Kucinich: "I Hope That You're Going To Talk About More Than A Tongue Stud"

[Hissyspit]

November 2, 2007, 11:29 AM
Kucinich: "I Hope That You're Going To Talk About More Than A Tongue Stud."
Posted by Brian Montopoli|

VIDEO AT LINK

This morning, Democratic presidential hopeful Dennis Kucinich and his wife, Elizabeth, appeared on the CBS "Early Show." And the Ohio Representative seemed none too happy when anchor Hannah Storm brought up his wife's age, beauty, and jewelry. Here's a portion of the transcript:

Hannah Storm: You have a core group of supporters for your political views, but a lot of people (are) talking about your wife and the fact that she's over three decades younger and she statuesque and beautiful and has a pierced tongue. What do you make of the attention on her?

Dennis Kucinich: Well, the most important thing I would tell you, Hannah, as a professional, is it's important not to trivialize a woman who has worked on international humanitarian matters, you know, helping people in Africa get access to energy and to housing and education, helping poor people and children in India, working with a group connected with Mother Teresa, working with the Mission To Seafarers in London. Here's a woman of great accomplishment with a Master's degree in international conflict resolution, and I hope that you're going to talk about more than a tongue stud.

After Storm asked Elizabeth Kucinich what she would bring to the White House, the "Early Show" anchor returned to the topic.

Hannah Storm: I know that your husband doesn't want to focus on your tongue ring, but you do have one, correct?

Elizabeth Kucinich: I do.

Hannah Storm: And would you remove it if you became first lady or leave it in?

Elizabeth Kucinich: It's part of me now. It's been there ten years, so --

Hannah Storm: Can we see it?

Elizabeth Kucinich: No, you can't. Sorry.

Dennis Kucinich: That's my privilege.

Check out the video for the full effect. It's not quite as tense as it seems when you read it – during that last exchange, it's worth noting, all three are laughing.

Still, things stayed interesting until the end. After Elizabeth Kucinich pointed out that Dennis is "polling fourth now" and Dennis added, "when I get to third place, everything changes," Storm responded: "When you get to third place, or you meet with Ahmadinejad, we'll have you back."

To which Dennis Kucinich responded, one finger in the air: "You know, remember you said that."

[EVDebs]

1. Storm was LUCKY to have the interview; The Early Show is in the tank 3rd in ratings

http://www.medialifemagazine.com/news2004/june04/jun01/5_fri/news3friday.html

[gateley]

18. Out of curiosity, how did it become known that she has a tongue stud? nt

[cyclezealot]

44. that is what motivates the media

being third. makes them go for sensationalism. Not news. This story is not a surprise The sorry state of our media.

[SoFlaJet]

2. She's a hot redhead

with a tongue stud...damn DK-good move

[noamnety]

3. repeating this part

"it's important not to trivialize a woman ... "

some days I hate this forum for all its sexist crap.

[SoFlaJet]

7. Whoa

Lighten up Francis-she's a sexy lady what's wrong wrong with a guy noticing that?

[tkmorris]

10. I'm with lwfern

A major thesis of the OP was that here you have a woman who is married to a presidential candidate, who has a list of accomplishments as long as your arm, and all anyone wants to talk about is her appearance and her tongue jewelry.

And then you immediately check in with "Wow, she's hot". Are you really not seeing the point here?

[SoFlaJet]

34. I refuse to be scolded

for admiring a woman's beauty-get over yourselves-really. I'm not talking about her accomplishments I'm talking about her being a beautiful (I was gonna say hot) lady. I'm sorry if it bugs you-maybe you should ask yourself why.

[Poll_Blind]

4. She's also a really cool _person_. Read up about her as a _person_ and....

...you'll find out why she loves Dennis. Not everyone who is socially conscious, willing to help the world, get a degree in international conflict resolution has to look like Golda Mier!

PB

[Disturbed]

5. After the silly interviewer started talking about the trivial again

I would have left. That would have received more coverage, plus made a point.

[LWolf]

16. She is an amazing woman.

And she'd make an incredible first lady.

[symbolman]

21. I agree, great catch k!

There's nothing sexist about admiring a hot, intelligent woman, I'm sure Dennis thinks the same thing.

Nothing sexist about being MALE either, it's NOT a Congenital "Defect" though some may try to make it sound that way.

It gets Old.

[noamnety]

24. Problems in your post

Nobody has said there's a problem with you personally admiring a woman you find attractive. Being attracted to people is not sexist; pretending that is the complaint is distorting the issue.

The problem is that people in this culture routinely feel the need to divert conversation after conversation about women into a discussion of whether they find them sexually attractive, whether they are too sexually attractive, what they should do to be more sexually attractive. So Elizabeth cannot be discussed without some helpful DUer letting us know if he would "do" her. It's demeaning, and it's related to how men bond, by discussing women as if they are pieces of meat on display for male (virtual) consumption, and they (the men) are the judges.

If you find her attractive or not is your own business, and that's not a congenital defect; nobody has claimed it is. When men (and the women here join in as well, in their own special way - please see the fashion police threads) feel the need to divert conversations about women into a discussion and display of their sexual feelings and opinions toward those women, the result is that it reinforces existing power structures, existing attitudes about what women are primarily valued for, existing oppressive attitudes about what women are "supposed" to look like, etc.

I understand that you don't see how your public comments reducing a woman to a potential sex object contributes toward attitudes that women exist for the sexual gratification of men, or how that relates to why women are devalued in our culture in every other role. But it doesn't take a lot of critical thought to see that connection, really.

It's kind of like if you made a point of telling us publicly here that some immigrant you saw was peeing in the street (as some other DUers have done in the past), it's silly to pretend that's not contributing to harmful stereotypes of immigrants. It's not racist to see someone peeing in the street. It's not racist to know the person, and to know their immigration status. It's not racist to be offended by that sight. But once you decide to post about it on a public message board, once you start making it a part of discussions about immigrants, that step to incorporate it into public discourse changes the nature of it considerably, and it becomes a racist action, which upholds certain power structures. And that always comes at the expense of oppressing others - even those immigrants whom you aren't even talking about when you relay that one tale about one person.

[druidity33]

32. great post

I'd rec it if i could.

I think you just summed up my Women's Studies 101 class pretty well...

:)

[mitchum]

36. Hell, that summed up the entire Women's Studies program (n/t)

[symbolman]

33. Utterly ridiculous, sorry but attractive makes the world go round

Good looking and intelligent people of both sexes are Valued, if for no other reason then their genetic material alone - we aspire as a race to create better people.. Not saying that there aren't plenty of Bimbos and Mimbos out there..

We will Never "rise above" our allegedly baser instinct, to make the best humans we can..

We are ALL pieces of meat. Sorry that people are threatened by a good looking woman with brains, but it appears to me that the most threatened seem to be those that have to bring up the subject of women being pieces of meat, while disregarding the REALITIES of interaction between Men and Women..

Again, it gets old.. So will those same people defend Kucinic for being but ugly, but a wonderful, intelligent person?

Also, sorry, but your examples are a mighty long reach in your post, nearly patently absurd.

All men are not pigs, most are nice guys, but all DO obey the Biological Imperative and all the handwringing in the world isn't going to change it one iota. :)

[noamnety]

37. I think you're arguing a point that wasn't made by anyone here.

I haven't seen anyone in this thread talk about feeling threatened by a good looking woman with brains. Did you make that up? Are you referring to some other thread I haven't read? I don't know.

And nobody has threatened your "baser instinct" as you put it, to be attracted to particular women.

What I've suggested is that by CHOOSING to make it part of your discourse - which is a decision, not uncontrollable biological imperative, you are contributing toward a culture where women are DEVALUED for their achievements, and valued as sex objects for men - which is exactly what the interviewer was doing as well. Did you at least recognize that the interviewer was doing that?

The backslapping behavior your previous post here engaged in - cheering on another guy for publicly stating that she's sexually attractive (rather than focusing on her achievements) serves to promote the idea that publicly rating women as sex objects is a desirable thing, a thing that you personally are encouraging, even when the women are presenting themselves as professionals. This serves to reinforce men's position in the world as professionals, and women's position in the world as not-so-much professionals. This is how it reinforces the dominant position that men hold in the world.

Get it now?

[symbolman]

38. No actually

I think you are the one that doesn't get it. I believe you just hate men, especially any one that doesn't agree with a stunted view..
first of all it was You that volunteered extraneous info, with overly erudite droppings. Next, and it us made readily apparent in the last few posts, TWIST people's words ie inferring that *I* have or exhibit those baser instincts, nice shift, but it doesn't fly to anyone with brains paying attention.

You've touched on none of my points, only further insulting both me, and the other poster, painting us as high fiving sub humans.

Why not come clean for once and admit you hate men, at least most of them?

To the point where you can no longer converse with them, and only attack, with a slash and burn agenda.

I've tried very hard not to put you on ignore as you have in the past made some points, but now you just insult, histronically, and the twisting, straw men,as well as Red Herrings are beginning to smell.. You even in the first post invited your "posse" to jump in, a lynch mob from some of what I've seen.

Good, kind decent PEOPLE, yes, MEN, are likened to animals right here on the DU by YOU, under the premise of NOT treating PEOPLE, yes, Women, DECENT.....

People living in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

[noamnety]

39. I think I give men more credit than you do.

You're the one blaming men's baser instincts, as if they can't control their own actions. I actually think you (and other DUers) CAN control your words on this forum and make a conscious decision not to use the forum here to rate women as sex objects.

Calling out sexism when it's on display here is not man-hating. It's sexism-hating. There's a difference.

[symbolman]

40. It was not "Blaming" - that's something you made up

It was Celebrating the Difference, Reveling in the Glory of it, makes Life a Beautiful thing.

I was agreeing with the poster because it makes people HAPPY.. The poster, Kucinic, his wife and I are Not wrong.

You DO know that the ball on her tongue isn't just for decoration, don't you? It's there to show how much she cherishes her husband..

[noamnety]

47. lol

"It's there to show how much she cherishes her husband."

How many years has she had the tongue ring?
How many years have they been married?
How many years have they known each other?

[symbolman]

50. Can't fathom it?

HOW Many Men is she Married to?

A dirty mind knows Everything, that's what my mom used to say..

[Norrin Radd]

41. Men are also rated as sex objects on this forum.

[noamnety]

49. not to the same extent, but yes.

That's more the exception than the rule. I remember a photo of a young howard dean, for instance, that some of the people here went on about briefly, but I don't think that overshadowed every conversation about his achievements or political opinions in the same way.

More importantly, in a larger cultural sense, it's not contributing to a cycle of violence and poverty among men. Personally, I've made an effort not to do that and I wish others would as well. But I recognize it isn't part of a systemic oppression of men that harms their ability to get jobs, to earn a decent salary, to be listened to during business meetings, etc.

Bush mocking Katrina victims is not equivalent to Katrina victims mocking Bush. One reinforces dominant classes of people, the other challenges it.

Rating men as sex objects isn't a way I think we should be challenging the power structure - the point should be for women to be taken seriously as professionals, not to try to reduce men to the levels of contempt that women are held in professionally. It's wrong for a subset of the same reasons rating women is wrong. It doesn't happen on a level that keeps men in poverty and treated as second class citizens in our culture. The majority of conversations here about men relate to their achievements, political opinions, and so forth here, while the majority of conversations about women relate to their bodies as women. That's a reflection of the world at large.

Here's a prime example: A commentator discusses the carlysle group, terrorist vs freedom fighter, the hilarity of o'reilly, hannity, etc., MoveOn as distraction from Patreaus report, the complicity of the mainstream media, the dishonesty of whitehouse spokesmen, the reason for the war is lining some folks pockets, and blackwater and mercenaries. Those are all issues that should interest DUers, right? Check out the discussion about the video clip: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=385&topic_id=56954

[treestar]

46. That's pretty good

Really a good description and thank you for pointing out the distraction.

Men get it too, specifically Dennis, he's too short to be president, you know. :sarcasm:

[JBoy]

6. A sad commentary on what passes for journalism

News person hoping, praying to get the big scoop: a look at a woman's tongue ring. :thumbsdown:

[Cleita]

8. For what it's worth, focusing on the age difference is trite.

My mother and father were twenty-five years apart in age difference. They were happily married for thirty five years until the day my father died. My mother never remarried although she was still very attractive and young looking. She died five years after being widowed. I believe she wanted to be with him.

[Joe Chi Minh]

9. Sarkozy! Sarkozy! Wherefore art thou Sarkozy? Nice is nice, but

not as nice as press-corps blood in the water. Go get 'em Nick!

[Chulanowa]

11. Nice hitback, Dennis!

Hannah Storm: Can we see it?

Elizabeth Kucinich: No, you can't. Sorry.

Dennis Kucinich: That's my privilege.

Jeeze. People just expecting the lady to stick her tongue out for everyone to gawk at. As if she eats lightbulbs and hammers nails up her nose or something. Scavengers.

[Hoof Hearted]

19. Actually, I don't get his response there. Like he owns her tongue?

Why is her tongue HIS privilege alone to see? Am I missing something?

[Der Blaue Engel]

20. And I'm sure he's the only one who gets to see her naked, too

I don't think that means he thinks he owns any part of her, just that it's a rather intimate thing for some gasbag talking head to ask to see. I think we all get the implications of a tongue stud, don't we?

[TahitiNut]

25. You might note he called it a privilege, not an entitlement.

:shrug: Words have meaning.

[NMMNG]

35. Sort of like your spouse/partner is the only one who gets to see you naked

It's privilege, not ownership. She extends it to him, he doesn't take it.

[OzarkDem]

12. WTF???

What is wrong with these reporters? That's the most insulting, ignorant performance by a talking head I've seen in a long time.

Dennis and Elizabeth should have told her to go to hell.

[Warren Stupidity]

13. That "interview" is why I try to not watch the false noise

I was ready to throw something through the tv to try and hit Hannah Assholla or whatever her name is, on the off chance it would knock some sense into her.

[MethuenProgressive]

14. She was funny on the Daily Show's FLILF skit.

And she hardly said a word.

it's important not to trivialize a woman who has worked on international humanitarian matters, you know, helping people in Africa get access to energy and to housing and education, helping poor people and children in India, working with a group connected with Mother Teresa, working with the Mission To Seafarers in London. Here's a woman of great accomplishment with a Master's degree in international conflict resolution, and I hope that you're going to talk about more than a tongue stud

Well done, Dennis.

[hootinholler]

15. Video here.

Link to story video on page

-Hoot

[MUSTANG_2004]

26. That's why I like CSPAN

They take it more seriously. If given 30 minutes to interview a candidate, they ask serious questions that will help viewer decide where a candidate stands on issues, and why.

[Telly Savalas]

17. In Storm's defence

asking Elizabeth Kucinich to show her tongue ring maintains a higher level of political discourse than you'll ever see on "Meet the Press" and shows more traits of investigative journalism than you'll ever see on CNN.

[baseballhead]

22. I can't believe

that journalist asked her about her tongue ring. That is so tacky.

[B Calm]

23. The last thing the corporate owned press wants to do is to cast

Dennis Kucinich as a serious contender for president!

[2rth2pwr]

27. Wow, She is Hot!

Why won't she show her tongue?

[GETPLANING]

28. She would make a fine First Lady

In fact, ANY of the Democratic candidate's wives would.

[fujiyama]

29. Kucinich said it well

Elizabeth is an attractive woman - and very intelligent and accomplished as well.

It's pathetic that this "journalist" would waste time talking about a tongue ring. Pathetic. I hate this superficial stuff. I mean, isn't it possible to at least treat them both with professional respect, regardless of his standing in the polls?

[Forkboy]

30. With Elizabeth's personality she'd be beautiful no matter how she looked.

[LTR]

31. The Early Show sucks ass

After the few times I watched it, I realized why they're in third place.

First was the infamous 9/11/01 broadcast, where Gumble was denying that a second plane had just hit, as the live video showed otherwise. Very embarassing.

Currently, it seems to serve merely as promotion for CBS prime time shows. The show and its newscasts are basically fluff. When they're not doing that, they're just aping the other morning shows, with stuff like live concerts (though they did have Steve Earle on a couple weeks ago, which was good). I'm surprised they even had the Kucinichs on, let along covered the presidential race.

Just a horrible, horrible show.

[Norrin Radd]

42. There's a stud on her tongue alright --

it's called "Dennis."

[Norrin Radd]

43. I think they are both hot.

Their accomplishments, their worldviews, and their personalities are so hot to me.

[LibDemAlways]

45. What's pathetic is that the corporate whores paid no

attention at all to Dennis...until they discovered his young, attractive wife with the pierced tongue...which in the juvenile media mind gives them an "angle" for a story...more about her than him.

[Evergreen Emerald]

48. He was awesome!

What a great response.

[Catherine Vincent]

51. Kick!

Excellent responses by poster "lwfern" mid thread.

:kick: