Ron Paul explains why staying in Iraq is madness, warmongers laugh at him

[ProfessorPlum]

Run time: 09:19 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BB3NrSpRGE   Posted on YouTube: September 06, 2007 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: September 06, 2007 By DU Member: ProfessorPlum Views on DU: 4502

 

[TwilightGardener]

1. Sad that the GOP can't respect differing points of view. Ron Paul

is a little bit goofy in his speech and mannerisms, which makes him a good target for ridicule, but openly baiting him and jeering him is downright shitty, when his views on the war are actually close to the mainstream. He is a threat to the GOP, not in terms of getting the nomination, but in terms of airing an "unacceptable" viewpoint that weakens their case for continued war.

[ProfessorPlum]

2. Yeah, it's pretty clear that the gloves are off

the military-industrial-complex-controlled-media has been given the marching orders to ridicule this guy away. It's kind of cool to see Paul not get flustered and keep punching back. Not that I'd ever vote for him.

[ginnyinWI]

6. he's too libertarian for me, but he's right about Iraq.

(There is a place for good government programs, when they are run well.)

But the rest of the Republicans seem to just want to let Bush drive them over the cliff. Buh-bye!!

[zbdent]

11. It's all part of their diversity ...

white, wealthy, war-mongering male vs white, wealthy, war-mongering male vs white, wealthy, war-mongering male vs white, wealthy, war-mongering male vs white, wealthy, war-mongering male vs you get the idea ...

[ClayZ]

3. That is canned laughter... I heard it each time he spoke!

K and R

[niceypoo]

51. It is Hannity laughing and being an asshole

[pretty_lies]

4. Wow. Try Finding These Answers From A Democrat.

"The same people saying there will be a bloodbath if we leave are the ones who said the invasion would be a cakewalk".

"We need to just GET OUT."

Sadly, the Democrats are just as co-opted into imperialism as the GOP...

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[rjones2818]

15. Ron's first question at the interview:

"What the hell were you thinking, you idiot, for sponsoring the Iraq War enabling act?"

That'd be the end of that partnership!

:)

:hide:

[rjones2818]

14. There's one Democratic candidate

who opposed the war from the beginning and has voted against funding it every single time.

Hint: It's not John Edwards, Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, Joe Biden, Bill Richardson, Mike Gravel or Chris Dodd (mind you, Mike wasn't in the Seanate for any of the votes, Bill wasn't either).

Go Dennis! :woohoo:
http://dennis4president.com
Choose Peace!

[DutchLiberal]

57. Try Kucinich!

[Dukkha]

5. fine. make the armchair chcikenhawks fight it.

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lasher]

8. I'm anxious about seeing Ron Paul promoted here

I know that his supporters are trolling this site, trying to siphon off Democratic votes for him.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=3491143

Not saying your're a troll. Not saying you shouldn't have posted the video. I'm just saying that I wouldn't like to see a lot of threads devoted to him here. Except for his position on Iraq, his policies could hardly be worse.

[ProfessorPlum]

19. That's understandable. I'm more enamored with his response

to these particular questions (especially about the war and liberty) and the way he presents them, than I am about the candidate. I would like our Democratic candidates to study carefully what he is saying. And repeat it. (Kucinich has already figured this out, by the way).

[Lasher]

24. I did like what he said about the war

But I see the Ron Paul trolls have invaded your thread already.

[terminal_concept]

33. There has got to be a reason

For all the Ron Paul spam all over the internet. Maybe it's just the "annoyance factor" like when they play classical music to drive away teen agers?

See you don't really change peoples mind on the internet. They are looking for something and if "Ron Paul" isn't that something they don't change their mind and pick him anyway. Is there some kind of spam filter to remove anything about "Ron Paul".Please say yes....

[Lasher]

34. Paul has a small but assertive number of supporters.

They are enthusiastic about his something-for-nothing promises that anarchy without taxes would be better than the system of government we have today. Greed has always clouded judgment.

Paul attracts only about 1% support from voters in the race for the Republican Presidential nomination. He is viewed favorably by just 20% of likely voters nationwide. Thirty-eight percent (38%) have an unfavorable view while 43% are Not Sure what to think of him.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/congressman_ron_paul_attracts_less_than_35_against_top_democrats


http://www.attackcartoons.com/index.php?topic=LibertarianMan

[Truth2Tell]

36. I think you're wrong

that "They are enthusiastic about his something-for-nothing promises." Yes, it's true that he makes these kind of statements. And it's true that he has wack-job and racist views about a lot of other shit.

But, the reason for the enthusiasm is not those things. The reason for the enthusiasm is the things you just heard in this video about the war and about U.S. foreign policy in general.

The reason it's important for us to look carefully at this on a Democratic forum is because unless we understand why people of all walks of life are cheering Ron Paul, we are missing a very major boat. People are cheering his straight talk on war despite his other looney tunes views, not because of them.

The Democrats, and particularly the top tier Presidential candidates, need to adopt the parts of Paul's platform that make common sense and that the American people are clamoring for. Do that and Ron Paul becomes irrelevant.

[ProfessorPlum]

38. Exactly. Well put. n/r

[Lasher]

39. You are entitled to your ridiculous opinion

His hardcore supporters are extremist libertarians. He and they are exploiting his position on the invasion, in hopes of restoring our society to the blessings of the 19th century.

If the war in Iraq is the only single thing that matters to you, then maybe you should campaign for him.

[Truth2Tell]

43. Did someone express support for his candidacy?

I must have missed that.

I would suggest that if what's most important to you is maintaining the U.S. foreign policy consensus of never-ending war - and that you believe adopting a platform of peace is "ridiculous" - that maybe Giuliani would be more to your liking?

Have you considered maybe campaigning for him Lasher?

[Lasher]

52. I get your point about adopting his position on the war.

I shouldn't have snapped at you like that. Sorry.

[Truth2Tell]

53. no worries, thanks for the reply.

I understand your response to Ron Paul. Libertarianism is a bankrupt philosophy. But it also has appeal to many people - and not just ultra-wackos.

I know this because in my younger years I was drawn to it, as are many people who strongly value personal freedom. But reading Chomsky and many others opened my eyes to the injustices that invariably occur in the vacuum of state power that libertarianism creates.

My own learning process on this taught me that it's possible for people who oppose war and oppression to evolve from a Ron Paul type outlook to a Dennis Kucinich type outlook on government. Even after you chop out the ultra-wackos and the militia types - I believe there are still a big chunk of Ron Paul Republicans, especially newer devotees, who are ripe for the same philosophical transformation I made some years ago.

I think this could potentially have enormous value to our party, but that it will require diplomacy rather than ridicule. Many, but not all, Ron Paul followers are new to politics entirely and have very shallowly defined political views. Many simply oppose wars of aggression, decry police state tactics and appreciate straight talk. It’s those voters we could potentially steal.

[Lasher]

55. Libertarians can be hard to understand.

Fortunately, according to Wiki, only 10 to 20 percent of voting-age Americans have libertarian views.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian

[KurtNYC]

22. the primaries have not happened yet

so I don't see how any dem vote siphoning can occur.

[rAVES]

10. Jesus... Loaded question... disgrace I tell you!!!

[Buddyblazon]

12. The Republican party is doing us a favor...

They're ostracizing a portion of their base.

Watch how many of his supporters just don't vote because of the spiteful crap they've been pulling on Paul.

[rAVES]

13. Please...

Kucinich and Gravel are getting the same treatment.

[Buddyblazon]

16. And?

[rAVES]

17. And?

Thats 2 Candidates!! so thats supporters of the Dems being made feel left out in the cold..

Christ.. you need that explained to you?

[Buddyblazon]

20. And you're angry with me...

because?

On edit:

Welcome to DU.

You'll find that being angry and/or patronizing to people here will not get you very far.


