Forbes' "Don't Marry a Career Woman:" ABSOLUTELY!

[The Cleaner]

Now before you throw the flames around, hear me out.

This morning, my wife and I heard this story on NBC Today. As usual Matt Laeur was his media-whore self and he could not resist this "controversial" story.

Anyway, I turn to my wife and I say, "Absolutely!" She says, "Yea, but you find yourself 30-something and single and then you get blamed for being a career woman." But I explained to her that I had a different perception of a career woman.

For all the young girls out there (and everyone else) - get a skill. Go to college. Get a job after college. Work on your carreer. I know this is important because of first-hand experience. You see, I am currently disabled and I cannot work. My wife however has had a good career for quite awhile and she is now basically supporting us. if she didn't have those skills she has now we would be up @#$'s creek.

My personal perception of a career woman is a 30-something, aggressive, cold, mean woman who chops off all her hair and does not make any qualms about stepping on the next guy's foot to get ahead. She's working all the time, focusing solely on her work and doesn't have time for her man. When she does she's either tapping on her keyboard or thumming the blackberry. She's overworked, tired, cranky and doesn't seem interested in personal relationships. All she thinks about is getting ahead. In other words, she's become a man.

This "Career Woman" thing is about ATTITUDE. Plain and simple.

Now I guarantee you I'll get an amen on the next statement. Generally speaking guys do like a more traditional woman. You don't have to be barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen but a sweet demeanor and a feminine mystique is what men are attracted to. When women become like men that just ain't attractive anymore. Who wants that? I know I don't.

Thoughts?

[Warpy]

Sweet demeanor and feminine mystique?

Grow up guys. Please.

[Mad_Dem_X]

51. Yes, PLEASE!

Want someone timid and meek who won't say boo to you? Give me a break!

[Gormy Cuss]

1. You forgot the sarcasm smiley. n/t

[Richard Steele]

2. Times like this, there just ain't no popcorn smiley BIG enough.

:popcorn:

[AngryAmish]

17. I think this calls for the poopcorn smiley

[Richard Steele]

20. I believe you are CORRECT, sir.

[merh]

110. yeah, I know what you mean

[kysrsoze]

3. Indeed, we men do like the little ladies

The diminutive type, not the ball-busting b*tch we all have to work with. We also need for them to wear lots of lace and only high heels so they differentiate themselves from the male @ssholes thumbing their blackberries. And lastly, they should make it home before us so they can bake a pie which will be piping hot when we get home from a long day at work.

[Berry Cool]

10. Now that is funny.

Seriously, I wonder what we women are supposed to do who have reached a certain age and haven't yet had a man come along to "rescue" us from having to be solely responsible for our own support. What are we supposed to do? Not have careers? Live on welfare until some man comes along to support us?

I enjoy my job. I like being able to take care of myself. But my job is not my whole life. I would love to share it with a man, but that man would have to understand that I wouldn't just give up my career when he came along either. Yes, I'd make him important in my life, you bet. But I wouldn't quit and go home and have babies and expect him to support me singlehandedly. And why should that not be good news? I feel sorry for a man thinking he has to be able to support two people or a family on his single salary or be considered a failure. All that does is motivate men to become workaholics. Both men and women should have time for a personal life.

[Avalux]

4. Oh brother.

I understand what you're trying to say, but your post is full of stereotypes. Sweet demeanor, feminine mystique...I am not sweet. I am smart, beautiful, thoughtful, generous, empathetic, a great mother - but don't ever call me sweet. I have had to act like a man in the workplace to survive; that's just the way it is and I don't think there's anything wrong with it. Why does a woman have to act a certain way to please a man - that's not my purpose in life.

I am intrigued by what you call your personal perception of a career woman.....why do you think you have that perception?

[The Cleaner]

8. Observation. And you just confirmed it.

What's wrong with Sweet? Why is Sweet a bad thing?

Smart and all your other traits are laudable, I don't mean to discount those either. But there's nothing wrong with sweet.

[Avalux]

13. Confirmed what??

:shrug:

[The Cleaner]

16. Answer my question, then I'll answer yours.

What's wrong with a woman being sweet? I thought that was a good thing.

[Avalux]

23. Read my post again.

I did not say there was anything wrong with being sweet, however your use of the word to describe women came across as diminutive. Your turn.

[Midlodemocrat]

25. Yes there is. Too much sweet can cause diabetes.

:eyes:

FWIW, all the 'sweet' women I have known would stab you in the back while looking you in the eye. The 'smart' ones simply don't bother with you.

