Elizabeth Edwards Responds to Bob Shrum's Allegations

[waiting for hope]

Run time: 04:54 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slvYjJRWbs8   Posted on YouTube: June 03, 2007 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: June 04, 2007 By DU Member: waiting for hope Views on DU: 4856

 
She's fantastic and credible - I can not wait until she's First Lady.

[underpants]

1. Why would anyone take anything that Shrum says seriously?

What you have here is the perfect example of the cocktail party groupthink that provides for the news fodder of our day.

[Bucky]

5. I would have said the same thing in 1988, but they listened to him.

I would have said the same thing in 2000, but they listened to him.
I would have said the same thing in 2004, but they listened to him.

He's like the Kevin Costner of the Democratic Party. He keeps on making losers and they keep on bankrolling him.

[Divine Discontent]

11. oh gosh

my friend would ROLL with your Costner joke! THAT'S FUNNY! Yeah, there were some things done in 88 that truly cost Dukakis the election, he was up by 10 points with 2 months to go if I recall right. They didn't come back at all on B*sh I, on the attack ads til the last days when Duke rolled up his sleeves, but by then it was too late. They need to attack hard any BS they throw our way, and Shrum always came across as annoyingly tricky/dirty to me when I listened to him.

[edwardsfeingold08]

2. Thanks for posting

It's nice to hear the other side for all the Shrum fans that keep posting his Time article on DU.

[seashorelady]

7. It was nice to see that Elizabeth was given the opportunity

to tell the truth about the Shrum allegations. She has an uncanny ability to remember the smallest of details, especially peoples names. I believe her.

[nini]

3. I couldn't help but think.... can you imagine Pickles giving an interview like that?

LOL


Elizabeth is awesome. She'd be a wonderful first lady.

[Divine Discontent]

4. Elizabeth: john said, "I don't really know any gay people"

he said this in 2004? I've defended him repeatedly on DU for 3 years, and I've never said a questionable word about him, but as a Democrat and a Senator, and a lawyer all those years, he actually didn't have ONE gay friend or associate even that he could say he knew was gay? Someone talk to me and give him an out on this, please? lol... Cuz that bugs me a lot. And I love Elizabeth (I have a bumper sticker just for her!), but man, she seemed to be tripped up by having to discuss this, she was very uncomfortable from what I PERSONALLY could tell.

[Bucky]

6. I'm going to tell you something shocking

Lots of people in their 50s still run around in social circles where gay orientation is not an open topic for speculation. Sure, he looks 36, but Edwards is 56 and has lived mostly in small towns in the Carolinas. My dad is very liberal and has lived in New Orleans and Houston and said pretty much the same thing to me 15 years ago, when he was in his late 50s. I asked him if he was going to the same Democratic meetings that I was, and he could only laugh.

[madrchsod]

8. some people think it`s none of their business if a person is gay

i grew up in the 50`s and most people did`t give a shit. i know that`s a novel or quaint thing now days but really that`s pretty much the way it was.

[Divine Discontent]

10. he's a senator, and was in congress, and you'd think

that he had some policy advisors, campaign staff leads, or made at least ONE friendship with a big donor who was gay, that had their significant other there or told him they were gay, and it just seems unbelievable to say you don't know ANYone who's gay. But I agree with you, that most people don't discuss gay issues at all, thanks for the real world thought.

[MsUnderstood]

9. I got to say that how he phrased it makes sense

I listened to the young turks--to young, liberal democratic guys and they just don't "get" the gay issue cause they don't know or think they know gay people. It doesn't make them bad people, it just means they haven't been personally affected by the issue.

John Edwards (as Elizabeth tells it) explains its an abstract issue becuase gay people haven't come out to him. Until you have a friend, family member, neighbor who sits down with you and says "I'm gay, here is why my life is harder than your straight life" how can straight people understand what we as homosexuals go through. If we dismiss a candidate because he says he is not personally knowledgeable about the situation, we're not giving him a chance to be an advocate for us.

