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How can Bush's mid-20's approval rating force Congress to submit us to illegal surveillance?

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seafan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 04:45 PM
Original message
How can Bush's mid-20's approval rating force Congress to submit us to illegal surveillance?
It likely involves blackmail, since Bush has been illegally spying since September, 2001. He has had 6 years to gather information illegally against his critics, and now he is using it against us.

Is impeachment still off the table, Ms. Pelosi?



Some important points in this article need to be highlighted:

New law expands power to wiretap

By Charlie Savage, Globe Staff
August 6, 2007


WASHINGTON -- President Bush signed a new law yesterday that expands the government's power to wiretap phone calls and e-mails on American soil without court oversight, capping a sudden victory for the White House despite loud criticism from advocates of civil liberties and privacy rights.
Just before midnight on Saturday, Congress passed the Protect America Act of 2007, which was largely drafted by the White House and received no committee hearing. The bill carves out a broad exemption from a 1978 law that requires the government to obtain a judge's permission to monitor calls and e-mails on US soil.
The new law allows the National Security Agency to spy freely on foreigners overseas when they communicate with Americans. It enables the NSA to resume a form of the once-secret warrantless wiretapping program that Bush launched after the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, and that ended when it was brought under court oversight last January.
The law also makes clear that the NSA does not need to obtain a judge's permission to monitor phone calls and e-mails if both parties are overseas, even if the communications happen to be routed through switching hubs on US soil.

.....

But privacy rights groups said the new law goes too far by allowing the NSA to evade warrant requirements for calls and e-mails involving Americans. They accused Democratic leaders of "spinelessness" in the face of Republican threats to blame them for any coming terrorist attack if they did not give the president the new power before leaving for their annual August recess.
"We are deeply disappointed that the president's tactics of fearmongering have once again forced Congress into submission," said Anthony Romero, executive director of the American Civil Liberties Union.

In two respects, the law grants the executive branch even broader warrantless wiretapping powers than the ones Bush said he had a right to exercise under his original program.
First, the law requires telecommunications companies to make their facilities available for government wiretaps, and it grants them immunity from lawsuits for complying. Under the old program, such companies participated only voluntarily -- and some were sued for allegedly violating their customers' privacy.
Second, Bush has said his original surveillance program was restricted to calls and e-mails involving a suspected terrorist, but the new law has no such limit.
Instead, it allows executive-branch agencies to conduct oversight-free surveillance of all international calls and e-mails, including those with Americans on the line, with the sole requirement that the intelligence-gathering is "directed at a person reasonably believed to be located outside the United States." There is no requirement that either caller be a suspected terrorist, spy, or criminal.


The law requires the government to delete any American's private information that it picks up, but it contains an exception allowing agents to maintain files of information about an American that has foreign intelligence value or that may be evidence of a crime.
As a check against abuse, the law requires Attorney General Alberto Gonzales and Michael McConnell, director of national intelligence, to design procedures for the program and to submit them for review by a secret national security court that normally approves warrant applications for intelligence-related wiretapping on US soil.
The court can reject the procedures only if it decides that the executive branch officials' plan for complying with the statute is "clearly erroneous." The program will be able to continue for a year, although the law will come up for renewal in six months. In any case, the warrantless eavesdropping can start immediately, even before the security court signs off on the procedures.

The debate over surveillance dates back to the weeks after the Sept. 11 attacks, when Bush signed a secret order authorizing the NSA to wiretap Americans' international e-mails and phone calls without a court order -- even though the 1978 warrant law prohibited it. Bush asserted that his wartime powers gave him an unwritten right to bypass such a law. ....... Legal specialists who have criticized the expansion of executive power during Bush's tenure compared the law to the Military Commissions Act of 2006, which expanded the White House's power over detainees in the war on terrorism, and the Iraq war authorization in 2002.
Both times, Bush abruptly urged Congress to give him greater national security powers shortly before lawmakers went on recess, warning that there was no time to wait. That strategy was echoed in the White House's sudden rush to enact the Protect America Act last week.

"The new bill shows that the Republican Party can get the Democrats to surrender almost any civil liberty -- indeed, to give the President just as much unchecked power as he might obtain under a Republican controlled Congress-- simply by playing the fear card repeatedly and without shame," wrote Yale law professor Jack Balkin on his blog.

.....




Two weeks ago, Alberto Gonzales was on the impeachment train. Today, he is in charge of wiretapping Americans, completely unchecked and unfettered.



