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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:26 PM
Original message
Why does the Democratic party support H-1b visas?

(re-posted from economy section, this is more a labor issue)

it's wage suppression, plain and simple

Clinton, Edwards and Obama all support raising the H-1b visa cap, from it's already high level

Clinton works with Indian outsourcer TATA, Edwards co-sponsored a huge h-1b increase during the tech crash

it's a sellout of working people, period

i've quit voting since 2000 - i stay home on election day and just watch the people who sell me out lose

what are we going to do about this?

I cant believe they havent changed their positions, with the economy plunging into recession

one way to help people in a recession, is to not glut the economy with hundreds of thousands of more workers


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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:30 PM
Response to Original message
1. You don't vote? Those that win, do they not sell you out?
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 12:39 PM by uppityperson
I have a hard time discussing issues with people who don't vote and ask "what are we going to do about this".

You wrote elsewhere on DU that you hadn't voted since 1996. So you didn't bother to vote against mrbush even the first time, eh?

"28. This is why I haven't voted since 1996"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=3143349#3144121
I find interesting stuff on that topic by you.
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. that doesnt mean I'm not politically active
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 12:42 PM by ornbudsman
I've contacted every candidate and every one of my reps ever since i stopped voting

I dont say to them, 'take me seriously, or I'll vote for you anyway'

One of them DID take me seriously, of all people, Republican Chuck Grassley (along with Dick Durbin and Bernie Sanders)



12/06/2007

Senator Grassley sponsored H-1B Supplemental Fee legislation which the Senate passed but collapsed. In the "unrelated" "Farm" Bill session, the Senator requested a ten-minute time and made the following statement on the Senate floor.

Mr. President, earlier this year, the Senate tried to solve the very complex and emotional issue of immigration reform. The immigration bill we considered included border security, interior enforcement, and amnesty. It also included many needed reforms to our legal immigration process. I said throughout the debate that Congress needs a long-term solution to the immigration issue. We cannot pass a bandaid approach that includes a path to citizenship for law breakers; rather, Congress needs to improve our legal immigration channels. I firmly believe companies want to hire legal workers, and people want to enter the United States legally. If we fix our visa policies, we can restore integrity to our immigration system, and all parties can benefit.

But if we cannot pass a comprehensive bill--and I think as time goes on it is going to look more difficult as we go into an election year--if we cannot pass such a comprehensive bill, I think that we should consider passing legislation we can agree on. I am taking the floor at this time to talk about the H-1B visa provisions that were included in the immigration bill and ask my colleagues to take a second look at these needed reforms. Many companies use H-1B programs. It has served a valuable purpose. But we need to reevaluate how this program operates and work to make it more effective.

The H-1B program was officially created in 1990, although we have brought foreign workers legally into our country for over 30 years. It was brought into existence to serve American employers that needed high-tech workers. It was created to file a void in the U.S. labor force. The visa holders were intended to file jobs for a temporary amount of time, while the country invested in American workers to pick up the skills our economy needed. We attached fees to the visas that now bring in millions of dollars. These fees and the dollars that come with it are invested in training grants to educate our own workforce. We use the funds to put kids through school for science, technology, engineering, and math skills. We provide students with scholarships with the hope that they will replace imported foreign workers. Unfortunately, the H-1B program is so popular, it is now replacing the U.S. labor force rather than supplementing it.

The high-tech and business community is begging Congress to raise or eliminate the annual cap that currently stands at 85,000 visas each year. These numbers do not include and account for those who are exempt from the cap. For instance, we don't count employees at institutions of higher education or nonprofit research organizations. We don't count those who change jobs or renew their H-1B visa. My point is, we have many more than 85,000 H-1B visas distributed each year. I am here to tell my colleagues that increasing the visa supply is not the only solution to the so-called shortage of high-tech workers. Since March of this year, the Senator from Illinois, Mr. Durbin, and I have taken a good look at the H-1B visa program. We have raised issues with the Citizenship and Immigration Service as well as the Department of Labor. We have asked questions of companies that use the H-1B visa, and I have raised issues with attorneys who advise their clients on how to get around the permanent employment regulations.

I would like to share what I have learned. I want to give some fraud and abuse examples. Unfortunately, there are some bad apples in the H-1B visa program. In 2005, a man was charged with fraud and misuse of visas, money laundering, and mail fraud for his participation in a multistate scam to smuggle Indian and Pakistani nationals into the United States with fraudulently obtained H-1B visas. The man created fictitious companies, often renting only a cubicle simply to have a mailing address. He fabricated tax returns and submitted over 1,000 false visa petitions. Another man pled guilty last August to charges of fraud and conspiracy. This man and an attorney charged foreign nationals thousands of dollars to fraudulently obtain H-1B visas. He provided false documents to substantiate their H-1B petitions.

The Programmer's Guild, a group representing U.S. worker interests, filed over 300 discrimination complaints in the first half of 2006 against companies that posted ``H-1B visa holder only'' ads on job boards. Anyone can go on the Internet and find jobs that target H-1B visa holders. There are more than just national anecdotes, however. Everyday Americans are affected. Since looking into the H-1B visa program, some of my constituents have come to me and spoken out against abuses they see. One of my constituents has shared copies of e-mails showing how he is often bombarded with requests by companies that want to lease their H-1B workers to that Iowan. There are companies with H-1B workers who are so-called ``on the bench,'' meaning they are ready to be deployed to a project. Hundreds of foreign workers are standing by waiting for work. Some call these H-1B ``factory firms.'' This Iowan even said one company went so far as to require him to sign a memorandum of understanding that helps the H-1B factory firm justify to the Federal Government that they have adequate business opportunity that requires additional visa holders. It is a complete falsification of the market justification for additional H-1B workers. These firms are making a commodity out of H-1B workers.

They have visa holders but are looking for work. It is supposed to be the other way around. There should be a shortage or a need, first and foremost. Then and only then do we allow foreign workers to fill these jobs temporarily. Another constituent sent me a letter saying that he saw firsthand how foreign workers were brought in while Iowans with similar qualifications were let go. He tells me he is a computer professional with over 20 years experience. He was laid off and has yet to find a job. He states: I believe has a history of hiring H-1B computer personnel at the expense of qualified American citizens. Another Iowan from Cedar Falls wrote in support of our review of the H-1B program. He is a computer programmer with a master's degree and over 20 years of work experience in that field. He says: Despite all of my qualifications, in the last four years I have applied to over 3,700 positions and have received no job offers. He believes he is in constant competition with H-1B visa holders.

I received a letter from a man in Arizona who works for a company that employs dozens of H-1B workers. When he asked his supervisor why so many foreign nationals were being hired, the head of human resources said: If the company has an American and a person from India, both with the same skill set, the company will hire the person from India because they can pay them less. These are firsthand stories from U.S. workers. I ask those begging for an increase in foreign workers to explain these cases to me. Why are Americans struggling to get jobs as software developers, data processors, and program analysts? Senator Durbin and I inquired with several foreign-based companies that use the H-1B program. Rather than sending a letter to all companies that use the program, which would be over 200 companies, we decided to start our investigation with foreign-based entities. Our intention was to learn how foreign companies are using our visas. We learned that the top nine foreign-based companies used 20,000 visas in 2006.

Think of what a high percentage that is of the 85,000, just nine foreign-based companies, 20,000 visas in the year 2006. I say that twice for emphasis. It just so happens that Indian companies are using one-third of the available visas we allocate each year, but there is more to learn. We are not done asking questions. We, meaning Senator Durbin and I, continue to talk to U.S.-based companies and companies in our own States that use the program. The Citizenship and Immigration Service also has concerns. Our review has prompted discussion among the executive branch, businesses, labor unions, and workers, and workers are the ones we are concerned about. So we are not the only ones asking questions.

The U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Service is also worried about fraud in the program. This agency's investigative arm, that subdivision called the Fraud Detection and National Security unit, is doing a fraud assessment of the H-1B and L visa programs. I asked the unit to brief my staff on their work, and they reported they are not finished with analyzing the data. Senator Collins of Maine and I put the agency on notice that we are anxiously awaiting this report so we may continue our quest to reform the program appropriately. In the meantime, the bill Senator Durbin and I introduced includes measures to rein in the abuse. It goes a long ways to close some loopholes to protect American workers. It is our hope that these measures will bring the program back to its original mission; that is, to help U.S.-based companies find highly skilled workers to fill the shortage for a temporary period of time. That is what the H-1B visa program is all about. Under current law, companies can bring in foreign workers on an H-1B visa without first attempting to hire an American.

Our bill would require every employer to attest that it is not displacing a U.S. worker by hiring an H-1B visa holder and that the employer has taken good-faith steps to recruit U.S. workers for the jobs in which an H-1B visa holder is being sought. Why would anyone oppose this measure? Our bill also gives more oversight and investigative authority to the Department of Labor. Right now the Department may only review labor certification for ``clear indication of fraud and misrepresentation.'' The Secretary of Labor is unable to review applications for anything but what the law calls incompleteness and cannot initiate an investigation unless requested. This means the Labor Department in effect is required to turn a blind eye to information that is suspicious.

To remedy this problem, our bill provides the Department of Labor the ability to initiate an investigation on its own and gives the Department of Labor more time to review applications. The Department could also do random audits of any company that uses the program. Aside from these measures, our bill would prohibit employers to only advertise available jobs to H-1B visa holders. It would encourage information sharing between the Department of Labor and the Department of Homeland Security. It would double the penalties for employer noncompliance with the H-1B program requirements. I am happy to report that most of these commonsense solutions were included in the immigration bill. I challenge any of my colleagues to oppose these needed reforms before we talk about increasing the number of H-1B visas or at the very least in conjunction with that process.

Today I take the floor to tell my colleagues that I am willing to work on this issue before the end of the year. I know businesses want more visas. I know groups that represent workers and visa holders want reforms. I know the American people want a sensible system in place that gives their children a chance at these highly skilled jobs. Some of my colleagues think the solution is increasing the annual cap on H-1B visas and doing nothing else. Before we agree to import more foreign workers, let's restore integrity in this H-1B program. The system needs a makeover. I am willing to consider an increase in the H-1B visa supply, but only if reforms are included. We must fix the loopholes before we just allow more foreign workers to come in and take jobs that Americans want to do. I would think my colleagues would want this program to work as it was intended by its original authors. My colleagues should want to protect the jobs of our various constituencies and help our businesses find the workers they truly need.



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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Yup, just don't vote. That'll teach them. Did you stop 1996 or 2000?
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. i voted for clinton in 1996
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 12:53 PM by ornbudsman
i was a perot voter in 1992. arguably, it's perot voters that took the election from bush, and got clinton up to bat

i didnt like clinton's globalization push, like nafta, but the deficit was improving, so credit where credit is due, i voted clinton in 1996

but gore and bush stood at podiums in 2000 saying we needed h-1bs when i was between jobs. i finally got a job, but had to travel out of state to get it

was i expected to travel back home (on a workday from a new client) to vote for a guy who put me on the road in the first place (because the job market sucked, my apartment was filling up with people from india, working across the street at a re-insurance place i had worked as a consultant, that no longer hired americans)
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #6
20. and how is not voting working out for you?
Are things better? You going to continue not voting? Why?
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. yes, i've made things better
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 02:45 PM by ornbudsman
sure, had I voted in 2004, we could have had a slightly better skull and bones bonesman (Kerry), who's actual positions and voting record on the things that count (globalization, patriot act and war) are so similar to Bush that he actually had to 'deny' that he was 'Bush-Lite'. Whooptydoo. But a visit to every candidate and every representative resulted in at least ONE of them listening to me, and he read the following on the Senate floor. He's one of nine on the senate immigration committee, and ironically, because he's a republican, he's taken more seriously, the implication being that if it's so bad that even a REPUBLICAN gets whats being done to working people, it's gone TOO FAR, which it most certainly has - it's indentured servitude!

I've never voted republican, ever, but i'll make an exception for Grassley - he EARNED it

the only reason I went to Grassley, is because I went to every single one of them, I went to him last just so I could say to myself I went to them all, I thought he would be the last one to listen, and to my shock he was the only one who did

It's not wrong to go on a voting strike, IF you tell every candidate WHY

you dont make things better by being silent about fraud and betrayal, you make things better by confronting it - by any means necessary

12/06/2007

Senator Grassley sponsored H-1B Supplemental Fee legislation which the Senate passed but collapsed. In the "unrelated" "Farm" Bill session, the Senator requested a ten-minute time and made the following statement on the Senate floor.

Mr. President, earlier this year, the Senate tried to solve the very complex and emotional issue of immigration reform. The immigration bill we considered included border security, interior enforcement, and amnesty. It also included many needed reforms to our legal immigration process. I said throughout the debate that Congress needs a long-term solution to the immigration issue. We cannot pass a bandaid approach that includes a path to citizenship for law breakers; rather, Congress needs to improve our legal immigration channels. I firmly believe companies want to hire legal workers, and people want to enter the United States legally. If we fix our visa policies, we can restore integrity to our immigration system, and all parties can benefit.

But if we cannot pass a comprehensive bill--and I think as time goes on it is going to look more difficult as we go into an election year--if we cannot pass such a comprehensive bill, I think that we should consider passing legislation we can agree on. I am taking the floor at this time to talk about the H-1B visa provisions that were included in the immigration bill and ask my colleagues to take a second look at these needed reforms. Many companies use H-1B programs. It has served a valuable purpose. But we need to reevaluate how this program operates and work to make it more effective.

The H-1B program was officially created in 1990, although we have brought foreign workers legally into our country for over 30 years. It was brought into existence to serve American employers that needed high-tech workers. It was created to file a void in the U.S. labor force. The visa holders were intended to file jobs for a temporary amount of time, while the country invested in American workers to pick up the skills our economy needed. We attached fees to the visas that now bring in millions of dollars. These fees and the dollars that come with it are invested in training grants to educate our own workforce. We use the funds to put kids through school for science, technology, engineering, and math skills. We provide students with scholarships with the hope that they will replace imported foreign workers. Unfortunately, the H-1B program is so popular, it is now replacing the U.S. labor force rather than supplementing it.

The high-tech and business community is begging Congress to raise or eliminate the annual cap that currently stands at 85,000 visas each year. These numbers do not include and account for those who are exempt from the cap. For instance, we don't count employees at institutions of higher education or nonprofit research organizations. We don't count those who change jobs or renew their H-1B visa. My point is, we have many more than 85,000 H-1B visas distributed each year. I am here to tell my colleagues that increasing the visa supply is not the only solution to the so-called shortage of high-tech workers. Since March of this year, the Senator from Illinois, Mr. Durbin, and I have taken a good look at the H-1B visa program. We have raised issues with the Citizenship and Immigration Service as well as the Department of Labor. We have asked questions of companies that use the H-1B visa, and I have raised issues with attorneys who advise their clients on how to get around the permanent employment regulations.

I would like to share what I have learned. I want to give some fraud and abuse examples. Unfortunately, there are some bad apples in the H-1B visa program. In 2005, a man was charged with fraud and misuse of visas, money laundering, and mail fraud for his participation in a multistate scam to smuggle Indian and Pakistani nationals into the United States with fraudulently obtained H-1B visas. The man created fictitious companies, often renting only a cubicle simply to have a mailing address. He fabricated tax returns and submitted over 1,000 false visa petitions. Another man pled guilty last August to charges of fraud and conspiracy. This man and an attorney charged foreign nationals thousands of dollars to fraudulently obtain H-1B visas. He provided false documents to substantiate their H-1B petitions.

The Programmer's Guild, a group representing U.S. worker interests, filed over 300 discrimination complaints in the first half of 2006 against companies that posted ``H-1B visa holder only'' ads on job boards. Anyone can go on the Internet and find jobs that target H-1B visa holders. There are more than just national anecdotes, however. Everyday Americans are affected. Since looking into the H-1B visa program, some of my constituents have come to me and spoken out against abuses they see. One of my constituents has shared copies of e-mails showing how he is often bombarded with requests by companies that want to lease their H-1B workers to that Iowan. There are companies with H-1B workers who are so-called ``on the bench,'' meaning they are ready to be deployed to a project. Hundreds of foreign workers are standing by waiting for work. Some call these H-1B ``factory firms.'' This Iowan even said one company went so far as to require him to sign a memorandum of understanding that helps the H-1B factory firm justify to the Federal Government that they have adequate business opportunity that requires additional visa holders. It is a complete falsification of the market justification for additional H-1B workers. These firms are making a commodity out of H-1B workers.

They have visa holders but are looking for work. It is supposed to be the other way around. There should be a shortage or a need, first and foremost. Then and only then do we allow foreign workers to fill these jobs temporarily. Another constituent sent me a letter saying that he saw firsthand how foreign workers were brought in while Iowans with similar qualifications were let go. He tells me he is a computer professional with over 20 years experience. He was laid off and has yet to find a job. He states: I believe has a history of hiring H-1B computer personnel at the expense of qualified American citizens. Another Iowan from Cedar Falls wrote in support of our review of the H-1B program. He is a computer programmer with a master's degree and over 20 years of work experience in that field. He says: Despite all of my qualifications, in the last four years I have applied to over 3,700 positions and have received no job offers. He believes he is in constant competition with H-1B visa holders.

I received a letter from a man in Arizona who works for a company that employs dozens of H-1B workers. When he asked his supervisor why so many foreign nationals were being hired, the head of human resources said: If the company has an American and a person from India, both with the same skill set, the company will hire the person from India because they can pay them less. These are firsthand stories from U.S. workers. I ask those begging for an increase in foreign workers to explain these cases to me. Why are Americans struggling to get jobs as software developers, data processors, and program analysts? Senator Durbin and I inquired with several foreign-based companies that use the H-1B program. Rather than sending a letter to all companies that use the program, which would be over 200 companies, we decided to start our investigation with foreign-based entities. Our intention was to learn how foreign companies are using our visas. We learned that the top nine foreign-based companies used 20,000 visas in 2006.

