Jonathan Alter says the GOP is trying to steal California in 08

[CatWoman]

A Red Play for The Golden State
There's some malicious mischief at play in efforts to reform our electoral system.

Jonathan Alter
I Know What You Did Last Summer

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Is California GOP Trying to Steal the 2008 Election?
By Jonathan Alter
Newsweek
Aug. 13, 2007 issue - Our way of electing presidents has always been fertile ground for mischief. But there's sensible mischief—toying with existing laws and the Constitution to reflect popular will—and then there's the other kind, which tries to rig admission to the Electoral College for strictly partisan purposes. Mischief-makers in California (Republicans) and North Carolina (Democrats) are at work on changes that would subvert the system for momentary advantage and—in ways the political world is only beginning to understand—dramatically increase the odds that a Republican will be elected president in 2008.

Right now, every state except Nebraska and Maine awards all of its electoral votes to the popular-vote winner in that state. So in mammoth California, John Kerry beat George W. Bush and won all 55 electoral votes, more than one fifth of the 270 necessary for election.

Instead of laboring in vain to turn California Red, a clever lawyer for the state Republican Party thought of a gimmicky shortcut. Thomas Hiltachk, who specializes in ballot referenda that try to fool people in the titles and fine print, is sponsoring a ballot initiative for the June 3, 2008, California primary (which now falls four months after the state's presidential primary). The Presidential Election Reform Act would award the state's electoral votes based on who wins each congressional district. Had this idea been in effect in 2004, Bush would have won 22 electoral votes from California, about the same number awarded the winners of states like Illinois or Pennsylvania. In practical terms, adopting the initiative would mean that the Democratic candidate would likely have to win both Ohio and Florida in 2008 (instead of one or the other) to be elected.

Hiltachk, who is lying low for now, is a former campaign lawyer for Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger. The governor's office says Schwarzenegger has no position on the initiative and "had absolutely nothing to do with its development." But whichever way Schwarzenegger goes, several GOP presidential candidates and their financial backers have already offered to help boost the plan. Just interested in good government? They've shown a curious lack of interest in backing the same idea in Red States.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20121791/site/newsweek/

[Elspeth]

1. This has got to be stopped

.

[SoCalDem]

2. Either way they "win"

republicans are great at getting dems on the defensive.. Now we will have to spend tons of money to defeat this lame proposition.

This is why legislation via proposition sucks..

It bypasses the elected legislators, and lets the people with deep pockets, elbow their way to the voters,,

[Mz Pip]

3. Maybe I'm overly optimistic

but I don't see this going anywhere here. Other than Ahnold, CA is very Blue. THe voters won't apporve this.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[SoonerPride]

5. Don't be too sure of that

They'll probably change the rules of how the vote in conducted or use Diebold machines for the tally.

You should be very worried about it.

[knight_of_the_star]

19. No they won't

The Secretary of State decertified all the touchscreen machines in California. They can't cheat on this one.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

7. You may be right about the voter sentiment, but

Opinions don't matter much in a low-turnout election. Getting "your" voters out will be the key to this one. If voter turn-out is low, that could favor the Republicans.

Unless there's also a big-draw proposition on the Jun 08 ballot, then the big turnout would seem to favor Democrats.

[OzarkDem]

11. I dunno, they elected Ahnold

they seem a little gullible, if you ask me.

[knight_of_the_star]

20. He didn't get the majority the first time

Keep that in mind before you dismiss people as gullible and honestly in his re-election the Dem running against Ahnuld ran a horrible campaign and deserved the loss he got.

[never cry wolf]

18. I dunno, from what I read this vote is referenda only

Maybe a few local candidates but in general very lightly attended. If they mobilize the repuke forces and the general public is unaware of the consequences it could go badly. The dems had better get this out in the open loudly!

[Hell Hath No Fury]

24. Voters can be fooled...

by the wording of these inititaives -- I was asked to sign the petition to get this monstrosity on the ballot and even I had to stop and really look at what they were asking.

Voter education on this proposition will be very badly needed!

[acmavm]

4. Wonder is this is just the first act of KKKarl's new job????

[BlooInBloo]

6. Not quite. It's certain to be defeated, but only AFTER the Democrats spend a bunch of $ on it....

... And trying to whittle away at our money lead is probably the real goal.

[K8-EEE]

10. It was sweet to defeat all of Arnie's last balllot initiatives

But DAMN are we just going to have to keep fighting these massive misinformation campaigns forever?? It DOES drain resources for the Dem candidates, as far as boots on the ground.

[Bitwit1234]

8. And God knows what they have planned for the rest of the country.

Do they have that big a majority in California that they could get this bill passed. Seems to me the democrats would stop them.

[K8-EEE]

9. Why don't WE do this then (in FL, NM, AZ, all "purple" states?)

I don't think they can win if more states do this; do they really think they can do it ONLY in CA? Even if it's successful in one election, how would they condone not having "fair" electoral division elsewhere?

[BlooInBloo]

12. Especially since we have oodles more $ than they do - we could probably....

... actually get one of them - lol!

You forgot Ohio on your list, btw. :)

[mikelgb]

13. Dems should pass this in FL and/or OH

[RDANGELO]

17. Texas.

Texas is their one big lock state. We have a chance to win Fla. or OH outright, especially Ohio.

[mikelgb]

23. good call

[RDANGELO]

14. How does this work in California.

If it passes on referendum, does it automatically become law?

[slackmaster]

21. Yes, then straight to court with implementation blocked pending a decision

That's how things are done here.

[Bjorn Against]

15. This is why the electoral college needs to be abolished completely

different states dividing their votes in different ways is just one more problem with an already antiquated system. The person who gets the most votes should win. Period. As it is now a person in the minority party in their state essentially does not get a vote for President because that vote will just be thrown out by the electoral college.

Dividing votes up in some states and having winner take all in other states that are voting for the exact same office is unfair and undemocratic. We don't need to divide electoral votes up, we need to scrap the entire electoral college system completely and go with a system which ensures the candidate that gets a majority of the votes wins(instant runoff voting comes into play here to ensure that there is indeed a candidate that gets the majority of the votes).

[EFerrari]

16. He means, they're *still* trying to steal CA for 08.

They've been at this for years now. :mad:

[suffragette]

25. Still is right.

And if this method doesn't work, they'll try something else.

Have to say this struck me the same way it did Jonathon. I posted about that here:http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1478879#1479036

As I said there, the line that stood out to me was "That's a number equal to winning Ohio."

[Hawaii Hiker]

22. This story has gotten under my skin in last few weeks:

I think I've commented on this story more than any one issue since I started posting here..

It is very troublesome, BUT, I can't imagine Democrats just sitting on their hands on this...Perhaps they'll have to spend alot of money to defeat it, perhaps they can tie it up in court, etc....Unless you change every state (and you know every state will NEVER be ready to split their electoral votes by election day 2008), this is can never work...

But this reform must be stopped, no fucking way can Democrats just let Republicans get 20 electoral votes....You don't need to be NBC's Tim Russert or Chuck Todd to know that Republicans will N-E-V-E-R win CA, so this is nothing but a plot to steal EV's...

I called the California Democratic Party (TWICE) & the lady didn't seem overly concerned....I wish some CA Democrats would address this story, & give their plan of action to defeat it...

:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: