How praising your kids screws them up

[AngryAmish]

"For a few decades, it’s been noted that a large percentage of all gifted students (those who score in the top 10 percent on aptitude tests) severely underestimate their own abilities. Those afflicted with this lack of perceived competence adopt lower standards for success and expect less of themselves. They underrate the importance of effort, and they overrate how much help they need from a parent.


When parents praise their children’s intelligence, they believe they are providing the solution to this problem. According to a survey conducted by Columbia University, 85 percent of American parents think it’s important to tell their kids that they’re smart. In and around the New York area, according to my own (admittedly nonscientific) poll, the number is more like 100 percent. Everyone does it, habitually. The constant praise is meant to be an angel on the shoulder, ensuring that children do not sell their talents short.


But a growing body of research—and a new study from the trenches of the New York public-school system—strongly suggests it might be the other way around. Giving kids the label of “smart” does not prevent them from underperforming. It might actually be causing it."

[ananda]

1. bs and wrong!

No one can get too much praise.

PRAISE IS GOOD!

[greenman3610]

29. didn't work for George Bush.

[all.of.me]

46. kids live up to what we tell them.

if we tell them they are worthless/useless/stupid, damned if they don't live up to that.

if we tell them they are smart/strong/creative, they will live up to that.

so i agree - praise is good.

[Dorian Gray]

53. Praise is good,

but I read the article. It said that in tests, 1/2 the children were praised for their hard work. 1/2 were praised for being smart. 9 out of 10 praised for the hard work would move on to more difficult tasks in the next round of tests, while the majority of those praised for being smart would pick easier tests to complete so that they could maintain the face value of being smart.

It was a really interesting article in this week's New York Mag.

[Fresh_Start]

2. wow and ow

not particularly something I want to see but I had to see it.

[Marie26]

3. The article doesn't say "don't praise"

it just says to praise kids for their effort & work as much as their intelligence. Kids can never get too much praise!

[Divernan]

18. Right. Kids don't have to have exceptional IQs to be praised.

You can always find something to criticize. The art of parenting is to find something GOOD to praise. I took a seminar at UCBerkley (Boalt) on teaching trial advocacy to law students. We had classes of students performing exercises like giving an opening statement, or cross-examing a hostile witness. Each one of those students did tons of things "wrong" - the whole reason they took the class was to learn what did not come to them from divine inspiration or watching Law And Order. What I learned was that criticism is very painful for people to tolerate. We were taught to pick one thing to criticize,because the student would flood out emotionally at hearing the first criticism and not even register any further critique. And since all of the students made pretty much the same mistakes, they would learn from what others were told.

However, we always started with a compliment - as hard as it may have been to find something positive to say. Stuff like, you had good eye contact, or, you have a strong voice. Then we would say, "One area in which I think you can improve is (whatever), and here is how you can do that. At which point we would demonstrate an actual way to improve, and the have the student do it right then. At which point we could say, good - that was better, and the more you do it, the better you'll get. That technique is a very positive way to teach.

[Hav]

4. .

I find this quite interesting and it reminds me of this article about "expectations" and their effects on the people.
I think that it's also important how people/kids deal with the praise or criticism from their parents. Do they respond to being praised by working even harder or do they think that it's not necessary anymore to work harder? Kids who chose the second path must be the ones mentioned in this article.
On the other side, there might be enough kids who get barely any support from their parents and as a result don't achieve what they could because they just don't have any ambitions.

[Mandate My Ass]

5. My parents always praised us for being smart

and then said our report cards had better reflect that, or else. :spank: It worked like a charm every time.

[Jackpine Radical]

6. On the other hand, there are lots of people whose parents

did their best to keep them humble by calling them stupid, losers, fat, ugly, and (literally) bastards.

We have a special name for children whose childhoods were like that. We call them "criminals."

[DemBones DemBones]

13. So true. nt

[MountainLaurel]

31. Ah, so you've met my brother?

He's a self-fulfilling prophecy after years of hearing how worthless and stupid he was.

[SharonAnn]

32. Maybe but psychopaths are "I'm OK, you're not OK" types. They may have had

plenty of praise (?) and they have a high opnion of themselves. Just not a high opinion of others.

[Jackpine Radical]

36. Beggin' yer pardon, but it has been my humble and ignorant opinion

that the psychopathic personality has its origins in severe attachment difficulties occurring in the period between 12 and 24 months of life, when the right orbitofrontal cortex is myelinating. There is certainly a well-documented dendritic "pruning" effect among the neurons in that region among infants lacking the right kind of nurturing experience, and some intriguing behavioral data as reviewed by Alan Schore, Dan Siegel and others.

In the face of your obviously superior knowledge, I see that my notions were ill-founded, so I stand corrected.

[Ron Green]

7. When praising your kids, it's a good idea to keep in mind the difference between

self esteem and self respect. I've worked with lots of criminals who have tons of the former and very little of the latter. Praise for simply existing is necessary if a kid is truly without a basic trust of the world, but the next step is important: teaching the process of giving effort to others without immediate reward, and withholding praise in a judicious way that supports self respect.

[WindRavenX]

8. excellent post

I am a loving person and I have no doubt I'll be a parent someday that gives praise when earned, and comfort with failures.

You can't coddle kids, but dammit, you have to let them know they're loved.

[Double T]

9. So, parents should stop praising and start kicking their kids butts............

to prepare THEM for the ass kicking and denigration they're going to get in the corporate world.

[speedoo]

10. Thanks for posting this. I listened to a discussion this morning about it.

Very, very interesting and I think it makes a great deal of sense.

[Vinca]

11. How many adults to you know who are screwed up because

they felt they never met the expectations of their parents no matter what they did? Some of us could have used a boost in confidence. Praise your kids.

[all.of.me]

48. that was me in my father's eyes - never good enough.

i battle that to this day (i am 53). i tell myself out loud every day that i AM good enough and that i am better than good enough.

[dysfunctional press]

12. welll...being verbally abusive and never praising them screws them up even worse.

and i have the empirical evidence to support that claim.

[sandnsea]

14. Know your kid

Every one of them is different and comes with a basic temperament, preferences and unique talents. There is no magic formula.

[Divernan]

15. Kids may each be unique, but they do ALL NEED love, encouragement and praise

I consider that a formula. There's lots of fine-tuning to be done. Particularly, you have to include teaching them (1)that actions have consequences, (2)personal responsibility, and (3)delayed gratification. I have 3 adult kids - each with their own personalities, temperaments, preferences and talents. They've all turned out to be fine people leading good lives, including doing some good in this world. I praised all of their achievements to the heavens, and encouraged them to make an effort. I taught them that if you never make a mistake or fail at something, you're not really exploring your world and your abilities. In other words, failure is something we learn from, not something that merits parental ridicule.

I have friends whose parents were never pleased. Whatever the person accomplished, the parents would point out someone who had done even BETTER. It's a great way to generate lifelong insecurity and self-doubt.

[sandnsea]

27. The kind is unique to the child

I have one child who always seeks the middle ground, she did best when put in just a bit over her head. I have another who has learning disabilities, and needed encouragement at every step. Another sailed through everything, and needed to be reminded about things like empathy and gratitude. Each kids is different. There's no magic formula. Love, encouragement and praise is the least of it, except for parents who were gifted with gifted children and don't have the humility to know it.

[devilgrrl]

16. What a pile of bullshit. Written by a former Bond salesman????

Puh-leeze!

[gravity]

17. Misleading title

This article is not telling people to not praise there kids.

It says to praise them for their effort instead of their innate ability, which could have the unintended side effect of making them doubt their innate abilities when faced with a challenging situation, thinking that they are stupid. Praising their effort on the other hand encourages them to try harder when faced with a challenging problem.

Anyways, great read. This makes me realize that I should change the way a view my own abilities, since my parents must have abused me growing up by praising my intelligence :)

[Divernan]

19. Did they just praise your intelligence, or was it your academic performance?

nt

[gravity]

23. Both

They praised me for good grades, but it was to be expected since I was intelligent. My parents were very loving, but I can see how the way they praised me affected the way I view myself now.

[Dorian Gray]

54. Exactly

NY Mag often has a lot of annoying articles in it, but this one I was fascinated by!

And to reiterate, it said to praise for their effort. I wrote another post further down in the thread about the tests that they did and how kids tried to live up to expectations. (Hard worker v. smart.)

[SoCalDem]

20. Education is its own reward.

We have three very intelligent sons, but each chose his own way. All were tested for G.A.T.E.

The oldest hated school and was the classic underachiever (did not graduate:grr:.... but he's now a mid-six figure exec with 68 people "under him"... he found his own
niche"

The middle one (the one with a tested IQ of 168) dropped out as well and "works with his hands" and happily so. He called me one day to announce that HE had just hand-made a door that would be installed at San Simeon...

The youngest one graduated with top honors from his huge high school, was a classic over-achiever, lettered 4 years in soccer & football..could have gone to any college he wanted, but chose to study art in Florence Italy for a while.. He's now a contractor in business with his best friend, makes $6500 a month and works when he wants to..not when he HAS to..

All three were highly intelligent, and all three chose a different way..