It is up to gays and lesbians not to shut down when an individual says "I don't understand" and take the effort to educate them on the rights taken for granted rather than just expecting everyone understands the gay lifestyle and difficulties. I can't imagine anyone thinking Televison is an accurate portrayal--Queer as Folk and the L word focus on the dramas of getting a hot date, Will and Grace focused on the comedy of being gay in New York and Queer Eye just reminded everyone that if he fixes your hair, he likes your husband.

[purduejake]

20. You're mistaken about who's responsibility...

it is to educate people. You said "It is up to gays and lesbians not to shut down when an individual says "I don't understand" and take the effort to educate them on the rights taken for granted rather than just expecting everyone understands the gay lifestyle and difficulties."

First of all, it's not "up to" gay people. Certainly we want to be sensitive to other people, but ultimately everybody needs to be responsible to themselves. After all, it's not up to black, hispanic, muslims, or athiests to explain to me why they deserve respect. It's a human right and they deserve respect without bending over backwards to try to earn it and so do gays.

The second issue is your use of the words "gay lifestyle." Would you care to explain to me what the "gay lifestyle" is and why it needs to be explained?

[MsUnderstood]

37. no need for the hostility towards me

If you want to make people change their minds about their feelings towards gays and lesbians a militant "I don't have to explain anything to you" attitude isn't going to cut it. The War cry of "we're here, we're queer, get used to it" can be replaced with a dialog between two people.

Just after I made this post I was in the break room with another co-worker I don't often talk to and the subject of my sexuality came up. She has neighbors down the street who are gay and she had curiosities (yes to people who don't know a gay person in their life we can be curiosities) about why one of the men seemed more "feminine" to her. She wanted to know if I thought it was a choice or genetic to be gay. I don't think she's really been able to ask those questions to a homosexual. At the end of the conversation she was telling me she thought gays should get the rights she gets as a heterosexual. It was a nice conversation.

And yes blacks, muslims, hispanics and atheists do sometimes have to explain to people their viewpoint as a minority in America. To think otherwise would be silly and ignorant of their struggles; just think back to Katrina victims who were stereotyped, muslims who are held back at airports, lots of examples come to mind.

Finally, There shouldn't be an issue with the use of my word "gay lifestyle" but go ahead and cherry pick my word choices if it makes you feel superior. It is sad but true that as a homosexual I sometimes have to do things very differently than a straight person--for example file taxes, come out to new acquaintances at regular intervals, avoid public displays of affection in certain neighborhoods. These are aspects of a gay life style that a straight person wouldn't understand until you had a conversation with that person to explain why its difficult to be gay.

[purduejake]

38. It just seems as if you're blaming the victim.

And suggesting that minorities such as gays ought to go out and earn some basic respect. The problem with that is it suggests that people with the hateful viewpoints aren't responsible for their actions. It's not my job to work with any bigot and frankly, I just write them off and marginalize them. And if they're old like Falwell, I just wait for them to die.

And concerning any "gay lifestyle," I just don't like those words. We both know doing taxes and avoiding PDA in areas it'll likely attract unwanted attention does not constitute a lifestyle. If I started talking about how other minority groups had a certain lifestyle, I'd expect the same pushback because it plays on stereotypes and I don't think you want to do that because I think you have nothing but the best intentions.

[benny05]

12. No, he didn't say this in 2004 n/t

[Divine Discontent]

13. I was thinking it was within a year or so before it at the most

but I understand this isn't an issue a lot of people talk about, even though they have gay friends or relatives. I accept her comment, I think a lot of Elizabeth, so I don't think she'd ever distort any facts, she rocks.

He has a lot more GLBT friends than he could ever imagine! :) He was one of the first to decry what General Idiot said about gays in the military when Clinton and Obama BOTH fumbled with their words when first presented with the comment the General made about gays being immoral.

[SemperEadem]

16. what about that is so hard to grasp?

you spin it like it's something that had been done on purpose when there is no evidence to back up that thinly veiled insinuation.

