What does it mean if we lose the midterms?

[readmoreoften]

It means...

[hedgehog]

1. that the Republicans have cooked the books nationwide.

[SKKY]

2. It means I will be moving to the moon to get away from all these...

...freaks who just don't get it. It should provide a nice view of what is likely to happen under further Republican rule.

[Sherman A1]

3. I think it means

we are screwed.

[wiggs]

9. There's a good campaign statement

Don't know why I haven't heard all dc dems talking about how bad things could get if there aren't checks and balances for two more years. Should be repeated over and over that we might have seen only the beginning of disasters and outrages if these guys get two more years of control of three branches of government and the fourth estate.

As you say, we will be SCREWED...in every policy area... unless we change course. GOP has had their turn, and now is the time to get back to democracy, the constitution, and effective government.

This election is CRITICAL for this reason and yet it seems that most pundits, candidates, and journalists are approaching this as business as usual. This is not a time to be mellow. This is an easy case to make for dem candidates! Easy!

[Sherman A1]

11. The folks I have spoken with along the way

some in the know, others not so much are of pretty much one opinion "we never thought it would be THIS BAD". I don't know if " We are Screwed" is a good campaign sentiment or not, but it's how I feel now and only think it will be worse because I don't see the Congress changing hands. I hope I am wrong, but don't see it happening.

[blm]

4. It will mean the Dem party infrastructure failed again and the machines

were never properly secured BEFORE the voting.

[ThomWV]

5. We Move Out Of The Country

[Selatius]

17. Could you act as a sort of Ben Franklin urging the French to help us?

We're gonna need help from the expatriate community if things take a turn for the worst.

[Initech]

19. Hell no. I'm starting my own country.

[Selatius]

20. Then you advocate...sedition! That's treason!

Kellogg, Brown & Root, a division of Halliburton, won contracts to build concentration camps. There will be a place for you in there when they're finished. There will be a place for us all!

:sarcasm:

[Initech]

26. Then I can do the next best thing...

Flee to South America! :popcorn:

[reichstag911]

6. Apocalypse Now... nt

[readmoreoften]

7. Interesting, no one thinks they'll suspend elections.

I agree.

Nonetheless, I think we're fucked if we don't win.

[Benhurst]

13. Why should they suspend the elections when they'll be counting the votes?

[readmoreoften]

15. Very good point.

It's just a sentiment that I read on DU every now and then. I agree. Why show your hand when you can play dirty?

[readmoreoften]

8. Hey, can some of the "others" explain? I'm curious. /nt

[Sherman A1]

10. Yup, mine was in post #3

[Greyhound]

12. Since the repukes have done everything short of actually endorsing

Democratic candidates, it means that the Democratic Party's true agenda is the solidification of the amerikan corporatocracy and that they have no intention of ever representing us again.

[Golden Raisin]

14. Start loading the cattlecars

to take "opponents" and "traitors" to the Halliburton domestic internment camps. Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo, and rendition did not happen in a vacuum and were just a dress rehearsal.

[AZBlue]

16. I voted other: It means the Dems STILL don't know how to run a campaign.

Don't know how to reach the voters, don't know how to explain themselves and are hurt too much by in-party fighting.

[readmoreoften]

21. Why is it that all of a sudden we don't know how to reach voters?

We won the popular vote in 2000. What would you suggest that we do to reach voters?

[bling bling]

27. Here's my suggestion.

Dems should say what they need to say using less words. Simpler words too. Especially during debates. Less words, keep it simple, and more repetition of key points. That's not out of the neocon playbook, either. That's just plain common sense marketing. The Dems did a HORRIBLE job of this very basic communication strategy during the last election.

And no silly cheese-ball themes like "help is on the way" or whatever that was next time. That's so abstract and ambiguous that it's totally useless.

[Kickoutthejams23]

31. I agree.

Too much "it's the machines" and "we have no free elections" balleyho going on. We need less :tinfoilhat: and more :dem: :kick:

[marions ghost]

37. unless

you admit there's a problem, you can't do anything about it. Basic common sense.

It does not help to deny the severity of the election problems. They are nationwide and pervasive. Not to see the truth of that is naive and uninformed. The majority of Americans are not wearing tinfoil, and yet the majority of Americans are concerned that we don't have free elections. The tide has turned.

Voters have to work to promote candidates AS WELL AS focusing on how the elections are conducted. We have two jobs now. They are not mutually exclusive, as you try to present them.

[ikojo]

42. You don't think there's in party fighting within the pug

party? Sure there is, between the fiscally conservative but socially liberal wing and the moral crusaders. Trouble is the moral crusaders scream the loudest and make for the most interesting and sensational one liners so they get a lot of attention.

[ktowntennesseedem]

18. Tough for me to answer that one.

Your question, understandably, didn't spell out what was meant by losing (or winning for that matter) the midterms. I assume you meant by losing we fail to gain enough seats to have a Dem majority. But I have to wonder what we should do if we gain several seats but remain a minority. Surely our response should be different than if we failed to gain any seats. And I also think a lot depends on who we elect; if we exchange some DINOs for more liberal/progressive Dems (a certain election in Connecticut comes to mind for some reason...), then maybe we'll have enough balls and backbone to use the fillibuster a little more often, even if we don't pick up many seats. But if we fill several Repug seats with more DINOs, then I think anything short of a majority won't matter much at all.

And one more factor that will need to be addressed is the message that the public sends via the voting booth, and more importantly the spin put on that message. KKKarl will no doubt spin anything short of an outright Dem takeover as a GOP success. Whatever gains the Dems do manage in November will need every effort to portray it as a victory for Democrats.

[Imagevision]

22. Lose the midterms and Bush continues to stay the course, win it and

Bush is not only a lame duck president for his remaining 2 years+ - but countless investigations will then commence - namely going to war under false prretenses for openers...

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

23. Most of the citizenry will go about their business no matter who wins.

In the last off-year elections in 2002 60.9% of eligible voters didn't bother to vote.

Even in the presidential election in 2004, 39.7% didn't vote.

Of those who voted, it's a pretty safe bet that many, if not most, do so with very little idea of the issues at hand beyond what affects them personally.

The idea that some great tumult will take place whatever the outcome is naive.

Further, if BushCo retains all of it's power and clamps down even more than it has already, the vast majority of citizens will be either unaware or uncaring. And, they will certainly unwilling to do anything risky to alter it.

Don't believe it? Try listening in on the conversations your neighbors have at the supermarket, in restaurants, at the local bar, at a baseball game. Most people don't read newspapers, watch the "news" on TV to catch up on the latest celebrity scandals and the sports scores, and surf the net looking for bargains or porn.

Those in power have little, if anything, to fear from an unruly public that is too busy shopping or being entertained to pay much attention to politics.

[readmoreoften]

24. agreed. /nt

[Imagevision]

25. Most of the citizenry will go about their business AFTER election day

[EFerrari]

34. Do we know who voted and who didn't? The more I think about it

the more I think that the "apathetic American public" is a strategy to discourage citizen engagement.

Do we KNOW who and how many voted?

[marions ghost]

36. yep

If you promote the idea that the public is apathetic (any more than at any other time in history)--it acts to encourage people to just give up.

Beware the doomsayers spouting, "the public is apathetic so there's no hope" line. They may not be working for us.

The truth is that the public has their antennae up more than ever now...everyone is sensitized after this latest nightmare. Many have lost faith in government. But that does not mean that people don't care. They may not know what do do about it, but that doesn't mean they don't care.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

39. Do you have any examples of the American people "caring"?

"Many have lost faith in their government." Really? Where are they? Are they not voting because they lost "faith" or because they don't give a rip what the government does?

"They may not know what do do about it, but that doesn't mean they don't care."

Where are these people you speak of that "care" about politics or their government beyond that that affects them personally?

From 1945 - 1998 the average turnout for elections was 48.3%. Which places this country 139th out of 172 countries.

http://www.idea.int/vt/survey/voter_turnout_pop2.cfm

Facing the reality of the American Public's apathy isn't encouraging "people to just give up". It's just facing reality.

The politicians are all too aware of the peoples' distaste for politics and politicians. They count on their willful ingnorance of what's going on the country and world to assure that "politics as usual" continues.

[EFerrari]

41. I really haven't formed an opinion yet. But, do you remember

the lines in Ohio on election night 2004? I'll never forget seeing that. Thousands and thousands of mostly Black people standing in line for hours, in stuffy buildings, in the rain. Those people cared.

And, except that Ohio was sold to us as the state that would decide the election, and that's where the cameras were, we'd never have known. Most people still don't realize that there were riots that night when voters were denied their franchise.

Where else did that happen only without the cameras? We know it happened in largely Black and Hispanic precincts. We knnow it happened on reservations. We know it also happened in low income precincts.

I guess that's what I meant when I asked if we know who voted. We know tens if not hundreds of thousands of people tried to vote and were turned away.

[marions ghost]

44. Ok well...

RE: that list of voting percentages, you'd have to take into account some other variables, such as:

How many scoring higher than USA on the list are the countries with mandatory voting? there appear to be several.

How many are countries with proportional representation, where voters feel their views will be taken into account even if a minority viewpoint?

How many are very small countries where interest is higher because it is perceived that voters make more of a "difference"?

How many are countries that have fewer problems with voter disenfranchisement? You would have to consider the extent that voter suppression impacts US percentages. My guess is that it is a lot higher than people would want to admit.
---------------
I am not saying that many Americans are not apathetic but it would take more of an in-depth study to get at the causes of this. People may vote less when they are complacent like in the 50s...
but also perhaps less now, when they have lose faith in government and the electorial system. And of course the effect of the media in keeping people out of touch and uninformed has to be factored in.

Look at the messages going out to the American voter:

--Nobody cares if you vote or not.

--It makes no difference anyway, because the 2 parties are indistinguishable.

--Voting is a difficult process, and especially hard if you move your residence.

--Minority viewpoints will not be heard. Liberal views may not be represented whatsoever.

--You may irritate your boss if you ask for time off to vote.

--Your vote may not be counted.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

46. The voters need to feel they have a stake in the process.

And, that the two main parties really aren't indistiguishable. As it is, with "triangulation" and appealing to the lowest common denominators by being the "not as bad" party, the Democrats aren't helping by advertising themselves as "not liberal", "moderate", and trumpeting the need for "bi-partisanship". Which is exactly what the Republicans do with "compassionate conservatism", "moderate", and the need for "bi-partisanship".

[marions ghost]

48. yes

this is one reason for less voting ... that people don't find their voice in either of the 2 parties. This doesn't necessarily mean they are apathetic. More like downtrodden.

--but my main point was there are a lot of reasons for lack of voting beyond "apathy."

People who are disgusted with the system cannot be called truly apathetic or uncaring. They have paid attention enough to know it stinks.

[Telly Savalas]

51. Democrats should trumpet the need for "bi-partisanship".

We should be doing it on different terms, though. Kind of like this:

"We welcome an earnest discussion with Republicans on the best exit strategy to get our troops out of Iraq within the next month."

or

"With 47 million Americans without health insurance, we've fallen far behind the rest of the industrialized world. That's why we invite Republicans to work with us in formulating a single-payer universal health care system like those in Canada and Western Europe."

Then if the GOP gets so hung-up on its little far right ideology that it wants to turn these common sense concerns into partisan issues, that's their problem, not ours. We're the ones trying to cooperate.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

38. Here's the link to the info I used.

http://elections.gmu.edu/voter_turnout.htm

[EFerrari]

40. Thanks. I'll check it out. n/t

[Initech]

28. There will be a lot of very disillusioned, really angry people.

[SoCalDemGrrl]

29. That there are no more free & fair elections in the U.S.

[nolabels]

35. Free & fair elections have been gone since Kennedy was murdered

They just got more blatant about outright theft of then with the 2000 elections.

[paparush]

30. YoYo Baby...and its Belize, here I come...

[Nikki Stone 1]

45. Why Belize?

Just curious.

[paparush]

53. Belize is English speaking. I spent a month there and loved it.

I still have to research being there *ahem* legally for an extended period of time.

[Porcupine]

32. We won the vote but lost the election........again.

And the spineless Dem representatives will do nothing to help the people AGAIN. Some serious shit will have to hit the fan before this country wakes up. Apparantly Katrina was not serious enough shit. The American populace, as evidenced by my local college population, is a bunch of morons.

YoureOnYourOwnIstan here we come.

[Hardrada]

33. American Democracy ceases to exist.

[catmandu57]

43. It means game over

we will move into a time of endless war, the pukes will sieze the government. The times approaching will make Dicksonian England and America during the Gilded Age look like a sunday school picnic. myself, i don't plan on lasting long afterwards, if I'm not carted off as an undesirable, I'll be left to live or die on my own, and I don't think a cripple will last long in the new world.

[FUGW]

47. Redistricting works and we should follow Tom Delays example in TX.

[CrushTheDLC]

49. So who are the 10 people who don't think we're right wing enough?

Iraq war resolution? Bankruptcy laws? ANWR? Chimpy getting FASCISTS nominated to the Supreme Court, Attorney General and other positions with little difficulty. Unconditional support for the Likud Zionfascists no matter how amny civilians they kill.

Well, if that's all too "liberal" for you, exactly where do the 10 of you want to take this country?

[flaminbats]

50. bring liberalism back into the Republican party..

if Democrats don't win..if Democrats don't fight back, then we can bring this fight into the Republican primaries!

liberals everywhere..regardless of color, class, and income will need to run and vote in the Republican party. If we can't bring change within the minority party, then we must bring it to the party in power!

[Telly Savalas]

52. Fighting Bob LaFollette is one of my favourite historical figures.

It'd be pretty cool if there was a wing of the Republican Party with guys like him.

(Hell, it'd be pretty cool if there was a wing to the Democratic Party with guys like him.)