TDPS: Oslo Shooter Bought Bullets from the United States...Problem?

[celtics23]

Run time: 07:25 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isr8TJPUexM   Posted on YouTube: August 02, 2011 By YouTube Member: MidweekPolitics Views on YouTube: 334   Posted on DU: August 03, 2011 By DU Member: celtics23 Views on DU: 1468

 
From: www.davidpakman.com | Subscription: www.davidpakman.com/membership | YouTube: www.youtube.com/midweekpolitics

[James48]

1. No, he did not buy bullets from the U.S.-

the show says he bought 30-round magazines on the internet. Not bullets.

This guy says those magazines were illegal to buy in Norway- but they are available here in the U.S.

I checked the Norway gun laws- and I do not see magazine capacity addressed.

Note: Personally, I believe the right to bear arms includes the right to buy and own these magazines. He may have violated his own country's laws when he purchased those magazines, or maybe not. I cannot seem to find any prohibition on it.

Here is the main Norway gun ownership law:

http://www.ub.uio.no/ujur/ulovdata/lov-19610609-001-eng.html

[friendly_iconoclast]

2. He didn't buy ANY bullets from the states- he bought magazines.

When this dude started his podcast talking about "Mexican drug cartels buying guns legally in the US", I knew more
inaccuracies were to follow. And I was correct.

I'd also point out that over-ten-round magazines for handguns are available legally in both Norway and Canada, and Breivik bought one for his handgun from a Norwegian source.

Go ahead and try to ban them if you like, but spree killers can and will simply reload with "VPC/McCarthy approved" magazines.
There are at least three documented cases where they did that very thing.

Pakman proves once again that factual accuracy is strictly optional in politics.

[wxgeek7]

5. Nope, you weren't correct.

A simple Google News search validates what he said about the drug cartels, to the point of the ATF getting involved:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/04/us/04guns.html

[James48]

7. Sorry, but you are incorrect , wxgeek7

Mexican citizens cannot legally buy guns in the U.S.

You have to be a U.S. citizen or legal resident in order to buy a gun legally in the U.S.

See this document for a list of the federal laws on gun purchases.

http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf

Basically, the bottom line is that a non-U.S. citizen (Mexican drug cartel member) can not legally buy a gun here.

[wxgeek7]

9. Oh?

Who says all members of the Mexican cartel are solely Mexican citizens??

http://www.todaysthv.com/news/article/166834/288/14-year-old-American-boy-convicted-of-being-drug-cartel-hitman

Btw, I think magazines/clips holding more than around 6-8 rounds should be restricted to law enforcement. Anyways, back before the 20th century, people did fine with mostly 6 shooters anyway.

[friendly_iconoclast]

10. Straw buying is illegal no matter who you are reselling to, if they are DQd to begin with.

As for your proposed magazine size restrictions- with reloading, the size of the magazine is irrelevant. Check out this video:

This guy gets 30 shots off in 13-15 seconds, using only "McCarthy/Brady Campaign approved" magazines.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5I1DXcNpMTo

So much for the idea of stopping spree killings by limiting magazine size.

The Brady Campaign is indulging in magical thinking.

[wxgeek7]

11. I disagree, size of magazine is completely relevant

If Loughner had been using a 10 round clip (like in the video; which indicated 5 seconds of total reloading time), instead of a 33 round one, there would've been less people dead/hurt:

"After the gunman ran out of ammunition in the first magazine, he stopped to reload, but dropped the loaded magazine from his pocket to the sidewalk, from where bystander Patricia Maisch grabbed it. A bystander clubbed the back of the assailant's head with a folding chair in the process injuring his elbow and representing the 20th injury. The gunman was then tackled to the ground by 74-year-old retired US Army Colonel Bill Badger (Oooh-Rah!), who himself had been shot, and was further subdued by Maisch and bystanders Roger Sulzgeber and Joseph Zamudio."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Tucson_shooting

[friendly_iconoclast]

12. The Virginia Tech crazy killed 5X as many people using only 10rd magazines...

...because he had two guns with him, so no one could get close enough to tackle him. Loughner had another gun, but he wasn't
'functional' enough to take it with him. The original "postal" killer (Norman, Oklahoma 1986) did the same.

You might cut down the number of spree killings with large magazines, but you won't prevent spree killings and you certainly won't make them less deadly. I've seen the same 'logic' used to restrict beer keg sales in Massachusetts.

The result? We ended up with far fewer keg parties- but the underage drinking kept on happening, with beer by the case
instead of beer by the keg. I pointed that out in this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=362693

[ChrisBorg]

3. I love listening to people who don't know what a clip, magazine, round or bullet is.

Then to end with "you better have a pretty powerful shotgun to take down a bear".

What you need is the 50 gauge automatic pump rifle.

Ever body knows that.

BTW, the headline is laughable. The ammo was not purchased from the US.

The bullet is the actual projectile coming out of the weapon. The cartridge and round are the exact same thing...that is the bullet, gunpowder, and some sort of primer all placed together in a metallic casing, or shell.

A clip is a device used to store bullets and to feed them into a magazine, while a magazine is used to load cartridges into the chamber of a firearm

[friendly_iconoclast]

4. The more doctrinaire a person is, the less factual knowledge about what they oppose...

...actually matters to them. Willful ignorance is the order of the day for these types.

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