NPR: Hillary Clinton says Michigan Results are Fair

[babylonsister]

Run time: 01:43 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-deGy60y9fo   Posted on YouTube: March 13, 2008 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: March 13, 2008 By DU Member: babylonsister Views on DU: 4741

 

[mod mom]

1. I heard it and couldn't believe it! The audacity of hope VS the audacity of Hill

[MH1]

27. The audacity of hope vs. the audacity of lying and reneging.

[Connonym]

88. Another Republican tactic -- if you keep repeating something it becomes true

I know it's not about me but I feel a personal sense of disappointment in her campaigning tactics. I held her in such high esteem before this election. Admittedly, I favored Edwards for the candidate but I had a positive opinion of Hillary. Now I feel like she doesn't care what she steps on along her way as long as she gets what she wants. Ambition is a good thing but stepping on the backs of others to climb to the top doesn't fit in with my liberal ideals.

[Hulk]

2. hillary is desperate....and her ship is taking on water - fast!

I'm really disappointed with Hillary and this whole FL/MI thing. The rules were they were NOT to be counted. Regardless of who "won" this aborted election process, they were NOT TO BE COUNTED. She can forget stealing the delegates.

If she wants any of them.....they need to revote or forget the whole damned thing. She is making a mockery of the process and our choice of who WE THE PEOPLE want to represent the Democratic Party.

Get over it Hillary!! You can NOT steal this election. IF you can't win fair, then you better chose another line of business.

[tulsakatz]

14. when she left her name on the ballots.......

....I thought that sounded fishy. I mean, why would you want to leave your name on a ballot when you aren't going to win anything? It just looked like she was trying to pull a fast one......and now we know why.

[XemaSab]

95. She was SO pulling a fast one...

This is the sort of sleazy crap the republicans have been pulling for years. We shouldn't put up with it within our own party.

[texshelters]

79. Please realize this Clinton supporters

If Clinton wins the nomination, she will not win the Presidency. Not after these statements and her general disregard for the party rules and support for the party as a whole. Yes, I'm talking about the praise for McCain over Obama. I'm not a Democrat, but Clinton's statements fly in the face of the party and general fairness. To paraphrase: "I won because I ignored the party and stayed on the ballot." She won because there was no competition. Is that the only way she can win? Is that how Senator Clinton wants to go down in history? Does Clinton have any dignity left?

Tex Shelters

[ProfessorPlum]

3. WTF? is right

I couldn't believe my ears, either.

[tyne]

5. Obama should jump on stuff

like that when he's talking about good judgment.

Is it good judgment to say that a primary was "fair" when your opponents name was not even on the ballet?

Use that as an example of bad judgment.

[natrat]

64. we allknow its a scam, maybe he's in on it

[BuyingThyme]

4. Evil, evil, evil woman.

[texshelters]

80. That's a bit unfair

I won't vote for Clinton, but evil? Let's reserve those words for the true criminals: Bush, Cheney, Rove, Rice, and so on.

Tex Shelters

[ProfessorPlum]

6. The rest of the interview is just as obnoxious

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=88165077

Dear Hillary - no one gives a crap about your "experience".

[ProfessorPlum]

7. She also keeps conflating winning the primary contest in a state

with likelihood of winning that state in the general.

As others have pointed out, this makes absolutely no sense, and just highlights the focus, as before, of her campaign on "big states", as opposed to Obama and Dean's 50 state strategy.

[ClayZ]

8. K and R

[TwilightGardener]

9. She's out of her gourd.

[BuyingThyme]

11. That's the best assessment I've read.

:hi:

[eyepaddle]

73. I've tried to stay out of most of these primary threads, but

after hearing her interview it is pretty damned hard to conclude anything other than "she's nuts."

[BattyDem]

10. Anyone who thinks the definition of a "fair" election is ...

having one candidate's name on the ballot has no concept of what "democracy" is. Having someone with that attitude as our potential nominee makes me sick! I don't care if it's Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama or even Al Gore. ANYONE with that attitude does not deserve to be our president! :grr:

[mudesi]

12. WOW

Is she genuinely losing it?