I do, however, know of another message board (not political unfortunately) where you actually ALLOWED to call each other names...let me know if you want their URL.

[rAVES]

21. Not angry at you

Dont get me wrong.

[Buddyblazon]

26. Hey...

I pretty much lost my faith in the political system in two events:

The hack job "scream" incident that they used to discredit Dean

and

When I worked my butt off to get democrats into office at the last midterm...only to find that they refuse to do any of the things the promised they'd do.


I'm at a point now where I feel like the country could just fall apart...and I'm not sure I would really care.

They give me a limited menu...of things I don't like...and if I don't vote...I'm unamerican.

It's fucking depressing.

[Truth2Tell]

37. let me know if you want their URL

...allowed to call each other names? Kewl, I'll take that URL. :)

[ProfessorPlum]

18. And? there will be a huge mass of disaffected voters

in the general, who will be given a choice between two pro-war candidates. As usual.

[Buddyblazon]

27. No shit?

Maybe that's why I'm so desperately depressed when I think about our future.

[seeker4ever]

23. Who was that giggling asshole?

Was that America's Mayor? What a fucktard!

[rAVES]

25. I would bet it was "Americas Mayor"

Obnoxious asswipe that he is.

anyone done an official "9/11" word count on him last night yet?

[ProfessorPlum]

29. Seriously, it sounded like he was sniffing nitrous oxide

It was like he was trying out for the part of the Riddler on Batman. Try to not act like such an a**clown, Rude-ee.

[ludwigb]

28. Ron Paul Is A Patriot

And Chris Wallace is a cretin. Utterly without class.

These guys speak lecture Paul about honor???????

[whistle]

30. Ron Paul can never get through to the Koolaid drinkers of the GOP

...but he is certainly a refreshing voice to hear among those conservative toads.

I also like the edited version of the GOP debates that includes only Ron Paul for 9 minutes :applause: verse the other GOP maniacs who say nothing for the other 111 minutes :hurts:

[DuaneBidoux]

48. Yea, but let's hope he's not getting through to the Koolaid drinking Dems.

[The Doctor.]

31. Wallace is such an asshole. "You'd take your marching orders from Al-Qaeda?"

Fuck him.

[Doc Martin]

41. This displayed an enormous lack of respect for another person

Wallace is a journalist, right?

[The Doctor.]

50. I wouldn't call him that.

Not at all.

[ryanmuegge]

58. Yeah, that's a really neutral comment from an impartial moderator there.

He (Wallace) wasn't trying to interject his opinion, steer the dialog, or give his preferred candidates ammunition there. Not at all.

[superkia]

32. "When you sacrifice liberty for security, you lose both"

I was amazed that his microphone didn't break or something at that point. He was right on about what is happening to this country! The one thing that I didn't like was the fact that the crowd was behind him as he made these great points and then after the show he won their little text in poll hands down. What I didn't like about that was the fact that so many Republicans were behind the guy that was speaking the truth and standing out on a ledge, when we as Democrats have a candidate speaking the truth and stepping out on that same ledge and not only do we not support him but the ones who don't bring him down to being unelectable? I think the republican voters have recognized what is being done to our country by our political system and are wanting change enough to vote for a candidate that was attacked and laughed at instead of saying hes unelectable. I also think that if Ron Paul is not the republican candidate and Kucinich was the democratic candidate, those republican voters would vote Kucinich hoping for some change in the country.

[DuaneBidoux]

47. Anyone remember "give me liberty or give me death"?

Now it's "give me liberty if it's not too dangerous."

[LSK]

35. who is laughing at him? a candidate or the FOX panelists?

[Doc Martin]

40. This is a great question

[daninthemoon]

44. i kept wondering that, too. it was very obviously meant to be part

of the broadcast, so faux had to have some hand in it.

[Juan_de_la_Dem]

42. I wish a Dem would talk like this just a little bit

[DuaneBidoux]

46. I think this way of talking is what is pulling them (who?) into his camp.

[DuaneBidoux]

45. I CAN see why Paul has a following: he talks about the war like we should.

[Jade Fox]

49. Chris Wallace is vile.....

He isn't fit to wipe his father's boots.