[Avalux]

28. .

:rofl:

[lukasahero]

5. "doesn't have time for her man."

You mean like to get him a beer and make him a sandwich, huh? Fuck that. Welcome to the modern era.

And "get a skill"? You mean like learning how to type or something that will allow her to support you just in case something bad happens but not to much so she gets all full of herself and uppity. :eyes:

FTR, I'm an engineer and quite happy with my career. Just to shatter your precious illusions, I have long hair, am very petite, my loving, open-minded husband says I'm very feminine and willowy. Thank god a few guys like him exist and they're not all like you.

[The Cleaner]

14. No - you are putting words in my mouth.

I mean spending quality time with her man. Maybe watching a movie together, discussing life, sharing ideas, connecting. You can't connect with a blackberry in one hand and a laptop in the other.

A skill - that can mean lots of things. My wife has had a long-term career in the computer industry. She is happy with that carrer and it is fulfilling.

I see nothing wrong with your line of work, continue, that's exactly what I mean by having a good skill.

[lukasahero]

21. Gee thanks for your permission to pursue my career

Are you for real? It is by the way, a career, not a skill. Typing is a skill. Engineering is a career.

FTR, I can also work 50+ hours a week AND catch a movie with my husband. Amazingly enough, we cook dinner together - it is lovely time to spend connecting.

So, is it ok for women to marry career men then? How do they "connect" when HE has a blackberry in one hand and a laptop in the other?

Your post is just sexist bullshit and now you're trying to spin your way out of having used insulting stereotypes about women.

[Name removed]

41. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Missy Vixen]

95. This is actually a euphemism

>I mean spending quality time with her man. Maybe watching a movie together, discussing life, sharing ideas, connecting.<

Let me translate: Having sex. If the wife works at any kind of well-paying job, she's supposedly not "available" for the other duties we all know are required of the little woman.

Ladies, we all know how to cram that extra hour in the day, especially for a guy who's shown us that he's not afraid to deal with all facets of the woman he loves. ;-)

Julie

[The Cleaner]

143. Julie, Absolutely not!

Any married person will tell you that the sexual aspect of the relationship is very minor really...and that's not what I mean. I am probably more emotional than most guys.

Maybe other guys think as you say the "little woman" has her so-called duties, but I don't think in terms of chores being divided by male/female.

Being available, man or woman, is more than just being available for sex. A relationship is multifaceted. If it's based on sex you can guarantee it won't work anyway.

But if a woman is constantly overworked and unavailable, how are the two supposed to get to know one another?

[SemiCharmedQuark]

6. Is this sarcasm?

Because if any man told me I needed to have a sweeter demeanor and work on my feminine mystique, I would tell him to go fuck himself. I'm just not attracted to cavemen straight out of 1950.

[The Cleaner]

19. Just sayin...

:rofl:

No, I'm just sayin that men are generally attracted to a more traditional woman who is sweet and kind as opposed to a woman who is mean, cold, and only thinking about getting ahead.

There's a difference between a working woman and a career woman. Career women are the ones in question here. Working women is a good thing, but career women - those who are so cold, arrogant, and mean just to get ahead are the ones I'm talking about.

[Marie26]

32. What about

a woman who is sweet & kind, with a PhD and success at the top of her field? Oh, the dilemma! I'm beginning to think this post is just flamebait.

[The Cleaner]

47. ATTITUDE

That is what I keep driving at. The thing about the career woman is that it's defined by ATTITUDE.

I would personally love a woman with a PhD who was sweet and kind. That's because I like smart women and can't stand dumb women or surfacey women. I am, however, married and my wife is pretty smart herself.

No this is not flamebait, it's discussion. I think alot of people are misrepresenting the OP.

[Midlodemocrat]

50. I have a PhD, but I'm not sweet.

I am kind, but sweet just doesn't describe me. I have a biting sense of humor, am extraordinarily quick thinking and I excel at my job.

I guess I don't have a chance with you. Pity.

[Bluebear]

75. Do you chop off your hair?

:eyes:

[Midlodemocrat]

77. Of course not, I want to retain some semblance of my femininity.

How else will I use my feminine wiles to get what I want?

:eyes:

This thread is a frigging hoot.

[Misunderestimator]

82. LOL!

Yes, it would be a prize to get a man like this, no? :rofl:

[treestar]

106. What's wrong with short hair?

There are gorgeous women who have short hair.