[rodeodance]

13. BO wants to steal HRC votes---he only wants a 50-50

Forum Name General Discussion: Primaries
Topic subject Obama Opposes Revote In Michigan
Topic URL http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5050394#5050394
5050394, Obama Opposes Revote In Michigan
Posted by Karmadillo on Wed Mar-12-08 09:00 PM

http://www.talkleft.com/story/2008/3/12/17353/7404 \

Obama Opposes Revote In Michigan
By Big Tent Democrat, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Wed Mar 12, 2008 at 04:35:03 PM EST
Tags: (all tags) Share This:
By Big Tent Democrat

So say his MI Campaign Co-Chair:

State Sen. Tupac Hunter, D-Detroit, said a mail-in caucus "is clearly the wrong path. "We don't like it one bit," Hunter said. "It disenfranchises people who need to participate and there are many questions with regard to security."

Hunter said the Obama campaign will accept nothing but a 50-50 split of Michigan delegates between Clinton and Obama, who removed his name from the January ballot here in protest of the early date.

(Emphasis supplied.) I guess the Obama MI Co-Chair does not agree with Obama's previously held positive view on mail in voting, agreeing instead with Obama's newly minted distaste for mail in voting. Oh and a 50-50 split is the ONLY thing Obama will accept in Michigan. Hope we are clear now on how Obama feels about the will of the people of Florida and Michigan.

more...

[indimuse]

17. he made a poor decision...

NOW he's crying and once again creating more problems. He is NOT ready to lead this country...he does NOT have foresight amongst other very important gifts....like Hillary.

[BrklynGreenDog]

19. And he wants SD to CHANGE THE RULES to be an OPEN primary

so that Republicans can vote. The SD organizers explicitly said they were doing it to aid Obama.

Yeah, thats democracy.

[indimuse]

23. the ONLY way he can win!

...

[pedo]

38. yes

because he's so far behind right now and doesn't have a chance!

[indimuse]

41. bzzz bzzzz

do you here something?

[Ned_Devine]

56. "do you here something?" Could you please spell words correctly? Please? ...

...Especially simple words like "hear"

[indimuse]

65. hahah

doeoos mi spelin buther yu?
Stay on subject!

[Ned_Devine]

77. Your position loses merit when you spell simple words incorrectly

That's how I stay on subject. If you are trying to plead your case and spelling commonly used words is a bit of a challenge for you, then your intelligence comes into question. Once that becomes an issue, it becomes difficult for me to give your argument much validity. It's like having one strike against you before you even step to the plate.

[elmerdem]

76. are you kidding?

You question his foresight? Read this!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5062471

HRC is such a great candidate she can win when there is no one else on the ballot? Try to understand all that has went on before you post. To comment on something you clearly know very little about makes you look...silly.

[texshelters]

83. That is not true

Obama has won primaries and caucuses all over the country.

Why doesn't the Clinton campaign come up with a counter proposal on how a re-vote should be run? Because she won't win even delegate to bridge the delegate gap. Instead she says, I won, I won, I won and no one else was on the playing field. Not have a new election and just counting the results as they are are Clinton's only hopes of catching up.

Tex Shelters

[texshelters]

82. At least he is proposing ways to vote

not saying he won in a non-election. Why doesn't the Clinton campaign come up with a counter proposal on how a re-vote should be run? Because she won't win even delegate to bridge the delegate gap. Instead she says, I won, I won, I won and no one else was on the playing field.

Tex Shelters

[pedo]

37. you actually buy that load of crap?

they all agreed it wouldn't count. she just admitted it for fuck sake. did you not hear what she said? even if you support her you have to admit this is pathetic and sleazy. if you don't you only expose your own blind loyalty and irrational bias.

and taking his name off a ballot that wasn't going to count was strategically a very smart decision.

