I haven't seen this question asked - Do you think any of our

[woodsprite]

Dem pres. possibilities would have said what Stark said and/or apologized for it afterward?

I think Biden and Dodd could have said something like that, I'm on the fence as to if they would have apologized or not.

Edwards - I don't know. I think he would have made a statement, but not in those words, WHICH may not have prompted the whole apology issue.

I don't think Kucinich would have apologized at all, and I do think he could have dealt such a speech.

Clinton and Obama - I don't think they would have been caught saying such a thing in the first place, and if they did, would they have been able to be coerced to apologize - I'm thinking yes, but I really don't know.

Gore - I know he could have dealt it and I think after all he's been through, he would have dealt it again come apology time.

I don't have any feelings about anybody else.

What do you all think?

[H2O Man]

1. I think that

Senator Biden has, perhaps more than once, said something that he has later had to re-word. His communication style is one of the things that I like about him.

[still_one]

3. This isn't the first time. Dick Durbin was also attacked for using a nazi comparison

a couple of years ago.

Funny, but they didn't say a word when santorum made a nazi parallel to Democratic actions

[still_one]

2. Can the Democrats win in 2008 without the left or progressive members of the party?

I will vote Democratic in 2008 ONLY BECAUSE OF THE SUPREME COURT

but, I really think the Democratic leaders in Congress are taking the progressive and the left for granted, and though they are most likely correct in that assumption, if they continue to demoralize that segment of the party, they may effectively dissuade them from even voting.

The only thing Stark should have done was change the words "the president's amusement", to the president's profit

[H2O Man]

4. Key question.

I've been calling various members of congress to express my concern that the party "leadership" is risking losing a significant portion of the progressive vote, because they appear far more focused on cuddling up to the conservatives than representing us. I know that some of them think that they have to appeal to those conservatives in order to win elections. Baloney. The only recent wins were the 2006 congressional elections, where progressives put a democratic majority into the House and Senate. The elections were about the war in Iraq, and the congress has betrayed us on that.

[still_one]

5. The truth is they will not get the conservative vote. You are right, 2006 was about the war

and that is not only a progressive issue, but also where America is trending, especially the independent voter.

The question is how can the Democratic nominee distinguish himself from the republican nominee on Iraq?

If a clear distinction cannot be drawn, then the 2008 election will be challenging

[H2O Man]

6. The progressive

democratic voters -- a group that today includes "traditional values" democrats -- is simply being taken for granted by the party "leadership." They believe that the majority of the subgroups have no option but to vote for a straight democratic ticket. They have not properly evaluated how progressives could, as individuals and subgroups, stay home rather than vote; vote for a democrats they support, but not vote in every contest; vote for some democrats, and some third party candidates; or simply vote for those third party candidates as a form of protest.

The truth is that the democratic party cannot win the majority of contests if the leadership betrays the grass roots progressives in the manner they have been since January.

[DeeDeeNY]

9. Well said

Whenever I get calls from Dem party for donations, I tell them I will not give anything for exactly the reasons you stated. Maybe if it hurts them financially, they will realize "playing it safe" does not work.

[still_one]

10. Somehow it is important they get the message /nt

[Enrique]

7. Kucinich is the least likely to have said what Stark said

he doesn't have that attacking personality

[ThomWV]

8. Apparently you haven't read Gore's book "The Assult On Reason"

In just a couple of hundred pages Al Gore (our once and future President) says it over and over and over.