Children should be allowed to follow their OWN dreams..and to KNOW they can..

[KitSileya]

21. One of the disturbing trends I have seen in my students,

is that they are so used to being praised for everything they do, that when they get to high school, they expect praise and extra credit for doing things that for us, 13-15 years their senior, was non-remarkable, something we took for granted. Like homework, for example, which for us was something we did as a matter of course, and we felt ashamed if we hadn't, but we didn't expect extra praise for doing it. Nowadays, my students have no compunction about admitting they haven't done their homework, and if they have, it's all 'look at me, I actually did my homework, I deserve a gold star.'

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

26. I heard this from one company's head of HR

She heads up HR for a division of a large company based in NYC. She says that people in their 20s expect constant praise for just doing their jobs, and come to her with complaints if their supervisors don't provide it. They also expect their average performances will be rewarded with the salary increases and promotions that only an outstanding performance earns. When one young man did not get promoted to an open position, his mother called HR to complain. His mother. The man, a 24-year-old, was mortified when he was informed. Talk about doing more harm than good.

[KitSileya]

44. Oh, poor man.

But I am of the firm belief that it is not the kids who are at fault, it is their parents, grandparents, and teachers. They didn't turn out this way on their own - this is a distinct lack of proper upbringing. And I'm not talking about proper as in no sex. For a society to prosper and advance, a majority of each generation needs to learn certain things, such as self-confidence, work ethic, compassion, and a willingness to work to get what they want. Thoday's parent and grandparent generations get the kids and grandkids they deserve. Today's kids will get a rather dismal society when they grow up, unless something drastic happens.

[Dorian Gray]

56. His MOTHER called?

That's hysterical. And somehow, not all that surprising.

There are a lot of over-protected kids....

[BluePatriot]

30. My supervisor is this way

We're both young (I'm 23, she's 25) and she keeps praising me for things that take no effort for me to do. I want to grab and shake her sometimes and tell her this isn't kindergarten, and that I'd prefer as a reward more meaningful work. I even have a memo with a star sticker on it...It has the effect of making me first depressed, then indifferent, then I found I am having no desire to try anything harder as the current low standard seems acceptable to everyone and dues-paying for 3 to 5 years even if you are obviously bright and can do more must just be expected, so why bother. Bleh. I should get back to my data entry now.

[KitSileya]

47. That is the sad thing about it.

When people get things too easily (and here I mean things as in non-essential things) they don't appreciate them. I was born in 1975, so I'm not a whole lot older than you, nor than my students, but I can see that a lot has changed in 10 years.

My parents weren't poor, but we didn't swim in money either. We got a wake-up call when my parents divorced when I was 16, and we became, not poor, but we had little money for extras, even if my mom managed to scrape together enough money for me to go on a school trip to Italy, for example. My mom influenced all us kids a lot, and we're all three of us careful about money. We are also careful about work - Norway has wonderful labor laws, but some people do exploit them, and that is anathema in my family (we're union reps nearly all of us). You work, and you do your share - but as you point out, it's no fun when you don't have to stretch to achieve and to become better.

I'm a teacher, and I have a really hard time motivating some of my students - some don't see the need, they can always end up on disability, and get money for doing nothing. Others have never succeeded, and now do everything to avoid doing anything because that might mean they will fail again. It's very frustrating.

Oh dear, I am rambling, aren't I? I guess I can blame my aching foot and the pain meds.

[Divernan]

22. Your heading should be "The WRONG kind of praise screws kids up."

It certainly isn't praise per se.

[SharonAnn]

33. Praise for accomplishing something is the right kind of praise. Phony praise is not.

When kids get praised for no reason, they just "roll their eyes". What's meaningful is praise for something they've accomplished.

Even if they didn't get an "A" on the exam, maybe they did a good job of studying and preparing for it. Maybe they learned more about what the teacher expects so that they can take that knowledge and prepare better for the next test.

Maybe they're not the best athlete but they practice regularly and give it all they've got. Maybe they encourage their team mates and help them play better.

I'm teaching a ballroom dancing class with a male friend who's an excellent dancer. He's never worked with kids and is very analytical about how he teaches this. He'd have them sit and listen while he explained things forever. But he's the good dancer and has done a great job on developing the syllabus. I'm the one who's got the kids up trying steps, working with them one on one, smiling and laughing with them, going through the routine over and over, and when they "get it" I acknowledge it with excitement. "That's it" You've got it" "See, it just takes that darned practice, practice, practice." Some are obviously better than others but there things to compliment them on. For one young lady who's having a hard time being coordinated, I compliment her on "sticking with it". And when her mother picks her up I make sure and tell her mother what a good student she is and how much I appreciate her commitment.

And, BTW, I praise my friend a lot, too and tell him how much the kids are watching everything he does and trying to learn. He can't always see it while he's demonstrating or practicing with one of the students, but he just loves hearing how much they're watching him and trying to emulate him.

The real key is, I think, find something "real" to praise. Not just meaningless praise because I think that's disheartening.

[TahitiNut]

37. It's been known for a long, long time that (for BOTH children and adults) ...

... there must be a positive correlation between the praise given and the person's own perceptions of the degree of accomplishment. When people are lauded for something that required little of their effort and an accomplishment in which they invested a great deal of effort goes unrecognized they tend to dismiss the judgment of others. If this is a repeated experience over the longer term, they lose respect for any authority and engage in activities with the intent to deceive rather than accomplish tangible results.

Thus, when counseling or nurturing, either as a parent or teacher or manager, the most important first step is to ascertain the individual's OWN honest opinion of their accomplishment. For children, the development of productive self-assessment skills is a critical component of healthy self-esteem.

[Beetwasher]

57. Insightful And Lucid Post

Per usual. :thumbsup:

[seabeyond]

24. how about if the kid is smart. do we pretend they are not

actually i just raise the expectation to all 100%. if smart enough to get easy A's why miss one. doesn't make sense to me, wink. then i find out son was getting 102, 105, 104 on tests so boom.... not satisfied with the hundred, i now want 105%. no one is going to fool my son he isn't smart, he knows better, smart enough to figure it out. but.... there is a sense to it in that they are already feeling good about their smart, no one can take it away so who cares if it is a B, not indicative of brain power.

[CJCRANE]

25. I think high expectations can be a burden.

My parents always praised me and expected me to be a high-achiever, as a result even though I have a reasonable amount of success in life I never felt I was good enough.

So, I think it's important for parents to praise their kids but also to make sure they know they will be loved whatever job they do, whether they are considered a "success" or not.

[BluePatriot]

28. Hm.

I think there's a desire to figure out why some kids that test off the scale underachieve. I'm one of these as of late, as are my husband and several of his friends. There are varied reasons for this --

Hubby: years of isolation until HS being home schooled (tradeoff: it's also preserved wonderful portions of his personality that got squelched out of me in public brainwashing...er...education) and then snoring through 4 years of high school due to them not letting him skip ahead due to home school not "counting," coupled with no one's ability to co-sign a college loan for him due to crappy credit and generally no peers that really care --

In my case, chronic health issues, awkward social skills, and incredibly low expectations the first few years in the workplace making me realize I've been overachieving for external validation all along and no one in the real world gives a crap and guess what, I'm not terribly internally driven anyway --

And, in friends' cases, simple lack of desire.

To me, blaming the parent seems convenient and lazy. They praised us a lot, in both ways, and seem confused as to how we are turning out, but it's not really their fault. IMHO, YMMV.

[brentspeak]

34. As opposed to having a parent do nothing but tell the kid they're going to be a "failure"?

[gollygee]

35. Five Reasons to Stop Saying "Good Job!" by Alfie Kohn

He's researched this issue and writes about it a lot.

http://www.alfiekohn.org/parenting/gj.htm


Hang out at a playground, visit a school, or show up at a child’s birthday party, and there’s one phrase you can count on hearing repeatedly: "Good job!" Even tiny infants are praised for smacking their hands together ("Good clapping!"). Many of us blurt out these judgments of our children to the point that it has become almost a verbal tic.

Plenty of books and articles advise us against relying on punishment, from spanking to forcible isolation ("time out"). Occasionally someone will even ask us to rethink the practice of bribing children with stickers or food. But you’ll have to look awfully hard to find a discouraging word about what is euphemistically called positive reinforcement.

Lest there be any misunderstanding, the point here is not to call into question the importance of supporting and encouraging children, the need to love them and hug them and help them feel good about themselves. Praise, however, is a different story entirely. Here's why.

(continues at link)

[marions ghost]

42. good article, thanks

There is a problem with overdoing praise, esp the type that teaches dependency. It's the constant value judgments from adults that keep kids in a state of insecurity about their ability to make decisions.

I can see this in the children of someone I know --the kids are in their late teens and early 20's but still feel they must have their parents constant input on everything, even minor purchases, clothes choices, activities. It's weird to me to see a 20-year old say she is unable to shop for her own clothes because she always make bad choices. She has no confidence because Mom and Dad have always been there, every waking second of her life, to instruct her. She has been allowed no room to make mistakes.