We are in very serious trouble.
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ORDagnabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
1. 1 party for the most part run by corporations....
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
2. Friggin' amazing, ain't it?
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Timmy5835 Donating Member (325 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Did ya ever stop to think...........
Maybe the Dems want this power too? 2008 is not that far away.
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 07:35 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. Are you serious? They keep kissing bush**s ass and they won't ever
see the White House again.

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FiveGoodMen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 08:19 PM
Response to Reply #3
15. If the Dems want this power, too, then they ARE just like the Pukes.
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
4. Tyranny
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 04:53 PM
Response to Original message
5. Ed Henry was on Ed Schultz' show. He said he believed it was
because they were afraid if they said NO and there was an attack on US soil WHILE THEY WERE ON VACATION they'd certainly be blamed for not giving Shrub this tool! I don't know if he's right or not, but I can understand it.
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Hydra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
6. You know, blackmail is the easiest thing in the world to correct
I always said Clinton should have had wild sex multiple times on the oval office desk with Monica and anyone else they decided to send to him, and then said in public:

"Yes, I did indeed have wild sex with a 24yo intern...and it was GREAT! I didn't have anything to do with Flowers, though. She wasn't my type."

In cases of blackmail, it's best to just come out with it.We'll probably forgive our reps if it means they are freed to do some housecleaning, and actually do it.

C'mon guys! We know you have dirty laundry and closets full of skeletons- you're politicians! Dump that junk on the lawn so we can get moving with derailing bushco!
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billyoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 05:38 PM
Response to Original message
7. Bush is invincible with the terror card.
The Democrats have been outplayed by Rove. Thank God for term limits.
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OmmmSweetOmmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. If he was invicible his poll numbers wouldn't be in the dumper. Everytime he opens
his frigging mouth it's been 9/11, terra terra terra, 9/11.

Americans have woken up to that bullshit. The Democrats were given the go ahead in November to exert their strength and I'm sorry, I can't buy it that Shrub and his terror rhetoric had them cowed.
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Bumblebee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #10
16. "Terra" is the only area where he still has an an advantage over the Dems
and they know it. In the NBC/WSJ poll, for example -- see the front page of

http://www.pollingreport.com/

It's 21/33

(I stand corrected. Actually the GOP has an advantage in Moral Values as well, but a smaller one, 23/28).

They WERE cowed. I note that the WP editorial has a different title on its front web page that the actual editorial. It reads:

Editorial: Those Cowardly Democrats

http://www.washingtonpost.com/

It is a double standard. I do not remember anything like "Those Unscrupulous Republicans" in the WP ever but here you have it. That's the price we are all paying now for what they did last week.
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Hydra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. No way
"Terra terra terra!" Isn't working anymore.

I can almost picture Rove, Cheney and Rumsfeld sipping whiskey in one of their mansions.

"This isn't working anymore, Gentlemen," Rumsfeld grumbles. "The propaganda has run it's course. We need a new wedge."

Cheney nods, gritting his teeth. "You're right. We need another terror attack. Fresh blood and outrage will give us the votes we need to continue our plans...why are you shaking you head, Karl?"

Rove stares at his drink contemplatively. "It's too risky," he says finally. "The public knows we need this, and our idiot compatriots have been crowing about the next attack in Congress. It has to be done perfectly...it has to be completely out of the blue, and no suspicion can fall on us."

Cheney glowers. "This kid-gloves management style is driving me nuts! We should be telling them what to do and sending the troops out top make them!"

Rove nods placidly, but makes a negating gesture with his hand. "I understand your frustration, but I told you this would be easier in the end. Cleaner. More profitable for us. That's worth pretending that our puppet really calls the shots, isn't it?" Cheney visibly relaxes. "I thought so. Now isn't a good time for us to attack again, but perhaps in a few months...we can even lower the alert level a bit....yes. Perhaps in October, when they're trying to shut down our little war..."
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MissWaverly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 08:15 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Nope, Iraq is going down the tubes
it will be the fiasco to end all fiascos, esp. when we are winning right up until an Iraqi collapse occurs, and the country
will be in a Katrina like mood and will be in no mood for more photo ops from the guy in a helicopter.
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 05:44 PM
Response to Original message
8. More than 50% of the dollars in the U.S. "approve" of Smirk & Sneer.
Edited on Mon Aug-06-07 05:45 PM by TahitiNut
One dollar, one vote. It's the best government money can buy. :puke:

(The dollar ain't worth as much as it used to be.)
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
11. oh please
this is ridiculous. They have been complicit for the last fucking six years. :mad:
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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-06-07 08:05 PM
Response to Original message
13. No comment.
The answer is simple.
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farmboxer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-07-07 12:07 AM
Response to Original message
17. Polls meant nothing to Hitler, and they mean nothing to Hitler,Jr.
Voters mean nothing, it's all about the money.
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Kool Kitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-07-07 12:22 AM
Response to Original message
18. Maybe this is a stupid question but-
if the Dems got a briefing or were shown evidence of an impending attack and that was why they voted the way they did, when are they going to clue US in on it? Don't we have the right to know what is going on? Is it okay for people to die, and them to play catch-up and then defend us? Does this show real interest in looking out for our welfare, or as President Pinhead is so fond of saying, "My job is keeping the people of America safe"? (Not that I believe that we are in danger, except from this administration, but how can they keep saying this shit and not get any questions about it from anyone in the press?) I know that it is all super-secret and we are just supposed to keep shopping, but....
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MasterDarkNinja Donating Member (139 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-07-07 12:31 AM
Response to Original message
19. Simple, the 2008 elections, dems don't want to be made to look 'weak' on terrorism
And that's basically the only reason why a weakened president like Bush can get a victory on an issue like this.
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-07-07 03:26 AM
Response to Original message
20. Because something else is at work here
None of us can be sure EXACTLY what it is:

Fear of Anthrax
Fear of "accidental" death by plane crash
Fear of "suicide"
Fear of Faux News (if THIS is why they cave, then they desrve to be along with the Royal Bushies.

WHATEVER it is, it is there.

Something is wrong, as wrong as it EVER has been in our nation, which isn't realy even ours.
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seafan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-07-07 07:55 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. This is closer to the truth, I'm afraid. Remember, *if you vote for Kerry, we WILL be hit again.*
This is just too chilling to contemplate. But face it we must. It will be the only way to stop it.


The reason for this Congressional capitulation has now gone far, far beyond any particular vote being called *unpatriotic* on the screeching airwaves.

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Pachamama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-07-07 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. Something is very wrong...I've been feeling it and recent events and this vote to approve FISA
has me feeling that there is something more wrong than ever before...

I have been trying to keep a calm head to think over what it all means...I don't have the answers and what is so strange to me is this feels different from other times. I'm not (and haven't) bought into the "terror terror terror" tactics even while I've watched my fellow citizens do just that.

This is different. How I'm not exactly sure, but I feel that our country is going to have to do a lot of suffering in the future and so many of us will pay the price.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-07-07 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
22. That's my question. How can * get his way on anything?
Makes no sense whatsoever.

It must be true that during his first 6 years, he somehow managed to change the system to subvert the Constitution.

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Help me help Earth Donating Member (217 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-07-07 10:12 AM
Response to Original message
23. Simple: we elected moral cowards too concerned with elections to do what is right.
My sarcastic brief of this story.

Congressional Democrats: You time is over Lord Bush, you twice unelected tyrant! Now peace and justice will be restored to America! Watch in fear as we strike down your warrantless wiretapping. It's time you remember that the Constitution is the highest law of the land, not your evil whims!

Our president, George W Bush: I'll veto whatever bill you pass.

Congressional Democrats: ...We proudly give you the power to wiretap anyone without a warrant and regardless of that outdated Constitution. All hail the mighty Bush!

Congress is pathetic. The war is still on, Bush's abuses of power are the law of the land, and Bush is still in office. A con friend pointed out to me that every single thing Bush could potentially be impeached for has been given explicit approval by the Congress. The biggest hole in his argument was the wiretapping, but now our Congress has nicely patched that up. I guess the used the table, so they don't have to worry about putting impeachment back on it.
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seafan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-07-07 02:52 PM
Response to Original message
25. This spying will continue through the next election. The "6 month renewal" is a sham.
Does anyone think it's convenient that this *program* is going to last for the rest of Bush's time in office? And that it will be operating in full force during the run-up to the next election??

The *renewal* in 6 months is only a feel-good sham for public consumption.


Here is the money quote from the Boston Globe:


The program will be able to continue for a year, although the law will come up for renewal in six months. In any case, the warrantless eavesdropping can start immediately, even before the security court signs off on the procedures.




Karl Rove must have the means to determine HIS NUMBERS for Election 2008. No kidding.


We have to stop this NOW.
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bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-10-07 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
26. .
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-10-07 01:53 PM
Response to Original message
27. Sometimes, the simplest and most obvious answer
Edited on Fri Aug-10-07 01:54 PM by mmonk
is the correct one. Could it be they are on the same side as bush on such issues?
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