[BearSquirrel2]

47. Hillary supporters ...

Do you guys ever get home and watch the news to the fresh carnage and wonder why it is that she makes your job so damn hard!!!

Seriously, isn't this particular candidate too much work. They haven't even STARTED bringing up the old Clinton stuff yet? Why are you people such masochists.

We appreciate many of the things Bill Clinton did in leading our nation. We were sorely disappointed in others. Instead of picking Clinton's "other half" isn't it just better to start fresh with someone with excellent insight and judgment rather that someone who has deep political ties with Bill's mistakes???

Finally, if experience is the best indicator I suggest you cart out Strom Thurmon and make him president. Clearly judgment is important. And in a game where you basically manage the people who run the country (cabinet secretaries) being able to judge what they tell you is paramount. It trumps experience by a long shot.

[bowens43]

60. the decision was made by the party.

Hillary is scum and anyone who defends what she said in this interview is just as bad.

[texshelters]

81. At least he is proposing ways to vote

not saying he won in a non-election. Why doesn't the Clinton campaign come up with a counter proposal on how a re-vote should be run? Because she won't win even delegate to bridge the delegate gap. Instead she says, I won, I won, I won and no one else was on the playing field.

Tex Shelters

[Chisox08]

44. Do you trust the mail service enough to handle your vote?

I don't, being from Chicago I don't even trust the board of elections with my vote. Having a mail in vote for the entire state is asking for voter fraud and and vote tampering. If there is a secure way to do a re-vote then I'm all for it.

Michigan and Florida broke the rules of the Democratic party and moved their primaries ahead of the "Super Tuesday". As a result of this rule breaking they stated that those votes won't count months before they even held their primaries Michigan and Florida had plenty of time to change the date of their primaries, but they didn't. The issue over those votes didn't come up until Hillary saw that she couldn't come close to winning without those votes.

They either need to have a fair re-vote or don't count they Michigan and Florida votes at all. Obama wasn't even on the ballot in Michigan because they had an agreement that they wouldn't participate in Michigan's primary only Hillary decided not to take her name off of the ballot. In Florida they all agreed not to campaign out in that state but Hillary did claiming it was for a fund raiser right before the primaries and also she was down in Florida on the night of the primary.

[maryallen]

85. Michigan NEVER BELONGED to Hillary.

The entire Michigan primary was a no-go from the start because Michigan BROKE THE RULES set by the DNC.
Hillary signed the agreement not to campaign nor PARTICIPATE in the election.
Hence, she broke her word.

Therefore, the entire election was illegal and NOBODY can LEGALLY claim victory.

[On the Road]

15. This Looks Really, Really Bad for Her

The position on Michigan actually bothers me more than anything else Clinton has said or done up to now. Bar none. It just smacks of disregard for the rules, false outrage, and self-serving argument.

Supporting a position that doesn't benefit you simply because it's the right decision is an earmark of integrity. Clinton has completely failed that test, and it kinds of shocks me. I thought better of her.

Clinton might get an agreement from Dean and Obama in Florida, but with only one major candidate on the ballot, Michigan's results are completely invalid. Clinton wants to be rewarded for breaking the rules when most candidates followed them, and cannot seem to understand why that's a bad idea or why anyone should object.

It's important for the party to attempt a re-voting solution, and it would be good for Obama to support that effort. But in the end, in Michigan, doing nothing is better than sitting the current delegates.

[BearSquirrel2]

48. Strange how ...

It's so strange how Hillary Clinton is proud of her giant victory over "None of the Above".

[JAbuchan08]

71. agreed.

Even her IWR vote could be forgiven (if not forgotten) if she just admitted that it was in poor judgement.

This, however; is poor sportsmanship and changing the rules in the middle of the game - commonly known as CHEATING.

[Yes We Did]

16. Are you kidding me? Wow, she is a monster, isn't she?

[BrklynGreenDog]

18. WTF? Obamania must have made your brains explode.

What are you people talking about? She said the primary should be completely redone or counted as is ie. NOT change the rules or results. She got 55% then and she's polling 57% now. She would be getting less than she could, but you scream injustice! And one point she did not raise, it was Obama who covertly pressured everyone else to withdraw their names but never even bothered to contact the Clinton campaign. Talk about down and dirty...

I swear, if HRC called Jesus an exemplar of human behavior you'd be crucifying her for dissing those who believe in his divinity and every other religion.

You people are truly sick and are the worst thing about his campaign. Worse, you perpetuate the right wing myth that all Democrats are loons and too disorganized to sanely run their own party let alone the country. Check out their sites if you don't believe this is now a major RW talking point.

[ProfessorPlum]

21. Listen to the interview

She says that even if it is not redone, the results as they stand NOW are fair. Even she can't believe that.

[babylonsister]

24. And, after saying this last October:

Clinton's Broken Promise

by BooMan
Thu Mar 13th, 2008 at 11:21:10 AM EST

Way back in October of 2007, someone in New Hampshire asked Clinton if it wasn't just politics as usual, saying one thing and doing another, that she hadn't taken her name off the Michigan ballot.

As the only top tier Democrat remaining on Michigan ballot, Clinton is all but guaranteed to win the state's primary. Michigan is tentatively slated to send 156 delegates to the 2008 Democratic National Convention, but national party officials have threatened to take away those delegates if the state persists in holding its primary on Jan. 15.

"It's clear, this election they're having is not going to count for anything," Clinton said Thursday during an interview on New Hampshire Public Radio's call-in program, "The Exchange." "But I just personally did not want to set up a situation where the Republicans are going to be campaigning between now and whenever, and then after the nomination, we have to go in and repair the damage to be ready to win Michigan in 2008."

snip//

None of that empty talk explained why she wanted her name on the ballot in a contest that 'is not going to count for anything.' She agreed not to campaign or advertise in Michigan, and she agreed that the contest wouldn't count. A lot of people smelled a rat back in October, and they were right to smell a rat.

Hillary Clinton says the results of Michigan's Democratic presidential primary should count, even if Barack Obama's name did not appear on the ballot.

"That was his choice," she says in an interview with Steve Inskeep. "There was no rule or requirement that he take his name off the ballot. His supporters ran a very aggressive campaign to try to get people to vote uncommitted."

It was not only Obama's choice, but the choice of Joe Biden, Bill Richardson, and John Edwards. But why does the choice matter? As Clinton acknowledged three months before the Michigan contest, 'It's clear, this election they're having is not going to count for anything.' If it was 'clear', then having your name on the ballot didn't matter any more than not having your name on the ballot.

more...

http://www.boomantribune.com/story/2008/3/13/112111/267

[BrklynGreenDog]

46. Hillary was not the only candidate on the ballot - Obama bowed to Iowa

Obama didn't want to piss off Iowa and NH, but OH NO thats not politics.

http://thinkonthesethings.wordpress.com/2007/12/19/wheres-obama-michigan-voters-realize-all-candidates-arent-on-their-ballot/http://thinkonthesethings.wordpress.com/2007/12/19/wheres-obama-michigan-voters-realize-all-candidates-arent-on-their-ballot/

And the reason he could ignore the rights of voters and piss off Michigan to protect the high-holly right of Iowa?

http://www.pollster.com/08-MI-Dem-Pres-Primary.php

[digidigido]

52. you miss the point

It wasn't about Iowa, it was about playing by the rules, it was agreeing to behave
in unity, with every other candiate, according to the wishes of the
Democratic Party. Hllary as usual behaved in the interests of the "What's in It for
Hillary" party.

[BrklynGreenDog]

92. So you're Hillary's shrink she confides in?

How is it that everyone else knows how Hillary works? She didn't campaign in either state to honor the wishes of the party, which is simply irrefutable. Your statement is clearly wrong. Yet you take the impossible as proof of some nefarious motive on her part. Name ONE politician who campaigns and doesn't want to win.

[indimuse]

26. WOW! Thank you!

:headbang: :woohoo: :applause: :yourock:

[BuyingThyme]

28. Yes, thanks for bringing Puke talking points to the forum.

Fantastic.

[indimuse]

29. only pukes if it's pro

Hillary...sarc.

[pedo]

40. you're very grateful to the republican poster

is it because you know your argument is weak and need all the help you can get?

all he did was name call. "you people are truly sick..." "perpetuate the myth that all democrats are loons" and he made an accusation without proof that is irrelevant even if it was true. (covertly pressured)

and you thank him for it

[texshelters]

87. So the Obama supporters belong to a cult?

That photo collage of Clinton looks like an alter to a religious figure. I don't need to hear about the "cult or Obama" anymore. A photo collage is not an argument, it's idol worship. Which is fine by me, but no more about the "Obama cult", okay. There's no credibility and it gives Republicans a talking point in the fall.

Tex Shelters

[milkyway]

31. Where did you get that Clinton is polling at 57% in Michigan right now? There's been a

couple of recent polls showing it about even.

[peace13]

33. Welcome to DU.

Have a nice stay.

[TomBall Democrat]

36. Can you possibly stay away from personal attacks

I already dislike your candidate.

Personal attacks on fellow DUers is against the rules.

Yes, AGAINST THE RULES.

There are rules in the Democratic Party. Rules for this forum.

It's not personal - it's not about my intelligence. It's about her ability to understand and follow the rules of the game.

That's the issue - not my ablity to choose a candidate.

[babylonsister]

42. Two points, and chill out, dude.

Obama wasn't alone in withdrawing; prove he covertly pressured anyone. They were honoring the wishes of the DNC because the state's Dem party didn't want to abide by primary rules.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/10/09/michigan.primary/index.html

Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois, Sen. Joe Biden of Delaware, New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, former Sen. John Edwards of North Carolina, and Rep. Dennis Kucinich of Ohio all announced the move Tuesday, the deadline for filing such paperwork.

The feud between the Michigan Democratic Party and the DNC comes as the Republicans face off in a presidential debate in Dearborn, Michigan.

Under Democratic National Committee rules, only Iowa, Nevada, New Hampshire and South Carolina are allowed to hold primaries before February 5.

But Michigan Democrats moved their state's primary date to January in an effort to increase the state's influence in the nominee selection process, arguing Iowa and New Hampshire unfairly dominate the process.

******************

And your gal Hillary said this way back in October 07. Now she's backtracking?

http://www.boomantribune.com/story/2008/3/13/112111/267

Way back in October of 2007, someone in New Hampshire asked Clinton if it wasn't just politics as usual, saying one thing and doing another, that she hadn't taken her name off the Michigan ballot.

As the only top tier Democrat remaining on Michigan ballot, Clinton is all but guaranteed to win the state's primary. Michigan is tentatively slated to send 156 delegates to the 2008 Democratic National Convention, but national party officials have threatened to take away those delegates if the state persists in holding its primary on Jan. 15.

"It's clear, this election they're having is not going to count for anything," Clinton said Thursday during an interview on New Hampshire Public Radio's call-in program, "The Exchange." "But I just personally did not want to set up a situation where the Republicans are going to be campaigning between now and whenever, and then after the nomination, we have to go in and repair the damage to be ready to win Michigan in 2008."

[BearSquirrel2]

49. I got news for you ...

Are you blind? I got news for you. Every time Obama touched down in a state he swung it ten points.

You're the type of person who would have a gymnastic competition with one competitor. The judges would just hold up numbers to empty apparatus.

Every candidate made a CHOICE to sign a pledge to abide by the rules. Obama followed through on that pledge and removed his name from te Michigan ballot according to the rules. Hillary chose to cherry pick and leave her name there (along with Kucinich).

The idea that this result could be allowed is completely desperate and Rovian. She should just drop out now and save herself the embarrassment. No Michigan democratic convention delegates were selected by rules. There are no delegates at this point. Michigan needs to hold a vote to select those delegates.

[bowens43]

62. another newbie for clinton trying to spin shit into gold.

HOw much does her campaign pay you guys to look so foolish?

[humbled_opinion]

68. Are you ok?

Hillary is stealing the primary right under your nose but she will not get away with it. The will of the people is to have Barrack Obama as the nominee. If she steals it I will support Obama as a third party candidate and I will never vote for her. I guess the Clintons don't need to be in the WH to get a BJ they can just stop by your house.

[DangerDave921]

89. Whose brain has exploded?

Can you really make an intellectually honest argument that the Michigan results should stand as is? When Obama was not even on the ballot? I'd love to hear that one!

In other breaking news, Tab announces that it won a national taste test as best cola. (See footnote)

Footnote: Tab was the only cola tasted in this taste-test.

[BigD_95]

20. this isnt true

It cant be. She cant be that much of a ass.

[rniel]

22. And anyone who disagrees

Hates women!!

[TomBall Democrat]

39. HA! HA!

Sounds a bit like,

anyone who isn't for the war is un-American.

Bush-like or Bush-lite? Which appellation best describes the senator from NY?

[humbled_opinion]

69. She is of course Bush's long lost sister.....

:eyes:

[Juche]

25. $10 says she will support 'winner take all' rules soon

I bet by May she comes up with a new rule that the big states like NY, CA, NJ are not supposed to award delegates proportionally, but to award them in a winner take all form like the GOP does.

[galadrium]

30. She seriously needs to switch parties

[FiveGoodMen]

32. She already has. She just hasn't announced it yet.

[NorthCarolina]

70. She represents the DLC within the Democratic Party

so there's absolutely no need for her to "switch parties" since she's already essentially a Republican in terms of her political ideology. If you seek to return the Democratic Party to one that actually offers a contrast to Republicans then you should research whether your Congress member or State Senators are DLC members, and if so....vote them out.

[XemaSab]

96. When Howard Dean said he represented the Democratic wing of the Democratic party

who do you suppose represented the Republican wing?

Think on that, Hillbots.

[knitter4democracy]

34. From this Michigander, thanks, but no thanks, Hil.

The primary was a joke. We had the lowest turnout I've ever seen. It was terrible. As far as I'm concerned, the primary results are null and void.

That campaign of Obama's that she referenced wasn't anywhere near as coordinated as the Hillary campaign from the party higher-ups. It's disgusting that she even brought it up. Conyers and his wife did that to try to get the message through to the state party higher-ups that Michigan's vote's not for sale to the highest bidder and to try to keep it fair, to let people know that they could vote for another option.

Hillary didn't fight for us when it mattered. Now that she needs us, she's pretending to care. The reality is, she doesn't give a crap about our state, so she should take her sob story somewhere else.

The only fair thing is a totally new election. If everyone decides they can't afford that (it is a big waste of money when we're up against McCain), then we should follow the rules and not seat any of Michigan's delegates. We all voted believing that our votes had been taken away from us, so our votes were purely symbolic. Many didn't vote because of that. Even 50-50 isn't fair, considering that some of us voted for Dodd, Kucinich, and even Gravel (he got some), unless those guys throw theirs in with Obama. Even still, it was a sham of a primary and shouldn't count.

Once we get our nominee, though, that person had better hurry up to Michigan, do some apologizing that the Party screwed us all over (yes, our state leaders were schmucks, but the DNC should've seen through that Rove tactic), and start building up a campaign base here.

[BearSquirrel2]

50. Just hold caucuses ...

Look, Michigan needs to select legal delegates. If they don't, they get ZERO representation at the convention. That would be a great tragedy and would likely set back their goal to break the early states monopoly.