[cynthia]

26. go to the South

There are a lot of people who think they have never met a gay person. Gays in the South seem to be very closeted, and until you start meeting out people, it would be easy to think that there aren't any.

[Doc Martin]

29. Troubling words

I really admire Elizabeth Edwards. She seems both very smart and authentic. I liked her from the first time I ever heard her interviewed.

John Edwards' words are troubling. Mrs. Edwards, brilliant advocate that she is, failed to make the case on this one.

Edwards has been my preferred candidate. Now, I'll wait and see

[JDPriestly]

33. I think the Edwards are trying to be very honest.

Elizabeth seemed uncomfortable telling this story. It is embarrassing that Edwards would think he did not know any gay or lesbian people.

I'm straight -- very straight, but I have had many, many gay and lesbian friends since at least my college days. It just does not seem possible to me that Edwards thought he did not know any gay or lesbian people.

[Rageneau]

14. People who hire Bob Shrum want Republicans to win. Period.

[Hulk]

15. She would be a welcome change...

God, what a difference to have the Edwards family in the White House. Going from air head, egotistical sacks of rich white trash to a family with conscience, intelligence and actual thinking minds. How novel!

[waiting for hope]

17. She (and John, Cate, Emma Claire

and Jack too) would be a wonderful, needed and welcome change. This country needs a new direction.

[Chomskyite]

18. Not good

It was a bad choice for Edwards to have even responded to that passage that way. Seems like there are way too many cooties under that scab. Shrum is a snake. He's going to bite back. The best course would have been, "That's Shrum being Shrum. Next question."

[zulchzulu]

21. Agreed

This gives Schrum more "validity" by having Elizabeth Edwards respond to the allegations. If you want a story to go away, you don't give it a response other than one that goes away quickly. He is, after all, on a book tour and will be interviewed about it.

This game plan keeps the story alive...adds more legs.

[waiting for hope]

22. I don't agree - do you think Kerry would

have won if he fought back harder against the Swiftboaters?

Schrum is getting a lot of post time here - I would prefer to see some black lash against false allegations.

[zulchzulu]

31. Kerry's "swiftboat" issue is not relevant here...

It's a myth that Kerry didn't fight back soon enough against the Swifties. They spent thousands of dollars trying to lie about his military service and the issue on that subject is more about how the MSM continued to allow the Swifties to get "relevance". The Kerry campaign actually began defending themselves a couple days after the first cycle of ads started airing and then had a lot of people who served with Kerry defending him.

The issues that Shrum has with Edwards are trivial compared to the Kerry/Swiftboat issue.

While it was good for Elizabeth Edwards to parse the events that Shrum wrote about in his book, it doesn't help to actually engage in that parsing (at least on a continuing level) due to the fact that it brings the accusations up again (putting the Edwards campaign on the defensive) as well as helps Shrum's book sales.

I would hope that both Elizabeth and John Edwards come up with a short and sweet zinger about Shrum that isn't too snarky and perhaps humorous... something like how Shrum rhymes with dumb...

[Chomskyite]

35. Shrum isn't being financed by the Rangers or coordinated by Rove

Nor is he carpet-bombing Edwards with commercials in toss-up states.

[jsamuel]

36. Shrum is already backing down on his version

[EVDebs]

19. Dennis Kucinich and John Edwards are the only Progressives in the race

and Edwards is electable; the R's will have a field day with Dennis in regard to their 'swiftbaiting'. John and Elizabeth can fight back more effectively, and this is proof !

[JDPriestly]

23. I am amazed at Edwards' provinciality.

Surely Edwards knows lots of gays and lesbians. He appears to be a compassionate, caring person. How could he not have noticed that some of his friends are homosexual. Edwards either shut his eyes to the reality of people he knew, was unobservant or is naive. I like Edwards, but I can't believe he thought he had never known any homosexuals. What kinds of social circles does he frequent? Gays and lesbians live everywhere including in small towns. They go to Baptist churches. How could Edwards have missed the boat on this? This does not ring true.