[JCMach1]

38. Praise should be given with a dose of realism!

Instead, they leave it up to us professors to pop the bubble of over-inflated expectations.

How many times have I heard, "But Sir, I was always brilliant in _________________."


Praise the good in children, but also work with them to recognize and perhaps overcome their shortcomings.

[clyrc]

39. Which can be more difficult than it sounds

Especially if the little dear's shortcomings are remarkably like your own... Like just about everything else in life, I find it hard to strike the right balance. I tell my oldest that being very smart doesn't excuse her from having to do the things that are difficult for her, like organizing her things so they aren't lost all the time. (A losing battle.) Every once in a while, I tell my youngest that I'm proud of her because she works so hard, but I don't know if I praise her enough. My dad never praised me at all, and my mom only did if I looked good, so I'm trying to figure this out for myself.

I don't want to encourage them to be arrogant, lacking in compassion young women, but neither do I want them constantly feeling "not good enough," which is pretty much my lot in life.

[JCMach1]

41. Not saying that you don't praise someone

just don't overkill!

[mondo joe]

45. I agree. Kids need to have their ability confirmed, but expectations set as well. NT

[rucky]

40. It's HOW you give praise that counts.

Praise is not an either/or. "Good Job" is pretty meaningless and unhelpful, but you can and should give kids evaluative praise often: "I like the way you..." is how I like to give it to my students, followed by whatever specific action they're doing well. Then I usually follow by issuing a challenge:

"I like the way you grouped the blocks by color, now try to sort them by size."

"This is great topic you chose for your paragraph, now find some specific details from the text."

"You did such a great job on the multiple choice section, I know you'll tear it up on the essay."

It's the small, specific successes that motivate kids to go to the next level. The population of kids I work with need that kind of motivation, and yes, they tend to sit on their laurels if you don't raise the bar - but it's not praise that's holding them back, it's low expectations. There's a difference.

[mainer]

43. Asian parents always say: "You can do better"

Maybe that's why they're super-students? Because they never QUITE please their parents?

[kineneb]

52. gee, sounds almost like my grandparents

I got praise if I did really well, and the "I think you could do better" lecture if not. Hmm, might also be a German cultural thing as well.

However... on dealing with gifted students who underachieve- I thought k-12 was absolutely boring, except for a few advanced classes, like mathematics and German. I really didn't care about the rest, and had poor grades as result. Prodding by my grandparents to improve my grades was useless. I loved college and excelled there. The pace in K-12 was simply too slow for me.

[dorkulon]

49. Hits close to home.

As I read this, I recognize myself as an over-praised, persistence-challenged person. Growing up, I was told over and over again by my parents and teachers how exceptionally smart I was, and it did indeed set up an almost crippling fear of not living up to the label. If you don't try, you can't fail. I see my family even now doing the same thing to the next generation.

Thanks for the thought-provoking link.

[LWolf]

50. Praise, like anything else,

is open to misuse and abuse. As is criticism.

The praise/criticize/bribe/punish methodology of cultural conditioning used universally (in some form) is inherently flawed, imo. Conditioning kids to expect external reward or punishment in response to their own choices removes intrinsic motivators and diminishes appreciation of or value for ways of thinking, doing, speaking, being for themselves. It's all about what good or bad thing you "get." This conditioning carried into adulthood helps make the human world the dysfunctional hell it is. In my opinion.

This author, Po Bronson, is not the only writer to note this phenomenon. There are many other sources. My personal preference is Alfie Kohn. His "Punished By Rewards" is a must-read for anyone raising, teaching, or building and creating systems to serve children. Again, imo.

:hi:

[lonestarnot]

51. Giving a child the knowledge that brain cells regenerate and that

new connections grow with each progression in acquired knowledge is more helpful than telling them they are "smart." If they perform poorly in say math, and they keep striving to "get it," guess what, they will! Scientific fact. The brain makes new connections if one continues to give it a workout.

[B Calm]

55. Hell even dog trainers know better than this.

[Clark2008]

58. What utter bullshit.

The more I tell my son he's smart, the more he lives up to it.

I think these people want us to dumb down our kids some more.

[Nikia]

59. Sometimes, telling someone how smart or talented they are can sound like a threat

Especially combined with crticism.
Even if these things aren't explicitly said, I have "heard: people tell me "You are so smart, that if you don't get straight A's that you must not be trying hard enough." "You are such a talented runner that if you do not win these races, it is because you aren't pushing yourself enough." "The fact that you succeeded in the past, but aren't now means that you aren't trying hard enough or have somehow lost your former abilities."
I think that every smart child has a harder time emotionally than more average children when they encounter something that is hard for them because they aren't used to working hard at academic things.