AFTER THEY AIR "PATH TO 9/11" NO F'ING RETREAT, NO F'ING SURRENDER!

[wndycty]

If ABC/Disney goes through with its plans to air "Path to 9/11" tomorrow and Monday I don't blame them at all. Why? Because they are not scared of the left and quite frankly we have not given them any damn reason to fear us. They are calling our bluff, they are telling you, I and everyone on the left that we are not organized enough, not committed enough and not unified enough to follow through and inflict any damage.

Why did CBS not air the Regan mini series? Because the right was organized and f'ing feared. Why did Slimfast fire Whoopi Goldberg for her comments about Bush? Because the right was organized and f'ing feared. Why did Disney not distribute "Fahrenheit 9/11?" Because the right was organized and f'ing feared. Why did CBS can those involved in the "60 Minutes"/Bush National Guard incident? Because the right was organized and f'ing feared.

Its not rocket science.

ABC/Disney is expecting some bad press, some hurt feelings, some protests and some of its lower rated shows to suffer (no big deal they were not going to make it anyway), but they feel their bigger, critically acclaimed shows will not be hurt in the long run. Their assumption is that this will no longer be an issue by Septmeber 13. That is why if they go through with their plans to profit from lies by airing "Path to 9/11," they must be held accountable and whatever efforts that were put forth to try to prevent the airing must be quadrupled and ANY AND ALL THREATS OF BOYCOTT MUST BE FOLLOWED THROUGH UPON! NO RETREAT NO SURRENDER!!!

Earlier in the week I wrote that we can really harm ABC/Disney by simply boycotting "Grey's Anatomy" and later after other DUers chimed included "Lost." I still believe that to be true and intend to follow through with my plan not to watch "Grey's Anatomy" (I don't watch "Lost" but I won't start either). Although I intend to greatly reduce or eliminate my patronage of ABC/Disney products, my motivation for just targeting two high profile shows as opposed to the entire corporation is based upon its expectations for these two series. Let's not forget that "Grey's Anatomy" was moved to Thursdays to allow the network to compete with strong Thursday night line-ups at both CBS and NBC. A 5% hit to "Grey's Anatomy" and "Lost" could really hurt ABC/Disney and scare the shit out of advertisers.

After my post i got the typical DU response, some supported while others dismissed it, which is what ABC/Disney is banking on. They are also banking on our lack or organization, our lack of focus and our inability to stay on message. They are calling our bluff and will continue to make BS like "Path to 9/11" unless we hurt them and hurt them bad. This is not even about Bill Clinton, Madeline Albright or Sandy Berger its about ABC/Disney trying to influence the historical account of one of the worst days in American history. If ABC/Disney does not pull this miniseries how great would it be to see one or both of these shows fail? The shareholders will RIOT and the advertisers will run.

I hope something will happen at the last minute and I can continue enjoying "Grey's Anatomy" but if not i'm ready to follow through with my threat.

Folks its time to organize, its time to follow through, its time to make good on our threats.

Please kick, recommend and forward to those not on DU, sometimes I worry that we think if we raise enough cain in our little echo chamber on the net we are doing something when all we are really doing is preaching to the choir.

NO F'ING RETREAT, NO F'ING SURRENDER !!!

ON EDIT: Post not even up for 15 F'ing minutes and DUers chiming in how it won't work, which of course is what ABC/Disney is banking on. Folks a bad plan (WHICH THIS IS NOT) is better than no plan at all. We are not even at 10 posts yet and DUers are doubting this will work. And we wonder why we can't win a damn election.

[AX10]

1. At 8:00 on September 10th, 2006, we will declare war on....

Disney/ABC!

[blue cat]

2. We won't retreat

They've really done it now.

[NYCGirl]

3. I'd be a better idea to boycott Disney PRODUCTS, because not watching

doesn't mean a thing, unless you have a Nielsen box. ABC has NO IDEA what you are or aren't watching.

[onecent]

4. Out of curiosity, how do you get a Nielsen box?

[NYCGirl]

13. Here's some info:

http://www.nielsenmedia.com/nc/portal/site/Public/

Found this application (and then they have to pick you):

http://www.nielsennetpanel.com/pls/mgpnl/affiliate.cj?afflt=ntrt1270002

[wndycty]

7. I expected your response. . .

. . .typical DU, rather than buying into a plan, offer your own plan and tell why the original plan won't work. That is what ABC/Disney is banking on us defeating ourselves by not quibbling over what will work. Thanks for your support, and ABC/Disney thanks you even more.

[NYCGirl]

9. No quibble. Do whatever you want. I'd rather people do something that

actually WORKS. Unless you have a Nielsen box, they can't tell what you're watching or not watching. However, it'll make you feel better.

[wndycty]

14. Do you know anything about sampling or statistics?

The more people who boycott a show the greater the chances of Neilsen families participating. The fact that someone does not have a Neilsen box should not discourage them from participating in a boycott. Do you think Neilsen boxes had anything to do with the Reagan miniseries being canceled or the CBS employees getting canned for the "60 Minutes" incident?

Go ahead, be a defeatist.

[NYCGirl]

20. No, a boycott of the sponsors' products had to do with getting the Reagan

miniseries being moved to Showtime (it wasn't cancelled).

I'm not a defeatist — I'm just giving you the more effective option.

[wndycty]

25. You can argue the details

. . .but the reality is boycotts work. If a TV show suffers in the ratings heads will roll.

[BootinUp]

5. Targeting where we can hurt them is the hard part

We have to target sponsors of top shows that are tied very closely to Disney or ABC.

BTW. THIS IS FUCKING WAR!!!

[wndycty]

15. An effective boycott will scare those sponsors away

:kick:

[Taverner]

6. Agreed

And that applies to any subisidiaries owned by ABC/Disney

Anyone have a list?

[Dinger]

8. Absolutely!

Hell, I'll watch Faux (briefly) before I ever watch ABC, and I'll NEVER watch it again. Oh, and my students will not be participating in the scholastic book fair this year or any year either (there's a way, trust me), and NO books ordered from them either (that's an easy one).

[BootinUp]

16. I think Scholastic

has distanced themselves best they can in a few days. I would recommend we focus on ABC/Disney at this point.

[lyonn]

46. Scholastics has been distributed in our school system for years

What business or interest do they have in a commercial project like this ABC program? They have shown which side they are on and they shouldn't be on any side. But, ABC is showing this free of commercials so they are getting cash for this somewhere. Blackball ABC.

Enough air time has been given to this show and Dems have had a chance to show that this program is geared for the Neocons, we could be making progress here if this continues and the Dems keep pointing out the Lies.

[wndycty]

47. kick

:kick:

[jus_the_facts]

10. Definite fear and loathing.....

:evilfrown:

[sproutster]

11. M-I-C ... SCREW ABC!!!

:)

Wish I was there to shout it.

[EFerrari]

12. Agreed. And you know something, this boycott is going to work!

Because it's even bigger than Disney! It's about refusing to let ANYONE use 9/11 to intimidate us. I think people are ready for that.

So, sure, we organize a major boycott. And anyone who plans to try to terrorize us with fake alerts and scary rhetoric and other kinds of propaganda is going to THINK AGAIN before they try this sh!t on the American public!


Boycott Disney. Respect the families of 9/11.

[david_vincent]

17. While I agree with, and support, the boycott of ABC

there are other points made here that are sound, such as how can you boycott a network whose shows don't interest you anyway, etc. More important, I think, is the idea that there is a bigger agenda at work here. This isn't just about ABC. ABC is just the corporate entity that has agreed to be the thin end of the wedge with this particular tactic. The tactic itself is to confuse people about the nature of truth, and about what we mean we talk about whether something is or isn't true. This is fundamentally philosophical, although these people aren't interested in participating in a Socratic debate. The purpose of this whole thing is to muddy the waters so that the public in general loses sight of any coherent and consistent basis for claiming any given thing to be true, with the end result that any claims, no matter how inaccurate, might be considered "true" if some (supposedly sensible) people believe them.
We can see how this all works by looking at the people who insist that WMDs were, in fact, found in Iraq. The insistence on the part of some people to live in a cognitive state detached from reality is one thing, but when they start demanding that others also acknowledge the legitimacy of that cognitive state in spite of all evidence to the contrary, then you're looking at epistemological tyranny calculated to command our apprehension of reality. This will lead to a dictatorship of knowledge and of ways of approaching knowledge, i.e. the rational, spiritual, and emotional spheres of being.

[texastoast]

19. That's a big paragraph. Could you break it up?

My eyes are tired.

[david_vincent]

21. Hmmm, I'm trying, but it doesn't seem to be doing anything??

[renate]

27. just read the second-to-last sentence for a summary

"The insistence on the part of some people to live in a cognitive state detached from reality is one thing, but when they start demanding that others also acknowledge the legitimacy of that cognitive state in spite of all evidence to the contrary, then you're looking at epistemological tyranny calculated to command our apprehension of reality."

Man, I wish I could put words like that together on a Saturday morning! All I can put together is "coffee.... now...."

[david_vincent]

36. Thanks! I just entered grad school

and it's only been 12 years since I got my BA! :P

[wndycty]

22. A few points. . .

Outside of Neilsen families ABC/Disney has no idea who is watching their TV shows and direct contact from an angry potential viewer is considered to represent thousands of potential viewers so letter writing and pressure do work.

Do you think that the all of the people who pressured Slimfast to drop Whoopi Goldberg use the product?

Here is a great snippet on letter writing:

-snip-
TEN TIPS FOR WRITING BETTER LETTERS TO TV STATIONS:

So...why are letters to TV stations so effective? Because television station management listens to viewer feedback. Contrary to popular opinion, the two factors that most shape broadcast television news are ratings and direct viewer feedback. And the most effective form of viewer feedback is a well-written letter.

In this context, given the current climate of media deregulation, broadcasters DO still serve the public interest, but it is the interest of the public that watches AND takes the time to communicate.

It probably comes as no surprise to anyone that very few TV viewers take the time to write letters. Most call or email, but this is far less effective. An email can easily be deleted, phone messages rarely reach their target, faxes are a little sloppy, but a well-written letter will get passed from desk to desk and office to office. It is a very powerful tool, even though it may never be published or generate a response.
-snip-

http://www.georgiafordemocracy.org/resources/index.cfm?Fuseaction=letters

[EFerrari]

24. The tactic is essential to successful facism. Which is why this is

the opportunity we've been looking for and one we can use to disrupt this takeover of perception in the service of fascism.

We couldn't have asked for a more appropriate venue.

[BootinUp]

26. The tactic you refer to is an old one.

Even President Johnson had a saying something to the effect of make the allegation and force someone to refute it. Yes it confuses the public on the facts.

The point here is we have the facts in the 9/11 report. It is not a perfect report, but it is the report our government put out and it must not be used by ABC to lend credence to a docudrama that contradicts it literally or figuratively.

Furthermore, there is the question of ABC judgement to air controversial material at this time and in this way.

I liked your post I am just adding to it. Hope you don't mind.

[OnionPatch]

18. There's no way I'm going to cave

This is blatant political propaganda presented as "news" on our network airwaves. I feel like I'm living in George Orwell's 1984. Disney/ABC and any sponsors I know have seen the last of my consumer dollars.

[robinlynne]

23. yes yes and yes.

I would request that you condense and write this as a small one paragraph email we can send to groups. the way for it to work is short and simple and spread it around by the thousands.

[dug2006]

28. Worse than boycott: actively share ABC programs without commericals online

If your friends and family feel the urge to be watching a long-form historical program, i.e. real documentary, about the events of 9/11, may I suggest watching the Discovery Channel's "Inside the Twin Towers" which aired last week.

I found a torrent for it here:
http://www.mininova.org/tor/416346

Since Discovery's program on 9/11 doesn't have the faults of ABC's program, it's a shame to download it when Discovery really deserves our support. ABC, on the other hand, should see an internet-based boycott.

If you really want to see an ABC program in the future, download it using bittorrent, and actively share their programs online without commercials. This is one of the few ways we consumers can fight back now that media in the US is in the hands of a very few companies.

[newyawker99]

37. Hi dug2006!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[rubberducky]

29. NEVER GIVE UP, NEVER GIVE IN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If we give up on this we will give up on everything they wish to spoon feed us. I have sent all of my e-mails, and cancelled plans for a vacation next summer in disney world. If they end up showing this docu, they will just as easily steal the elections in `06. But, actually `06 is ssssssooooooooooo minor compared to `08. They have no intentions of leaving, the power has been too much of a narcotic for them to give it to the dems.

[freedomsunshine]

30. I have had it with the lies and the distortions coming from the

media!!! I used to watch ABC because I had believed that they were calling Bush out for the way he has screwed up our country!!! Now I have come to believe that the WHITE HOUSE NAZI is going to use ABC as his own PROPAGANDA CHANNEL!!! I want to know who is at ABC/Disney on the Bush payroll!! Who has become the new mouthpiece spewing out these lies about the greatest President we ever had since Jimmy Carter? Why are the American people going to put up with this garbage on their TV sets? Bush is the future dictator of our country and his manipulation of the media is going to continue until he is stopped!!!

Just wait...he has already distorted the facts about the aggression in Iraq through his Faux News Channel. Now he will continue to do so by placing the blame on Bill Clinton instead of where it belongs!!!

We have been lied to for the last five years and we have assaulted a peace-loving culture and have murdered thousands because of it!!

When ABC begins airing more propaganda about how great Bush is and does not focus on the truth. We will gobble it up without a second thought because it is the "truth". Bush will control the media, as well as our minds unless this Evil in the White House is stopped!!!

If you tell enough lies to enough people for a long enough time, it eventually becomes the truth. This has to stop NOW!!!

[freedomsunshine]

33. I will never again watch ABC on TV again. I will never get involved

with anything remotely involved with Disney either.

Hit these guys where it hurts!!! Don't watch ABC and see their ratings plummet. Don't watch Disney movies!!! Cancel your trips to Disney World!!! These guys will feel the pressure as their bottom line drops like a rock. Maybe then these guys will start getting the stones to stand up do the White House Nazi. They can fire whoever the mouthpiece is on the ABC payroll. Maybe even prosecute him for slander against our beloved Bill Clinton!!! Then and only then, should we begin to even consider watching ABC TV or endorsing Disney with our business.

[wndycty]

38. Kick

:kick:

[Cobalt-60]

40. Run up the Jolly Roger

It seems to me that massive duplication and near free distribution of a media company's product might take a Great White Bite out of their corporate backside.
If it is within your power to do so, duplicate and pass out some copies of Disney features today. (Make sure you do a good job so the recipient doesn't run back to the mouse for another one.)

[stevietheman]

31. Desperate Housewives is about to get really desperate!

I will stop watching any ABC/Disney broadcast, and sell my new Disney/ABC-related videos in a yard sale for ONE CENT each and note on the price sticker my protest.

I am open-minded to other things I could do. Still thinking about it...

[City Lights]

32. NO SURRENDER indeed!

I don't intend to back down.

[JNelson6563]

34. I'm with you 100%

It's time to unite and kick some ass! Nevermind the naysayers, let 'em sit in their own poop and cry.

We'll make this happen.

:toast: Julie

[Vinca]

35. Of all the networks, ABC is the easiest to boycott for me.

I can't think of one show I watch on ABC. Boycotting Disney is easy, too.

[tabasco]

39. When we retake Congress, we must never forget.

The giant profiteering media corporations must be broken up.

Complete control of the media by the super-rich is unacceptable.

[sandyd921]

41. Cancel or don't book

vacations at Disney World and Disneyland and cancel or don't book conferences there either. That would be very visible.

[Imagevision]

42. you mean none of you guyz are going to watch P-2 9-11??

How will you know what they've done??

[mnhtnbb]

49. Some of you will tell us!

[wndycty]

43. Kick

:kick:

[cascadiance]

44. I'm still trying to get myself to cancel my ESPN gameplan subscription!

I know that would send a message. I'm thinking that to do that effectively, perhaps we can organize "DVD clubs" where we can share DVDs of the games we want to see through the net from people who can record them off the air without a Gameplan subscription. That way, they aren't getting any extra PPV money from many of us, and at the same time we at some point can watch the games anyway. That and contacting the NCAA to tell them that we plan on killing off our plans so that they can also put pressure on ABC and ESPN too.

[wndycty]

45. This is my point. . .

. . .you will notice in the OP I talked about my desire to reduce or eliminate my ABC/Disney patronage. The key word being reduce. I think Disney is too vast of a company for use to realistically eliminate it from our lives. That is why I targeted two shows to take out, not any two shows but the two shows that will severly harm the network if they don't do well. Think of it as a diet. it may be unrealistic to deny you your Gameplan, but don't pick up new ABC/Disney habits. If one or both of these shows (Grey's Anatomy and Lost) fail they sends a ten times more important message than canceling your Game Plan.

[dug2006]

51. here's how

wndycty, here's how to get and share Grey's Anatomy and Lost without ever watching your ABC station:

Use this program: www.utorrent.com

with the files you'll find here:

http://www.mininova.org/search/?search=lost

http://www.mininova.org/search/?search=grey%27s+anatomy

You can use the same source for Disney films.

[cascadiance]

52. Lost would be tough to miss. Gives me another idea though...

The guy who had the original idea to create that show, Lloyd Braun (he's interviewed a lot on the first DVD set supplementary materials), manages our division now at Yahoo. I'm tempted to along with others at our company to write an email to him to have him put pressure on ABC, since it will be his series here (and I think others he created there too) that will suffer if they go through with this broadcast.

Though I'm not willing to miss my team's games altogether by cancelling Gameplan (not sure if I can do it yet now anyway), if I can arrange with others that will have local access to shows to record them off the air, instead of us all collectively paying for pay per view access, I'd settle for watching them later if that meant helping send them a message. If one game is not on regular broadcasts anywhere, perhaps one of us could get daily access to Gameplan and record it for the others. That way we'll all not completely suffer, but we can give ABC SIGNFICANTLY less money than we normally would have. And I might even go so far as chopping out the commercials of the DVDs I pass around too, though that would be more hassle than it's worth. Just some well placed chapter stops would probably solve the skipping commercials problems.

[mnhtnbb]

48. I will not watch "Dancing With the Stars" gave up "Lost "last year

and have never watched "Desperate Housewives" or "Grey's Anatomy"

I'm in for the boycott! No Disney products, either!

[Julius Civitatus]

50. I agree: BOYCOTT, no surrender!

All progressives should PLEDGE to boycott the Mouse
Link here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2099079

[wndycty]

53. Kick

:kick:

[BlueCentrist]

54. Giving Up?I'm trying to get them prosecuted.

for what they've done.Click the link below if you'd like to help in that effort.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=2101445&mesg_id=2101445