Think of what a high percentage that is of the 85,000, just nine foreign-based companies, 20,000 visas in the year 2006. I say that twice for emphasis. It just so happens that Indian companies are using one-third of the available visas we allocate each year, but there is more to learn. We are not done asking questions. We, meaning Senator Durbin and I, continue to talk to U.S.-based companies and companies in our own States that use the program. The Citizenship and Immigration Service also has concerns. Our review has prompted discussion among the executive branch, businesses, labor unions, and workers, and workers are the ones we are concerned about. So we are not the only ones asking questions.

The U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Service is also worried about fraud in the program. This agency's investigative arm, that subdivision called the Fraud Detection and National Security unit, is doing a fraud assessment of the H-1B and L visa programs. I asked the unit to brief my staff on their work, and they reported they are not finished with analyzing the data. Senator Collins of Maine and I put the agency on notice that we are anxiously awaiting this report so we may continue our quest to reform the program appropriately. In the meantime, the bill Senator Durbin and I introduced includes measures to rein in the abuse. It goes a long ways to close some loopholes to protect American workers. It is our hope that these measures will bring the program back to its original mission; that is, to help U.S.-based companies find highly skilled workers to fill the shortage for a temporary period of time. That is what the H-1B visa program is all about. Under current law, companies can bring in foreign workers on an H-1B visa without first attempting to hire an American.

Our bill would require every employer to attest that it is not displacing a U.S. worker by hiring an H-1B visa holder and that the employer has taken good-faith steps to recruit U.S. workers for the jobs in which an H-1B visa holder is being sought. Why would anyone oppose this measure? Our bill also gives more oversight and investigative authority to the Department of Labor. Right now the Department may only review labor certification for ``clear indication of fraud and misrepresentation.'' The Secretary of Labor is unable to review applications for anything but what the law calls incompleteness and cannot initiate an investigation unless requested. This means the Labor Department in effect is required to turn a blind eye to information that is suspicious.

To remedy this problem, our bill provides the Department of Labor the ability to initiate an investigation on its own and gives the Department of Labor more time to review applications. The Department could also do random audits of any company that uses the program. Aside from these measures, our bill would prohibit employers to only advertise available jobs to H-1B visa holders. It would encourage information sharing between the Department of Labor and the Department of Homeland Security. It would double the penalties for employer noncompliance with the H-1B program requirements. I am happy to report that most of these commonsense solutions were included in the immigration bill. I challenge any of my colleagues to oppose these needed reforms before we talk about increasing the number of H-1B visas or at the very least in conjunction with that process.

Today I take the floor to tell my colleagues that I am willing to work on this issue before the end of the year. I know businesses want more visas. I know groups that represent workers and visa holders want reforms. I know the American people want a sensible system in place that gives their children a chance at these highly skilled jobs. Some of my colleagues think the solution is increasing the annual cap on H-1B visas and doing nothing else. Before we agree to import more foreign workers, let's restore integrity in this H-1B program. The system needs a makeover. I am willing to consider an increase in the H-1B visa supply, but only if reforms are included. We must fix the loopholes before we just allow more foreign workers to come in and take jobs that Americans want to do. I would think my colleagues would want this program to work as it was intended by its original authors. My colleagues should want to protect the jobs of our various constituencies and help our businesses find the workers they truly need.

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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Kerry is "Bush-lite"???? Whooptydoo??? You sem to be campaigning here for a repub.
Why are you on DU?
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onbudsman Donating Member (63 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-30-08 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. did you even consider the topic?
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #1
16. keyword is 'since', I voted clinton in 1996
i was a perot voter in 1992. arguably, it's perot voters that took the election from bush, and got clinton up to bat

i didnt like clinton's globalization push, like nafta, but the deficit was improving, so credit where credit is due, i voted clinton in 1996

but gore and bush stood at podiums in 2000 saying we needed h-1bs when i was between jobs. i finally got a job, but had to travel out of state to get it

was i expected to travel back home (on a workday from a new client) to vote for a guy who put me on the road in the first place (because the job market sucked, my apartment was filling up with people from india, working across the street at a re-insurance place i had worked as a consultant, that no longer hired americans)
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
3. Bush increases have ended and we are back to Clinton era 65,000 - almost all India - "programers"
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:50 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. they were bipartison, signed by clinton
and we're not back to 65,000, there's an additional 20,000 for 'masters only', and unlimited L1 visas well over 100,000
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #8
17. True - the masters and L1 limits are there - but I thought you were discussing H1b? In 1999 the
job creation was 22 million over 8 years with unemployment in the 3% area.

Later attempts to take that laws higher quotas down in light of the job losses in Bush's first year were resisted by Bush.
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. L1 is used interchangeably with H-1b for all practical purposes
and there are no limits

here's an article that sums it up

"

Companies may have found a way around H-1B visa limits
2007's No. 5 most underreported tech story

"

http://www.infoworld.com/article/07/12/28/52FE-underreported-visas_1.html
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. true - executives make sense at the top - but middle management and workers with specialized skills
should follow H1b rules.

The new bill would have capped L1 if I remember correctly - but only by letting the H1B plus L1 total be no higher than 400,000.

Not a decrease.

Bill Gates and the GOP were pushing for 600,000 as I recall.

I do not recall anything getting passed.
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
4. Most Democrats making the decisions have to be removed from office.
They're not there in our best interest, but in the interest of corporations. Like right wingnuts, they will allow the little people to rot without jobs. The only suggestion I have is circulate articles that tell the truth among people, and for people that don't read or don't really understand what the hell they're reading, just tell them what's going on. Maybe through some grass roots movement, we will bring the Democratic Party back to what it ought to be, the party of the people.
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. that's really not true
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 01:14 PM by ornbudsman
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Pelosi doesn't seem to be doing anything except headbobbing to whatever GW Bush wants. nt
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 12:55 PM
Response to Original message
10. Harris Miller ran in the Virginia Senate primary in 2006
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 12:57 PM by ornbudsman
if you know the H-1b issue, it's UNBELIEVABLE that this guy ran as a Democrat, supposedly a party of working people!!!

NOBODY is a bigger enemy of American workers, than him - Harris Miller IS H-1b

here's a flyer Jim Web (who won) made, it seems extreme, but he's absolutely right

http://media.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/metro/documents/webb_flyer_color.pdf

'truley one of the bad guys' says the union

when things are this bad, the party has to be criticized

a party of working people has no business running an outsourcing lobbyist
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:01 PM
Response to Original message
11. watch this short youtube video
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PsN2Wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
12. For those jobs that can't be exported
you import the labor. Lax border enforcement for the unskilled workers, H1Bs for the more skilled positions. It's a win, win for corporations and they use the money they save on wages to invest in the "best congress money can buy", to make certain it continues to their benefit.
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. that is exactly what is happening
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 01:08 PM by ornbudsman
and why it is so terrible

the savings that workers conceed to corporations is only used to buy congress to hurt them more

Bill Gate's gratitude to the people who made him rich is the perfect example
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OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:24 PM
Response to Original message
14. Business and Corporations want to hire people at lower
wages. For example Hi Tech Worker (US) makes 75 K . Bring in Workers
from overseas for 50 K. This is profitable for Corp and Business

GOP is party of business so they will push this and Conservative
Pro Business Demcrats will vote with GOP. Business then supports their
campaigns.

No organized effort to oppose this at activist or grassroots. Congress
will do anything as long as no one cares . To be effective has to
be group or movement initiated.

We continuously contribute to Dems without ever checking to see
where candidates stand on such issues.
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ornbudsman Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. thank you
Edited on Sun Jan-20-08 01:33 PM by ornbudsman
for understanding what i'm trying to say

i've been viciously attacked whenever i say i quit supporting the democratic party over h-1b

but how can we change them, if they take corporate bribes AND still get working people's support?

you think they will still get corporate bribes if they dont deliever to corporations? corporations may be evil, but they're not stupid

so who do politicians screw?

politics is not like ebay

if you lose the auction, you can still pay even if you lose

you have to assurer them you WONT
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. I agree - Met Life and others are using Cognizant as 3rd party IT as Cognizant hires only
H1b's from India (who are not well trained, barely speak English, have skills at the US Sophomore in college level).

That way MET LIFE avoids the charge they are replacing "American" jobs with overseas workers (Hell they even opened an IT center in India as part of their "globalization" ).
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Joanne98 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-20-08 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
23. Because they're assholes!
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Omaha Steve Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-30-08 05:51 PM
Response to Original message
26. Don't tech jobs go out of the country no matter what anyway?

I just got home and saw all this. Programing can be done from any location that is on the net. Correct?

All this traffic is nice. To bad it is over the first real disagreement here.

OS

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onbudsman Donating Member (63 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-30-08 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. yes and no
Edited on Wed Jan-30-08 07:58 PM by onbudsman
'Programing can be done from any location that is on the net. Correct?'

in years of consulting, no client ever let me work off site, because a much more accurate level of work can be done close to the business

H-1b visas are absolutely essential to outsourcing, anyone who's ever been in IT knows you cant just lift the systems 'cold', you have to have people on site for a long time, some permanently. 7 of the 10 largest h-1b users are indian outsourcers

'To bad it is over the first real disagreement here.'

as a 4th generation democrat, i didnt come to the point of criticizing the party easily

but if i have to be quiet about the party's support of blatent wage suppression and discrimination against American workers, then what does a democrat victory really mean?

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onbudsman Donating Member (63 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
28. tech visas may be as high as 400,000 per year now

400,000?

65,000 'regular H-1b'
20,000 'so called master's only'
? number exempt from above cap -> anyone from chile, singapore, anyone deployed at educational, 'non-profit', or 'research' even if employed by a for profit body shop

up to 315,000 L1 visas that can be used interchangably with H-1b *

http://www.infoworld.com/article/07/12/28/52FE-underreported-visas_1.html


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onbudsman Donating Member (63 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-31-08 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
29. just look at the google ads this topic generated
at the bottome of the thread page

a whole industry of screwing citizen workers

H1B Visa Transfer
Transfer & Sponsor H1B visas in IT Min. 90% Billing Rate is Yours
www.independenth1b.comH1B Sponsorship

transfer H1B Keep 90% of billing New H1B contact: sai@iticontech.com
www.iticontech.comFaster H1B Visas

Online H1B visa processing from the immigration leader – VISANOW.
www.VISANOW.com
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onbudsman Donating Member (63 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-11-08 01:19 PM
Response to Original message
30. McCain, Obama, Clinton - all big H-1b pushers
and none of them will get my vote
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onbudsman Donating Member (63 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-15-08 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
31. even milton friedman called H-1b a subsidy to corporations from the middle class
pressures mounting that might increase tech wages?

'sorry, tech earnings are capped' (can't even increase to take inflation into account)

pressures mounting that might cause you to lose your job and move your earnings to zero?

'sorry, it's a free market'

a free market where the door only swings one way - into the face of the American worker

and yes, BOTH PARTIES are in on it



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onbudsman Donating Member (63 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-18-08 03:08 PM
Response to Original message
32. Here's one explantion for Democrat's support of H-1b
Edited on Mon Feb-18-08 03:09 PM by onbudsman

'it's not what it looks like!' - lol (it almost always is)

from Orwell's 'Animal Farm'

The mystery of where the milk went to was soon cleared up. It was mixed every day into the pigs' mash. The early apples were now ripening, and the grass of the orchard was littered with windfalls. The animals had assumed as a matter of course that these would be shared out equally; one day, however, the order went forth that all the windfalls were to be collected and brought to the harness-room for the use of the pigs. At this some of the other animals murmured, but it was no use. All the pigs were in full agreement on this point, even Snowball and Napoleon. Squealer was sent to make the necessary explanations to the others.

"Comrades!" he cried. "You do not imagine, I hope, that we pigs are doing this in a spirit of selfishness and privilege? Many of us actually dislike milk and apples. I dislike them myself. Our sole object in taking these things is to preserve our health. Milk and apples (this has been proved by Science, comrades) contain substances absolutely necessary to the well-being of a pig. We pigs are brainworkers. The whole management and organisation of this farm depend on us. Day and night we are watching over your welfare. It is for your sake that we drink that milk and eat those apples. Do you know what would happen if we pigs failed in our duty? Jones would come back! Yes, Jones would come back! Surely, comrades," cried Squealer almost pleadingly, skipping from side to side and whisking his tail, "surely there is no one among you who wants to see Jones come back?"

Now if there was one thing that the animals were completely certain of, it was that they did not want Jones back. When it was put to them in this light, they had no more to say. The importance of keeping the pigs in good health was all too obvious. So it was agreed without further argument that the milk and the windfall apples (and also the main crop of apples when they ripened) should be reserved for the pigs alone.
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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-29-08 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
33. Indian Outsourcer WIPRO feels hiring Citizens in USA costs Indians Jobs
Recently Wipro Chairman Azim Premji had said: "If we hire people locally, it will displace people we send from here on H1B visas. So net-net, it will not mean an extra cost to us." If this happens, there will be fewer plum jobs for the boys in India.

http://inhome.rediff.com/money/2008/feb/18cut.htm
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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 12:34 PM
Response to Original message
34. Clinton, Obama & McCain on H-1b visas

Hillary Clinton
"I also want to reaffirm my commitment to the H-1B visa program and to increase the current cap. Foreign skilled workers contribute greatly to our technological development. That is well understood in Silicon Valley."

John McCain
"I will continue to support H-1B visas, but, I’m telling you, the American peoples priority is, either rightly or wrongly, and we live in a democracy, is that we secure the borders first."

Barack Obama
"We can do better than that and go a long way toward meeting industry’s need for skilled workers with Americans. Until we have achieved that, I will support a temporary increase in the H-1B visa program as a stopgap measure until we can reform our immigration system comprehensively."

http://weblog.infoworld.com/realitycheck/archives/2008/02/the_three_presi.html
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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. Hillary on H-1b visas and outsourcing
But in Buffalo, the fruits of the Tata deal have been hard to find. The company, which called the arrangement Clinton's "brainchild," says "about 10" employees work here. Tata says most of the new employees were hired from around Buffalo. It declines to say whether any of the new jobs are held by foreigners, who make up 90% of Tata's 10,000-employee workforce in the United States"

The quote from John Miano at the Programmer's Guild reminds me very much of the criticisms faced by Harris Miller in last year's Virginia Dem. primary

"It's just two-faced," said John Miano, founder of the Programmers Guild, one of several high-tech worker organizations that have sprung up as outsourcing has expanded. "We see her undermining U.S. workers and helping the offshoring business, and then she comes back to the U.S. and says, 'I'm concerned about your pain

http://modernpatriot.blogspot.com/2007/09/hillary-clinton-supports-destruction-of.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOW0cUaGWZU
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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #36
39. She really said it: ' I am delighted to be the Senator from Punjab as well as from New York'
Edited on Sat Mar-01-08 02:09 PM by namsdubmo
my opinion - you should NEVER introduce yourself as the Senator from anywhere but the state that elected you

http://www.sikhcouncilusa.org/article.aspx?article=evtdinner



Hillary Clinton bowls over Indian MPs promises H1B increase

http://www.plex86.org/computer_2/Hillary-Clinton-bowls-over-Indian-MPs-promises-H1B-increase.html

(there's only 2 places Hillary gives frank answers about H-1b visas: $Silicon vally, and India)

Hillary says 'TA TA' to American jobs

http://bp2.blogger.com/_d9PxlbCXrxA/RuyouHU0hII/AAAAAAAAAAc/eB1_hnP758g/s200/Hillary-Tata+Smooch.jpg
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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #36
40. Hillary's idea of an incentive for tech workers - a reality TV show



I'm not making this up. watch this brief Lou Dobbs clip

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhLBSLLIhUs


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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #36
43. Hillary defends outsourcing in India
Hillary clears outsourcing air
Hillary Clinton made it apparent where she stood on outsourcing during her India visit, in an attempt perhaps to clear the Indian misgivings received during the Kerry campaign. "There is no way to legislate against reality. Outsourcing will continue," she told an audience of Indian big-wigs. She pointed out that there were 3 billion people who feel left behind and are trying to attack the modern world in the hope of turning the clock back on globalization. "It is not far-fetched to imagine ... if the Indian miracle would be the one of choice of those who feel left behind," said Hillary.

Hillary has been at the forefront in defending free trade and outsourcing. During the height of the anti-outsourcing backlash in the US last year, she faced considerable flak for defending Indian software giant Tata Consultancy Services (TCS) for opening a center in Buffalo, New York. "We are not against all outsourcing; we are not in favor of putting up fences," Hillary said firmly, despite inevitably invoking the ire of the anti-free trade brigade.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/GC01Df03.html
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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #34
38. Why is it that Sen Durbin (D-IL) gets this but Obama doesn't?


Does Obama ever talk with his fellow Democrat senator from illinois? or was he out campaigning the day Durbin made the speech below. Read it entirly - its a stunningly complete indictment of the H-1b program:

Mr. President, in the coming weeks the Senate will again consider legislation to reform our broken immigration system.

I think we all understand the challenge is substantial. If we want to solve the problem, we need a comprehensive approach that is tough but fair. We should improve border security by increasing manpower and deploying new technology. We should enforce the law against employers who are hiring millions of undocumented workers. And we need a realistic, honest approach to the 12 million undocumented immigrants who live and work in our country illegally.

Most importantly, we must ensure that immigration reform legislation protects the American economy and American workers as well.

I am concerned about the H-1B visa program as it is currently
structured. I am afraid it is being abused by foreign companies to deprive qualified Americans of good jobs.

To address this problem, Senator Grassley and I have introduced S. 1035, the H-1B and L-1 Visa Fraud Abuse Prevention Act of 2007. This is a bipartisan bill. It would overhaul the H-1B and L-1 visa programs to protect American workers and crack down on unscrupulous employers.

The H-1B visa program was designed to allow employers to attract and hire high-skilled foreign workers with specialized knowledge. H-1B visas are probably best known for their use in technology to import computer engineers and programmers.

I can't tell you how many leaders in industry, including one this afternoon, come into my office and say: We absolutely need H-1B visas. We can't find enough people specialized education for our businesses. If you won't allow us to bring these workers in from overseas, we are going to be facing the possibility of taking our production facilities overseas where they live.

It is a compelling argument. I understand it on its face. But let me explain some of the problems with the current system and why Senator Grassley and I believe the system needs to be changed.

Supporters claim the goal of the H-1B program is to help the American economy by allowing U.S. companies to hire needed foreign workers. The reality is that H-1B visas are being used to facilitate the outsourcing of American jobs to other countries. It seems counterintuitive that a visa that allows people to come into the United States could lead to jobs being outsourced overseas, but when you hear my illustrations, you will understand the conclusion.

A recent expose in the International Herald Tribune disclosed that 8 of the top 10 H-1B visa applicants last year were outsourcing firms with major operations in one country--India. So in many cases it wasn't the American high tech company using the H-1B visa that was given this opportunity but, rather, a firm, more likely in India than any other country, that was given the authority to use H-1B visas to send workers into the United States. The Herald Tribune concluded:



As Indian outsourcing companies have become the leading consumers of the visa, they have used to it further their primary mission, which is to gain the expertise necessary to take on critical tasks performed by companies in the United States and perform them in India at a fraction of the cost.

According to this report, the Indian Government has been lobbying hard for the United States Government to increase the number of H-1B visas.

Kamal Nath, the Indian Commerce Minister, was very blunt when he said recently that the H-1B visa "has become the outsourcing visa." He concluded: "If at one point you had X amount of outsourcing and now you have a much higher quantum of outsourcing, you need that many more visas."

That is a very candid statement by this commerce minister in India. It should give us pause as we think about this program, what it was designed to do and what it is actually doing.

In other words, the Indian Government wants more H-1B visas so Indian companies can outsource more American jobs to India.

Let me be clear. India is a valuable American partner in commerce, diplomacy, and many other endeavors. Indians who have come to the United States have made immeasurable contributions to the benefit of our country in so many ways. I trust them as great friends. But some in India todayu nderstand that we have a weakness in our visa system and are using it for their own economic advantage.

It is not surprising the Indian Government is advocating on behalf of Indian companies. The American Government should advocate on behalf of American companies. I don't criticize the Indian Government for doing that. But we should expect the same from our Government for our workers. We need to stand up to make sure American workers don't lose their jobs to outsourcing because of H-1B visas.

H-1B supporters claim we need more H-1B visas to stop American jobs from being outsourced. That was the logic behind H-1B visas. It appears the opposite is true. Under the current system, more H-1B visas will mean more outsourcing.

Let me give an example. Indian outsourcing company Wipro was No. 2 on the list of top applicants for H-1B visas in the year 2006. Wipro has more than 4,000 employees in the United States, and approximately 2,500 of them are here on H-1B visas. It is pretty clear that when it comes to Wipro's American operation, the majority of the workers are here on H-1B visas. Every year Wipro brings 1,000 new temporary workers here from India, while they send another 1,000 U.S. trained workers back to India. This is essentially an outsourcing factory.

Here is what the Herald Tribune concluded:

"Rather than building a thriving community of experts and innovators in the United States, the
Indian firms seek to funnel work--and expertise--away from the country."

It is hard to believe, but it is perfectly legal to use the H-1B visa program for outsourcing. A foreign outsourcing company with a U.S. office can use H-1B visas to import workers from their home country, train the workers in the United States, and then outsource them back to their home country to populate businesses competing with the United States. They are not required to make any efforts to recruit American workers for these jobs. In fact, they can explicitly discriminate against American workers who apply for the same jobs by recruiting and hiring only workers from their home country.

Here is what the Labor Department says about the current law:

"H-1B workers may be hired even when a qualified U.S. worker wants the job, and a U.S. worker can be displaced from the job in favor of a foreign worker."

Is that what we had in mind with H-1B visas? That certainly wasn't the way it was explained to me. In fact, under current law, only employers who employ H-1B visa holders as a large percentage of their U.S. workforce are required to attempt to recruit American workers before bringing in foreign workers.

Senator Grassley and I have taken a look at this system. We both reject the notion that what is wrong with the H-1B program is that we need more visas. We have to look at the system that generates these visas and the way they are used. The legislation we have introduced would overhaul the H-1B program, protecting American workers first, and stopping H-1Bs from being exploited as outsourcing visas.

Here are the highlights. First and foremost, we would require all employers who want to hire an H-1B worker to attempt to hire an American worker first. Employers would also be prohibited from using H-1B visas to displace American workers. You can't fire an American and turn around and appeal to our Government for an H-1B visa to bring someone in from overseas to replace that worker.

This is an important principle. We have to make it clear that companies doing business in the United States have to give first priority to American workers.

Our bill would require that before an employer may hire an H-1B worker, the employer must first advertise the job opening to American workers for 30 days on the Department of Labor Web site.

Some companies that abuse the H-1B visa program are so brazen, they say "no Americans need apply" in their job advertisements. Hundreds of such ads have been posted on line. They say things such as "H-1B visa holders only" or "we require candidates for H-1B from India."

Is that what we have in mind, to create this perverse discrimination against American workers? That isn't the way it was explained to me. Our H-1B reform bill would prohibit this blatant discriminatory practice.

There is another serious problem with the H-1B visa program. Federal oversight is virtually nonexistent. Under current law there are many roadblocks to effective Government enforcement. For example, the Department of Labor does not have the authority to open an investigation of an employer suspected of abusing the H-1B program unless the Department receives a formal complaint, even if the employer's application is clearly fraudulent. Even if there is a complaint, the Labor Secretary--and this is something that is almost unique in our law--must personally authorize the opening of an investigation.

These restrictions in the law are aggravated by lax Government enforcement. According to the Department of Homeland Security's own Inspector General, Homeland Security has violated the law by approving thousands of H-1B applications in excess of the annual cap of 65,000. The Government Accountability Office found that the Labor Department approves over 99.5 percent of H-1B petitions it receives, including those that on their face clearly violate the law.

There is virtually no Government oversight of potential abuse in this system. The Labor Department's inspector general has concluded that the H-1B program is "highly susceptible to fraud." Remember, this program was designed to help the American economy, to help create jobs and prosperity in our country. Our Government is not even watching it closely to make sure that fraud isn't being perpetrated.

The bill Senator Grassley and I are proposing would give the Government more authority to conduct employer investigations and streamline the investigative process. Currently, the Labor Department is only authorized to review applications for "completeness and obvious inaccuracies." Our bill would give the Labor Department more authority to review employers' H-1B applications for "clear indicators of fraud or misrepresentation of material fact."

Our bill would authorize the Labor Department to conduct random audits of any company that uses the H-1B program and require the Department of Labor to conduct annual audits of companies that employ large numbers of H-1B workers. We would also increase the penalties for companies that violate H-1B visa rules and authorize the hiring of 200 additional Government investigators to oversee and enforce the H-1B program.

Last month, the government began accepting H-1B visa petitions for Fiscal Year 2008. In the first 24 hours, the government received 150,000 petitions for 65,000 slots, supposedly for the whole year. Based on last year's statistics, it is likely that the top petitioners for visas were companies from India. They understand the system. They understand how to make this profitable. But this is not the way it has been described to most Members of Congress. It certainly isn't consistent with our intent.

There is another program I wish to mention, the L-1 visa. The L-1 visa allows companies to transfer certain employees from foreign facilities to the United States for up to 7 years.

Experts have concluded that some employers use the L-1 program to evade restrictions on the H-1B program, because the L-1 program doesn't have an annual cap and doesn't include even minimal protections for American workers. As a result, efforts to reform the H-1B program are unlikely
to succeed if the L-1 program is not overhauled at the same time.

The bill Senator Grassley and I have prepared would reform the L-1 program.

We would establish for the first time whistleblower protections for those who call attention to employer abuses of L-1 programs, and for the first time we would authorize the Government to investigate and audit L-1 employers suspected of violating the law.

Before we are persuaded to increase the number of H-1B visas, we have to reform the program to protect American workers first and to stop H-1Bs from being used as outsourcing visas that send jobs and business away from America. That is what our bill would do, and that is what Senator Grassley and I will be pushing for as the Senate considers comprehensive immigration reform legislation.

http://www.mydd.com/story/2007/5/16/183114/236


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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
35. Pelosi pushing for massive guest worker increase - from NumbersUSA



Incredible as it may seem amidst talk of recessions, job cuts and stagnant wages, we are finding reports and signs everywhere that House Speaker Pelosi is negotiating to give millions of U.S. jobs to foreign workers.

Please go to your own customized Action Buffet corkboard and make sure that you have sent all the faxes and made all the phone calls available to you to stop Speaker Pelosi's vile maneuverings.

And thanks to all of you have already sent nearly 100,000 faxes into Congress just this week, demanding that Congress save the dwindling number of U.S. jobs for Americans and legal immigrants already here.

It appears that the irresponsible, outlaw minority of the corporate world that insists on illegal foreign labor has a special "in" with the Democratic Speaker.

Pelosi's backroom deals appear to be motivated by fear that a group of freshmen Democrats may get most Republicans to help them force a vote on the enforcement-only SAVE Act (Secure America with Verification Enforcement). That bill -- with 145 bi-partisan signers in the House and Senate -- primarily would drive millions of illegal aliens out of their jobs.

But Pelosi is trying to ensure that if the enforcement-only bill comes to a vote it will include huge increases in H-2B and H-1B visas for foreign workers of all kinds, and that it will include millions of legal work permits for all the illegal aliens currently holding a job.

I want every American to be aware of Speaker Pelosi's callous attitude toward the 23 million, less-educated working-age Americans who do not currently have a job.

This group of Americans without any college education and without a job increased by 2 million between 2000 and 2005 at the same time Congress was importing 1.5 million foreign workers of the same education level, according to research by the Center for Immigration Studies.

Nobody in Congress has a worse grade (F-minus) than Nancy Pelosi when it comes to protecting American jobs, American wages and American working conditions from the downward pressures of massive immigration.

As the head Democrat, she stands in stark contrast to most of the newly elected Democrats who are pledged to protecting American workers and fighting illegal immigration. Unfortunately, Pelosi, the most radical Member of Congress on the immigration issue, is using her power as Speaker of the House to try to wreak even more damage on the most vulnerable of American workers and legal immigrant workers in this country. I urge all concerned Americans to contact their Members of Congress and express opposition to Rep. Pelosi's outrageous push for more foreign work visas.

Our Action Buffet Team will be providing you new opportunities for action during Wednesday.

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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. with gas, food prices soaring, and wages stagnant


why in the heck would we increase the competition for food gas and wages at a time like this?

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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 06:51 PM
Response to Original message
41. 'Our goal is clearly NOT to find a qualified and interested US worker'



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QR1Jke2NWTA&feature=rela ...

taken out of context?

well, put it in context, watch the longer version (about 4 minutes)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCbFEgFajGU&feature=rela ...

the Democratic party clearly supports this practice

WHY?!?!?

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namsdubmo Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 03:47 PM
Response to Original message
42. 7 out of top Top 10 Companies Receiving H-1B's are Indian Outsourcers
Edited on Sun Mar-02-08 03:54 PM by namsdubmo


have you heard that h-1bs are an alternative to outsourcing?

think again

Top Ten Companies Receiving H-1B's<22> Rank Company Headquarters Primary Employment Base H-1Bs received 2006 6 year projection
1 Infosys Bangalore, Karnataka, India India 4,908 29,448
2 Wipro Bangalore, Karnataka, India India 4,002 24,012
3 Microsoft Redmond, Washington USA 3,117 18,702
4 Tata Mumbai, Maharashtra, India India 3,046 18,276
5 Satyam Hyderabad, Andhra Pradesh, India India 2,880 17,280
6 Cognizant Technology Solutions Teaneck, New Jersey<25> India 2,226 13,356
7 Patni Computer Systems Mumbai, Maharashtra, India India 1,391 8,346
8 IBM Armonk, New York USA 1,130 6,780
9 Oracle Corporation Redwood Shores, California USA 1,022 6,132
10 Larsen & Toubro Infotech Mumbai, Maharashtra, India India 947 5,682
TOP TEN TOTAL 148,014

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H-1B_visa

Recently Wipro Chairman Azim Premji had said: "If we hire people locally, it will displace people we send from here on H1B visas. So net-net, it will not mean an extra cost to us." If this happens, there will be fewer plum jobs for the boys in India.

http://inhome.rediff.com/money/2008/feb/18cut.htm

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