[TomBall Democrat]

35. Why the right hates her?

is something I could never understand.

For years, I've defended her as misunderstood, over-eager, rough around the edges- give her time, she'll learn not to ruffle everyone's feathers.

Turns out she's not capable of listening, moderating her tone, following the rules.

Does she think we've been ASLEEP for 16 years? Do we not remember the mess she made of health care before?

And now, wrong is right - if if turns out her way. Will she cry again if she loses?

My God, how could I ever have liked this monster?

I was for Obama long before I was against Hillary. But she drove me to AGAINST. Yes, AGAINST her.

[skyounkin]

51. The right

hates her because she is an easy figure to polarize. She is the picture of "militant feminist" in their eyes and it's easy image to sell to the kool aid drinkers as such.

Ignoring all the other facts about her- some just hate her because she is an "uppity woman"

Eh......

I'm sick of her and want her and her husband to shut up and go back to Arkansas.

[JAbuchan08]

72. THey also hated the Clintons because they co-opted their issues

in such away that they were palatable to middle America.

[Hamlette]

43. When asked in October why she didn't take her name off the ballot she said

it was because MI wasn't going to count for anything so it didn't matter.

She is pissing me off. I used to think I liked them both but the last two weeks are pushing me over the edge.

At least I have now answered a question that always troubled me: Why do they hate the Clintons?

This is why. This kind of dishonesty.

I'm sick of defending her.

[MindMatter]

45. Talking straight out of her ass

On one hand she says that the phony non-election should count.

Then not 10 seconds later she says the only fair solution is a complete do-over. What kind of bullshit is that?

A do-over would be just fine with Obama too. But there is the issue of the cost of the election.

Next she is going to say that Obama should have to pay for the do-over because he's the one who didn't get his name on the ballot. Hillary's already got her votes. If Obama wants his, then he should pay for the do-over.

Wait a minute. That makes as much sense as anything else she has said in the last 8 weeks.

Maybe Geraldine Ferraro can help us out here. According to Geraldine, Obama should be able to call on all the wealthy over-privileged black people to drop a little of their pocket change on poor disadvantages Hillary to fund this do-over.

Lewis Carroll has nothing on the Clintons.

[BlueJac]

53. What a loser and a cheater..........

Do people really want more of GW Bush? He is a loser and a cheater!

[From The Left]

54. Hillary is Due a Crying Jag

[navarth]

55. She's disappointing this Mich. voter more and more

I'm trying to remember the differences between her behavior and Bu$h's

This sucks. I've been able to overlook her voting record (with difficulty) but she's making it harder and harder.

If you're going to win something, do it fair and square. Otherwise, do something to help!!

[Quixote1818]

57. She can't be this stupid. A fucking 3 year old would understand that is not fair

What a NUT!!!! She have become as bad as Bush.

[krkaufman]

58. What about all those voters, both in MIchigan and FLorida...

... that their primaries wouldn't be counted, and so didn't vote. Seating of the delegates as-is would disenfranchise all those voters who were then, effectively, lied to.

[bowens43]

59. how can anyone support this ridculous , arrogant , foolish woman.

she is horrible, just horrible.

[Apollo11]

61. Hillary says she would be happy to have a "complete re-do of the primary"

She makes this statement very clearly at the end of the audio clip.

[bowens43]

63. of course she would

but that wasn't what she agreed to. Now that she's losing she's changed her made.

she is scum.

[arewenotdemo]

94. True, and I find that curious as I expect Obama would win.

[Infinite Hope]

66. What do these words have in common: Bush, Deibold, Rove, Hillary Clinton?

[speedoo]

67. K&R. To help reveal this monster Hillary.

Yeah, she's a monster, with blood on her hands. And I'm being kind.

