Firefighters asked to report people who express DISCONTENT with the government

[tekisui]

It was revealed last week that firefighters are being trained to not only keep an eye out for illegal materials in the course of their duties, but even to report back any expression of discontent with the government.

A year ago, Homeland Security gave security clearances to nine New York City fire chiefs and began sharing intelligence with them. Even before that, fire department personnel were being taught "to identify material or behavior that may indicate terrorist activities" and were also "told to be alert for a person who is hostile, uncooperative or expressing hate or discontent with the United States."

Unlike law enforcement officials, firemen can go onto private property without a warrant, not only while fighting fires but also for inspections. "It's the evolution of the fire service," said a Phoenix, AZ fire chief of his information-sharing arrangement with law enforcement.

Keith Olbermann raised the alarm about the program on his show Wednesday, noting that "if the information-sharing program works in New York, the department says it will extend it to other major metropolitan areas, unless we stop them." He then asked Mike German, a former FBI agent who is now with the ACLU, "This program seems to be turning , essentially, into legally protected domestic spies, does it not?"



More at link, including video from Countdown: http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Homeland_Security_turns_firefighters_into_domestic_1129.html

This is a little more detail on an earlier story.

[yardwork]

1. Nazi Germany.

[kestrel91316]

2. If they find subversive books will it be their job also to

burn them a la Fahrenheit 451?

Just wondering.......

[ThomCat]

5. No, they'll just turn you in to the Gestapo

for interogation. Then they'll use your books as bait to see if they can catch anyone else. x(

[hootinholler]

17. It's not illegal to own the books...

It's just illegal to read them.

-Hoot

[shadowknows69]

19. A fireman burning a copy of "F- 451"

would probably cause the universe to implode wouldn't it?

[Angela Shelley]

3. Do you suppose they will be asked

to turn themselves in?

[Javaman]

4. Fahrenheit 451. nt

[Bitwit1234]

6. Now we understand how the Nazi's gained control of Germany

looks like the bush administration is really hyping it up...I bet you one thing they don't expect to step down in 2008. Do you think for one minute they are going to turn this country over to a Democrat. The Supreme Court gave it to bush once he stole it the second time, how do you think he'll stay in. Any guesses.

[txaslftist]

28. What if the Democrat agrees to maintain the same programs ...

... and gets approval from the same folks?

Why not a handover? Because it wouldn't really be a handover of power, would it? Just a shift from one to another to keep all of us malcontents fat and stupid?

[spanone]

7. and they call it homeland security.....not home security

homeland is govt.

[gratuitous]

8. I'm sure there are strict guidelines and rules in place for this

:rofl:

Better think twice about calling the fire department if your house is burning down. Who knows when the responding group is going to include some dimwit intoxicated on Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity, who sees terrorists around every corner and under every bed? "He had Michael Moore documentaries in his DVD collection!"

Here's a radical idea: Why don't we let the fire department put out fires? And how about we let the DMV license drivers who pass the test? Don't we already have government agencies whose mandate is to ferret out terrorism, nab bad guys and prosecute allegations of wrongdoing?

[wtmusic]

9. It's about time for another Red Scare

Be on the lookout for Terrorists, Communists, anything with "-ists" on the end!

[Mutineer]

10. And just how often would a fireman happen to hear such a thing?

I don't think they stop for tea and crumpets and a bit of conversation while they are in the midst of putting out a fire.

[tekisui]

12. Well, they get in people's houses. Not just for fires.

In fires and medical emergencies they enter homes. After fires they sift through whatever is left to determine the cause. Now, they are told and trained to report people based on suspicious behavior and based on items seen as threatening.

Fascist States of America---Welcome.

[spanone]

11. if they ask me, i'll give them a piece of my mind.....

i'll show them some fucking discontent

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

13. They should report the entire Republican Party

Hating the U.S. government and wanting it shrunk down and drowned in a bathtub is part of the Republican creed.

[CT_Progressive]

14. "firemen can go onto private property without a warrant" - Bzzt.

"firemen can go onto private property without a warrant, not only while fighting fires but also for inspections."

Bzzt.

They lack the power of arrest, therefore they are private citizens with no authority to trespass on your property.
You have to allow them into your house for an inspection. If you refuse, there is nothing they can do without a warrant.

[shance]

16. Thank you. That is good information to have.

n/t

[mtnester]

20. Actually, a persone designated as fire marshal has more authority

to enter AND arrest than a police office does in Ohio anyway. In Ohio, they CAN enter.

I don't think this will go over well in NYC...look at how the cops are already turning over juicy bits to smack Ghouliani. The firefighters will not be far behind, since they are SUCH fans of Chertoff and Pauleson....not

[seaglass]

26. Yeah, I don't really get this. My husband is a firefighter and

inspections are scheduled for new homes and when you're buying a home to make sure it has smoke detectors. Seems to me that if you're a terrorist and have a bunch of chemicals and RPGs in plain sight and then call the FD to do a smoke detector inspection you're a stupid terrorist. But to be honest, I wouldn't have a problem with the FD telling the PD about something like this.

Firefighters know a lot of stuff and they are pretty closed mouth about it. For instance the people in my town have no idea how many suicides happen in this town because the FD doesn't let that info get out - in order to protect the families. They usually won't comment on drunk driving accidents either. I trust their judgment, at least in my town.

I don't think many Firefighters are going to report on anti-Bush sentiments, I know too many of them who despise him.

[shance]

15. I read something recently about firefighters and spying.

And that some within the fire department were being actively engaged in spying/harassment.

May have had to do with neighborhood harassment.

I think at the core much of what is happening around us has to do with good ole fashioned racism and/or white supremacy.

Have to say the firemen in my area are some kind of cute - hope its not any of them!!

[tom_paine]

18. Wow. They are really accelerating the program aren't they? Next stop: Totalitarianism

Actually, they are already here.

[JBoy]

21. They should be on the lookout for anyone expressing CONTENT with the gov't

Those would be the people more likely to need some kind of mental health assistance.

[Mnemosyne]

22. Great answer, JBoy!

A late welcome to DU! :hi:

I wonder if yard signs calling for impeachment, stop the war, etc. are in the line of fire now.

[file83]

23. So when are Firemen going to start carrying sidearms or shotguns?

Because if they are becoming obligated informants, they better get ready for some serious confrontations.

[L. Coyote]

24. I got discontent. Should I dail 911 now and ask for a fireman.

Or, should I sent it in directly? :rofl:

[leveymg]

25. They still do housecalls.

[MilesColtrane]

27. Past Orwellian, into Bradburian...next stop, Gilliamesque.

[momster]

29. Any Word from the Union?

The Firefighters Union is pretty tough. What do they say about the Bushies turning their people into spies?