"If X wins the Democratic nomination, I'm not voting for them"

[FatDave]

Man, I'm sick of hearing this. If you can't commit to vote for the democratic party's nominee, whoever that may be, then I don't think you really belong here. The site is called Democratic Underground after all.

Oh, but here's where you say "But...but..but...I never said I was a democrat!" and point out the "other progressives" clause in the About DU page. Well, if you ask me (which you didn't, but I'm not gonna let that stop me) it ain't very god-damn progressive to help the republicans by refusing to vote for the democrat OUT OF SHEER SPITE! Fuck you and your candidate that didn't make it through the primaries, you need to suck it up and get it together for the greater good. And if you don't think that any of the democratic candidates would make a better president than any of the republican candidates, well, then maybe you'd fit in better at a site called Green Party Underground or maybe Former-Republicans-Disillusioned-by-Their-Party-Becoming-Fascists Underground.

And look, I know everybody's got their favorite candidates right now, and we're going to argue over which one would make the best president. That's what primary season is about, and there will be plenty of times where it won't be pretty. But once we have a nominee chosen, for fuck's sake, get behind them. You don't even have to be enthusiastic about it. All you've got to do is vote. Bitch all you want, wax poetic about the party's propensity for fucking up their chances, and demand that the first votes be moved from Iowa and New Hampshire to New York and California. But when November of 2008 rolls around, leave it behind and vote for the democrat on the top of the ballot.

If you can't manage to do that one simple thing, then you obviously don't give a damn about the future of your country. And that means there's no place for you here.

[PeaceNikki]

1. Some people think voting their "conscience"

will absolve them of the mess that results in more GOP bullshit.

Fuck what happens to the rest of us, at least *THEY* will be able to sleep at night because they didn't compromise their "values".

Sleep well, wise ones.

[FatDave]

10. You know what my conscience says?

It says stopping madmen from inheriting the country by voting for somebody I'm less than enthusiastic about is not a betrayal of my ideals.

[skipos]

2. Anyone who says that doesn't give a shit about the supreme court

that is for sure.

If ANY republican wins in 08, the SC is screwed for a LONG time.

[Aviation Pro]

3. I am voting for whomever is nominated as the Democratic candidate...

....

[Name removed]

4. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LoZoccolo]

5. I agree, but if they got rid of all those people, this site might have some cash problems.

Personally I wonder if they started tombstoning the splinterists, committed Democrats would find the site more useful and stay and give even more money.

[FatDave]

7. Nah, they're really a minority

Their numbers just seem bigger because they show up in every pro-X candidate thread.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

6. Thomas Jefferson disagrees.

"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever, in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else, where I was capable of thinking for myself. Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free and moral agent. If I could not go to heaven but with a party, I would not go there at all." --Thomas Jefferson to Francis Hopkinson, 1789.

"Were parties here divided merely by a greediness for office,...to take a part with either would be unworthy of a reasonable or moral man." --Thomas Jefferson to William Branch Giles, 1795.

And, so do I.

I have the quaint notion that, in a democracy, I have the right to vote (or, not vote) for whomever I decide is the best candidate...even if I have to write one in.

[ozone_man]

8. What, you have your own mind?

In Vermont, people break party lines frequently. We get Republicans voting for Progressives like Bernie Sanders all the time. When he wins with 70%, and he does, you know they're not all Progressives.

[FatDave]

9. I didn't say you don't have the right

I just said even if you can't have your favorite candidate in the general, then at least try to stop the republicans. Keeping your moral purity is more important to you than saving your country? Well, I hope your moral purity is some comfort to you in that Haliburton-built prison cell after they label you an enemy combatant.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

28. Well, it's a good thing that I'm not a patriot.

And, have no delusions about "saving" my country.

Does your inclination to "save" the country have anything to do with morality?

I find it amusing that you should be decrying "purity" when demanding party loyalty.

[scarletwoman]

11. Oh goody, another high dudgeon lecture about how I damn well better fall in line.

I don't know about anyone else, but I just can't get enough of these posts -- especially the "fuck you" and "go find another board" bits.

Only eleven fun-filled months to go until the election! Woo Hoo! :P

sw

[HCE SuiGeneris]

13. ...

:rofl:

:toast: scarletwoman!

[FatDave]

14. I know, how fucking dare I suggest that democrats should vote for the democratic party's nominee?

You'd think I said Jesus was a homosexual and the only reason he raised Lazarus was because he thought he had a nice ass. No wonder we can't win the presidency.

Also, the nominee will be decided by February 5th. That's 2 months, not 11.

[scarletwoman]

20. Hey, *I'm* not the one saying "how dare you!" *I'm* not the one posting ultimatums.

You'd think I said Jesus was a homosexual and the only reason he raised Lazarus was because he thought he had a nice ass.

Well, if you had posted THAT, I would have simply replied with :rofl:

And, sorry, but it IS eleven months until the general election, and you can bet your sweet bippy that the browbeatings will continue until that very day.

sw

[bluestateguy]

12. I have taken the pledge and will do so again here today

We choose our nominees through a democratic process. If you call yourself a Democrat and don't pledge to support that nominee, then you are really saying that he have contempt for the process and the party's members.

[pansypoo53219]

15. i to am sick of fuckin 'purity' voters.

this is how the fucking republiKKKans win. they are lemmings willing to follow their leader of a cliff. sure. i didn't WANT to vote for DUKAKIS OR KERRY, bt i did my duty to america, because the alternative was GEORGIE.
how does voting for nader or whoever going to HELP?

UNITED we stand, DIVIDED we elect EVIL.




dang. i just pray iowa doesn't pick hillary and huckleberry.

[Truth2Tell]

16. What's with the insults?

Why do so many of you in the Party Uber Alles crowd think you can insult people into thinking or acting like you wish they would? Can you already see a loss coming down the tracks after we nominate some war-mongering corporate suck-up to represent us in the General election? Are you already trying to project blame?

Really, if you're worried about genuine progressives failing to turn out in November, don't support some sell-out in the primaries. It's that simple.

[Individualist]

19. Some people think attempts at coercion will convince people to vote as they do.

How deluded is that?!

[FatDave]

21. I don't think I'm supporting some sell-out

You're free to disagree, but I'd bet cash money that when DK inevitably drops you and I will be supporting the same candidate. Unless you just decide to take your ball and go home, because Lord knows the rest of them are no better than the republicans.

And I'm most certainly not "Party Uber Alles". I'm as pissed off at the republican wing of the democratic party as everyone else here. Believe me, I'm as liberal as they come. Some have called me socialist, and I'm not offended when they do it. I've been fighting the republicans since ketchup was a vegetable. Would have been doing it for longer if my age allowed it.

Lastly, I'm not sure what part of what I said qualifies as an insult. I used a good amount of strong language, but I didn't call anybody any names. OK, I did say fuck you once, but you just called me a nazi and questioned my credentials as a progressive!

[Truth2Tell]

23. I actually was referring to a more inclusive "people"

than just you. But yes, you did say "fuck you" and that sort of torpedoes the whole friendly dialogue thing, I'd say.

If you're so gosh darned progressive you'd think you'd have more understanding of the moral quandary so many of your fellow progressives find themselves in - especially young people who have come to understand that our system is a fraud in so many ways.

I will vote for the nominee, and yes I will likely share your candidate if DK drops, but I can also relate to my friends and neighbors who have simply decided to say "fuck you" to both Parties. I have more values in common with them than I do with the Democratic "leadership". I will also try to encourage them to suck it up and vote for the lesser evil, but I suspect that if I tell them to fuck off I won't get very far.

[FatDave]

24. You're probably right.

I would catch more flies with honey than vinegar. But I'd just seen about the 10th "I'll never vote for them" post today when I wrote this, and I was pretty pissed off. I couldn't lash out at the post that was the final straw (though I did say a milder version), so I thought I'd lash out at them all in an OP.

Funny thing is, I thought I'd have the popular opinion on the subject. I thought I'd make at least 5 recs and have a lot of support. Guess I'll never understand DU.

[Truth2Tell]

25. Maybe the natural supporters for your post

were all on their nightly conference call when you made it?

Joking, joking.

I guess the response highlights the depth of dissatisfaction with the direction and strategy of our "centrist" Dems among most of the base. It's a big problem. series!!1!

:hi:

[Joe Fields]

17. no point in dialogue here. You have all sides of the argument covered.

:eyes:

[JustAnotherGen]

18. It would not be out of spite

I really don't want to vote for Hillary Clinton. I don't see much difference at the core between she and President Numnuts. And I'm sorry - but someone with a surname other than Clinton or Bush can be President. It's getting to be a bit dynastic around the US - wouldn't you agree? I thought we started because we rejected a monarchy that was taking our money, giving it to people elsewhere - and we said it's our money, we don't like you, and now you have to leave! LOL!

Me - I'll probably be engaged by this summer. Living overseas not too long after the general election. I'd like to leave my country in 'good hands'. . . but I won't vote for someone that I don't believe in. I can't do it. I simply can't. I'd simply rather leave.

[Hoof Hearted]

22. I will PROUDLY vote for ANY of our Dem nominees.

I was getting picky about them and then today something happened.

My daughter asked me if she could make a special request for her Christmas present. She asked me if she could please have a routine doctors exam. Even though she works hard and has held a steady job since she was 15 years old, she has no insurance and can't afford an office visit.

I may still prefer some candidates over others but I will work, sweat, and give till it hurts when our nominee is chosen, no matter who that is.

[Alexander]

26. I'd even vote for Biden over the Republican, and he's the worst candidate.

I'd vote for Hillary as well. I can tolerate her slightly more than Biden.

[sce56]

27. Ok Fat Dave Do you have the loyalty oath out for us to sign also? Go look at the VA state republics

Site for a sample!
:sarcasm:

[magellan]

29. It'd help the troops who've been following these orders

...if the people in charge realized we were at war and joined the battle.