[Midlodemocrat]

112. It's in the OP. Bluebear didn't mean anything by it.

[The Cleaner]

You're smart, which is attractive.

Nice and sweet are the same to me. Semantics.

No biggie.

[Midlodemocrat]

83. Oh, YAY!!!! The man who thinks women should be sweet said I was smart!!

Wait until I tell my husband!!!! He'll be so happy he chose well!!!!


:eyes:

[Solly Mack]

89. ROFLMAO

Now if you bake a cake and get his slippers ready, you can go from sweet to a sweetheart

Dare to dream!!!

[melnjones]

97. LOLOL

:rofl:

[chimpymustgo]

128. Can I wear comfortable shoes? Or does that make me "a woman who wears

comfortable shoes" (and we all know what THAT means).

Hey pal, you need to stop defending your stereotypical, misguided OP - and seriously read some of these responses and consider where your resentment of "career women" stems from. Have you talked about this with your cute, sweet, supportive wife?

[WritingIsMyReligion]

111. So let's look at the attitude of "career men" now.

Or are you saying that "men will be men"?

:eyes:

[newspeak]

so, do you think most women want a cold, unfeeling, arrogant

prick of a guy? Or, is that acceptable because, gee, men will be men? stereotypes of both men and women, is what keeps humans in their little box, not allowing them to be who they are. It's amazing that some have a preconceived idea of what and who men and women SHOULD be!!!! You know, you're also bashing men in this thread because you are attributing these traits as masculine.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

109. Well, good.

If I cared one fuck what men are "generally attracted" to, I wouldn't be here right now.

Now you are not only demeaning women but also men who dare to love women who aren't "sweet" and "traditional girls."

Nice job. :eyes:

[Matariki]

118. Look, I think I understand you

ANYBODY would prefer a partner who is warm, loving and available over a partner who is mean and cold. That doesn't have anything to do with gender - or with how driven a person is in their career. WHERE did you get this stereotype from?

[WritingIsMyReligion]

103. "cavemen straight out of 1950"

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

:thumbsup:

:yourock:

[JitterbugPerfume]

7. a little insecure there huh guys?

maybe a big ego and a small penis?

[calico1]

9. .......

:eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes:

[Demobrat]

11. But if you don't marry a career woman

who's going to support your ass when you get fired from your McJob for being a lazy screw-up?

[Occulus]

12. I found your new avatar

[Fierce]

15. Thumming (sic) the blackberry?

Best. female masturbation euphimism. Evah.

[Marie26]

18. Bleck.

:eyes: Have you ever wondered why or how you received this perception of the "career woman"? I think this is closely related to the "Hillary Clinton" syndrome exhibited by so many Freepers. Just the name "Hillary" sends them into convulsions of fear & hate. Because, IMO, they're channeling all their fears & insecurities about modern women into this one person. You're going to get flamed here, sorry. Without meaning to, you've pretty much listed almost every sexist stereotype out there.

[The Cleaner]

31. No I've listed the damn truth.

Ask any guy out there: Which would you rather have? A cold, mean, aggressive, unfeeling, arrogant woman who will do anything to get ahead and who has no time for you, or a sweet traditional girl? Go ahead! I think you know the answer.

I never considered Hillary in this discussion. But what I have considered is that it's essential for women to have a career. Working women are essential nowadays, and women SHOULD BE independent as opposed to being dependent on a man. I believe it is a detriment for a woman NOT to be working.

But there is a HUGE difference in ATTITUDE between a working woman and a CAREER woman.

Understand yet?

[lukasahero]

36. Why, in your mind are the two mutually exclusive?

"A cold, mean, aggressive, unfeeling, arrogant woman who will do anything to get ahead and who has no time for you, or a sweet traditional girl?"

That's the reason you're getting flamed for your sexist bullshit. You're saying that women with careers are "cold, mean, aggressive, unfeeling, arrogant" That's a bullshit, sexist stereotype and yeah, we're going to call you on it. Deal.

[The Cleaner]

104. Jeez, what a mess!

Okay, "Sweet traditional girl who may or may not have a career."

My own WIFE has a career for goodness sakes, and I'm fine with that. Again, it's all in the ATTITUDE. She is not driven to success; she is not in the office 24/7; she does not view her life as success in business at all costs. She views her career as just a job, and she's happy where she's at. She has time for me and vice versa, we have a good relationship.

That's all.