[Capt. America]

74. Personal power over party. Shameful.

[against all enemies]

75. Is this another SNL skit? She really couldn't have said such bullshit.

[catbyte]

78. What a load. I live in MI

and DID NOT vote for the first time since I was 18 (I'm 52 y/o Ojibwa, French/Irish woman) last January, because everyone said it was meaningless because MI broke the rules and the delegates wouldn't be seated. My husband and I figured it was pointless, so why waste the gasoline and contribute more to Global Warming to go to the polls? We are quite political and so are our friends. I don't know anyone who voted. Not only did everyone (except the MDC chair) say the vote would be meaningless, there were only 2 choices: Hillary Clinton or Undecided. How in the hell can Clinton say it was fair? It's ludicrous. I was not a big Obama supporter (I was for Gore), but I haven't been impressed with Clinton since her health insurance fiasco in 1992-93. She was arrogant and then completely caved when the plan was met with derision. She didn't fight for us then, and I don't believe that she will fight much for us now. She's never really put up a serious fight since then as far as I've seen, save for this primary season. Even then, I wonder if she would have run if she knew how difficult it was going to be. She expected a coronation and, instead, backed into a buzzsaw. She has reverted to Republican tactics, which makes me actually queasy. For her to even remotely resemble a Republican after the years of hell we've gone through is inexcusible. I can't forgive Bill for pardoning that sleazeball Marc Rich while letting Leonard Peltier rot in jail. If Hillary was co-president as she wants us to believe, then she agreed with this decision and I can't forgive her. If Bill did it alone, then she's dishonest by having us think that she was in on all major decisions. Why did she vote for Kyl-Lieberman and Cluster Bombs? I suspect it was because she figured that she could get away with it because the Dem. primary season was going to be a cakewalk and it would play well in the Red States in the general. That tells me she is just another calculating politician who won't vote the morally right choice. Why didn't she bother to show up for the Telecom bill vote when she was right in the area? Obama and McCain managed to get to Capitol Hill. Can Clinton supporters help me out here and explain these things to me? Don't just call me names or bring up Obama. This thread isn't about Obama. It's about Clinton. Sorry, I digress.

There is NO WAY the election in Michigan was fair. She LIED, either in that NPR interview, or when she signed that DNC agreement. Either way, she's dishonest and disingenous. I'm so tired of the parsing, triangulating, and tip-toeing-around-reality, I just can't tell you. At least Obama is showing some integrity and a grip on reality.

Clinton has offended me so much that if she manages to wrangle her way to the nomination, I'm tempted to stay home in November. I probably won't, because at this point, anyone with a D after their name is better than an R, but I'm really sick of holding my nose while I vote. I hope I won't have to do that in November.

Diane :mad:

"Tales of the hunt will glorify the hunter until lions have their own historians." Author Unknown

[stray cat]

84. Thats my problem with the results in both MI and FL

If you announce an election or an exam won't count most people won't waste their time. You can't suddenly change the rules after the fact and say I like the results so they will count.

[GOTV]

86. It's difficult to take her seriously when she takes me for an idiot n/t

[L0oniX]

90. Get off the crack pipe, Hillarat.

:hide:

[Veracious]

91. 1st Election I vote Republican

If Hillary steals the nomination Ill have to vote Republican - we know McCain will be bad, but Hillary will slink around pretending to be a progressive.

[BrklynGreenDog]

93. Pretending to be progressive by voting for progressive legislation

How evil and deceptive of her.

Really, do think either candidate is going to veto legislation from a Democratic lead House and Senate? That they're proposing health care plans because they're secret reactionaries? Promising to withdraw troops only because they're planning their own wars? What? What is it?

Please get a grip and learn that if you preferred candidate does not win you do no one any good by sulking off or worse, supporting the true opposition.

[XemaSab]

97. The most GALLING part for me are the cries of "voter disenfranchisement"

She didn't seem so goddamned concerned about voter disenfranchisement in 2000 or 2004.

And this f***s up the whole issue of voter reform and turns it into a big goddamned joke.

It's right in there with Ferraro claiming that she's being persecuted because she's white.

:grr: