MSNBC Live with Dan Abrams

[Demeter]

Run time: 07:07 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c05y06xvdbI   Posted on YouTube: November 06, 2007 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: November 08, 2007 By DU Member: Demeter Views on DU: 931

 
Pat Buchanan and Rachel Maddows debate torture with a guy who was waterboarded. Includes graphic demo (which I couldn't watch)

[grasswire]

1. the waterboarding demo was amateurish, the operative said.

He had been himself waterboarded. He called the demo that everyone is using video of "amateurish." He said he felt from the moment it began on him that it was torture. No ambiguity there.

[LeahMira]

2. What is Buchanan's problem?

Torture is a crime internationally, by whatever conventions you want to quote. The U.S. signed on to the Geneva Conventions outlawing torture, so those conventions have the same force of law in this country as those laws passed by Congress. Our Constitution says that all treaties signed with a foreign power or powers assume the status of law. So now he wants Congress to pass individual laws stating that this is torture and that is not? Waterboarding is torture. We already have laws to affirm this fact. So was everything done to the prisoners at Abu Ghraib. Some people just don't want to admit that they did wrong. Suck it up, you guys. Personal responsibility, remember? Take it!

[Demeter]

4. Seems Like the GOP Needs An Engraved Invitation

A signed international treaty or 4 just isn't sufficiently compelling.

[ProfessorPlum]

3. More Rachel Maddow goodness

k&r