38 PM
Response to Reply #29
39. Remember the myth also binds the mythologised
It is a straight jacket; depart from the story and you loose all protection from doubt and enmity that the myth gives you. Churchill was bound by the myth of the truculent prophet; when the war ended so did his role. More pitiful was his "comeback" in the '51 election when he was exposed as
...Last scene of all,
That ends this strange eventful history,
Is second childishness and mere oblivion;
Sans teeth, sans eyes, sans taste, sans everything.
William Shakespeare
As You Like It, 2. 7
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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 01:59 PM
Response to Original message
30. Very insightful.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:08 PM
Response to Original message
31. I thoroughly enjoyed this! Excellent!
:applause:
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Bake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:51 PM
Response to Original message
32. Every quote ascribed to Jesus in your piece
comes from the Gospel of Thomas, a non-canonical Gnostic text that virtually no serious scholar accepts as authentic. There's a reason it's non-canonical ...

Beyond that, I think you may be right that some Obama suppporters see his as a quasi-messianic figure, METAPHORICALLY speaking; however, I wouldn't push that metaphor too far.

Bake
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #32
37. One is from Matthew. Canonical texts have been heavily edited by different churches.
As someone who has never been a member of any Christian religion, I choose to rely upon the The Gospel of Thomas precisely because it is not claimed by a specific Church and does not appear to have gone through a board of censors. If you study it, you will see that it is not unlike the canonical Gospels. However, there are subtle differences. I believe that the differences reflect political forces which would have been intent upon changing a movement that emphasized mysticism and self awareness as means towards breaking with the past into a tool which could be used to prolong the Roman Empire in a new form.

Mystical traditions around the world share similar imagery and language---and these messages are very powerful where ever they appear. The Gospel of Thomas even more than the other Gospels seems a clear distillation of the same type of message that the Buddha delivered or that mystics like St. Francis or Rumi delivered later. These messages are able to mobilize large numbers of people when they are delivered by charismatic leaders.
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Bake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. The differences are far more than subtle.
And critical scholarship - not "official Church dogma" - rejected the Gospel of Thomas long ago, for reasons of provenance as well as dogma.

If you like it, fine. But I wouldn't cite it as an authoritative source.

Bake
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #38
41. I am citing it as a literary source. I am not a Christian and don't care about dogma.
As far as the literature of mysticism and mystical movements goes, it is far superior to the canonical texts.
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
33. Hubby, the psychiatrist, who has spent his professional life analyzing myth
and treating people (not just shoving pills at them)is no more taken with Obama than I am. In fact,
we had a discussion the other day that ended with our agreement that Obama doesn't really know who he is
and that it shows not only in his demeanor, but in his approach to this race.
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Politicub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
36. This is amazing
I love the contrast between the mythology of the hero and Obama.

If you're right, Ob ama dovetails with some deep seated, subconscious ideas that motivate us.

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bhikkhu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-08-08 01:21 AM
Response to Original message
44. give it a rest
historical analysis is one thing, but projecting myth upon the living is simply obnoxious.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-08-08 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #44
46. American notion. Act through impulse, understand the past. Rest of the world acts rationally NOW.
Edited on Tue Jan-08-08 11:42 AM by McCamy Taylor
There is no reason not to make an attempt to understand why we do things. That does not mean that we have to change the way that we do things. But knowing oneself is always better than blindly following the same old patterns, especially if the same old patterns include self destructive behaviors---like electing Dumbyas (Ronald Reagans, George W. Bushes, idiots like that)---or like voting against our own economic self interest---or like rushing blindly into wars of choice.

I have not said that we should not support Obama. His Superman/Messiah history makes him more electable. I want the Democrats to win. I just think we need to be aware of what we are doing. For one thing, the knowledge is important in formulating a winning campaign strategy for the general election. If Obama's history is a major factor in his appeal, then it needs to be emphasized--and any Republican attempt to discredit it needs to be countered ASAP.

Note that all three Democratic front runners are "outsiders" to a certain extent. Hillary is a woman and has been the target of the Right Wing attack machine for years. John Edwards was the son of mill workers, a self made man, a southerner, current victim of a MSM blacklist. Obama is Obama. This is not a coincidence. The American public believes that only an outsider can cleanse this country. I offer this as proof that the candidates' histories are extremely important this election cycle. The public is not electing a set of ideas. They are electing an individual. A leader whom they need to do heroic things.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-08-08 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. Bingo!
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bhikkhu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-09-08 02:28 AM
Response to Reply #46
48. So to elect an individual we must encourage mass delusion
I don't buy it, and certainly would not vote for it. From what I have seen I would vote for Obama, as he seems a refreshing break from the hypocrisy of political "insiders". He doesn't have to be a messiah to be likable, honest, intelligent and capable - qualities hard to find together in any political arena.

Marketed as a messiah I would avoid him and those who supported him like the plague. I am old enough to have seen all previous messiahs turn to crap, and their followers to rabid social engineers.
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aein Donating Member (262 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-08-08 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
45. Kinda reminds me of a 9/11 conspiracy theory video
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