[provis99]

61. what a piece of crap Wallace is.

Is his dad ashamed at what a mockery of journalism he turned out to be?

[nam78_two]

54. Whatever Ron Paul's position on the war, let us not forget his past

He may say the right things on the war, but at the end of the day the reason he says them is because he is an isolationist libertarian.

He has a past of involvement with racist militias & he is a hard core libertarian on environmental issues. For all his libertarianism, he is as much opposed to gay rights as the rest of the Rethug party (pro "Defense of marriage" act, voted against same-sex adoption etc.)

A good Daily Kos diary on the guy:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/5/15/124912/740

This site has a good (and pretty funny piece) on Ron Paul :

http://suicidegirls.com/news/politics/21528/

(CAVEAT: not for those offended by coarse langugae)


For those seeking a candidate to fill their horrible Ralph Nader hole, Ron Paul is you man. He is completely void of any possibility of winning an election, so you may clamor on for years about how fucked up things are and how great Ron Paul would have been. Of course, you will have to avoid talking about the fact that Ron Paul is an enormous douche bag.

Let me start by saying Ron Paul is a racist. There is just no way around that fact. Ron Paul used to write a newsletter back in the '80s and '90s called the Ron Paul Political Report. The name was changed to the Ron Paul Survival Report in 1993 due to the fact that the newsletter was becoming so popular with the many lunatic militia groups around the country. It was around the time the survivalist movement was peaking.

The report had around 7,000 subscribers and was eight pages long. The mainstream media has yet to be able to track down a copy of the newsletter because it was largely only sent to nut jobs. Ron Paul still has copies, but he refuses to make them public because of the horrifying words contained in those pages. One of his supporters did, however, post a copy of a newsletter to a newsgroup in 1993. To say Paul has a demented racist view would be an understatement. Here’s a sample:


"Opinion polls consistently show that only about 5% of blacks have sensible political opinions, i.e. support the free market, individual liberty and the end of welfare and affirmative action."



Although "we are told that it is evil to be afraid of black men, it is hardly irrational. Black men commit murders, rapes, robberies, muggings and burglaries all out of proportion to their numbers."



"Black males age 13 that have been raised on the streets and who have joined criminal gangs are as big, strong, tough, scary, and culpable as any adult and should be treated as such."



"The Earth Summit is the creepiest meeting of politicos since the first gathering of Bolsheviks. Officially known as the UN Conference for Environment and Development, it will be held in Brazil in June; bad guys from all over the globe will attend."



"Why do we need the federal government? There's no Cold War and no Communist threat. Many other nations are breaking into smaller and smaller pieces. The centralization of power in Washington occurred in a different time. Why not think about getting rid of the federal government, returning to the system of our Founders, and breaking up the United States into smaller government units?"



Good stuff and exactly the kind of ideas we need from a leader. Of course, Racist Paul has distanced himself from his own newsletter. He now claims he did not write it. It just had his name at the top. So, either he’s incompetent or he is a racist. Paul has chosen incompetent.


"I could never say this in the campaign, but those words weren't really written by me. ... It wasn't my language at all."
>>



>>
And just two years ago Paul was an honored guest at a John Birch Society dinner. Not really sure if there are bigger lunatics around that the Birch Society. Ron Paul also attended the Libertarian-Patriot Banquet on April 2, 2004. Ah, nothing like hanging out with the lunatic “Patriots” to show how truly Presidential you are. You can find a picture of him here with Robert Clarkson, leader of The Carolina Patriots and The Patriot Network. Good company!

David Duke also loves Ron Paul so much that he keeps putting Ron’s articles up on his website. What could possibly be wrong with a guy David Duke loves?

>>

>>Okay, enough with his racist beliefs and the fucktard company he keeps. Let us move on to the issues, where Ron Paul comes across even more idiotic than he does as a racist.

Ron Paul is a Libertarian! Weeeee! That means he would like to get rid of the Environmental Protection Agency, Social Security, Medicare, the Department of Energy, the Federal Reserve, the IRS, aid to foreign nations, and the Department of Education as well as remove the US from the United Nations and NATO. Man, that would be so great. Maybe we could also get rid of everyone’s cars and we could ride around on magic unicorns. Also, I want to be able to turn my old shoes into muffins – because I’m a fucking crazy lunatic. Libertarians hold onto these ideas because they cannot grasp the complexities of being part of a larger society. Feel free to come join the adults at the party whenever you want. But I shouldn’t be rambling on; I should let Paul speak for himself.

Paul on Hurricane Katrina:


"Is bailing out people that chose to live on the coastline a proper function of the federal government?" he asks. "Why do people in Arizona have to be robbed in order to support the people on the coast?"



Does da little baby not wanna be part of da big society? Are they taking your money? Boo hoo.

Paul on Social Security:


"We didn't have it until 1935. I mean, do you read stories about how many people were laying in the streets and dying and didn't have medical treatment?...Prices were low and the country was productive and families took care of themselves and churches built hospitals and there was no starvation."



Fucking read a book, man. How stupid are you? Ever hear of a fucking Hooverville? Michael Katz, a historian of poverty at the University of Pennsylvania answers the question I just asked. Plenty stupid.


"Where to begin with this one?" asks Michael Katz. "The stories just break your heart, the kind of suffering that people endured…Stories of families that had literally no cash and had to kind of beg to get the most minimal forms of food, who lived in tiny, little rooms that were ill-heated and ill-ventilated, who were sick all the time, who had meager clothing…"



Paul considers Medicare and Medicaid to be unconstitutional.


I think it's a flaw in the perfect society I would like to see where individuals take care of themselves.



Yeah, we never tried that. Again, Paul, books are your friend, not your enemy. As far as Paul’s choices for Vice President, he had this to say.


John Stossel, John Stossel would be good.



Fucking John Stossel? Are you kidding me? It’s like a sketch on Human Giant. First of all, never pick a guy who has a Saddam-like moustache. Nobody with a non-ironic moustache should hold public office. Secondly, Stossel may be the worst reporter alive.
(:rofl:)
How about aid to poor countries?


Paul is against the government's "delusional, feel-good" policies of giving aid to needy countries in places like Africa; instead, private citizens and private groups should give charity if they want to. He has written that Americans "don't need to be forced to pay for foreign welfare at the barrel of a government gun."

>>
And lastly, for you liberals who are swayed by his anti-war views, Paul is staunchly pro-life. He was given a 0% rating by NARAL, a political organization of the pro-choice movement. Paul believes a fetus is a person, that it is human and has legal rights. He believes if you kill a fetus it is an act of aggression and you should be punished accordingly.

So, there you have it. Ron Paul is obviously a great fucking guy – especially if you ignore everything that he is.
>>

[DutchLiberal]

56. For *some* reason, you never hear hosts/other candidates laughing at Kucinich/Gravel in a Democratic

debate. They may disagree a lot, they may think they're nuts, but they keep that to themselves. They show respect for other points of view. They don't publicly laugh at or scoff at or belittle candidates with another point of view.

This video shows just what I've always said: the Republicans and their enablers at Faux News are nothing but high school bullies, who only care about being the toughest and meanest guys in the room and who will bully and belittle anybody who thinks differently. They're a bunch of immature jerks. (And half of the country is going to vote for them.)

The crowd sure loved Paul's remarks.

[Joe Chi Minh]

59. When Ron Paul was in full flow, and the anchor-man was trying to stop

him, it looked like he was licking his lips in fear. Also the guy standing next to him, on one occasion.

[manomensa]

60. Ron Paul is still a member

of the Repugnant Party. Don't trust them, no matter what they say. It is their economic policies that we must fear. The Repugnant Party are the exploiters of the stupid class.
http://www.youtube.com/v/24blx5Bg-x4