[Divine Discontent]

24. yes, the comment I said above in my title about him not knowing any gay people

is disturbing. I know people can change, and he surely has changed over the years as all straight people eventually find out about gay people and learn about them, but the way she explains how he reacted showed me that at THAT particular point in his life, he didn't want to know his friends or associates might be gay, and it made him feel uncomfortable, as I said, she seemed to be having a hard time discussing this one, and I feel it's because she knows John has changed, why not just say, "well, if we're good humans we mature and learn things we do not understand and back then John felt uncomfortable by it, blame it on him living in a small southern area his whole life, but know that he's changed and he is more supportive of gay & lesbian rights as any candidate is!", just felt she needs to retool the comment when gay issues come up, because this one was one of her weaker rebuttals.

I had a 19 yr old friend who was a ladies man, but he befriended me so he could understand what life is like for a gay person better, and even said so, and he is a southern small town guy. That's why with Edwards' progressive beliefs I found the party story a bit odd. Well, I go on the present when it comes to supporting a candidate - and I'm still in John's corner! There's only 2 guys I'd be more interested in, and neither of them have announced, so I happily support John for PRESIDENT!!!!!

[JDPriestly]

32. Don't get me wrong. I like Edwards. This seems odd.

I have known people who thought they did not like homosexuals but learned they did. If he never noticed that someone he knew was gay or lesbian, he probably is not homophobic in fact. If he really did not like homosexuality he would be more conscious of homosexuals. He probably never really cared. That's the good news. There is a pretty good statistical probability that he has known quite a few homosexuals in his life. It troubles me a bit that he was never concerned enough about their lives to find out about their problems. I think of him as a very compassionate man.

[tsuki]

27. Maybe he doesn't know he knows them. Some of us lead

pollyanna existences when it comes to sexuality. I don't know if someone is gay or not unless I see them with their partner or they tell me. I have no "gay-dar."

But, I do believe in equal rights for everyone.

[ashlarah]

34. I don't think I have a pollyanna existence, but

I am like you on this. Over the course of the last year, I realized two people I know socially are lesbians. One realization was when one of the friends introduced me to her partner. The other, another friend told me. I cared about them before and I cared after, but somehow I missed whatever social clues there are to sexual orientation. I don't evaluate people on the basis of sexuality, so I guess it has not been that important to me.

I don't think it has anything to do with compassion. The compassion comes into play once you know your acquaintance has a more difficult road than you do and what you do to ease that road.

Sen. Edwards shows more compassion on a regular basis than any other candidate. He works hard to make life easier for those who face difficulties in life. He is a strong advocate for equality.

Requiring a candidate to have accurate "gay-dar" seems unnecessary. What is necessary is that the candidate not discriminate on the basis of sexual orientation and be willing to fight for everyone's civil rights.

[rpannier]

28. I don't find it that hard to believe

I have relatives that live in small towns in the midwest and they'll tell you that they don't think they've ever met a gay person.
Gays and lesbians in many small towns go out of their way to be more 'non-gay' than their friends do because of the huge stigma attached to it.
If people suspect someone is gay, they either shun the person, or if they like the person, they talk around it.

[ElizabethDC]

30. Yes, my reaction was the same

I find it shocking that he thought he didn't know any gay people. Surely, a man who becomes a successful politician has a lot of friends - some of them are bound to be gay. Naive is definitely the right word.

[ooglymoogly]

25. Hasn't anybody wondered

Maybe he does not give a dump if someone is gay or straight or black or white but cares about what they bring to the table. That is my sense of John....that he could care less and I can certainly understand why as a young very handsome groom he might feel uncomfortable thinking a gay person or anyone for that matter would try to snake him away from Elizabeth who he clearly cares deeply and profoundly for and who can blame him? Elizabeth has won the hearts of us all, gay and straight.