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[Sapphire Blue]

[babylonsister]

1. There's a few threads on this. Here's one:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2678205

[bahrbearian]

2. I heard the Israel plans to attack Iran with Nuclear Telegrams

[leveymg]

3. Revealed: we've heard that one before.

More war drum propaganda.

[leveymg]

16. Here's an article from 08/24/06 Jerusalem Post, says same thing:

Aug. 24, 2006 0:30 | Updated Aug. 24, 2006 14:29
Israel may 'go it alone' against Iran
By HERB KEINON
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1154525933028&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull


Talkbacks for this article: 3

Israel is carefully watching the world's reaction to Iran's continued refusal to suspend uranium enrichment, with some high-level officials arguing it is now clear that when it comes to stopping Iran, Israel "may have to go it alone," The Jerusalem Post has learned.

One senior source said on Tuesday that Iran "flipped the world the bird" by not responding positively to the Western incentive plan to stop uranium enrichment. He expressed frustration that the Russians and Chinese were already saying that Iran's offer of a "new formula" and willingness to enter "serious negotiations" was an opening to keep on talking. "The Iranians know the world will do nothing," he said. "This is similar to the world's attempts to appease Hitler in the 1930s - they are trying to feed the beast."

He said there was a need to understand that "when push comes to shove," Israel would have to be prepared to "slow down" the Iranian nuclear threat by itself.
Having said this, he did not rule out the possibility of US military action, but said that if this were to take place, it would probably not occur until the spring or summer of 2008, a few months before President George W. Bush leaves the international stage. The US presidential elections, which Bush cannot contest because of term limits, are in November 2008.

[Dhalgren]

22. This is a pretty scary quotation:

"Having said this, he did not rule out the possibility of US military action, but said that if this were to take place, it would probably not occur until the spring or summer of 2008, a few months before President George W. Bush leaves the international stage. The US presidential elections, which Bush cannot contest because of term limits, are in November 2008."

It sounds like something Bush would do. There would not be enough time to do anything before he left office in '09...

[toshirajo]

4. definitely revealed a few times today

but it strikes a chord.

good psyops

[Redstone]

5. Well, for Christ's sake, when another country threatens to "wipe you off the map" you DO

makes some plans in case they really TRY to, don't you?

Unless you're really, really stupid.

Redstone

[BushOut06]

6. Iran has never threatened to actually wipe Israel off the map

Iran's president has stated on several occasions that Israel will someday be wiped off the face of the map - but has never actually said that Iran would be the one to do it. If you read his other statements, and stop taking things out of context, it seems clear that he doesn't believe that Israel can maintain its existence in the region, that eventually the Israelis there will move elsewhere. When he speaks, he speaks of the "Zionist regime" in power.

I've heard many evangelical Christians state that the United States will eventually cease to exist. Does this mean that they are planning the destruction of the US? Or perhaps, is it more logical to think they mean that the US will collapse on its own, as have many world empires? Why then do we not treat the statements coming from Iran the same way?

[Redstone]

7. If you're going to try to convince that those fucking maniacs who in charge of Iran

are nice guys, or misunderstood, we have nothing to discuss.

Don't make excuses for theose assholes, would you please? At least not to me.

Redstone

[BushOut06]

8. Show me one instance where Iran has directly threatened Israel's existence

And I don't mean statements like "Israel will someday cease to exist". Show me where Iran has actually threatened to attack Israel. Show me where Iran has even begun mobilizing its military to attack Israel.

I can't believe that you would honestly condone a NUCLEAR attack on a country without any provocation, based solely on the words of that country's leader. I'm glad the leaders of the US and the USSR didn't have such thin skin, and launch nukes anytime the other leader said something highly inflammatory.

[Redstone]

11. No, not discussing this, I told you. If you're going to be an apologist for people

who host an international "The Germans didn't kill any Jews" conference, I'm not, and I mean REALLY not, interested in having a discussion with you.

Goodbye.

Redstone

[originalpckelly]

14. There's a difference between supporting Holocaust deniers...

and supporting those planning the use of nuclear weapons. Wouldn't you agree?

[BushOut06]

19. I never said I supported their denial of the Holocaust

Why do you insist in dragging in this red herring? It has nothing to do with the debate at hand. You have YET to show a single instance where Iran has directly threatened to attack Israel. You have yet to show where Iran has stated that they WOULD attack Israel. You can't do it, because Iran has never said they will attack!

You know that you can't win this argument, which is why you say that you don't want to have this discussion. You want to get your two cents in, and have that be the authoritative word.

Once again - do you really think it's justified to attack another country because of what they MIGHT do? Hmmmm, that logic sounds mighty damned familiar to me. Oh that's right - it's exactly the logic that Bush used to invade Iraq! Hell, I guess if that's okay, then why not attack Iran? And this time, let's use nuclear weapons!

[originalpckelly]

12. Redstone, you're not making sense. These plans are not in case Iran actually...

attacks Israel, these plans are preemptive.

There's a big difference, obviously any idiot would want Israel to defend itself if Iran attacked it, but this isn't about self defense after being attacked, it's "self defense" before they have even developed a weapon.

Israel has no proof that Iran is developing nukes, they only have suspicion. When one accuses another of doing something, one must provide proof to PROVE that someone has does something.

This is the exact same idiotic problem which lead to the Iraq war, and I do hope you'll admit that was wrong, right?

[Dhalgren]

20. The phrase in Farsi is translated, accurately, as "Israel will vanish

from the pages of history". Not exactly, "We are going to wipe Israel off the face of the earth". Juan Cole had a big blog entry on this issue a while back. The Iranians were definitely saying that they did not care for the Israelis, but it in no way could be construed as a "threat" to Israel by any sane government. Now, Israel, on the other hand, evidently has plans drawn up to nuke Iran! The country that appears to be out of control and needs to have its nukes taken from it is Israel - Iran doesn't even have any nukes. If a nation like Israel were threatening the United States with nukes and the US didn't have any, you can bet your ass the US would get some and fast. Israel continues to be a source of conflict and danger in the Middle East and the world. I wish that they would come to their senses (I wish the US would come to its senses, as well)...

[originalpckelly]

9. Oh Redstone. Have you thought about the following FACT:

Israel is drawing up plans to blow up Iran, and is considering doing so, BECAUSE and now get this, Iran is developing a nuclear weapon. Though in Iran's case there is no really hard evidence, unlike in the case of Israel, which has just admitted to planning to blow up Iran.

Doesn't that sound a *little* strange to you?

[Redstone]

13. No. Just no. Let's not do this, OK? I'm serious. Drop it.

Redstone

[originalpckelly]

15. Oh yes, I really think the Holocaust didn't happen, and you know...

I really support Iran a whole bunch. Don't you have enough common sense to ask for proof before someone nukes another country?

[Sapphire Blue]

17. Redstone has asked you to stop. Please do so. Thanks.

[Redstone]

21. We've been friends up to now, and I'd like to keep it that way. If you'd rather not,

well, that's your decision.

Redstone

[scarletwoman]

18. So you're cool with nuking Iran, cuz they MIGHT someday have nukes of their own.

Massive death and destruction is just fine by you as long as it happens to someone else.

But go ahead and stick your fingers in your ears and go "la la la I can't hear you". You just don't want to cop to what you're really advocating here.

sw

[Tom Joad]

10. This will create a catastrophe beyond our worst nightmares.

Perhaps worse than all the genocides of the 20th century. It will probably kill tens of millions of people. And lead to war after war.

The reason for the information becoming public is not certain, but it can be that Israel is saber rattling, or that it is trying to get the US to take action, or that it is softening up world opinion so that such a strike will be more acceptable.

Not good.