F TORTURE!

[hootinholler]

Filibuster, *what* were *you* thinking, hmmm? :D

Seriously, I indeed intended to SHOUT it!

There's this bill:

S.3929
Title: A bill to authorize military commissions to bring terrorists to justice, to strengthen and modernize terrorist surveillance capabilities, and for other purposes.
Sponsor: Sen McConnell, Mitch (introduced 9/22/2006) Cosponsors (1)
Latest Major Action: 9/22/2006 Introduced in the Senate. Read the first time. pursuant to the order of September 21, 2006, as modified on September 22, 2006. Placed on Senate Legislative Calendar under Read the First Time.

Which Will strip the courts from jurisdiction to hear cases like these, among many others:

or

I call upon my Senator, Paul Sarbanes, who has announced his retirement, to lead a filibuster of this ominous piece of alleged legislation.

This must not pass!

I call for every moral Senator and Citizen to think really hard about what history will say about this moment!

I call upon all moral persons to fax detainee photos to your Senators!



Make their staff look upon the shit-smeared boils, the pulped digits, nay, limbs! Forced public masturbation, sodomy. Let them hear the child's screams as the mother heard them!

Where are the Christians? The ones outraged when 2 consenting adults commit sodomy?

As you do to the least of these!

Jesus Wept.

I call upon the ACLU to publish torture pictures in all major newspapers nationwide! I urge them to release the photos and videos they have or raise a fuss that they have not been released yet per Court Order.

And Last but most assuredly not least, I call upon you to:
F Torture!

-Hoot

[whistle]

1. The link to the bill you posted says the following regarding torture...

...I do see the loophole almost at the very end where it states:

(3) COMPLIANCE- The President shall take appropriate action to ensure compliance with this subsection, including through the establishment of administrative rules and procedures.

With a President like George W. Bush, this let's him interprete compliance with his own set of administrative rules and procedures, doesn't it.

<snip>
`SUBCHAPTER III--PRE-TRIAL PROCEDURE

`Sec.

`948q. Charges and specifications.

`948r. Compulsory self-incrimination prohibited; statements obtained by torture or other methods of coercion.

`948s. Service of charges.

`Sec. 948q. Charges and specifications

`(a) Charges and Specifications- Charges and specifications against an accused in a military commission under this chapter shall be signed by a person subject to chapter 47 of this title under oath before a commissioned officer of the armed forces authorized to administer oaths and shall state--

`(1) that the signer has personal knowledge of, or reason to believe, the matters set forth therein; and

`(2) that they are true in fact to the best of his knowledge and belief.

`(b) Notice to Accused- Upon the swearing of the charges and specifications in accordance with subsection (a), the accused shall be informed of the charges and specifications against him as soon as practicable.

`Sec. 948r. Compulsory self-incrimination prohibited; statements obtained by torture or other methods of coercion

`(a) In General- No person shall be required to testify against himself at a proceeding of a military commission under this chapter.

`(b) Statements Obtained by Torture- A statement obtained by use of torture shall not be admissible in a military commission under this chapter, except against a person accused of torture as evidence the statement was made.

`(c) Statements Obtained Before Enactment of Detainee Treatment Act of 2005- A statement obtained before December 30, 2005 (the date of the enactment of the Detainee Treatment Act of 2005), in which the degree of coercion is disputed may be admitted only if the military judge finds that--

`(1) the totality of the circumstances renders it reliable and possessing sufficient probative value; and

`(2) the interests of justice would best be served by admission of the statement into evidence.

`(d) Statements Obtained After Enactment of Detainee Treatment Act of 2005- A statement obtained on or after December 30, 2005 (the date of the enactment of the Detainee Treatment Act of 2005), in which the degree of coercion is disputed may be admitted only if the military judge finds that--

`(1) the totality of the circumstances renders it reliable and possessing sufficient probative value;

`(2) the interests of justice would best be served by admission of the statement into evidence; and

`(3) the interrogation methods used to obtain the statement do not violate the cruel, unusual, or inhumane treatment or punishment prohibited by the Fifth, Eighth, and 14th Amendments to the United States Constitution.
<.....>
`Sec. 950rr. Torture

`(a) Offense- Any person subject to this chapter who commits an act specifically intended to inflict severe physical or mental pain or suffering (other than pain or suffering incidental to lawful sanctions) upon another person within his custody or physical control for the purpose of obtaining information or a confession, punishment, intimidation, coercion, or any reason based on discrimination of any kind, shall be punished, if death results to one or more of the victims, by death or such other punishment as a military commission under this chapter may direct, and, if death does not result to any of the victims, by such punishment, other than death, as a military commission under this chapter may direct.