[melnjones]

117. Get rid of the words..

sweet, traditional, and girl. Sweet=doormat in the real world most of the time. Traditional=barefoot and pregnant, like it or not. And GIRL? What are we, 13 years old? Try "woman." I'm 25 and can't think of a single guy my age who would want me to tell them they are a "sweet boy." ugh.

[alcibiades_mystery]

40. The one word that does NOT come to mind is HUGE

Yours is an opinion of the teeny-tiny man. Gnaw mean?

[Marie26]

46. Do you understand?

Hey, I'm a sweet traditional girl who's a fairly successful attorney. According to you, I shouldn't exist. :shrug: Your post speaks for itself. You say that it's important for women to have a "skill", apparantly to support their husbands if the need arises, but then reiterate every sexist stereotype of women who have a career. The point being, I guess, women can work, but can't succeed? Can get an education, but can't make use of it? Can work with men, but must be submissive & solicitous towards them? There is NO difference in attitude, except in your own mind. People are people. There are very nice women w/successful careers, & very cold mean women who don't work outside the home. Same goes for men - some have good personalities, some do not, at all economic levels. What you have done is taking every negative character trait & assigning them to the mythical "Career woman." It's the same thing as Rush Limbaugh ranting about the "Femi-Nazis". And guy who starts hateful, fearful rants about Hillary. It's all the same thing. And it's all about minimizing women's new strength & power, and wanting to re-establish male dominance in society.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

72. Dude, why do you assume a woman cannot be powerful and "sweet"?

They're not mutually exclusive. Not that any self-respecting woman would want to be "sweet" in the way you apparently describe it. :eyes:

[Sparkly]

74. Or unemployed outside the home and crabby, for that matter? nt

[WritingIsMyReligion]

87. Exactly.

Fuck this "sweet" shit. It is damned demeaning to women, to say that what we ought to be is "sweet." I don't see any threads calling for men to be "sweet" and supportive. Hmmm....why might that be?

[Misunderestimator]

78. A "traditional girl" ... LOL!

:rofl:

I just don't even have words.

[gkhouston]

85. you know,

one who keeps the house, raises the kids, and still has time to swim a witch if the need arises. ;-)

[Misunderestimator]

98. Ah yes... this kind...

[gkhouston]

107. ROFLMAO n/t

[Richard Steele]

115. Oh god i'm laughingso hard the cats ar hi&#8706;ˆng!!!!!

edit/translation: "Oh God, I'm laughing so hard the cats are hiding".

Sorry, I was typing blind for a second there.
Lord, that's some good caption!

[Matariki]

133. Ohmyfuckinggod that's funny

"It's not a clown car" :rofl:

where did you get that!!!?

[Misunderestimator]

142. Blue-Jay found it somewhere... I stole it from this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=105&topic_id=5535923

[Midlodemocrat]

22. Are. You. Kidding.

I have been married for 17 years, have three kids, an extremely pressure filled job that pays extraordinarily well, but I am so far from sweet and your description of a career woman, I don't even guess I am human.

A more traditional woman? You mean one who doesn't have an opinion? Or one who doesn't work, but spends all her time in the kitchen a workin' fer her man?

Fuck. That. My husband is every bit as capable of putting dinner on the table as I am. We have different strengths and different weaknesses, but I grew up with three brothers, so I am not that little lacy undies wearing female you purport you want. :eyes:

And, FWIW, 'becoming like a man' for work is shit. Either a person, male or female, is an asshole, or they're not. I have no desire to make someone suffer so I can get ahead.

This is just absurd.

[acmejack]

24. How can I get someone to support me in style then?

I totally disagree, there are plenty of professionally driven, mean killer people who happen to be female out there. On their personal time they are women and apparently quite normal.

I know several of them, my Sister is one of the top attorneys in her field in the State, her SO would of 25 years would be stunned, A friend's wife is an executive at a major food service company been married to her for decades, he seems happy (most of the time:)

[Wickerman]

26. rofl

what a great parody! :rofl: er, :yoiks:

[unpossibles]

27. it's a bit more complicated than that

I think men and women need to learn how to balance careers and personal lives. It's too easy for either to get sucked up into the cannibalistic rat race of career and to ignore or to take things out on our S.O.'s - gender has nothing to do with it.

Frankly, I love to cook and do other "feminine" activities, and I respect my wife's talents and career choices. Do we sometimes neglect our personal lives? Of course - I think that it's the Modern American Disease. There are times when we both feel the other is spending too much time on the computer or at work, or whatever, so we try to communicate that.

[eShirl]

29. what hair style have to do with being a career woman or not ?!

good grief man

[peacetalksforall]

30. There are those you describe. There are those who use sex to get

ahead (still). There are sweet ones who sublimate sweetness for facts and progress.

But, you're premise is all wrong. You describe what men are attracted to. That is totally different from business. The problem is that men and some women can't think through the logic of it.

Men evolve. Women evolve. Career-minded people evolve. Sometimes they evolve according to what is expected of them according to what they read and observe.

Attractiveness in business should focus on thinking, presenting, persuading, and the ability to finish.

Sweetness and femininity should have little to do with what women should do or be to be attractive to men or women - in business. Business should be genderless to avoid being sidetracked.

Regrettably, you're not alone in your thinking. If women should be sweet and feminine, what should men be? The key to your statement is that attractiveness to men is important to business?

[Lex]

33. Your wife sounds like a really lucky lady.

Wow.

[Midlodemocrat]

37. .

:rofl:

:applause:

[trotsky]

34. Still haven't gotten that "amen" yet, have ya?

"Sweet demeanor and a feminine mystique"? I've always been most attracted to intelligence, independence, and determination. My wife has all those, but she's also a kind and loving person and a great mom to our kids. It just seems like you've created this caricature of a "career woman" to bash. Even if there was such a thing, who says that every woman wants to be married with kids and baking pies for her man in her lingerie? People should be free to choose their own lifestyles, and love whom they want.

[Midlodemocrat]

35. Only when Hell freezes over. DU guys aren't stupid enough

to jump on this bandwagon.

[alcibiades_mystery]

38. Get a job, freeloader

Oh, are you offended?

Now you know how decent people think about your spurious bullshit.

[sendero]

39. Just another example..

... where you can forget statistics. People are individuals, and putting them in some sort of pigeonhole is not too bright.

My wife is a "career woman". She's tough as nails at work and she's my wife at home. She has plenty of "sweet demeanor and feminine mystique" for me.

I wouldn't want to be married to a woman who could not support herself. I'm not some kind of sugar daddy nor do I want to be. I'm just the daddy, that's all :)

[TlalocW]

42. Yeah, all that is good

:sarcasm:
But you forgot the most important thing - really big breasts.

TlalocW

[melnjones]

70. LOL nt

[Fierce]

43. You funny little man.

Maybe that career woman doesn't want a man. There's worse things than ending up 30 and single. Like, uh, being expected to keep a sweet demeanor and a feminine mystique (WTF?). Gawd, just thinking about it makes me want to take drugs.

[GeorgeGist]

44. Don't marry a career man...

if his work is his life.

[melnjones]

45. Huh.

And yet we are expected to want the men that are:

"30-something, aggressive, cold, mean man who does not make any qualms about stepping on the next guy's foot to get ahead. He's working all the time, focusing solely on his work and doesn't have time for his woman. When he does he's either tapping on his keyboard or thumming the blackberry. He's overworked, tired, cranky and doesn't seem interested in personal relationships. All he thinks about is getting ahead."

So this "attitude," as you call it, is acceptable for men but not for women? Interesting. Reason # 75435679976554 why I will probably never marry.

And a woman with a good career who ISN'T all of the things listed above isn't considered a "career woman" in your book? That's nice. What would you consider her? Just a wife? Just a woman? Just a mom? Heaven forbid her career be part of her actual personhood.

For the record, I am an attractive young woman with typically a kind, sensitive and gentle disposition. I love children and animals. I love spending quality time with the people I care about. My sweet little feminine self, however, would never marry a jerk who didn't understand that my educated, independent, confident, out-spoken self was just as valid and just as much a "woman" as the rest of me. Be glad you already have yourself a wife...comments like these won't make you popular with the ladies.

[acmejack]

60. Sorry about the career!

:sarcasm:

[Solly Mack]

48. I have the sudden urge to take a shit. This is the crapper, right?

Sometimes my "sweet demeanor" and "feminine mystique" just get the bettter of me.

[bleedingheart]

49. hahahaha

I know the feeling

[Solly Mack]

54. I'll be printing out the OP to use as TP

[bleedingheart]

62. I don't know...I would be afraid of catching something

;-)

[Solly Mack]

68. ZING! lolol

[MsFlorida]

52. dont marry a career man either - exactly

I love my construction worker man with the college education. He is kind, gentle and damn he looks hot in those jeans and that tool belt!

[gkhouston]

59. ahem... pics, please.

;-)

[bleedingheart]

53. Once again...the Burden of Womanhood is being discussed

we are supposed to be the ones to diaper the babies, take care of the home, and meet our man at the door with a martini...

If we work...well we have to do all that and bring home a paycheck...but Oh dear...don't cause any ripples in the family life because you are just a domestic and working slave....and wait a minute...have you gained a bit too much weight? Is your hair looking a bit flat? Well you had better work on that...can't look over wrought, tired or just fed up....that man-pet you are taking care of might leave you for a newer model...

:sarcasm:

[Bluebear]

55. Well, hush mah mouth!

:crazy:

[boolean]

69. lol (nt)

:rofl:

[MsFlorida]

56. and 1 more thing, I do CHOP off my hair!

and I am aggressive and watch out, that could be your foot under my stiletto heel!

[Misunderestimator]

57. Thank god I'm gay.

:eyes:

[Midlodemocrat]

58. .

:spray:

[gkhouston]

61. okay, so for a lesbian couple,

would you take turns playing "career woman" and "nice lady" or what? }(

[Misunderestimator]

65. Sounds like fun.

:P

[Bluebear]

66. Nice lady!!!! >>>>

[begin_within]

138. Can I watch?

[idgiehkt]

63. thoughts?

"When women become like men that just ain't attractive anymore."

I think butch women are fucking hot, but that's just me...

[underpants]

64. Need more info-is she wearing spiked heels? Is there spanking?

:spank:

[MissMillie]

67. I don't mind if you think that way about a woman, however....

My personal perception of a career woman is a 30-something, aggressive, cold, mean woman who chops off all her hair and does not make any qualms about stepping on the next guy's foot to get ahead. She's working all the time, focusing solely on her work and doesn't have time for her man. When she does she's either tapping on her keyboard or thumming the blackberry. She's overworked, tired, cranky and doesn't seem interested in personal relationships. All she thinks about is getting ahead. In other words, she's become a man.

Bad traits are bad traits no matter who exhibits them. If these things are bad traits for a woman, why are they not bad traits for a man?

[idgiehkt]

I don't think these are inherent male traits either

"in other words, she's become a man."

The OP sounds like a real man-hater.

[MissMillie]

121. I don't think they are either

Gosh I hope that's not the way my post sounded.

I just meant that it seemed ok to the poster that men have those traits.

I don't think it's ok for anybody to have those traits. But certainly what is good for the goose is good for the gander, right?

[Sparkly]

71. IF there are such "mean Career Women,"

it's a good bet they don't care what you think.

How many do you know, btw?

Do you know any "mean Career Men?"

[Bluebear]

73. Is this the Feminine Mystique you say attracts men?>>>

[prolesunited]

76. Do us a favor and share this thread with your wife

and let us know what she thinks.

[gkhouston]

90. but only if you have good insurance. n/t

[Missy Vixen]

79. Maybe you should talk to my husband

>but a sweet demeanor and a feminine mystique is what men are attracted to<

Sweet = doormat in the working world.

My husband says that he married me because I'm not "traditional".

Julie

[izzybeans]

80. This guy said it best:

http://movies.yahoo.com/movie/1800026332/photo/536837

[johnnie]

81. LOL

:spray:

Oooops. Where are the fire extinguishers?

[Stinky The Clown]

84. Awright, Mr. Cleaner .... you touched this crusty-assed 59 yr old MAN's...

... last nerve.

That is the singularly most sexist, bunch-of-crap bullshit I've read/heard in a LONG TIME.

I'm no Alan Alda metrosexual type. I'm a cigar smoking, often unshaven, cussing, grumpy, old curmudgeon. Pretty 'traditional' in many of my views. Probably someone you'd expect to go along with with your views.

Yer wrong.

My wife has a career and I support it. I'm proud of her. She's free to do whatever she wants and my job is to walk one step behind her when she's in 'career' mode. The reverse is also true, which is to say she walks one step behind me when I'm in career mode. That's called a 'partnership'.

My daughter is just embarking on her life course. At 19, she's still unsettled and finding herself. But you can rest assured she's being guided with the notion that she can do whatever the hell she wants to do.

I have two business partners - both women. Both are as feminine as you would want any woman to be. Both are also tough as nails when it comes to business. But ya know what? NEITHER of them pound keyboards at night or thumb blackberries all day. They have families and they kids and they have careers.

And ya know what else?

I don't know *any* women who act to your ideal .... except for a few of the religiously insane 'promise keeper' types. And even for them, stupid as *I* think their lifestyles are, have *made a choice* to live as they do.

By the way ...... the flip side's also true ...... I have NEVER met any 'career' women of the type you describe. And I'm in a business that puts me in touch with many top-line professionals of both sexes.

I'm sorry for your disability. I also advise you to thank your wife for putting up with your views.

[Midlodemocrat]

88. You forgot the part about your being a fabulous cook.

:hide:

[Misunderestimator]

91. Bravo!

:applause: and :rofl: and :thumbsup:

[Nickster]

96. Bravo! Well said. n/t

[WritingIsMyReligion]

99. Just excellent.

Thank you, sir.

:applause:

[Hell Hath No Fury]

86. This small business owner with "chopped off hair" says...

"Bite my strap-on".

Ha ha, just kidding.

No, not really. :eyes:

[WritingIsMyReligion]

100. Tee-hee.

:rofl:

[Misunderestimator]

105. And this career woman with "chopped off hair" says...

:thumbsup: :rofl:

[Coyote_Bandit]

92. RIP n/t

[RB TexLa]

93. You honestly think men don't want their wives to succeed in life?

I guess maybe the ones that don't love them very much.

[Nickster]

94. Sounds mysteriously like Rushbo's way of using Femi-nazi to single out

only certain women, but supposedly not all feminists. As long as they are quiet and in their place,everything's cool eh?

Why single women out for special focus? Women are forced to become more cut-throat in the corporate world because they are fighting against corporate male dominance. So why no focus on the male model that's being forced on them by you? Bad traits are bad traits regardless of sex don't you think?

[Sparkly]

101. Quotes from 1906 -- Your views ARE that old...

"For a woman to persist in wearing her hair short, unless there is some special necessity for it, shows a perverted taste; woman detracts from her charm in so far as she tries to look like a man."
-- Carl Rosen, The Face, Hair and Scalp,1906

"I'm sure you're smiling now just for the joy of knowing that you have at last found something that is going to make you a new woman; not the mannish new woman about whom we have heard so much, nor the new woman with all the sweetness crushed out; but the sweet, pure, healthy, wholesome and fascinating woman with more of love and sympathy -- the dainty woman whom everybody loves."
-- Alice M. Long, My Lady Beautiful, 1906

One more, even older:
"Every woman now-a-days is expected to be generally well-informed, but a strong woman is an abomination."
-- A Society Lady, How to Acquire Personal Beauty, 1889

[Marie26]

134. LOL

I guess some things never change.

[treestar]

102. Why is there so much generalization about when men want?

Aren't men individuals? They seem to be, to my experience. Yet Dr. Phil and the rest of those idiots are always trying to tell you what men want.

Some men want to freeload off a woman. Some men want to support a woman. Some men can handle an equal partnership. Some men fall in love with a particular woman and just deal with her way of doing things, and vice versa. We are not automatons.

If I were going to generalize, I would say, I've never met a man who didn't want the woman to be some sort of challenge. I'm very easy to get along with and tend to give in on little things. Men never have more than a passing interest. They want someone to make demands and challenge them. They prefer a "bitch." Maybe I'm lucky and have never met a freeper - but my experience is that men do NOT want a woman who will just do whatever they say or put them first. They want some sort of challenge or fight even over petty things. And I think the career woman would fit the bill.

I've met several men who lack respect for a woman who doesn't go out and get a job, too.

[Sammy Pepys]

108. I don't think you should marry a "career" anything...

Obviously, one mate has to have time for another...but with regards to the story I do have a personal anecdote that relates.

One gal I know through work (don't know her exact age but she's between 38 and 40) could probably be considered a "career woman" without the coldness and impersonality mentioned by the OP. She's very nice, very personable...but was also extremely driven for much of her life. She flew through her BA and two grad degrees by the time she was 26ish, immediately landed a very lucrative position (and continues to be a real go-getter) and a year after that got married to guy she had met in grad school. I don't know what the discussion had been about kids, but about 3 years into the marriage or so things got tense because he wanted them and she didn't at the time. They eventually divorced, with that (according to her) being the major factor, which was exacerbated by the furious work schedule she kept.

