Strap yourselves in, folks. It's gonna get good from here...

[WilliamPitt]

Democrats To Start Without GOP Input
Quick Passage of First Bills Sought

By Lyndsey Layton and Juliet Eilperin
Washington Post Staff Writers
Tuesday, January 2, 2007; Page A01

As they prepare to take control of Congress this week and face up to campaign pledges to restore bipartisanship and openness, Democrats are planning to largely sideline Republicans from the first burst of lawmaking.

House Democrats intend to pass a raft of popular measures as part of their well-publicized plan for the first 100 hours. They include tightening ethics rules for lawmakers, raising the minimum wage, allowing more research on stem cells and cutting interest rates on student loans.

But instead of allowing Republicans to fully participate in deliberations, as promised after the Democratic victory in the Nov. 7 midterm elections, Democrats now say they will use House rules to prevent the opposition from offering alternative measures, assuring speedy passage of the bills and allowing their party to trumpet early victories.

Nancy Pelosi, the Californian who will become House speaker, and Steny H. Hoyer of Maryland, who will become majority leader, finalized the strategy over the holiday recess in a flurry of conference calls and meetings with other party leaders. A few Democrats, worried that the party would be criticized for reneging on an important pledge, argued unsuccessfully that they should grant the Republicans greater latitude when the Congress convenes on Thursday.

More: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/01/AR2007010100784.html

[Target_For_Exterm]

1. Don't worry, Bush will counter it all with a few signing statements.

[durtee librul]

97. and a few pocket vetoes...

all the while grinning and saying HE is the decider

[lonestarnot]

98. Yeah, when are they beginning the repeal of those signing statements?

[Waya]

2. That oughta bring frowns and bellows.....

....of rage from the Repukes. :P

[tridim]

8. They can just go home and spend more time with the "family" then..

They've already said that's what they want. See ya in a few weeks lazy-ass Repukes.

[Imagevision]

81. Repukes should stay on 3 day work week, who needs them anyway, they can go online

to find out who gets the subpeona's...

[Joe for Clark]

3. Mr Pitt, that cannot possibly be good.

They did that to us - look where we are.

Joe

[WilliamPitt]

6. Um...

I am of the opinion that a few serious and unilateral moves are required to undo the damage done these last several years.

We'll be friendly next week. At the moment, we have to put the roof back on the house.

[Joe for Clark]

10. Well, I am of the opinion that no party has a monopoly on

truth or good ideas. And it doesn't hurt to listen.

We are at a dangerous crossroads here - we better be listening to all of our people.

That is what makes us a great society - and we don't exclude on a party line - we are dems - we are a lot better than that.

Joe

[conscious evolution]

15. Repugs have good ideas?

They tell the truth?

On what planet?

[Joe for Clark]

22. Sometimes - no harm listening in any event.

You know, people take political positions to win elections - doesn't make them right - except for elections. Our interest is in what is truly best for our country. Without politics injected.

We better do that now -

Joe

[Webster Green]

28. That is absurd!

The only thing they have to offer is more tax-cuts added as ammendments to bills (Minimum wage bill, for example).

We already know where they stand. I say fuck 'em!

[WinkyDink]

43. Yes, LET'S "listen"~~~to the OVERWHELMING "out with the bums" of 11/7.

What's with you, that you think Republicans, who WERE IN CHARGE, might have any GOOD ideas??

[Joe for Clark]

48. Oh no, those people are dangerous.

But they do not represent the conservatives, either.

I want to see a true balance again in the country. I want to see "true" conservatives and "true" liberals debating what is best for our country. We have to have this - this B*sh stuff is just killing our society. The last six years it has been politics at all costs - no principle, no debate. We are in a position to stop it - and we better.

Joe

[WinkyDink]

51. Oh. Well, then. Whom do you nominate for "true conservative"?

[Joe for Clark]

54. In terms of war - I think Buchannon was right.

I think the Goldwater survivors have good foundation.

There are some.

I do not like Pat - but he did make the most powerful argument against this was I ever read.

Joe

[Morgana LaFey]

75. Well, that's such a loft and all-encompassing goal,

surely you're willing to wait 2 - 3 weeks for it to take hold, eh?

I agree with Pitt (something of a rarity) that the first 100 hours ought to proceed without Republican malfeasance and ThePolitics of Disruption which the GOPers are so well known for, and polished at.

[mzmolly]

65. Joe, it's not a matter of "listening" it's a matter of not allowing them to ruin/

muddy our legislation and render it ineffective.

[Imagevision]

86. no harm listening? - we've been listening for 6 years, time for new measures...

fuckem, our way or the highway!!

[Joe for Clark]

101. SO - if your way or the highway means 10 more dead kids

You still so sure???

This is about being adult- not about vengance.

Isn't it???

Joe

[Waya]

19. We already know their ideas.....

......and over the last 6 years they weren't good, nor was there any truth on the side of the GOP.
They rammed their crap thru without listening or even considering to listen to the other side.
And now that we are in a mess up to our eyeballs because of their lousy ideas and their lies - it's time for the Repukes to shut their yaps while the Dems clean up the mess. It's the least those hacks can do.

[Joe for Clark]

32. They did, no doubt - doesn't mean we should.

Does the gop have good ideas sometimes - of course they do.

No harm in listening - a lot of harm in excluding - they did that to us - we should not follow.

I will make this very plain - my interest really is in the war - and the two groups that really did agree that the war was wrong were the true liberals and true conservatives, maybe for different reasons.

B*sh people, the middle, it was totally wrong. And that was political - not ideological.

If the United States was eagle, it has two wings. The truth happens when the two wings meet. And an eagle cannot fly without two wings. Our country depends on that ability to extract ideas,

Those people tried to exclude our wing - and that is precisely why we are where we are.

I don't think we can afford to make the same mistake.

Joe

JOe

[Waya]

37. I'm not saying that your point isn't valid.......

...for the future. But for the moment a semblence of sanity has to be reestablished. The GOP went alone and f*cked it up. Royally. Maybe now the Dems have to go it alone, for a little while, in order to fix it.

[Joe for Clark]

45. You may be right.

I really do trust the collective conscience of the country.

I'll go this far - maybe 4 out of 5 times the dems have the better idea. I think thats about right. But that 5th time, maybe they do - I just think we better be open.

I believe in listening - they believed in political gain. SO we are where we are right now.

It is a very dangerous time for us.

Joe

[WinkyDink]

44. "Does the gop have good ideas sometimes - of course they do."

Name one. Besides Nixon's EPA.

[Joe for Clark]

46. Funny you said the EPA -

Well, Nixon going to China was smart. Reagan's decision to spend the USSR into oblivion was smart (and in concert with every previous administration), Bush's father did well in sidestepping Iraq in 91 was smart.

They did some smart things - not "w" - But many did some smart things.

Joe

[WinkyDink]

50. China was smart? Why, pray tell? So they could own our arse sooner than they might have?

Reagan destroyed the USSR? oh, riiiiight; Afghanistan, the Pope, and Lech Walesa had NOTHING to do with its demise, nor its liberal leader at the time. But Ronnie DID do a good job of spending OUR money.
Poppy "side-stepping Iraq" was smart? In what context, our helping the very undemocratic Kuwait after they stole Iraq's oil? I.e., we shouldn't have gone there then, either.

IN ANY EVENT, CURRENT Republicans are waaaay beyond any "smart" ideas.

[Joe for Clark]

53. I thought - maybe more so in retrospect -

we were going to be fighting China - and we haven't yet.

That Reagan used a checkbook to nail the USSR - well, he did. And that combined with the effort of every president we have had since FDR sealed that fate.

And that the Senior managed to stay away from Baghdad in 1991 - well, he did.

NO ONE is wrong 100% of the time. Smart societies can pick the best and use it.

If this gop has one good idea out of a hundred - we should listen.

Joe

[conscious evolution]

87. I guess you did not

hear Al Haig last night on C-Span.
He said they knew the Soviet Union was going to collapse in the seventies.Thaey just didn't know when.
He also said that the ramped up military spending in the eighties was a boondoggle.

[Joe for Clark]

89. I could never talk Al Haig seriously without three beers.

They didn't know when, did they??

Maybe Al should take the three beers instead.

I think presidents Ford, Carter and Reagan may have alot more meaningful things to say here.

Joe

[Morgana LaFey]

77. Oh please tell me the last GOOD GOP idea you're aware of

I'd really like to know. I keep coming up totally empty-handed since about Gingrich.


Well, I disagree with most of the ones you've posted, but they were also Presidential "good ideas" and not garden-variety Congressional "good ideas" which have been completely and totally absence since Newt's "good ideas" of demonizing everything Democratic and Liberal (tho he didn't start with the demonization of the word "liberal," that was Reagan's gift, which GHWB echoed).

So for my question, stick to Congress.

[Joe for Clark]

91. In 1975 I was in High school.

The truth was I always assumed I was going overseas- Just an assumption because of my family - but it was there for so long - the assumption - I wasn't sure what to do when it was really off the table.

I was the first and last male in my family not to go to war - I am it.

So I think back now - cause a few of my family had such "war glory" - and I understand the truth about such things all these years later - and I think - what a lucky SOB I was back then.

But all these years - all those basic grad classes later - I understand one thing true - All those kids that walked down the parade grounds - they are/were just little kids. That this is the one thing we better hold above everything.

So, yeah - I listen to all possibilities - cause the alternative is to send those "kids" to die - I'll listen to every single alternative before that.

Joe

[Morgana LaFey]

107. Oh how noble

and what a clever way to avoid the challenge.

Things may be different right now -- Novacula DID say it's going to be hard for Bush to find more than 12 Senators to support the Surge, and I'll be eager to see if the Repugs are listening at all -- but prior to this, you'd have been hard pressed to find any GOOD IDEAS from the GOP crowd.

Nor were we talking exclusively about avoiding sending our men and women to war. Again: how clever of you.

[Joe for Clark]

108. How was this clever???

Avoid what challenge??

Things may be diferent right now - oh, really - what are you talking about??

Joe

[flyarm]

85. we have been listening ..for 12 years..enough!! enough already!!

we listened when they gave us a 9/11 commission that toilet paper would have more value
we listened when they took us to war for oil..and our kids are dying..

in a shit hole

we listened and listened ..because that is all we were allowed to do!!!!!!!!!!

in fact we weren't even allowed to listen..or read a damn thing they did till they put most of it on the floor of congress..without our reps even getting toi see it until they had to vote on it

we listened when they put us in the basement of the capitol

we listened when Sensenbrenner turned the mike's off and turned the lights off..

now it is their turn to listen ..while real men and real women try to fix what those mother fuckers broke!

enough of the damn listening!!

now it is time for action..and fixing...and fuck those bastards who broke it!

they didn't give a rats ass when they were the tellers!!

and that is what they were..tellers..they never once listened to anything those representing us had to say!


I'm not ready to make nice..........

fly

[Joe for Clark]

94. Fly - I don't think you've been so close to a fight - correct me if I am

wrong. And I don't think you were even around the last time we fought as a country.

I don't think you ever really saw the results that can happen, do happen - cause if you did - you'd know, you just look for a solution - politics don't matter at all.

Those kids are just kids- in every war - they are just kids. The country has to make a decision as to if it is necessary to send them off to be soldiers - the country makes the decision - to send them to fight or to call them back.

We made the call - bring the kids home, right now.

I do not care a lick about the politics - I just don't. But those kids, I care about them. I was too young to speak in the last war - I am not any more. And they were the same faces to me.

All these years later - it is unfortunate to me I understand those things - very unfortunate.

Get the kids the hell out of there - one way or the other - the other issues will get resolved on their own.

Joe

[flyarm]

95. SIR I AM IN MY MID 50's...and my brothers fought in that other war of lies!

both my brothers went to nam..and i had a boyfriend ..a childhood sweetheart that never came home!
my next door neighbor ..my brothers best friend came home missing 2 legs and an arm...i know all about the lies to war..and the carnage it leaves in its wake.

and my hubby got in the reserves when his number was 14 in the draft..he served in reserves stateside.

and i will say it again..and i will say it loud..i am not ready to make nice,.i will never be again!!

my co-workers were killed on 9/11 and i took off as flight crew in front of UAL flt 93 out of Newark that morning..i am fucking sick of the DAMN LIES..AND I AM REALLY SICK OF THE LYING SACKS OF SHIT THAT CALL THEMSELVES REPUBLICANS!

no ..i am not ready to make nice..and i do not believe i will ever be again!

those fuckers have destroyed my country. and they have done their damnest to destroy what every member of my family fought for ..to protect the very constitutuon ... that these damn republicans and this white house have shredded!

they have destroyed and robbed my children of their legally born rights under my constitution..i want them all held accountable!

my entire family fought for those rights in uniform unlike the sniviling little coward in this white house..

and most of those who call themselves republicans..i am done with those fuckers!

shut them off and shut them down..nowwwwwwwww!!!....thats what i have worked my ass off for to get a dem congress to take this country back!

I want our kids home from another damn lie of a war, for the greedy mother fucking bastards in the republican congress and this white house!

end of story!

i am done with those fuckers!

no more nice in me left!


i pray before i leave this earth i can look my children in the face and say..i tried ..i did what i could to save your country for you...

i want to be able to hold my head up and say i am an American ..with pride again..instead of hiding behind Canadian flags and pins when i travel out of the country for safety!..

for 33 years ..i flew and was always proud to say i am an American...now i fear saying it out of the country! i fear having anything that says i am American on me!..that is what republicans and pissy pants have done to my nation!!

and sir i have flown for a major airline since i was 19 years old!!

i took early retirement because i no longer trusted my own government!

I was flight attend of the year in 2001 for the entire NY base of my airline..that encompassed LGA , Jfk and EWR...

no sir..i am done with nice...i want someone with balls to take those fuckers on..head on,..and i want accountablity!

now!!

fly

[Joe for Clark]

96. I shouldn't have been so quick with you - I apologize -

It is weird in a way - I never thought of Viet Nam as this wrong - my parents did. My brothers that fought there did - later. I didn't. Funny in a way.

I want the kids out of there as fast as possible - and I am willing to make deals to do that.

Not that I count - but if I did I would. Together we do count.

It is not a matter of being nice - it is a matter of getting the deal done. Cause if we don't, kids die. Nice kids.

I didn't mean to be so harsh with you - I am sorry. But I lived with war or the consequences of it every day of my life. And now, my kid is there right now. He has been ambushed, shot at, mortared and blown up.

I don't have an interest in being nice - I do have an interest in getting a deal done though.

Joe

[Tsiyu]

117. It's so easy to attack people you can't see

that's what the Repukes have been doing for years:

attacking senior citizens, our military, innocent Iraqis, hell, they run the prisons. They make money torturing America's own.

They are bloodthirsty goons who must be stopped. There are no good ideas on that side of the aisle, because Republicans are too busy worrying about getting busted/voted out of paradise/needing Depends real soon.

I think you have a very selective memory if you don't recall John Conyers and Cynthia McKinney holding hearings in the freakin' basement. That's how much those lowlifes sought to listen.

They heard money, and that's all the hell they've heard for a long time. Money in their pockets. If you think we should show them even one iota of trust at this massively screwed up point, you have probably been made a fool of quite a few times in your life.

[BigBearJohn]

113. Well said Flyarm. The GOP DEGRADED us and now we should LISTEN to them?

They have nearly DESTROYED our country and we should LISTEN to them?
Holy fucking shit. When did they EVER listen to us? Oh, but we
don't want to be like them? EXACTLY. I don't want to have anything
to do with them. The thieving lying sacks of shit. Yes SHIT.
Republicans care about the almighty dollar and THEMSELVES. That's it.
They will do ANYTHING -- EVEN DESTROY OUR CONSTITUTION to further
their goals -- and you want us to LISTEN to them? I can still
remember how HUMILIATED I was when Sensenbrenner turned off the
microphones in the middle of our meeting. I wanted to vomit.

Well, OK, changed that -- I will be glad to listen to them on 2 occasions.
1. When they are in court for their crimes.
2. When they are sitting behind bars, pleading for parole.

As far as republicans go, I have one guiding rule:
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It's a waste of time
and it annoys the pig."

I might have listened to a republican back when the words
"human decency" meant something in this country.

In closing, remember this: when the house is burning down,
you don't stop and listen to a yapping, whining dog
biting at your heels. You kick the dog off your pants
leg and run to put out the fire. And Baby, our country is
on FIRE... nearly burnt down to the ground.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

20. Thanks for your concern. -nt

[Cleita]

24. I would ordinarily agree with you, but since most of these

Repugs have violated the Constitution and are basically gangland style criminals, I don't consider them to have a legitimate leg to stand on.

[babsbunny]

59. Yeah!

[bobbolink]

92. Off with their heads! errrr.... legs...

:hi:

"are basically gangland style criminals" -- Very well put! :thumbsup:

[WinkyDink]

41. I beg to differ. With Republicans, it not only hurts to listen; it KILLS.

[specimenfred1984]

47. You like ideas like torture, illegal wiretapping, rigged elections?

Name 1 mutha fcking idea repukes have had that didn't involve treason or corruption.

[Joe for Clark]

49. The last 6 years I don't think anyone can.

Doesn't make it right that we don't allow the true gop to speak.

They were pretty muzzled by their party. Maybe not so much after November- anyway, we have nothing to loose by listening,

Joe

[specimenfred1984]

52. The "true GOP" wasn't in power? lol

It must have been that make-believe GOP that people just pretended to vote for.

But I'm listening, learning and always open. So, what "real GOP" ideas are the dems refusing to listen to?

The "real GOP", GAWDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD!

[Joe for Clark]

55. If we listen, we may find a worthy idea.

If we don't - we'll never hear it.

I advocate listening - thats all.

Joe

[specimenfred1984]

57. You mean like this one:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=3026635&mesg_id=3026635

Take a good look, that's the "true GOP", true racists, true Nazi-like smear campaigners, true corruption.

[Joe for Clark]

58. No.

Joe

[Horse with no Name]

63. They have had the sole platform for the last few years

without listening to any input from Democrats.
They have royally fucked things up--I'm with Will.
Let's fix the worst and then bring them to the table.

[mzmolly]

64. Actually, I'd say Republicans have proven you incorrect.

They are ideologues with a goal to protect the wealthy. They are void of "good ideas/intentions/truth" and have demonstrated that for the past several years.

[Joe for Clark]

67. No - they thought they could keep their jobs if the held

a party line - that is what they thought.

Well, they aren't so sure now. SO there is no better time to get the best input.

Nobody has a monopoly on good ideas - not even us.

We do not have to make the same mistakes they did.

Joe

[mzmolly]

69. Bullcrap. Regardless, they have proven they don't deserve a say.

The mistake they made was not listening to "reasonable" people. I am thankful we're not letting the lunatics effect policy any longer.

[Joe for Clark]

73. The mistake they made was doing the bidding of those

that funded them - their campaigns.

And I think they leave the rest of us "reasonable" people not so much room now.

It is not about effecting policy - it is about speaking up with ideas - it is about "us" picking out the best ideas to continue as a country. Just that.

At least, I think so.

Joe

[mzmolly]

78. Actually ideas become policy.

That's the "idea." ;)

Have a nice night.

[durtee librul]

100. Yeah, let's not forget Terry Schiavo

and how the good 'dr.' diagnosed her from afar ( must be psychic)....

Yepper, they are worth listening to.

Well, I agree Joe we should listen, but sir, with all due respect, we have been FORCED to listen for too long and it's now time to speak and tell them to shut up and take their lies and cheating and 'morals' somewhere else.

Now, that being said, do I think the dems will follow thru? Nope. I don't think they have the cahones to do it. I sure hope I am wrong, but they were all so quick to lean to the 'center' to be pc....nope, maybe the new kids on the block will shape them up, and I hope they do, but am I holding my breath - no.

[Joe for Clark]

106. I am a catholic - I do believe in life.

You know what happened this weekend?? The day they executed Saddam they lost us - really trully lost us. I think they lost a lot of people.

We don't have to accept BS - just listen for good ideas. You know the sick thing is I think the US government realized too late the consequence. Anway, it really is done.

I am truly a member of the christian left right now. I think the catholic church just joined us in mass too!!

Joe

[Imagevision]

120. K&R!!!

[LittleClarkie]

21. I just wish they hadn't promised to do otherwise

And hence, would not now be going back on their word.

[Beetwasher]

25. They Never Promised They Would

allow themselves to be SUCKERS. And when they said they wouldn't do to the Repubs what the Repubs did to them, the Repubs came out and said they would USE that opportunity to FUCK w/ the Dems right out of the gate.

[LittleClarkie]

27. They said that? Where? I'd like to read it.

Would put some perspective on things.

[Beetwasher]

30. Read The Article In the OP

"House Republicans say their strategy will be to offer alternative bills that would be attractive to the conservative "Blue Dog" Democrats, with an eye toward fracturing the Democratic coalition. They hope to force some tough votes for Democrats from conservative districts who will soon begin campaigning for 2008 reelection and will have to defend their records.

"We'll capitalize on every opportunity we have," said one GOP leadership aide, adding that Republicans were preparing alternatives to the Democrats' plans to raise the minimum wage, reduce the interest on student loans, and reduce the profits of big oil and energy companies."

--snip--

"If they've got ideas that will make our legislation better, we ought to consider that," said Rep. Allen Boyd Jr. (D-Fla.), leader of the Blue Dogs. "But if their idea is to try to split a group off to gain power, that's what they've been doing for the past six years, and it's all wrong.""

--snip--

And that's exactly what they would try to do and that's fucking w/ them and using their good will against them. Why SHOULD Dems give them that opportunity? It would be beyond stupid.

They had 12 years to put forth their bullshit, why should the Dems allow them the opportunity to stall and delay and try to fuck up their initiatives by being nice to them?

[Old and In the Way]

31. Boehner said it a couple of weeks ago.

They'd use any bi-partisan opportunity to sink our agenda.

Hey, I'm all for having Republicans jump on our bandwagon and help pass our agenda in a spirit of bi-partisanship. All they need to do is vote for it. We didn't elect Democrats to adjust the Republican agenda...we elected them to replace that agenda.

[LittleClarkie]

35. Oh well they're asking for it then

Let 'er rip.

[frazzledmom]

38. Exactly... they had their chance.

When Americans are finished dying in Iraq for no reason then we can welcome the Repub opinion. As it stands now we know where they stand and we know what they want. Fuck them.

[WinkyDink]

40. That's because of what the Republicans PASSED, not merely because of the

methods.

[mzmolly]

62. We're where we are because Republicans are not rational.

We, on the other hand, are. ;)

[Joe for Clark]

68. Oh - maybe we are here because they can't afford to

run for office - if they really say what they think.

Well, they are there - they are free to talk right now - and I pray they do.

Maybe - anyway.

Joe

[mzmolly]

71. Joe, your idea is a nice one and full of "patriotic" idealism. However, again this isn't a matter

of "listening" to them, it's a matter of preventing them from stalling/poisoning progress. They will not be able to muddy the legislation we are putting forward because of this decision. That's a good thing.

[Joe for Clark]

82. I am very pro US - patriotic - in a reasonable sense.

You know - when FDR was president - he saw what was coming. The country was very divided. He turned and put republicans in the cabinet (Clinton did that too, by the way) it was smart and unified us so that - when the war did come - we were ready.

I pray to god there is no WWIII - every day. But I know at the end of the day, our ability as a country to prevent it has to do with our strength going into the possibility.

I am a dem - I am american first, however. And I fully understand we better be unified right now - the consequences of not doing so are so serious.

It is not so much to ask that our elected officials ask the other side what they think - not so much at all.

Joe

[mzmolly]

83. They've shown us what they think, and how they think.

However, this move is about not allowing them to play politics with our very important agenda. We haven't much time to undo the damage that Party has brought us.

G'night. :hi:

[Joe for Clark]

88. Look, there was a strategic move that went against us -

continues to - day by day.

The problem is the country has to recognize an appropriate strategy to counter- and do it united.

Really.

From this day to the end they have us by the short hairs - until we eliminate that, this is going to be a problem. Why do you think we are in Iraq - something to do with oil??

A regional conflict threatens the straight - threatens our economy. From now to the day we are independent of the middle east it will remain a threat.

The strategy has to be to stop the dependence. It is the only way.

Th gop knows that full well - so do we. This is the true issue of our generation.

Joe

[mzmolly]

90. The GOP denies global warming, they parrot the talking points of the

corporate world. They believe whatever their corporate "daddy" tells them. They believe that the UN is "bad" that social security is "bad" that universal health care is "bad" that helping the poor is "bad." You give them credit for being rational and honest, I don't, and I think they've proven me correct.

[Joe for Clark]

93. I guess I do.

These people - their funding comes from what they have to say to get elected - it is not right.

I only give them "credit" for being smart enough to get elected - the rest they have to earn.

I know that the country has to have two different views to pick out the right one - that is what I want. I want the best for the country- our country.

This hasn't happened for many years now - it has to happen now. We are out of time for the political. They may be right only 1 out of 5 times - that is enough to make us listen. We just have to listen - a courtesy they took away from us - we do NOT have to do the same.

Joe

[Laurab]

99. It's only 100 hours, not forever

and there is an awful lot to undo and to do. I am sure that we will afford them much more say, and listen to them much more, than they allowed us, and surely much more than they deserve.

They're talking about taking 100 hours to actually get some things DONE before the game-playing begins. It's really not all that big a deal. If they have any good ideas, I'm sure we can wait past the first 100 hours to hear them.

Every politician has to say things to get elected - that doesn't mean that after they're elected they have to rubber-stamp everything their nutcase of a pResident tells them to, and that is what the repukes did, for far too long.

Perhaps they will become more reasonable, for political reasons, now that * is a liability, but if their goal right from the start is to mess with the dems proposals, it sure doesn't look that way. Lets give the dems a little time before they have to get all bipartisany with the people who have screwed them over for so many years. They have a LOT of work to do.

[Joe for Clark]

102. I know -

I am so sick of the politics -

This congress was elected because of the stupid war. They have to deal with it.

The gop congress made a decision to exclude us - we surely better not do the same.

Everything starts from a begining - That they did wrong does not mean we have to.

And we should start from the begining.

Joe

[Tatiana]

109. I understand what you are feeling, Joe. This is not the time for bipartisanship.

We are at a crisis point in our nation. We have thousands of troops dead, our military has been severely compromised, and our civilians have little faith in this country's executive or Congressional leadership. Many hard-working families are making the decision whether buy groceries or pay rising heating costs. Many other hard-working families are one emergency room visit or major illness away from financial ruin.

We've heard from Republicans. We've heard their ideas and they have netted us a wrongful invasion of Iraq, the Patriot Act, a disastrous bankruptcy bill, a falling dollar, an increasing national debt, and many other horrendous results.

We cannot afford, at this juncture, to compromise with the folk who have plunged this nation into near-ruin. We must be concerned with stopping the free-fall and correction as must damage as we can as soon as we can. In order to do that, I support whatever parliamentary and legislative tools the Democratic Congress must employ in order to attain some measure of respite for the American public.

Indeed, the people have heard what the Republicans had to say and they rejected their message by voting them out of office. If Republicans want to support legislation such as the minimum wage increase, I'd more than welcome that support. However, I don't want to entertain any amendments that would tie it to more tax cuts, for instance. That's the only sort of thing we'd gain from bipartisanship right now.

Take an honest look at the remaining GOP Representatives and Senators. Many more stand to lose their seats in 2008. These people don't represent the average American at all. They represent corporate interests, who have bought and paid for them. While we've heard from some Democrats that have apologized for their support of Bush's Iraq fiasco, we've heard next to no contrition or apology from Republicans. In fact, many, like McCain, suggest we send thousands more over to Iraq to die.

I'm sorry, but I don't want to listen to anything McCain and those of his ilk have to say. I've heard enough. We've sacrificed enough. Maybe when we have a Congress represented by real Republican conservatives who have the interests of citizens of this nation in mind, then we can talk about bipartisanship and dialogue and debate on the issues.

Make no mistake, this isn't about something as petty as "payback" or "revenge." This is about checks and balances, how we go about protecting the lives of American citizens, injecting a healthy dose of common sense and accountability in government, and restoring the global respect of the United States of America.

[Joe for Clark]

111. I don't think you do Tatiana - and I know you mean well.

This whole thing is very personal to me.

My kid got shot at, ambushed, mortared and blown up - he doesn't have too many lives left at this point.

If Satan came up with a good plan, I'd listen to him too at this point.

This isn't about revenge - it is about getting the kid, a lot of kids out of there as fast as possible. That simple.

Joe

[Tatiana]

112. I'm very sorry for what your son has gone through.

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't have any faith in the current GOP or in their idea to produce any worthwhile ideas or strategies to improve your son's situation or the lives of our other troops. Their ideas are the very reason our men and women are over there.

Have you read or heard Keith Olbermann's special comment on the additional troop "surge" Bush will propose? If not, you should check it out. He states with passion and eloquence the folly of Bush's desire to "win" in Iraq and the "human sacrifice" more of our kids will pay.

These people -- these Republicans will not be the ones to save our men and women. They didn't listen when General Shinseki told the U.S. Senate Armed Services committee before the war in Iraq began that "something in the order of several hundred thousand soldiers" would probably be required for post-war Iraq. They didn't listen when General Clark advised against invasion.

What makes you think these same people who didn't listen to military advisors with experience would be capable of proposing some miraculous strategy for getting us out of a situation they put us in?

It's not going to happen. What we need to do is bring in minds like General Clark and Senator Kerry and other retired Generals to develop and implement a successful exit strategy and plan for post-invasion Iraq.

[izzie]

4. Well we already know the GOP does not want any of this

Let Bush veto them. I bet the thoughts are that the GOP would hold up the bills and they would never let them pass with their add ons.

[displacedtexan]

5. Repukes will scream bloody murder no matter what Dems do.

[zanne]

14. I can't wait to hear them. nt

[madeline_con]

7. Will they repeal the PATRIOT ACT? n/t

[Cleita]

26. I don't thinks so, but I think they will change some of the more

draconian provisions that lessen our freedom and liberty. Some Democratic legislators have said in the past that there are some provisions of the Patriot Act that are necessary.

:shrug:

[madeline_con]

33. I'd really like to know what they may be.

There were already laws on the books to deal with things like flying planes into buildings, resulting in mass murder.

[Rex]

9. Republicans have a proven track record of failure.

Only 11% of Americans approved of the 109th! I'd say they should just step aside and let the adults try and fix the messes Repukes seem to always make. Oh, BTW, this won't be the first time Dems have gone back on their word. Seems both parties like doing that. What? Repukes just thought the Dems would play nice?

See? They are stupid.

[dogday]

11. Republicans want partisanship when they

don't have the power... I tend to remember all the bills they passed without any partisanship at all, all the damn time...

I think about when the Democrats held meetings in the basement, and how Senslessbrenner turned off the microphones, and lights on one those meetings.... So I say to them a big hearty FU... May the Democrats run the show..... Go for it!!!!!!

[Esra Star]

23. I think you mean "bipartisanship"........don't you? n/t

[dogday]

36. Yep that too!!!

[zanne]

12. They say there's a "dark side" to all of us.

My "dark side" is coming out...I can't wait for the fireworks! I don't want unity and compromise; I want to see Republicans cry! I'm evil and I love it.

[Double T]

13. The voters want results that are meaningful and substantive ........

for THEM and their lives. As long as legislation is being formulated and passed by the DEMOCRATS with that goal in mind, the rethugs no longer matter. It is NOW about the voters, the people; NOT about the corporations.

[SoCalDem]

16. All they need say is this:

republicans have already spoken on these issues.. They said NO.

The public said YES on Nov 8th. We are following the public. When these bills are presented to the president , he will have his chance to weigh in.

Republicans are already on the record about these issues..

New legislation will be inclusive from the beginning.

[jaxx]

17. Bring it on.

The pubs have had 12 years to hash out these same measures and have chosen to do nothing. Why would we want to give them more time to stall? They're going to have enough 'aw shucks' moments to come when dubya tries to sell his escalation in Iraq.

[catmandu57]

18. Don't you know bush* is fifty foot tall and bullet proof

at least according to some of the threads I've read. Myself I've stocked up on popcorn :evilgrin:

[Gidney N Cloyd]

29. As much as I'd like to say "Good! The GOP has it coming," this just has a weird Animal Farm feel...

...to it.
I think SoCalDem touched on something above. Pelosi needs to make it clear why this approach is being taken.

[in_cog_ni_to]

34. Bring it on! I'm more than ready for our Dems to stand tall

and take the rat bastards to the wood shed. I cannot wait.

[Joe for Clark]

39. If we do not do the smart thing right now, as a country

A lot of kids are going to die. This situation could friggin blow up.

I want those kids out of there - right now - make no mistake.

So I am absolutely prepared to listen to both sides in this - And I am certain no side has a monopoly on truth. No one can be wrong 100% of the time.

The reason our country is great is because we as a society have an inate ability to pick the fly shit out of the pepper.

That is exactly what we have to do now.

Joe

[hashibabba]

42. This argument is about the first 100 hours of the 110th Congress.

So what's the big deal? At this point, I wouldn't even care if the Dems shut out the Repukes for the next two years!!! They've been killing us and its about time we turned the tables and brought some common sense back to this government.

There may be two wings to an eagle, but only the right wing has been in operation for years. How much has worked out well in that time? It's time for the left wing to even things out.

[Joe for Clark]

56. So as we flutter into the ground we have the satisaction

of knowing that instead of hitting the ground from the right we hit the ground from the left??

Man, I don't want to hit at all!!!

Joe

[Selatius]

61. Your hyperbole is not really helping to illustrate your point.

Cutting student loan interest rates in half and raising the minimum wage in addition to passing other laws Dems said they'd do won't make the US hit the ground at all.

[Joe for Clark]

66. No hyperbole - you didn't get the opportunity to go fight for

your country yet, did you??

Well, I think you will - soon.

What do you think student loan rates mean in the big picture, exactly??

This is about the war - about the possiblity of a big expansion of the war - about dumb kids about about to be caught in it - really.

I like the kids - I don't care so much about student loan rates.

Joe

[Selatius]

72. From what I read, the 100 hour plan included nothing about the war.

These measures were meant to fix some of the house problems like the minimum wage that Repubs have neglected, but I guess for Repubs, helping the poor is a small issue. The war is a bigger issue that couldn't be addressed in the next 100 hours at any rate. If they pass a draft or send another 30,000 troops, then the Dems committed electoral suicide. Like I said, I don't think they're going to drive the country into the ground by making minimum wage the star platform of the 100 hour plan. The war and the draft, those are issues for the next 2 years, not the 100 hour plan.

[Joe for Clark]

74. You understand - the problem is they are going to send more

kids there - right now. How is it that we do not address that situation immediately - in the first hour!! That is what the election was really about.

You know there are many republicans that DO agree with us on the war. At least now they do.

What other issue is so important for us????

It is the issue to me.

Joe

[Selatius]

80. Bush can't send the 30,000 troops without the money

The 100 hour plan isn't likely going to include another 100 billion defense appropriations bill for that kind of undertaking.

I'm not here to defend to you the merit of the 100 hour plan they devised. I am stating what is and isn't included in the plan, though, as I had read over Christmas they wanted to do with this plan.

If I had my way, the first thing they would've done is introduce a bill calling for a timetable for withdrawal.

[Joe for Clark]

84. He already did.

It is happening.

We DO have an interest as a society in talking to the Hagel factions RIGHT NOW.

DO you really think we needed to "surge" to fight it out in Baghdad??

Joe

[kineneb]

60. to the Rs: Karma sucks.

The Rs should not be surprised to have their own tactics turned on them.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

70. Considering the lack of productive input from Republicans in the past Congress

I don't see any harm in this. Since they've made it abundantly clear that they are little more than bush's ditto heads, why should anyone respect what they have to say?

[upi402]

79. R's are proven crooks and liars. Corporatist ideologues, therefore sociopaths

effemall

[BR_Parkway]

76. I dont recall any campaign pledges to be more bipartisan - seems like

most of them were a complete repudiation of the Republican course of action, and that was totally backed up at the polls.

[leanin_green]

103. Why am I not surprised?

I mean, it would have been laudable for me to think that the existing political power structure would do anything but, tit for tat. How unrefreshing! Another opportunity for the Democrats to set a more coherent course of political civility squandered. A chance for the Democrats to show the people who voted(?)them into power that they mean to change the political climate is proving to be just "more of the same." And then to sit here and read this drivel cheering them on. Lemmings over the cliff! Why am I not surprised?

Okay, you may flame away now and pile on.

[WilliamPitt]

104. And you are "leanin green" why, exactly?

Seriously.

[leanin_green]

122. It goes like this, Will. . .

My username, leanin_green, refers to where I am on the progressive political spectrum. If I was referring to leaning toward the Green Party, I would have capitalized the "G". I'm still a registered Democrat Will. My politics within the Party leans toward some of what the Greens say, some of what the Socialists say, hell, sometimes on certain issues, what conservative Democrats say! So, because I'm still a Democrat, I reserve the right to criticize the actions of those within the Party. I'm not happy with what passes for being a Democrat today. Frankly, I've come to realize that what really is going on is the struggle for power and that within this current social structure that is America, it's beginning to become very hard to distinguish between the Dems or the Repubs. Something really stinks in the halls of power, and the Democrats are a big contributer to the stench. Any TRUE Progressive can accept that without trying to shout down the person pointing it out. Someone with a liberal mind can acknowledge valid criticism and bring an open mind to bear.

"The liberal soul shall be made fat: and he that watereth shall be watered also himself." Prov. 11:25

[Tiggeroshii]

105. Very entertaining radio for any midday commute.

[BuyingThyme]

110. Everything the Washington Post does is aimed at protecting

their war.

[Hugin]

114. More broadly, I'd say it's to protect the 'Status quo'...

But, I agree with you on the specifics.

[BigBearJohn]

115. Ok, Joe for Clark, you seem like a religious man. How about a quote from the bible:

In Proverbs 25:26 we read that "A righteous man who falters before the wicked is like a murky spring and a polluted well." Certainly, we would be faltering before the wicked if we chose to be unarmed and unable to resist an assailant who might be threatening our life. In other words, we have no right to hand over our life which is a gift from God to the unrighteous. It is a serious mistake to equate a civilized society with one in which the decent people are doormats for the evil to trample on.

And, my friend.. the current Republican party is as unrighteous and as close to pure evil as I have ever witnessed.

[maine_raptor]

116. Joe for Clark is right, we should listen to the GOP.

Let's listen to them yak and spout and pound their feet. Let's listen to them cry and moan. Let's listen to them as they try to wrap themselves in flag, God, and country. Let's listen to them cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

And do exactly what and how they listened to us all these years.

Listen, then do what we Dems planned to do all along anyways; fix the country and restore the Constitution.

Maybe they have a good idea, but I ain't heard one yet..........and I have been listening.

[marions ghost]

118. bring it on

n/t

[BigBearJohn]

119. Listening to the GOP reminds me of the story of the SCORPION and the FROG

For those of you who don't know the story:

In the story, a scorpion and a frog meet on the bank of a stream and the scorpion asks the frog to carry him across on its back. The frog asks, "How do I know you won't sting me?" The scorpion says, "Because if I do, I will die too." The frog is satisfied, and they set out, but in midstream, the scorpion stings the frog. The frog feels the onset of paralysis and starts to sink, knowing they both will drown, but has just enough time to gasp "Why?" Replies the scorpion: "Its my nature..."

[mnhtnbb]

121. I don't think this is smart in the long run.