`(b) Severe Mental Pain or Suffering Defined- In this section, the term `severe mental pain or suffering' has the meaning given that term in section 2340(2) of title 18.

`Sec. 950ss. Cruel or inhuman treatment

`(a) Offense- Any person subject to this chapter who commits, or conspires or attempts to commit, an act intended to inflict severe or serious physical or mental pain or suffering (other than pain or suffering incidental to lawful sanctions), including serious physical abuse, upon another within his custody or control shall be punished, if death results to the victim, by death or such other punishment as a military commission under this chapter may direct, and, if death does not result to the victim, by such punishment, other than death, as a military commission under this chapter may direct.

`(b) Definitions- In this section:

`(1) The term `severe mental pain or suffering' has the meaning given that term in section 2340(2) of title 18.

`(2) The term `serious physical pain or suffering' means bodily injury that involves--

`(A) a substantial risk of death;

`(B) extreme physical pain;

`(C) a burn or physical disfigurement of a serious nature (other than cuts, abrasions, or bruises); or

`(D) significant loss or impairment of the function of a bodily member, organ, or mental faculty.

`(3) The term `serious mental pain or suffering' has the meaning given the term `severe mental pain or suffering' in section 2340(2) of title 18, except that--

`(A) the term `serious' shall replace the term `severe' where it appears; and

`(B) as to conduct occurring after the date of the enactment of the Military Commission Act of 2006, the term `serious and non-transitory mental harm (which need not be prolonged)' shall replace the term `prolonged mental harm' where it appears.

`Sec. 950tt. Intentionally causing serious bodily injury

`(a) Offense- Any person subject to this chapter who intentionally causes serious bodily injury to one or more persons, including lawful combatants, in violation of the law of war shall be punished, if death results to one or more of the victims, by death or such other punishment as a military commission under this chapter may direct, and, if death does not result to any of the victims, by such punishment, other than death, as a military commission under this chapter may direct.

`(b) Serious Bodily Injury Defined- In this section, the term `serious bodily injury' means bodily injury which involves--

`(1) a substantial risk of death;

`(2) extreme physical pain;

`(3) protracted and obvious disfigurement; or

`(4) protracted loss or impairment of the function of a bodily member, organ, or mental faculty.

`Sec. 950uu. Mutilating or maiming

`Any person subject to this chapter who intentionally injures one or more protected persons by disfiguring the person or persons by any mutilation of the person or persons, or by permanently disabling any member, limb, or organ of the body of the person or persons, without any legitimate medical or dental purpose, shall be punished, if death results to one or more of the victims, by death or such other punishment as a military commission under this chapter may direct, and, if death does not result to any of the victims, by such punishment, other than death, as a military commission under this chapter may direct.

`Sec. 950vv. Murder in violation of the law of war

`Any person subject to this chapter who intentionally kills one or more persons, including lawful combatants, in violation of the law of war shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a military commission under this chapter may direct.
<.....>
`(d) Common Article 3 Violations-

`(1) PROHIBITED CONDUCT- In subsection (c)(3), the term `grave breach of common Article 3' means any conduct (such conduct constituting a grave breach of common Article 3 of the international conventions done at Geneva August 12, 1949), as follows:

`(A) TORTURE- The act of a person who commits, or conspires or attempts to commit, an act specifically intended to inflict severe physical or mental pain or suffering (other than pain or suffering incidental to lawful sanctions) upon another person within his custody or physical control for the purpose of obtaining information or a confession, punishment, intimidation, coercion, or any reason based on discrimination of any kind.

`(B) CRUEL OR INHUMAN TREATMENT- The act of a person who commits, or conspires or attempts to commit, an act intended to inflict severe or serious physical or mental pain or suffering (other than pain or suffering incidental to lawful sanctions), including serious physical abuse, upon another within his custody or control.

`(C) PERFORMING BIOLOGICAL EXPERIMENTS- The act of a person who subjects, or conspires or attempts to subject, one or more persons within his custody or physical control to biological experiments without a legitimate medical or dental purpose and in so doing endangers the body or health of such person or persons.

`(D) MURDER- The act of a person who intentionally kills, or conspires or attempts to kill, or kills whether intentionally or unintentionally in the course of committing any other offense under this subsection, one or more persons taking no active part in the hostilities, including those placed out of combat by sickness, wounds, detention, or any other cause.

`(E) MUTILATION OR MAIMING- The act of a person who intentionally injures, or conspires or attempts to injure, or injures whether intentionally or unintentionally in the course of committing any other offense under this subsection, one or more persons taking no active part in the hostilities, including those placed out of combat by sickness, wounds, detention, or any other cause, by disfiguring the person or persons by any mutilation thereof or by permanently disabling any member, limb, or organ of his body, without any legitimate medical or dental purpose.

`(F) INTENTIONALLY CAUSING SERIOUS BODILY INJURY- The act of a person who intentionally causes, or conspires or attempts to cause, serious bodily injury to one or more persons, including lawful combatants, in violation of the law of war.

`(G) RAPE- The act of a person who forcibly or with coercion or threat of force wrongfully invades, or conspires or attempts to invade, the body of a person by penetrating, however slightly, the anal or genital opening of the victim with any part of the body of the accused, or with any foreign object.

`(H) SEXUAL ASSAULT OR ABUSE- The act of a person who forcibly or with coercion or threat of force engages, or conspires or attempts to engage, in sexual contact with one or more persons, or causes, or conspires or attempts to cause, one or more persons to engage in sexual contact.

`(I) TAKING HOSTAGES- The act of a person who, having knowingly seized or detained one or more persons, threatens to kill, injure, or continue to detain such person or persons with the intent of compelling any nation, person other than the hostage, or group of persons to act or refrain from acting as an explicit or implicit condition for the safety or release of such person or persons.
<.....>
(c) Additional Prohibition on Cruel, Inhuman, or Degrading Treatment or Punishment-

(1) IN GENERAL- No individual in the custody or under the physical control of the United States Government, regardless of nationality or physical location, shall be subject to cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment or punishment.

(2) CRUEL, INHUMAN, OR DEGRADING TREATMENT OR PUNISHMENT DEFINED- In this subsection, the term `cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment or punishment' means cruel, unusual, and inhumane treatment or punishment prohibited by the Fifth, Eighth, and Fourteenth Amendments to the Constitution of the United States, as defined in the United States Reservations, Declarations and Understandings to the United Nations Convention Against Torture and Other Forms of Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment done at New York, December 10, 1984.

(3) COMPLIANCE- The President shall take appropriate action to ensure compliance with this subsection, including through the establishment of administrative rules and procedures.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

2. The ones outraged when 2 consenting adults commit sodomy...

Yeah that's not ok but for an adult soldier to "rape" an unconsenting adult is ok.

We live in a crazy country.

[hootinholler]

3. It was reported that a child

Was raped while the mother was held nearby.

-Hoot

[hootinholler]

4. Kick

[hootinholler]

5. Hmmm, is it the headline or the pictures.

Well? I hope it's not the message!

-Hoot

[Solly Mack]

6. It's an excellent message

[hootinholler]

7. Thank you.

I think we're in the monority.

-Hoot

[Solly Mack]

8. let's hope not

:)

[BelgianMadCow]

9. You put it in an excellent way

with the pics and all.

You are NOT alone :-)

[hootinholler]

10. Please explain to me.

What am I doing wrong? The post is up 5 hours, 1 rec, sinks like a stone.

Why is there no call to filibuster this piece of legislation?

Why isn't this on the greatest page?

-Hoot

[BelgianMadCow]

11. Well, let's see

1) Thread title : You said F torture. I thought it was funny when I saw you meant filibuster, but most people indeed think about the other f word. The sentiment "No to Torture" was and is so widespread on DU that people don't feel the need to click. So I think "Action NOW : the compromise retroactively legalises torture, filibuster!" as a thread title would have generated a much different response.
2) Body of your OP : I missed the parts that show specifically what would be legalised, which would justify filibustering. You jump immediately to the "cases that could not be heard".
3) Cognitive dissonance : even Duers, who have read Hersch years ago on the torture scheme, shy away when they see it photographically. It is just so hard to wrap your mind around, that the land of the free is up to this kind of stuff.

Hey, you asked for it. :-)

But I totally agree with the gist of your post.

Or, to be honest, a political play such as filibustering is even WAY to tame a response to this retroactive justification of torture.

It demands an all out offensive. You are very close to the point of no return as a country I believe.

For good measure, I've seen cooler DU heads than me put forward that this law does not pass SCOTUS muster (cannot retroactively apply law) and will be the first to be repealed by the dems (if and when...)

on edit : it's also weekend and people are digesting Clinton and the "compromise" itself - I know I was.

[hootinholler]

15. "Hey, you asked for it."

And it's noted and appreciated.

As to 1, I guess joke headlines have been my Theme this weekend.

As to 2, I'm still digesting the bill, but when the Republicans had to 'compromise' it has to be bad. It strips the Judiciary of being able to hear the cases. Also I can think of no other cause that wold justify a filibuster more.

As to 3, Those are mild photos but even still I debated including them. I thought maybe it would stir something up.

As to the Supremes' reaction to this, it really isn't an ex-post facto law, it is insidious in that it renders the Judiciary branch powerless. Now, that actually may be constitutional.

Thanks for the input, and hopefully I'll learn.

-Hoot

[femmedem]

13. I have that problem all the time, so maybe I'm not the best to answer...

but I think it was the title in this instance. I think if it was titled something like "call to action: filibuster torture bill" more people would have opened it.

It certainly isn't the message. People at DU care about this bill.

[BuyingThyme]

12. kcik

[scarletwoman]

14. I totally agree with you. I only just saw your post because of the link

you posted in another thread -- somebody's poll on the "most important issues". I had much the same reaction as you -- if the Dems don't unequivocally oppose the torture bill, then nothing else matters. Our country is lost.

So here's a k&r, and an invite to a thread of my own on the same subject (hope you don't mind): The torture issue is "The Chance of a Lifetime" for Dems

sw

[hootinholler]

16. I had already rec'd You excellent thread.

Peace and thanks.

-Hoot

[scarletwoman]

17. Thank YOU! And here's another kick! (nt)

[hootinholler]

18. Thanks One more before bed n/t

[uppityperson]

19. kick

[chill_wind]

20. Kicking nt

[Swamp Rat]

21. GOP = Pro-Torture

The republican party is populated by little Hitlers and 2-bit Anti-Christs. :puke:

[DemReadingDU]

22. Another good thread to read

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2205267



K&R

[Philosoraptor]

23. our national soul is sick

[bobbolink]

24. Too late to recommend, unfortunately, but here's a boost to the top

I can't stand to look at those pictures. :cry:

I just wonder if we'll ever get our country back. I know it's been a progression to this--it hasn't happened all at once. But the US I know doesn't stand for torture and the overturning of sovereign nations.

Thanks for posting this!

[petgoat]

25. Protest Torture October 5th in every city across the country

Get a cheap jumpsuit on ebay and spray paint it orange. Put a pillowcase on
your head and you're a one-person demonstration.

I like to kneel across the street outside churches when the 10:00 is
letting out and the 11:00 is going in. In half an hour I can influence
several hundred people to consider the hypocrisy of professing "turn the
other cheek" and "love thine enemy" when we torture people.

World Can't Wait, Nationwide day of repudiation.

http://www.worldcantwait.net /



Find a group near your town:

http://worldcantwait.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=702&Itemid=209

It's time, folks. We need millions in the street.