IF YOU WANT TO SEE WHAT TORTURE LOOKS LIKE...

[WilliamPitt]

Watch this, and send it to your friends, congressfolk, and/or whomever would benefit from a dose of truth:

Waiting for the Guards
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZ1NYizv2sw

Warning: Graphic

[ourbluenation]

1. makes me physically ill. n/t

[Disturbed]

2. There are thousands of methods of Torture.

Some methods even seem benign. I strongly suspect that the Busholini Regime has green lighted more than they have admitted to.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_torture_methods_and_devices

[Blashyrkh]

3. I have read most of those. Humans can be a creative bunch.

[defendandprotect]

4. Not looking--! But the Vatican Crusades set precedent for brutality . . .

and evil with their tortures ---

According to Will & Mary Durant . . . "It was a moral step backwards for humanity."

I don't know that they've yet been exceeded?

There is a lot of info on internet re those Vatican torture ---

[Joe for Clark]

9. Don't do that -

That was some centuries ago - hopefully we catholics learned something.

Pitt - you are wrong about this - What is torture in the end??

If I was going to blow up your town - kill everybody in it - what is the importance of just picking you out for such treatment?? Even if it killed you.

Not a lot is it??

This is about what the United States stands for - not that we haven't committed atrocities - we have - just that we learned to know better now.

What does total war mean in the end? Nobody agrees you know. It is sad to me.

But we are the United States - we stand for so much to so many people.

The deal is - it means something to us - enough to be better. We learned better. I really think that is the premise we need to start from. There are 7 paradigms to war -we are that last paradigm. The next time something approaches total war - we die. You really think soldiers are in jeopardy here - it is all of us.

I think this is that serious. For a lot of reasons.

Joe

[Yukari Yakumo]

11. ...

This is about what the United States stands for - not that we haven't committed atrocities - we have - just that we learned to know better now.

Can we be sure that still is true? With the Chimpenfurher in control?

[Joe for Clark]

14. He is not in charge of anything - WE ARE!!

Joe

[defendandprotect]

20. Don't do what? You have to consider our gene pool . .

and the gene pool which gave us the Crusades -- the genocide against the native American ---

the enslavement of the African in America --- the patriarchal war on women which continues even now

-- THAT gene pool is still with us.


Further, as Catholics --- and I'm a recovering Catholic --- you may have learned something about Crusades and torture . . . but then there was still 2,000 years of sexual abuse in the church to catch up with!

It's not so much what Catholics may think they have learned ---
it may be more about what we now understand of humanity and the possibilities for this kind of shit!!!

[defendandprotect]

21. Asking people what they "think" is meaningless . . . telling them that they have the . . .

possibility of being waterboarded or having their fingernails pulled out ---

maybe when they're in a group of 1,000 and you're going to torture ever 60th person?

Then let's hear what they think of torture ....

[Joe for Clark]

24. Kind of 12th century - don't you think??

Joe

[defendandprotect]

27. Vatican --- ??? I think they're back to the Fifth Century .. . !!!

[Yukari Yakumo]

10. Don't give the Chimpenfurher any ideas! {nt}

uguu

[Flabbergasted]

5. It would be astonishing to watch the national debate change....

if this were to be aired in an advertising campaign on mainstream media.

[Rex]

6. Sent

That is no way to treat a human being. So now we are no better than crime organizations. Great. We torture. :eyes:

[blondeatlast]

7. I couldn't get past the opening. Great find, Will. K&R. nt

[jkshaw]

16. You should have carried on until the ending ...

which was indescribably shocking and cowardly. I can understand why people don't want to see this sort of thing, but it's there, it's being done all over the world, that and much worse. It SHOULDN'T be done by Americans. What can we do except march and write letters and day-dream of seeing all the self-righteous and deluded pro-torturers behind bars?

"Blow Daddy a kiss," indeed. Did he think that would wash away his self-disgust?

[spanone]

8. watched it.....i can't assimilate much more outrage

it's hard to fathom the rationale

[bridgit]

12. "Go to the window...and blow daddy a kiss."

:thumbsdown:

[Kajsa]

13. I'm way too squeamish to watch.

Oversensitivity is a bitch, sometimes.

But a good K&R is coming.

:kick:

[blondeatlast]

26. I felt the same. I'm so suggestive I'd have nightmares for weeks,

maybe months.

I'll read some of the comments, try to brace myself, and try it again, but I don't think I can take it after that, either.

[Kajsa]

30. I think a number of us feel that way.

:hi:

[Az]

15. Why have we not thrown our bodies in the gears of this twisted machine we have become

What have we become that we allow this in our name?

[razors edge]

19. This is not in our name.

This is a perversion carried out by a "Few Bad Apples", they just happen to hold the Nukular Football today.

What I find unusual is that the Marines did not teach me about water boarding, they did teach me a few other things that were quite gruesome and inflicted permanent damage to the body. Lucky for me I never had the unfortunate decision of becoming a mad man placed before me, I fixed planes.

Torture is as old as mankind, it is deplorable and it serves only one real purpose, that is to discourage anyone who has not been rounded up as an enemy of the state, or church, to shut the fuck up and sit down.

It has worked rather well at that, wouldn't you say?

[defendandprotect]

23. Probably pre-Bush Geneva Accords were in play ---

but I disagree . . .

I think we have to find some way to stop our government's fascistic methods ---

it is our government ---!!!

[razors edge]

28. It has never been our government.

It has been the government of the wealthy, the big land owners, the slave holders, the bankers, the military industrial complex, but never the government of the people. I wish it had been, or would be different, but it is not.

I will not accept responsibility for actions taken by those who do not respect the law. The rest of the world does not hate us the way they hate our so called leaders, there is a reason for that, they realize we don't have recourse to the law.

We don't own the politicians, the courts, or the press, someone else does.

I'm getting tired of flinging myself against some mad bugger's wall. Even when we win we lose, since actual change is "off the table".

[defendandprotect]

22. I agree --- isn't it FASCISM when our government is torturing people --- ????

[emilyg]

17. Will not watch - Kick

[MuseRider]

18. Can't watch

won't watch. Things like this never leave and I just can't deal with it. Minor nastiness bothers me so...

Thanks for posting though. Those that can live with it stored in their memory will pass it along to others and perhaps it will change some minds.

[derby378]

25. Feh. Amateurs.

I've seen worse. Like the pictures at Tuol Sleng, for example.

But yes, this much is bad enough as it is.

[WilliamPitt]

29. .

Sorry.

[WilliamPitt]

31. .

[spanone]

32. it doesn't matter anymore....we torture.

[cali]

33. no. wrong. it matters more than ever.

And it's more out in the open than ever. it's certainly not time to say "it doesn't matter".

[WilliamPitt]

34. One last