If Roe v. Wade is overturned by the Supreme Court, what options do...

[FormerRepublican]

...women have left? Any?

Wolf Blitzer doing a bit on this (but seems to be from the right-to-life perspective).

Why do anti-abortionists want to force women who are raped or the victim of incest to bear a resultant child? Do they have NO CLUE what that does to a woman? I can envision victims killing themselves left and right, making an abortion moot. What a sad state of affairs...

[WI_DEM]

1. If Roe is actually overturned there will be a huge outcry in this country

my guess is that they will take an incremental approach and weaken it rather than actually overturn it, but you never know and either way it's bad.

[iconoclastNYC]

28. Huge outcry? Are you serious?

Please..... where was the huge outcry for the Patriot act, or for wiretapping, or for three stolen elections?

There will never be a huge outcry in this country until the middle class goes hungry.

[Iris]

37. outlawing abortion and certain forms of contraception will CAUSE

the middle class to start going hungry.

[iconoclastNYC]

45. How's that?

Are people eating aborted fetuses? Freakanomics (the book) says it might raise crime but I dont see how it will increase hunger.

[Iris]

49. Given that the average American family has a high level of credit card

debt indicates to me that they are living beyond their means. Throw in one or two unexpected children on top of the 2.4 kids they've already got, and a lot of families will be in trouble.

[Nomen Tuum]

50. Republican Congressmen will still have access to abortion...

...for thier mistresses, just like any other rich white man.

As for everyone else, you're on your own...

[Avalux]

2. It'll go to the individual states.

Each state will have to decide whether or not to abide by the ruling. Some won't - so more fortunate women can travel to them. In states that abortion becomes illegal, it'll go underground.

Abortion will not stop, even if it's illegal, and women will die.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

6. That's how it was

before Roe.

Individual states had their own laws regarding a woman's choice. New York had the most liberal, and women flocked there.

Check out the case of Sherry Finkbine and her thalidomide pregnancy. That was the beginning of the really powerful pro-choice movement in this country.

[Avalux]

11. I am familiar with that case.

I am sad cases like hers have all but been forgotten and we are regressing as a nation; sad my daughters will be subjected to it.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

13. Your daughters

will have to be political agitators - like we were - and not stop until they get control of their bodies back from a bunch of old white guys who don't know them.

I bet this will go on forever.

[acmejack]

22. I can't believe we are even having to seriously discuss going back there

Damn, to have such hard won freedoms, human rights, and to see them taken from us is just heart wrenching. It is not even a male's decision, it is so gender specific, our sisters must be doubly aghast.

[TheCentepedeShoes]

63. Remember that very well

I was early teens in the early 60's. She went to Sweden IIRC ?

[OldLeftieLawyer]

74. I was the same age,

and I think she went to Sweden, yes. The fetus was found to be terribly deformed.

That was the beginning of the pro-choice movement in New York state, where she was from.

People forget.

They should be reminded, don't you think?

[leftchick]

76. well I had to Google her ....

I was only 4 in 1962 and had never heard this before. Interesting she is the same age as my mother.

<snip>

1962: Abortion mother returns home
An American mother-of-four is on her way home amid a storm of controversy after being given a legal abortion in Sweden.
Sherri Finkbine, a TV presenter from Phoenix in Arizona, was denied an abortion in her home-state following intense negative publicity surrounding her case.

The 30-year-old mother decided to terminate her fifth pregnancy after discovering that tranquilizers she had taken in the first few weeks of her pregnancy contained the drug Thalidomide.

In recent months there has been increasing evidence suggesting Thalidomide causes severe foetal deformities including missing limbs, deafness and blindness.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/august/26/newsid_3039000/3039322.stm

[LostinVA]

77. Sissy Spacek starred in a great movie about this

[CottonBear]

9. Women will create safe underground aborion clinics.

They did it back in the 1960s. Nurses and other medical people banded together to provide safe abortions. We'll have to do it again.

[CountAllVotes]

31. safe?

I rather question that and I do remember those times. Very tragic indeed. Younger women of today need to rise up and reclaim their basic human rights!

:kick:

[CottonBear]

35. Well safer than a non-experienced back alley type of abortion provider. nt

[CountAllVotes]

58. well if my memory serves me properly

I remember a lot of very young women/girls that got pregnant in high school and they did one of two things:

1. Swallowed several bottles of Tylenol or anything else they could buy over the counter hoping it would cause them to abort. In some cases they bought street drugs in massive quantities if they could afford to find/buy them hoping that it would kill the fetus. In some cases this worked and it also killed the host, meaning the young woman herself. :(

2. Some young women tried to figure out a way to get rid of "it" quickly before the parents found out if possible; hence the famed image of the "coat hanger" scenario. I personally never knew of a young woman that tried this particular method to abort themselves but I did witness many other attempts that I won't elaborate on. None of them were practical.

or tragically, and far too often this was the case:

3. They ended up being pregnant for all in school to see. They were not viewed in a positive manner, they were viewed with an extreme stigma by others in the school and elsewhere throughout society.

The children they bore were often only with the young mother herself if she opted to not put it up for adoption; the teenage father (or whoever the father was) was in most (if not all cases that I knew of) nowhere to be seen. In some cases, the teenage girls' mother might take the baby and care for it, might that is. In many cases, the teenage mother that kept the baby ended up dropping out of school and fending for herself and the child.

I never knew of the case of even one woman that was lucky enough to know of a doctor that might give her an illegal abortion. Many simply hid and hoped that they'd miscarry.

Pretty damn sad if you ask me. It was the older women that might have had a few bucks and/or a husband to help and a few connections that might have made it possible to find a back alley butcher to deal with the unwanted pregnancy if they were verylucky. The "safety" of this practice was highly questionable and deaths did result in many cases, do not kid yourself or anyone else.

Some choice there - back alley butcher or die with a pile of pills inside of you or shove something up your vagina to try and remove what is inside of the uterus. Giving birth to a baby and caring for it was not really part of the picture for a young teenager 16 years old or so and it still is not IMO. Sad it was, and I remember it very well and I will never forget.

I truly fear that this will happen again. Young women today need to stand up for their rights NOW and FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT for the rights they intrinsically hold, as they do own their bodies! Fight again, oh yes women we must fight again! Apathy has no place in any woman's life today pertaining to this or any other women's issue for that matter.

If Roe v. Wade is overturned, it will be a very sad day for this country; democracy will be officially dead.

Only the very few, primarily rich women, will be able to afford a legal abortion in another country, something a young teenager or most women cannot afford.

So as we see, the "haves" win again once again no matter what, as they hide behind the cloak of being "born again". Born again ... my ass is what I say to that. They'll be in line too just like the rest of the ones that have the money to pay for it.

Money talks and bullshit walks. :grr:

[in_cog_ni_to]

40. Safe...ONLY for people who could afford "safe."

Many, many, many women died from self abortions, back alley abortions or from hack doctors who used filthy dirty medical instruments. I cannot believe we're headed back there.:(

[SmokingJacket]

61. But only those medical people willing to risk jail.

Many good doctors and nurses will find they have too much to lose. It's a horrible situation.

[Epiphany4z]

15. This is what drives me nuts

abortion has been around forever. It will continue to be around I just think there are better places to put resources. Sex education, free birth control, parenting classes, job training all these things help bring down the abortion rates. I would think a goal of the pro life " forced Gestation" crowed would be to have fewer abortion. Making it illegal will do so very little . I wonder what they will do with a woman when they find she has had an abortion? Take a mother of 5 who couldn't afford 6 and lock her up? Will the woman having the abortion get more time than the man who raped her? Do the men have no complicity? I know so many girls who say there men nearly forced them into the abortion...do the men just get to walk away?

My understanding is pver turning it will leave it up to the states and only some state will make o illegal what if the woman crosses state lines?

ahh well it just seem such a waste to me when so many other things need to be done.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

20. My grandmother told my mother

(her daughter in law) that anytime she was more than two weeks late with her period, she went to her doctor and he did a "mentrual correction" right in his office. Nobody called it an abortion, but it was.

tg

[iconoclastNYC]

29. Like the forced gestation frame.

Very good.

[Iris]

39. They can't stop an adult woman from crossing state lines.

Minors - that's another story.

[salin]

78. one has to have resources to travel

this would only be an option for those with said resources.

[eggman67]

34. What do you mean

"Each state will have to decide whether or not to abide by the ruling"

There's nothing to abide by. The ruling wouldn't make abortion illegal, it would just allow the states to decide. They'd be abiding by that no matter what stance they took.

[against all enemies]

38. But the SC just took a NATIONAL case on late term abortion.

Won't that trump state laws that allow it? Making all late term abortions illegal.

[havocmom]

3. Kidnap men who are anti-choice and implant fetues in them

Tell them to put up or shut up.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

8. Or,

let's just shove watermelons up their collective white, anti-choice asses, and let them experience the miracle of birth.

Of course, we could also shove babies, but I think that might annoy the babies.

:hi:

[havocmom]

21. Not good enough, OLL, and you know it.

Watermelons do not require care and support for 18 years or so. Nope, if they are so concerned with unborn humans, give each one of them something to keep them busy enough they won't have time to tell our daughters how it's gonna be!

:hi: back at cha. Give me a holler some time and let me know how ya are.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

23. It's not just white anti-choice asses

in this area the black churches are very anti-abortion as well, not to mention the Cubans.

[Gato Moteado]

26. great point TG

and it's not just men. fundy and freeper women are anti-choice as well.

[havocmom]

33. I fugure the women are taking their own chances

Som of the anti-choice men need some serious illustration about forceing parenthood on others.

[Gato Moteado]

51. i would think a woman would not want anyone dictating what she can or...

...cannot do with her body and that would not only include men but also other women.

[havocmom]

52. Anti-choice women HAVE MADE a choice about their bodies

and they are stuck with the risks along with the rest of us. Anti-choice men don't have to deal with the risks of their choice to deny choice to others. If they would force women to endure unintended or forced (as in rape/incest) pregnancy, they should share the same fate.

That is what I was illustrating, with humor. Seems most got the humor in my intent. Sorry it didn't come through for all.

But as a woman who does not want anyone dictating what any woman chooses for her own body, I also think there should be more direct responsibility for males who want to force their choices on women.

And I don't wanna hear any arguments that men do have just as much at stake. We all know child support just isn't reliable in this country. Nor is there justice in employment opportunities for female parents and male parents. Females are viewed as possibly more divided in their loyalties and time than males are if they are parents.

Was trying to make a point with a metaphor. If women are forced to bring pregnancies to term, males should be too.

[Gato Moteado]

57. i'm not disagreeing with your point about women being able to choose...

..what to do about their own bodies. and i agree it's ridiculous for men, who don't have to live through a pregnancy, to dictate what women can or cannot do.

my point was that it isn't only men who are trying to tell YOU what you can and cannot do with YOUR body. there are many anti-choice women in the US and many vote repuke based on a single issue, the right to choose. so while they might feel they should not be able to have an abortion, they are also forcing that "morality" on you. they are just as guilty as the anti-choice men, as nobody of either sex should be able to dictate to anyone, man or woman, what they can and cannot do with their own body.

that goes not only for abortion but for a patient's right to die. and there are plenty of other choices that are forbidden by law because some segment of the population doesn't like them. and that segment is usually the judgemental, hypocritical, extreme religious right.

[havocmom]

60. I mentioned anti-choice women several times -

did you miss that?

[Gato Moteado]

62. i must have missed it.....sorry

i'm tired today. i was tired yesterday too. it's just that repuke women disgust me just as much as repuke men.

anyway, anti-choice, anti-democratic, racist, bigoted, facist-boot-licking, stupid people (regardless of their sex) can kiss my ass. :)

on edit: i think repuke women piss me off even more than repuke men because they, of all people, should be on board with the right to choose. gay and african american republicans perplex me too.

they're all human garbage as far as i'm concerned. :)

[sarcasmo]

4. It the Men that I don't get. Being a Man how can I or any other Man tell

a Women what to do with her body? The whack jobs will tell you because it's what Jesus wants.

[CottonBear]

5. Some teenage girls have their boyfriends hit them in the stomach

with a baseball bat to abort the child. It's sad, but true. There was a story about this las tyear. :(

Thre will be a lot more abandoned babies.

[atreides1]

7. No Options

Why do they want to force women, because they do not care. It's that simple!!!!

Personally if I saw a group of these anti-abortionists in a bus barely hanging on the edge of a cliff, I'd be tempted to push it the rest of the way!!

But that's just me.;)

[Hosnon]

10. Just go to a blue state that legalizes it. nt

[Left Is Write]

24. That won't be so easy for some.

[Hosnon]

36. Yeah I know. Just a quick reply to "what can I do?" nt

[drm604]

12. We need a reproductive rights constitutional amendment.

I keep hearing that the vast majority of people in this country are pro-choice. If so then it may be (remotely) possible to amend the constitution on this issue. It's certainly worth a try. Thinking about it now, I realize that we should have been fighting for this kind of amendment all along since there's never been a guarantee that Roe v Wade wouldn't be overturned someday. Does anybody know how many states are required for a constitutional convention?

[eggman67]

18. 38, I think

However, I believe the necessary groundswell would appear if Roe is overturned.

This is one of the reasons I think we're actually better off without Roe it has prevented us from fighting for it all along as I explained here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=497026&mesg_id=502733

[SaveElmer]

14. It'll be a wake up call...

To everyone who voted for Bush believing it would never happen...there would be a backlash like you won't believe!!!

[Gloria]

65. I'm not convinced of a backlash/groundswell...yeah, the polls

say 60% or so want abortion legal, but if it goes back to the states.....all bets are off.
Look at the environment. Big issue,lots of talk, but it doesn't swing elections. Imagine all those pro-life Repugs talking about terror, or taxes....why will abortion rise to the top if it "doesn't affect" most of the populace?? If it really affects only the poor or young who can't go somewhere for a safe abortion, then who cares????? (I care, but you know what I mean)

Which is why I want to see NOW step in and set up railroads and training for abortions...really, this has to be organized and ANGRY!!! Call it "Woman Rescue"---we do it for dogs, what, women don't rate rescue???? Fundraise for this, now--the courts are lost. Legislatures change. Women will never be safe in this country.

[colinmom71]

70. At this point, I doubt it...

Most of the Bush voters who talked themselves into believing that he (and his fellow Repubs.) would never outright ban abortion will simply say to themselves "oh well, it's not relevant to me anyway. I'll never go for an abortion...". Though it will be interesting to see this same group stutter and protest when that vocal minority that is working to get rid of abortion starts working towards getting rid of birth control. They'll never see it coming, but they will see access to birth control does effect them and that's when we'll actually see a huge backlash against the tyranny of the fundy minority.

Then again, Bush hasn't actually himself sought to ban abortion in a manner that SD has here, has he? His party is just working at the state level to get the courts to try to do it for him. Politically, it's best case scenario for Republicans at the national level. Prompt state parties to get this legislation through and then let the court battle ensue.

If the courts rule in their favor, they can take credit for abortion ending under their administration and continue to enjoy fundamentalist support and applause. If it fails, then they get to shrug their shoulders and say that they can't help what all those "activist judges" do and hey, you fundies obviously need to keep funding us so we can keep working on this problem... To these guys, it a game of political gain bought at the expense of women's health.

[jim3775]

16. Cross the border into Canada

http://www.ppfc.ca/ppfc/find.asp
http://www.caral.ca/layout/index.html

For the women who cannot afford to travel, I have no idea.

[bettyellen]

17. because they can easily blame the victim- since she's not "pure" aymore

she doesn't fit in, and they don't give a fuck.
what's so hard to understand? many cultures feel this way about sexually abused women. it's not an uncommon attitude at all.
sickening, but not rare.

[Burning Water]

19. If it's overturned the issue

will return to the states. some will restrict abortion, some won't. It will still be available just not everywhere.

It isn't the end of the world, but it does show the necessity of winning elections. The judiciary cannot hold out forever against a consistent and unanswered political assault. For decades progressives have been content to let the judiciary "settle" these matters for them while the enraged right fought back the only way that they could, through the ballot box (and maybe cheating a little bit).

So that's what Democrats have to do, now.

Clark's da man in 2008.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

25. First, I hope it doesn't happen

but I have been reading about the success of home abortions in the early months, usings chemicals. That would eliminate the whole clinic scenario and doctors would dispense right in their offices.

[iconoclastNYC]

27. Underground railroad type effort

RU486 and cars to take women who experience complications to friendly states for treatment.

Most RU486 abortions happen without complication but sometimes you do have to go get a D&C to stop bleeding in the case of an incomplete abortion.

RU486 eliminates the need to have a back alley abortion but you do need a back up plan in case you need a D&C

[raysr]

30. The pukes lose an election

wedge.

[robertpaulsen]

32. We need to choose options that are CONFRONTATIONAL to wake people up!

Something like an OVERground Railroad to bus women in red states that ban abortion to blue states that allow it. I say overground instead of underground because we should not carry this out quietly, we need to choose tactics that can be visibly publicized to illustrate the injustice of having women's civil rights violated in the name of "state's rights".

This was mentioned on another thread by Tesha along with the idea of smuggling the morning after pill into anti-abortion states as well. Bottom line is we need to do whatever we can to wake people up until we get a Constitutional Amendment protecting the rights of women. It might take time, but I think everyone here agrees that the fight is worth it!

[in_cog_ni_to]

41. OHIO abortion ban legislature will make going to another state ILLEGAL.

How the hell they think they can enforce THAT is beyond me, but that's their intention. I'm sure the fundie, wacko, nut job states will try to do the same thing.

[robertpaulsen]

42. WOW! We're going to have to have another Civil Rights movement.

If that's what it's going to come to in a Post-Roe aftermath, it's going to be like the 60's again in this country. Whether that's the 1960's or 1860's remains to be seen. But if red state legislature's like Ohio are going to resort to this, I for one will resort to MASSIVE CIVIL DISOBEDIENCE!

[cascadiance]

43. Maybe we in California or other places can give them "instant citizenship"

if they need to get an abortion as a way around this law. If not California, maybe one of the other neighboring "blue" states... Those states can start imposing toll taxes at the borders on the interstates as part of recovering any costs of doing this.

[Gloria]

66. So, Ohio nuts think the state OWNS a woman's body?? That's

the implication if they ban travel! Are they going to check everyone's wombs at the exit tolls????

Even Irish women travel to the UK for abortions....in fact, the EU is questioning all countries who hassle women in their own countries...Ireland, Poland, etc... there's a move on there to declare choice a HUMAN RIGHTS issue....

[colinmom71]

71. It's not enforceable...

At least not in any practical sense.

Though if that provision remains within the proposed Ohio statute (and is somehow passed), it will raise some intersting interstate commerce issues. It's been a while since I've studied commerce rulings, but I've never heard of a state level law attempting to regulate it's residents' commerce activities in another state as being rendered Constitutional. Since abortion is a service for fee, commerce law does apply. Sort of a cold way to look at it, but it is a factor.

[mzteris]

44. old herbal remedies?

beats the coathanger. :(

More abused children. More abandoned babies. More women in poverty.

[TimeChaser]

56. I was thinking about that earlier.

I remember hearing somewhere that certain plants were used to induce abortions even back in ancient times.

[DanCa]

46. And when the fundies outlaw abortion rest assured stem cell research

Is a mere stones throw away from being banned. In the warped mind set of the fundy theres a link between abortion and scr. Of course we know thier isn't but were talking about the sheeple here. I believe though the ultimate game the fundies are playing is to establish a national church of prolife, and blur fundamentalism in one religion the way Hitler woulda wanted. See roe vs wade is about a lot more than abortion.

[Azathoth]

47. Stem cell research is a tad bit safer

Abortion is a 50/50 issue. Half support it, half don't. Many intelligent, well-educated, rational people honestly believe abortion is murder. A solid majority of the country, however, supports stem cell research, and its opponents depend primarily on those who are ignorant, misinformed, or religiously insane for support. That's not to say that there won't be a continuing push from the nutball right to completely ban the research, but I doubt they will succeed. Too many people, including too many conservatives, have too much to gain from the potential benefits of stem cell research.

[DanCa]

48. I hope your right

I think that I am just a little burned out from fighting the looney fringe this past week.

[rpgamerd00d]

53. Here is what will happen. A brand-new Roe v Wade.

Remember, its about PRIVACY, not ABORTION.

Outlaw abortions? OK.

How do you know the woman is pregnant? Oops, right to privacy, sorry, not telling you.
How do you know the woman got an abortion? Oops, right to privacy, sorry, not telling you.
Ask doctor? Oops, right to privacy, sorry, not telling you.

Point is, a woman walks into a doctors office, walks out 1 hour later.
There is no possible way to find out what happened inside.
Doctor is proteted, woman is protected.
With or without Roe v Wade.

Violate that protection, and you get a brand new Roe v Wade.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

54. Sounds Good On The Surface, But Privacy Isn't Protected In The Midst Of An

illegal act. I like this thinking though, as it does appear based on privacy laws that it would be very tough to determine when this act was taking place, however I'm not sure there would be any doctors that would knowingly put their entire careers on the line when the procedure was for an elective purpose. I think that's the greater challenge, would be finding the doctors who would be willing to actually take that risk. If there weren't any, then the privacy point is moot.

[Gloria]

67. Medical records are available all over the place--Ashcroft was

after them in, was it Missouri?? With Bush's judges in place, they'll rule in favor of anyone being able to pry....

[bunkerbuster1]

55. Wolf Blitzer is a pro-criminalization shithead

who implied that Paul Begala was not a "good Catholic."

http://mediamatters.org/items/200504090001

On a day that they were covering Pope John Paul II's funeral.

Just wanted to remind everyone of this. Carry on.

[MoonRiver]

59. Contrary to many on DU, I think it will be overturned by SCOTUS.

I also think the Pukes will try to pass a constitutional amendment outlawing abortion. I don't believe this will work though. Anyway, regarding your question, women will do what they have always done: get illegal abortions by hook or crook, try to self-abort by crude methods, or, in the most horrific scenario, commit infanticide. Not a pretty picture.

[blonndee]

64. Well,

I know this isn't an option for everyone and no one should be forced into this decision, but I won't have sex with men anymore. I don't want a baby and I don't want to get pregnant, and birth control has failed twice in my life already. So as a so-called "fertile Myrtle," I'll turn elsewhere for my sexual needs, as angry as I am that I feel compelled to do so. Good thing I like women too. I'm sure that will please the fundigelical anti-choicers.

I am sick and outraged over the South Dakota decision and honestly I'm so shocked I don't think it's really sunk in yet. It's too horrifying to imagine what could actually come of this.

[omega minimo]

68. DU might quit FLAGELLATING over abortion & start ADVOCATING women's rights

That's what this comes down to-- especially if there are too many more DUers and Dems who are confused about this as your OP suggests.

Your question:

"If Roe v. Wade is overturned by the Supreme Court, what options do women have left? Any?" is perhaps unintentionally loaded.

The question really would be: Why would Democrats and progressives ever allow the clock to be turned back on women's rights and return women to second (or worse) class status again?

[raggedcompany]

69. re: "killing themselves left and right, making an abortion moot."

The conservatives would impugn the suicide as a murderer, and piss on her grave.

[JerseygirlCT]

72. They simply don't care what it does to a woman. nt

[Joe for Clark]

73. Move to California.

[LostinVA]

75. If Roe is overturned, I guarantee it will be reinstated pretty

Damn quick. The majority of Americans think abortion should be legal, at least in some form. Most people aren't nutjobs. I'll even say most rank-and-file GOP politicians aren't happy about the SD thing... this will blow up in their faces... especially hen you start talking about rape and incest.

[salin]

79. most people are ambivalent - until the *need* hits someone

close to them. I think the notion that a backlash would happen is over optimistic. I think that a backlash will happen but that it will take a great deal of time - and have a direct impact on a great number of folks who do not have the financial resources to "get the problem taken care of quietly."