FDR won WW 2 in 1,347 days. Bush is over that in one country and still losing

[msongs]

badly (any normal commander would declare victory and go home - no wmds or nukes, got rid of saddam, held elections, got a local government in charge - our part over, see ya).

Of course the US had lots of help from its allies in WW2. Still, with millions of American men and women in uniform against 3 axis enemies, FDR did something bush is incapable of doing - fighting a legitimate, honest, moral, and legal war and declaring victory.

Msongs
www.msongs.com

[illinoisprogressive]

1. FDR was beloved around the world and competent

[The_Casual_Observer]

2. The Vietnam War went on for 10+ years. I expect that this one will

go on for 20+, or until the oil is gone.

[ben_meyers]

3. FDR died before WW2 ended

But we firebombed German and Japanese civilian populations and Truman nuked 2 Japanese civilian cities to "win" a war that FDR let happen to pull the US economy out of the Repuke Calvin Coolidge's great depression. WW2 was based on money just as much as what Bush is doing for oil now. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

[Hippo_Tron]

4. Oh bullshit

Unlike Saddam Hussein, Hitler was actually a threat. If you don't believe it ask the people who were living in England, France, Poland, or hell most of Eastern Europe during World War II.

[lligrd]

5. Uh, Didn't Hitler DECLARE War On US?

And couldn't that declaration be believed since he was invading one country after another? Quite a big difference from what Saddam did, if you ask me.

[ben_meyers]

7. I ain't saying Hitler was a good guy

However
On September 11, 1941, the President of the United States publicly declared that he had ordered the American Navy and Air Force to shoot on sight at any German war vessel. In his speech of October 27, 1941, he once more expressly affirmed that this order was in force. Acting under this order, vessels of the American Navy, since early September 1941, have systematically attacked German naval forces. Thus, American destroyers, as for instance the Greer, the Kearney and the Reuben James, have opened fire on German sub-marines according to plan. The Secretary of the American Navy, Mr. Knox, himself confirmed that-American destroyers attacked German submarines.

Furthermore, the naval forces of the United States, under order of their Government and contrary to international law have treated and seized German merchant vessels on the high seas as enemy ships.

The German Government therefore establishes the following facts:

Although Germany on her part has strictly adhered to the rules of international law in her relations with the United States during every period of the present war, the Government of the United States from initial violations of neutrality has finally proceeded to open acts of war against Germany. The Government of the United States has thereby virtually created a state of war.

The German Government, consequently, discontinues diplomatic relations with the United States of America and declares that under these circumstances brought about by President Roosevelt Germany too, as from today, considers herself as being in a state of war with the United States of America.


Odd the Sept. 11 reference.

I don't know what the hell business it was of ours what was happening in Europe. Hitler was not a threat to us any more than Saddam was. Japan bombed Pearl Harbor, not Germany, and FDR allowed that to happen as well. The government knew it was comming and did nothing to stop it, much like 9-11.

[lligrd]

8. You Know, I Would Have Laughed At That Before

but after all that has happened, I no longer can. Can't I just keep some ignorance about the past? I liked thinking America was a good country.

[Oeditpus Rex]

9. Y'think maybe that order was given

because German U-boats were torpedoing Allied merchant ships transporting goods and machinery to Britain under the Lend-Lease Act?

Wow. Just... wow. :crazy:

[ben_meyers]

12. Of course it was

But lend-lease was a "back door" way for FDR to get us involved in a war in Europe that most of the people in America were opposed to. I know my parents weren't ready to pull Europes fat out of the fire again and many others in this country weren't either. This country had enough with WW1, the "WAR TO END ALL WARS". My point is that the OP is comparing Iraq with the "good war", WW2, there is no good, pure of motive war!

[Oeditpus Rex]

13. How many were opposed to it

once we got into it? Once the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor? Once the Holocaust and Bataan became common knowledge? The treatment of American POWs by the Japanese?

And please don't tell me FDR goaded the Japanese into attacking to prop up his reasons for going to war. That's so old and tired.

No war is "good," but a few are necessary.

[Thothmes]

14. War

Germany declared war on the United States as a result of our declaration of war on Japan. The Germans were acting in accordance with their mutual defense pact with Japan. It is normal for a country at that time to respond to a declaration of war with their own declaration of war.

[sweetheart]

6. true indeed

world war 2 was a global military takeover of the world via neo-corporatism, all to supress the socialist
rebellion that stirreth... to finally marx the public with the opiate of perpetual race wars of the stupid.

[Superman Returns]

10. but to be fair...

Bush's war was a catastrophic failure and blunder. However in WW2 it was "total war" Our aim was to unconditionally defeat our enemies by making them surrender to us. Iraq on the other hand is a "nation building" mission. There is no remaining capital to capture, no treaties left to sign. We are not trying to defeat Iraq but instead build it up by proping up a democratic regime in the country. We were always good at winning wars...just never good at winning the peace.

[pampango]

16. If you consider a war to be one nation's military against another's

the war in Iraq didn't last very long. It is a bit confusing because you hear the terms Iraq war and Iraq occupation used almost interchangeably for what is going on now.

Of course, there was an occupation of Germany and Japan for years after WW II ended. Heck, there are still US military bases in Germany and Okinawa. Of course, the occupations of Germany and Japan were much more, but not totally, peaceful than what is happening in Iraq.

[Oeditpus Rex]

11. Let's have some historical accuracy

I am NOT disagreeing with the gist of the OP; it's spot on, IMO.

But FDR did not win WWII, nor did America. The Allies did. Without Russia's tremendous campaigns in Stalingrad and along the Eastern Front, and without Britain's valorous beat-back of the Luftwaffe in the Battle of Britain — before America even entered the war — U.S. forces in Europe would've been squashed.

I hate this term since I spent so much of my working life talking to high school coaches, but it was indeed a team effort.

[Gruenemann]

15. FDR had help!

If it hadn't been for our Soviet allies, we'd have had a much harder time.