Well, she's now pushing 40..if not there already...and has decided that after all this, she wants a family badly. She's dated since her divorce, but has not had anything terribly long term that I've known about. She's not optimistic that she's ever going to be a mother, and when she talks about it you can tell she's majorly bummed out. She's said more than once she'd trade where she is now to start over in her mid-late 20s when she got married.

[Shakespeare]

113. Do you keep your knuckles bandaged or otherwise protected?

Just wondering what you do with them, since they so obviously drag the ground when you walk.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

116. Hoo!

:rofl:

[WritingIsMyReligion]

114. "In other words, she's become a man."

Holy fuck. I can't even BEGIN to wrap my mind around this blatant sexism. God FORBID a woman should DARE to act at all MASCULINE!

:eyes:

:puke::puke:

[MissMillie]

124. I frankly get tired of the labels

Why does society spend so much time trying to define what is masculine and what is feminine? Can't we just be/like/wear/act the way we want to and still be the women and men that we are?

[Solly Mack]

127. Thank you!

we're humans with all that implies...we run the gamut

[ZombieNixon]

119. "Sweet demeanor and feminine mystique?"

OK, first of all, what the fuck does that mean?

I for one, want a woman with ambition and drive, and I know that that and what you might call "sweet" (though I rather think that your "sweet" and mine are highly divergent :eyes:) are not mutually exclusive.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

122. Glad to see you in here, ZN.

;)

[ZombieNixon]

141. Yeah, someone left the Lounge unlocked...

:eyes: :P

[myrna minx]

120. I just needed to post in one of the most sexist threads I've read here.

What absolute patronizing drivel. :eyes:

[Solly Mack]

123. I think our "sweet demeanors and feminine mystique" ran him off

lolololol

[Midlodemocrat]

125. Yes. But good for a chuckle or two.

[begin_within]

126. So, is this your ideal career woman:

[Warren DeMontague]

129. ...Hey- is she single?

:blush:

[begin_within]

135. last I heard... you wanna take her on?

[melnjones]

136. no, her hair is too long...

and she's showing too much cleavage. Doesn't look "manly" enough. Otherwise, you're right on.

[begin_within]

130. And is this your ideal "traditional" woman:

[Midlodemocrat]

132. No. This is.

[Sparkly]

146. Or this.

[mad-mommy]

131. I wasn't going to...but...

What would you call a woman who stays home and doesn't work?

"She's working all the time, focusing solely on her work and doesn't have time for her man. When she does she's either tapping on her keyboard or thumming the blackberry. She's overworked, tired, cranky and doesn't seem interested in personal relationships. All she thinks about is getting ahead. In other words, she's become a man."

that's my day, with exception to the blackberry, and I haven't turned into a man yet.

LOL.

[LeftyMom]

137. Thanks, we don't want you either

-Uppity Career Women

[Solly Mack]

140. Spitting coffee...LMAO

[verse18]

139. This is one of the most

amusing threads I've seen in a while. Mr. Cleaner is trying so hard to defend his idiotic, sexist, stereotypical views and is not doing very well.

[Midlodemocrat]

144. Not doing well is a major understatement. He's getting his clock cleaned.

[Warren DeMontague]

145. I think chock full o' nuts is the heavenly coffee.

And chock full o' crap is your post.

I married one of these "career women". I think generalizations like yours are weak, at best. "Guys do like a more traditional woman".. Traditional like what? June Cleaver? Anne Boleyn? Neanderthal?

And which "guys" are you talking about? The guys who, like the women, are overworked, cranky, and only interested in getting ahead?

I think I see what the real problem is, here: Maybe if people in our nation o' busybodies worried a little more about living their own lives, and conversely stopped trying to fucking tell everyone else how to live theirs, we all would be a happier lot. And likewise, the people who need Matt Lauer to validate their lifestyle choices for them might purchase the damn clue that THEY are the ones who, in the end, determine the worth of their own existence.

Now, of course, lest I skirt the rocky shoals of ironic hypocrisy, it's not for me to tell 'em to do that. But at the very least, we'd have one less line of bullshit for the media to distract us with--- particularly while there are REAL, IMPORTANT things happening on this planet RIGHT NOW.

[catbert836]

147. I was going to post a full rebuttal

but others have already done my work. I would suggest that you stop trying to back up your OP, read ALL the posts in the thread, and then go back to read your original remarks. You'll find that misogynists, however unintentional their prejudices may be, are not very well tolerated on this forum, just like racists and homophobes.

[maddezmom]

148. locking