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She really was a traitor re: Jane Fonda

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Saphire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:18 PM
Original message
She really was a traitor re: Jane Fonda
WTF!!!!!

Why can't the right see that ALL torture is BAD!!!! I just got this e-mail (yeah, i work with these nuts, and this is just part of the bullshit it get every week.) Asking me to basically condemn torture because it's bad, but they all support Mr. Bush's torture. WFT is wrong with these people. My blood pressure is up to high for me to respond now, although it never makes a difference with the kool-aid gang. They just keep sending this shit.

:banghead:

IF YOU NEVER FORWARDED ANYTHING IN YOU LIFE FORWARD THIS SO THAT EVERYONE WILL KNOW!!!!!!.......



She really was a traitor

A TRAITOR IS ABOUT TO BE HONORED
KEEP THIS MOVING ACROSS
AMERICA

This is for all the kids born in the 70's who do
not remember, and didn't have to bear the
burden that our fathers, mothers and older
brothers and sisters had to bear.

Jane Fonda is being honored as one of the
"100 Women of the Century."

BY BARBRA WALTERS
Unfortunately, many have forgotten and still
countless others have never known how Ms.
Fonda betrayed not only the idea of our country,
but specific men who served and sacrificed
during Vietnam.

The first part of this is from an F-4E pilot

The pilot's name is Jerry Driscoll, a River Rat.

In 1968, the former Commandant of the USAF
Survival School was a POW in Ho Lo Prison
the "Hanoi Hilton."

Dragged from a stinking cesspit of a cell,
cleaned, fed, and dressed in clean PJ's, he was
ordered to describe for a visiting American
"Peace Activist" the "lenient and humane
treatment" he'd received.
He spat at Ms. Fonda, was clubbed, and was
dragged away.
During the subsequent beating, he fell forward
on to the camp Commandant's feet, which
sent that officer berserk.

In 1978, the Air Force Colonel still suffered from
double vision (which permanently ended his
flying career) from the Commandant's frenzied
application of a wooden baton.

From 1963-65, Col. Larry Carrigan was in the
47FW/DO (F-4E's). He spent 6 years in the
"Hanoi Hilton",,, the first three of which his
family only knew he was "missing in action".
His wife lived on faith that he was still alive.
His group, too, got the cleaned-up, fed and
clothed routine in preparation for a
"peace delegation" visit.
They, however, had time and devised a plan to
get word to the world that they were alive
and still survived. Each man secreted a tiny
piece of paper, with his Social Security Number
on it, in the palm of his hand.

When paraded before Ms. Fonda and a
cameraman, she walked the line, shaking each
man's hand and asking little encouraging
snippets like: "Aren't you sorry you bombed
babies?" and "Are you grateful for the humane
treatment from your benevolent captors?"
Believing this HAD to be an act, they each
palmed her their sliver of paper.
She took them all without missing a beat. At the
end of the line and once the camera stopped
rolling, to the shocked disbelief of the POWs,
she turned to the officer in charge and handed
him all the little pieces of paper.

Three men died from the subsequent beatings.
Colonel Carrigan was almost number four
but he survived, which is the only reason we
know of her actions that day.

I was a civilian economic development advisor
in Vietnam, and was captured by the North
Vietnamese communists in South Vietnam in
1968, and held prisoner for over 5 years.

I spent 27 months in solitary confinement; one
year in a cage in Cambodia; and one year
in a "black box" in Hanoi.
My North Vietnamese captors deliberately
poisoned and murdered a female missionary, a
nurse in a leprosarium in Ban me Thuot, South
Vietnam, whom I buried in the jungle near the
Cambodian border.
At one time, I weighed only about 90 lbs.
(My normal weight is 170 lbs.)

We were Jane Fonda's "war criminals."

When Jane Fonda was in Hanoi, I was asked by
the camp communist political officer if I would
be willing to meet with her.

I said yes, for I wanted to tell her about the real
treatment we POWs received... and how
different it was from the treatment purported by
the North Vietnamese, and parroted by her as
"humane and lenient."

Because of this, I spent three days on a rocky
floor on my knees, with my arms outstretched
with a large steel weights placed on my hands,
and beaten with a bamboo cane.

I had the opportunity to meet with Jane Fonda
soon after I was released. I asked her
if she would be willing to debate me on TV.
She never did answer me.

These first-hand experiences do not exemplify
someone who should be honored as part
of "100 Years of Great Women."
Lest we forget..." 100 Years of Great Women"
should never include a traitor whose hands are
covered with the blood of so many patriots.

There are few things I have strong visceral
reactions to, but Hanoi Jane's participation in
:banghead:
blatant treason, is one of them.
Please take the time to forward to as many
people as you possibly can.
It will eventually end up on her computer and
she needs to know that we will never forget.
RONALD D. SAMPSON, CMSgt, USAF
716 Maintenance Squadron, Chief of
Maintenance
DSN: 875-6431
COMM: 883-6343

PLEASE HELP BY SENDING THIS TO
EVERYONE IN YOUR ADDRESS BOOK. IF
ENOUGH PEOPLE SEE THIS MAYBE HER
STATUS WILL CHANGE


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meegbear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
1. From breakthechain.org ...
The "100 Women of the Century" list alluded to in this chain was actually called "A Celebration: 100 Years of Great Women," and aired on ABC television in 1999. This letter originated about the same time, but creeps back into inboxes near the end of each year, as magazines, TV shows and others begin producing their "________ of the year" lists, misleading many to believe this is current news.

This accounts of Fonda's visit to Viet Nam are based on real events, but the specifics of Ms. Fonda's betrayal are exaggerated at best. Some aspects are true and verifiable, while other parts are pure fiction or rumor. Jerry Driscoll and Larry Carrigan have publicly denied the accounts attributed to them.

<snip>

http://www.breakthechain.org/exclusives/hanoijane.html
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texastoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #1
15. More propaganda from the Reich wing
You see, right-wingers don't want the truth. Facts scare them. They don't have enough ground to stand on, so they make up lies to distract. The followers just email the stuff on because they are too stupid to look up anything themselves (or maybe they are counting on the stupidity of the recipients to whom they forward the emails). They are very easily manipulated, and the reich counts on that to help spread hysteria and misinformation.

http://www.snopes.com/military/fonda.asp

________________________________________________________________________

Even Bill O'Liely (smear boy) had to back down on this one.

O'Reilly Admits He Was Wrong About Jane Fonda
Reported by Marie Therese - May 19, 2005
Yesterday (5/18/05) Bill O'Reilly actually admitted he made a mistake about Jane Fonda! He announced it towards the end of the show.

O'REILLY: Time now for "Most Ridiculous Item of the Day"...

Setting the record straight on Jane Fonda. Now, last night I told Dick Gillespie of Reason magazine that I was not willing to give Ms. Fonda a pass on the accusation she turned over notes from American POW's to the North Vietnamese during her trip to Hanoi.

A web site called Snopes.com has investigated and debunked that accusation. They say it's not true.

Well, we decided to research it. We spent the day doing it. And the indication is that Snopes is correct! The story is bogus. So at this point, lacking any definable evidence to the contrary, Jane Fonda did not turn over any POW notes to the Vietnamese.

We're happy to clarify the record. It would be ridiculous not to do so. All right. Way to go, Snopes.com.

http://www.newshounds.us/2005/05/19/oreilly_admits_he_was_wrong_about_jane_fonda.php

_________________________________________________________________________

Just let me know when you get the email that says it was all John Edwards' fault that we ran short on flu vaccine. You should be getting it any day if you are on the mailing lists for these fools.

I dearly love to Reply to All when I debunk this stuff.





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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 03:01 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. Bush is a traitor, forward that to everyone you know...
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Rabrrrrrr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
2. They tell us to "get over" a stolen election, but they are STILL fucking
obsessed with something that happened FORTY FUCKING YEARS AGO!

GET OVER IT!!!

Especially since Fonda has apologized. Fuck.
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Der Blaue Engel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
3. Well, gee, thanks for helping them spread the word
Is it really necessary to post that here?
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
4. Got it
deleted it
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Dogmudgeon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:26 PM
Response to Original message
5. More hate-Jane mail?
There's a ton of it out there, and just about all of it is crap. And it predates the Internet -- I got my first piece of hate-Jane mail by "snail mail" in 1978.

No doubt about it, Jane Fonda made a fool of herself when she visited Vietnam. She allowed herself to be used by some of the most cynical tyrants to have ever walked the Earth. But the stories of her leaving a trail of abused POWs in her wake are usually confabulated, pieced together from other incidents, or just plain lies.

Check out Snopes and Soldiers For The Truth (David Hackworth's website).

If it's an Internet "grass roots outrage" mailing, it's probably bullshit. That goes for ANY such incendiary mail, from "Blue Star Acid" to even some of the stuff about Bush.

--p!
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
6. She was young, stupid, protected by money and incredibly
naive, and she was USED. That last part is what the rabid anti Fonda people don't GET.

We hated her guts in the antiwar movement, BTW, because she was the lightning rod for all the Archies, their proof that every single war protestor in this country was disloyal, communist, and a traitor.

Her grandstanding and the way she was used by Hanoi propagandists and right wing propagandists in the US set the movement back and nearly discredited it completely.

The rabidly pro Fonda folks and the rabidly anti Fonda folks are both wrong. The answer, as usual, lies somewhere in between.
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Pathwalker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:35 PM
Response to Original message
7. Yeah - who does she think she is? An American who
is entitled to speak her mind - like she lives in some nation with a Constitution that gives her the right of Freedom of speech, or something like that? Why, the nerve of that woman! .... :sarcasm:
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wholetruth00 Donating Member (576 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:36 PM
Original message
More lies, smears, and swiftboating. Why would DU even post this?
I am very suspicious.
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Monkeyman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:36 PM
Response to Original message
8. As a Vietnam Vet I forgave her along time ago
Yes I was Angry when she went on the radio and told us lay down your arms. I was in war then after coming home I wanted it to end . When I met her in the 70's she told me I am sorry its over replugs get over it, You got bigger issues like the VA again being shot 3 Billion and vets being turn away by the 100's everyday
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TallahasseeGrannie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
9. But I have to ask....
is this TRUE? She turned the papers overe to the captors? That can't be true, can it? I mean, wouldn't she have been tried for treason or something????
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Historic NY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. No its not true and this trash has been on the internet since 1999
http://www.snopes.com/military/fonda.asp

the above debunks the entire story.
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TallahasseeGrannie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Thank you
I personally would have a hard time forgiving that, and I never heard it before.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
10. Ms. Walters is entitled to her opinion
. . . and Ms. Fonda is entitled to hers.

And I am entitled to mine, which doesn't necessary agree with either.
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acmejack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
11. Malicious Bullshit!
Edited on Mon Sep-25-06 02:41 PM by acmejack
Jane Fonda Supported the Enemy in Vietnam and Her Conduct Got American POW's Killed-Truth! & Fiction!

Summary of Rumor:
In protest of Jane Fonda being considered as one of the top 100 women of the century, this email reminds Americans of her controversial visit to North Vietnam during the war. It quotes a POW named Jerry Driscoll who was taken from his prison cell, cleaned and dressed for a visit with Fonda, then ordered to give Fonda a positive account of his treatment. He spit at Fonda and was beaten and dragged away. Then a group of POWs which included a Col. Larry Carrigan were brought out to visit with Fonda

http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/h/hanoijane.htm

edit for more appropriate title line!
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countryjake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
14. Republicans are devious liars...true! Jane Fonda a traitor...false!
http://www.snopes.com/military/fonda.asp

~snip~

The most serious accusations in the piece quoted above, that Fonda turned over slips of paper furtively given her by American POWs to the North Vietnamese and that several POWs were beaten to death as a result, are untrue. Those named in the inflammatory e-mail have repeatedly and categorically denied the events they supposedly were part of.

"It's a figment of somebody's imagination," says Ret. Col. Larry Carrigan, one of the servicemen mentioned in the 'slips of paper' incident. Carrigan was shot down over North Vietnam in 1967 and did spend time in a POW camp. He has no idea why the story was attributed to him, saying, "I never met Jane Fonda." In 2005, the Minneapolis Star Tribune reported that Carrigan "is so tired of having to repeat that he wasn't beaten after Fonda's visit and that there were no beating deaths at that time that he won't talk to the media anymore."
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Coyote_Bandit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
16. Jane Fonda is one of my favorite Christians
She made a mistake - for whatever reason. She acknowledged it. She appologized for it. It doesn't get much better than that. But it seems the self-righteous biggots still can't find it in their hearts to forgive - after how many years....?
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Lady Effingbroke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 02:57 PM
Response to Original message
17. Oh, FTS!
We "kids born in the 70s" (and 80s and 90s and far, far beyond) will end up bearing a burden far more colossal "than our fathers, mothers, and older brothers and sisters had to bear", thanks to the dick n' bush mob.

I *hate* shit like this because of the underlying assumption that "Gee, aren't kids spoiled these days? Why, by golly, they don't know how lucky they have it! I recollect in my day we had it rough compared to these whiny, pansy-ass kids..." etcetera, etcetera, gloop, glop, glurge.

Also, this g-mail (g for "glurge") must be ancient, as the youngest of the "kids born in the 70s" it derides are now in their late 20s.

I have a 4 year old niece, and I've no doubt that her great-grandchildren will be paying (in oh so many ways) for this mess.



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walldude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-25-06 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
19. Funny how we are supposed to forget all the mistakes
the administration has made in the last 6 years but Fonda still has to suffer for her grevious error 35 years ago. At least she admitted she was wrong and apologized.
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