Fundie History re-writing contest.....

[and-justice-for-all]

Just a about 30min ago I got what I will call proof that Fundamentalist bible thumpers are rewriting history.

I was getting a tool for a couple of Maintence Techs when the American Flag came up, it came up because one of them saw my German Camo jacket which has the German flag on the shoulders. I got it for 5 bucks on clearence at a URBAN OUTFITTERS and I like Germany alot.

Well one Tech said I wonder what the German flag colors represent and the bible thumper said "Well, they represent something because flags have meaning." which they do. The history of the German Flag goes back to the Holy Roman Empire; being in Europe the German history is much deeper then that of the still young America.

Anyway, the freeper spoke up and from what I recall because I try to block out the nonsence but I was floored by what he said about the meaning of the colors in the American Flag. He stated that "The Red represents CHRIST BLOOD, The White 'Jesus' Royality..." and I cant remember what he said about the blue but it was related to JC and Xtianity.

But in reality the colors represent the following:

50 Five pointed stars = 50 States (Which in time the flag will be changed after the addition of Guam, Virgin Islands and other provinces that will become recognized as states.)

The Stripes = The 13 Colonies

White = Purity and Innocence

Red = Hardiness and Valour (Many people also take the red as a reference to the blood of patriots, especially members of the military, who fought for freedom.)

Blue = the color of the Chief signifies vigilance, perseverance & justice

This according to the book "Our Flag" published by the HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES "The colors red, white, and blue did not have meanings for The Stars and Stripes when it was adopted in 1777." It goes on to say, on page 41 (page 47 of the PDF version)<2> that the colors of the Great Seal of the United States, when it was adopted in 1782.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Flag

Its apparent that xtianity played no role in the creation and meaning of the American flag.

[and-justice-for-all]

1. kick

[sofa king]

2. Yeah, but they're working on it.

We'd better get used to this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_flag

Since the Christian flag was inspired by the flag of the United States, it takes its colors and overall design from the American flag. However, elements of the flag represent Christian concepts.

The flag's most conspicuous symbol is the Christian cross, the most universal symbol for Christianity. The red color represents the blood of Jesus and brings to mind his crucifixion. Christians believe that Jesus' death and resurrection is the means God uses to save believers from their sins. The cross and blood have been used since earliest Christianity to symbolize salvation through Jesus; in the words of the Apostle Paul, "Through God reconciles himself to all things... making peace by the blood of the cross" (Colossians 1:20).

The white field draws on symbolism throughout the Bible equating white clothes with purity and forgiveness. People who have been "washed white as snow" in the Bible have been cleansed from their sins (Isaiah 1:18).

The symbolism behind the blue canton is uncertain. It has been interpreted to represent Heaven, truth, or the Christian ritual of Baptism in water. Most likely it is simply a carry-over from the American flag.

I happen to think the blue canton represents their noses.

[and-justice-for-all]

3. So its a mockery....

Just like the fact that the entire religion is a fraud and they just stole from earlier religions to create their corperation. The Cross is a 17th/18th century marketing ploy, the Romans didnt even crucifiy people like the bible thumpers claim...Lie, Lie, Lie.....

So, my bible thumper took the oportunity to interject a falsification. I will have to make sure I tell the other guy the TRUTH and not allow the other to get away with handing out xtian falsehoods to people. He also believes that the Serpation of Church and State does not exist..

[happyslug]

4. Various reason have been said WHY the US Flag was adopted

But the basic design, started as a way to show a UNITED COLONIAL SUPPORT, thus the 13 stripes. Now the first US Flag the "Grand Union Flag" seems to have been developed in New England, with the 13 stripes and the British Union Jack nearest the Staff (This is called the "Canton" of the Flag). The Staff position was considered the most important part of any flag design.

Sometime after 1775 (and apparently even before the Declaration of Independence) they was a move to replace the British Union Jack with something. Thus the Stars were adopted (Apparently the flag "canton" was dyed so that the British Union Jack was removed and the 13 stars put in the Canton to replace it).

Now on June 14, 1777 the present flag was officially adopted by Congress (Through it seems to have been in use unofficially for over a year before hand).

Given this history, to understand the colors of the Flag, you must understand the Colors in the British Union Jack. The Union Jack of 1606, in use in 1775-1783 period (The Irish flag was added to the Union Jack in 1801 producing today's Flag of the United Kingdom) consisted of merging two flags, the White Cross on a blue field Flag of Scotland with the Red Cross on a white Field which was the flag of England. In affect the Red, White and Blue of the US Flag is derived DIRECTLY FROM THE BRITISH UNION JACK.

The British Union Jack consisted of a Flag of England superimposed on the Flag of Scotland (In the 1790s, a red stripe was added to the White point to point cross strip of Scotland to represent the Red Strips on White Field flag of Scotland).

Thus the COLORS were adopted directly from the British Flag. Now why red and whites strips instead of blue and red strips? This seems to have been a deliberate decision of New Englanders. The Puritans were the most powerful in New England, and they had backed Oliver Cromwell during the English Civil War of 1640-1660. During that war, blue was the color of his forces (Thus the Phase "True Blue" which is still in our lexicon), while Red was the Color of the King's forces.

In 1775 New Englanders wanted and needed support from the rest of the American Colonies, thus the decision NOT to use Blue in the Stripes. Blue was to much of a color of open Rebellion, something even New England was not willing to do without the support of the rest of the Colonies.

Now once it was decided that an open break with Britain was what was needed, blue became a fully acceptable color, but by that time the Red and White Stripes had already become the norm for US flags and was kept. A different Color from both was needed in the Canton and once Stars were decided to replace the British Union Jack, expanding the blue field of the underlying flag of Scotland was to easy NOT to do (remember flags at this time periods were hand made and dyed, and thus reused and redyed as needed or till the flag was no longer usable and them it was destroyed).

Now one of the problems with deciding HOW the US flag evolved is the lack of any surviving flags of the Period. In fact the oldest US Flag known is a 15 stars and strip flag from 1795 (which had the 15 stars in a Circle). Thus most of the flags we seen that claim were used in the Revolution are from written description of the flags by people at the time they saw the flag, or from memory in their old age (Which can sometime give us want we want the flag to have been, as opposed to what it was).

Flag of Scotland:

http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/gb-scotl.html

Flag of England:

http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/gb-eng.html

St Patrick's Flag (the Flag of Ireland 1782 - 1801, maybe before that date but records are weak) :

http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/ie-stpat.html#spf

Note: Today's Irish flag is a combination of the Green Flag of Catholic Ireland and the Orange Flag of Protestant Ireland with a white middle to show that Ireland included BOTH Groups.

Union Jack from 1606-1801:


Present British Union Jack:

http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/gb.html

The Grand Union Flag:


One group of Historian suggest the red and white stripes were taken from the East Indian Company flag of the time period:

http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/gb-eic.html

US Flags:
http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/us.html

Colonial Flags:
http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/us%5Erv.html

Web Sites for more on Flags:
http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/iso3166.html#s
http://www.flags.net/