Can someone explain how Deoderant, Toothpaste and Shampoo, Lip Gloss

[KoKo]

all packaged seperately can be an explosive? Could you really blow up a plane by taking any of these items out of your bag.. How would one do that?

Do you need to squeeze the toothpaste out or do you throw the tube and when it hits the plane cabin wall it explodes? Same with lip gloss, deoderant...etc.

Maybe this is a dumb question but how do you get these things to explode? And isn't there a better way to screen this? Like a family with little kids is going to have explosive deoderant, toothpaste and lipgloss and mix them all together on the plane with a cotton ball and a pour some water on it and it all explodes?

I just don't get it. It really sounds kind of bizarre but then I'm not up on explosive materials and how they work.

:shrug:

[Akoto]

1. The more pressing question is ...

Since I used all of these things on myself this morning, am I now an explosive device? :rofl:

[Hugin]

7. Only if you've topped it all off with a bean and green chile burrito...

Then and only then are you a walking WMD.

[elehhhhna]

46. No, but if ya skip the deodorant, the plane might be a stinkbomb.

[SammyWinstonJack]

57. !

:spray:

[MercutioATC]

2. Of COURSE that won't explode, silly...

You need GEL

...it's all in the evil GEL

[Malikshah]

12. That's it! Now I know why I hate those "Gellin'" Commercials

You know the ones...

I'm gellin with no swellin or redness and yellin...

It's all a code for the tur-rists.

:)

[SutaUvaca]

19. Do innersoles show up on Xray scans?

'Cause a lot of terrorists could now be gellin' like Magellan! :rofl:

[XemaSab]

3. If 300 people got on a 10 hour flight

without those items, would ANYONE survive? :crazy:

[im10ashus]

4. It's overreaction, IMHO.

They've known of the possibilities since 1994.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/10/world/europe/09cnd-bojinka.html?hp&ex=1155268800&en=1e15bcb135378169&ei=5094&partner=homepage

[Protagoras]

28. Absurdly, obscene, gross overreaction

that needs to be protested and shut down asap. These people know that every time they want an inch they should try and grab 3 miles.

[im10ashus]

30. Give them enough rope though, and they will hang themselves.

I'm just saying...

:shrug:

[Protagoras]

40. I used to believe that...but 6 years later the rope is still going out

nt

[Tyler Durden]

5. You nailed it. It's stupid.

Sounds like a dumb movie script. And it is. That's why we have to react with shouts of "BULLSHIT!"

Good luck, though, on "MYSPACE" for the over 21 crowd.

[havocmom]

43. GELS ON THE PLANE!?!?! This is series!!!

Neocons had to get us to stop talking about throwing other incumbants out.

[flordehinojos]

6. the bushit boy has cried "wolf" too maaaaaaaaany times.

now his poodle lap dog is helping him to do so.

plain and simple.

[malaise]

61. Sadly work out the cost of this bullshit

to people who have to travel. I cannot take anymore of this fugging madness.

[flordehinojos]

75. neither can i.

[yellerpup]

8. A person could

take chemicals disguised as these products and mix them in the bathroom. That would make a bomb. Although, I am with you, I don't see how any family traveling with little kids is going to pull this off.

[blonndee]

9. Careful, Gonzales may want to detain you

for this post.

[Xenotime]

10. MacGyver can make them work together.

[Norquist Nemesis]

13. LOL!

JINX!!!

[Midlodemocrat]

21. But he would need a paperclip and a toothpick to pull it off.

[Norquist Nemesis]

11. It all sounds a bit too McGyverish

:shrug:

[rug]

14. Mary Kay's headquarters are surrounded.

[mikeytherat]

60. You do NOT mess with Mary Kay. Ever.

mikey_the_rat

[Catherine Vincent]

15. Lotion is what I'm concerned about.

Us darker skinned travelers won't like that. I guess we need to lotion up before we fly. :)

[Snivi Yllom]

16. In 1994 Ramsey Yousef killed a passenger with a nitro bomb

The explosive was smuggled in a contact solution container.

It's not the ingredients, it's the containers.

[oneighty]

27. Details?

Nitro bomb.

180

[Snivi Yllom]

35. details here - nitro smuggled in contact lens solution bottles, 1994

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bojinka

In 1994, Yousef and Khalid Sheik Mohammed started testing airport security. Yousef booked a flight between Kai Tak International Airport in Hong Kong and Chiang Kai Shek International Airport near Taipei. Mohammed booked a flight between Ninoy Aquino International Airport near Manila and Kimpo International Airport near Seoul.

The two had already converted fourteen bottles of contact lens solution into bottles containing nitroglycerin, which was readily available in the Philippines. Yousef taped a metal rod to the arch of his of foot in place of the detonators. Yousef and Mohammed wore jewelry and clothing with metal to confuse airport security.

On December 11, 1994, Yousef built another bomb, which had one tenth of the power that his final bombs were planned to have, in the lavatory of the aircraft and left it inside the life jacket under his seat, 26K, after he got off the plane from a flight that arrived in Cebu. Yousef had boarded the flight under the assumed name of Armaldo Forlani, using a false Italian passport. The aircraft was Philippine Airlines Flight 434 using that aircraft on a Manila to Narita route. Yousef had set the timer for four hours after he got off the aircraft. The bomb exploded while the aircraft was over Minami Daito Island, near Okinawa, Japan. A Japanese businessman named Haruki Ikegami was killed after the bomb detonated. The Boeing 747-200 safely made an emergency landing in Naha, Okinawa. None of the aircraft's other 272 passengers or any members of the crew were killed, although 10 passengers in front of Ikegami were injured. Yousef then planned which flights to attack for Phase I.

[Jacobin]

54. Don't confuse everyone with facts

There are no terrorists. It is impossible to smuggle explosive compounds onto an airliner disguised in innocent looking containers. It simply cannot be done. It is a physical impossibility. (See all the threads on DU explaining this in detail)

Our foreign policy is benevolent and creates absolutely no one in the world who would want to do such a thing as blow up planes. It has never happened and it never will.

These London guys were all hired by Karl Rove to try to take attention away from Ned Lamont's victory. They actually love America and appreciate that we are bringing freedom to Iraq and the support Israel in its fight against Lebanon.

:sarcasm:

[Snivi Yllom]

66. "It's a Lamont conspiracy!!! AAAHHHH!H!!!!"

[oneighty]

72. Ahhh

Nitroglycerin

Okay.

180

[htuttle]

50. But that doesn't seem to be what they are alleging

The official story, so far, as I understand it, is that they were supposed to buy all the ingredients for the bomb at the airport concession store, and assemble them on the plane. They are no reports of bomb-making materials found at any of the suspects' houses yet.

[mmonk]

17. Because terrorism can be anywhere and is easy to do.

That's the general theme they want.

[fishwax]

67. that's why it's so SCARRRRY!

[MrModerate]

18. Not an explosives expert but . . .

We'd be talking genuine explosives disguised as innocent toiletries. And there're thousands of explosive substances that are inert and innocent-looking until combined.

Sure there's a better way to screen this. But they haven't figured out how yet, and so are being understandably cautious. I wouldn't hold my breath, though, expecting them to come up with a sensible methodology. It's been 5 years since 9/11 and they're still floundering.

Family party let through unchecked? I don't think so. Some of these people are really seriously crazy and can't be relied upon to not blow up their own children.

[otto m]

58. TOTALLY AGREE

WOULDNT SOME OF THESE POSTERS SCREAM IF AN AIRLINER DID EXPLODE?? IM WITH YOU MR MODERATE. THE WORD IS SAFETY !

[MrModerate]

70. True -- but you have to understand . . .

The profound distrust of the administration on the part of most posters here -- myself included -- who've been lied to, bamboozled, and basically fucked over by Bush and his coteries of creeps and so believe very little that comes out of Washington.

[newyawker99]

73. Hi otto m!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[KaryninMiami]

20. Well, let's see. Toothpaste comes in "hot" flavors, lip gloss in "hot"

colors, deodorant keeps you cool when you get "hot"- so maybe when put together they become another substance?

As a frequent traveler, I'm annoyed that I can no longer carry my bottled water or my morning Starbucks through security, frankly. Ah well. It's all to keep us safe, right?

This came much earlier then I had imagined- I was thinking September or October. Guess they wanted to get a head start on primary season and take our mind of the middle east. Seems to be working quite well- the coverage has been totally hijacked from Iraq, Israel and Lebanon to people emptying their suitcases of personal gels and liquids.

[CoffeeCat]

37. Please don't judge our government...

...until you've tried the Cinnamon Blast toothpaste that Crest makes.

;)

[sistersofmercy]

22. Some chemicals in small amounts react violently with others

Not a chemicist here but from my understanding there are substances which in minute amounts can cause huge explosions. There is one and I can't recall what it is but it is a powder form I believe mixed with a common liquid. The powder is routinely kept in chemistry labs. Maybe someone else, a chemist perhaps can explain.

[Protagoras]

23. Shoes and nail clippers and anything else they can think of

not because it keeps us safe, but because it makes us afraid of our own shadows. Using common objects they teach us to fear all that is around us. They condition us to reflexively give up our freedom and to comply unthinking with authority requests no matter how absurd.

And by "They" I am not talking about the terrorists...at least not the ones they are talking about on the NEWS right now.

[hfojvt]

24. what's that oder I smell?

If an English teacher sees you write 'deoderant' his/her head might explode. :evilgrin:

[mwb970]

25. Where does it end?

We had a "shoe bomber", so now we have to take our shoes off every time we fly. Apparently this latest plot involved liquids, so now we can't bring liquids on board. What if some passenger hides explosives in his hair? Will we all have to submit to forced shampoos by TSA personnel in the security line?

It seems dumb to try to prevent every specific thing anyone has tried so far. Why don't we notice that they keep changing tactics?

[lectrobyte]

38. I've got two words for you to consider: rectal bomb

Yeah, someday we'll look back (pardon the pun) and laugh about when we used to complain about taking our shoes off before we got on the plane.

[paparush]

26. Its the containers... The containers look generic and harmless..

but these crafty terrorist would empty out the benign contents and replace them with...um...a mixture of highly vilatile liquid chemicals that, when mixed together and shaken (not stirred) errupt into a firey ball of death. These super chemicals while dangerous enough to blow up or disable a 767, are of such sophisticated manufacture that they will not eat through a common shampoo bottle.

[lala_rawraw]

29. I am trying to get answers... but

on the surface, i have to say that I share your concern.

[GardeningGal]

42. GMA had Richard Clarke on this morning explaining it.

This apparently happened in 1995 or 1996 over the Pacific where a flammable substance was smuggled in a contact lens solution bottle. The person with that, met up with others on the same plane who had other components and a crude bomb was made in the lavatory and put in the ceiling tiles. Somehow they found out about it and the pilot went back and was able to recover it. So this is something they have known about for at least 10 years. Not sure why the hubub today. Maybe GMA will post the interview on their website.

[lala_rawraw]

53. no i mean i am skeptical of the plot as a whole, not the MO

which is doable. but still trying to figure out what happened.

[shain from kane]

31. Ripley's Believe It Or Not/prisoner committed suicide with playing cards.

I don't have the reference now, but I used to have books that collected newspaper columns from Ripley's Believe It Or Not.
And there was this story that a prisoner had no hope of leaving prison alive, so he looked around his cell and fashioned a deadly device from a part of his bed, playing cards, water, and matches.

[originalpckelly]

32. Glycerin. I bet that was the explosive these terrorist were going to use.

Glycerin is present in most of the products you just listed. If you are searching for glycerin explosives, you would get hundreds of false positives from people carrying those things. (I don't know about the toothpaste, but all the others do have that in there.)

[Snivi Yllom]

39. nitroglycerin was the explosive in the 1994 Plillipines Airlines bombing

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bojinka

[CoffeeCat]

33. Sounds like a Lifetime movie...

Next thing you know, our government will expose a plan to put...SNAKES ON A PLANE!!!!!

Oh the humanity!!!!

[cbugle]

34. Like in Batman

The first one where the Joker put out those products that separately are ok but when you put them together...

[no_hypocrisy]

36. I suppose you could rub toothpaste or shampoo into eyes and

blind someone . . .

[CoffeeCat]

41. That's it!!!

They've been doing this for years to lab rabbits!

Why not the pilots!?

Again...oh the humanity!

Another terror plan thwarted! Ahhhhh...I can feel safe and cozy now.

[DemInDistress]

44. would I (or you) now be considered a terrorist if we brought

those very items on let's say the NYC Subway System? I'd like to know because I have already done this in the past. Are pharmacies and other outlets guilty of selling terroristic materials? Rite-Aid,CVS, my local supermarkets?

[Cleita]

45. Years ago I saw a show about a prisoner who was

able to make an explosive out of a deck of cards he had been given. They explained it as a combination of the chemicals the cards were made of mixed with water that created an explosive that he could blow himself out of his cell. I believe he killed himself.

Other than that, I grew up in a mining camp and the same nitrates used for dynamite and other explosives are also used for fertilizer and other household items like scouring powder. If you know how to put those things together with ordinary plumbing pipes, you can make a bomb.

[warrens]

47. The problem is that some explosives and components

Look exactly like common household products. I see their point. Someone is going to make a fortune selling makeup and hair gel etc. in small packs to disembarking passengers.

[Cleita]

65. The liquid and gels can be used as suspension agents

for the explosive chemicals. I believe that what they are looking for is a rather garden variety pipe bomb, usually made with pipes, but could be made with other cylindrical countainers like a shampoo bottle. My two cents anyway.

[myrna minx]

48. Self-defense Against Fresh Fruit

Self-defense Against Fresh Fruit



Colonel (Graham Chapman):
Get some discipline into those chaps, Sergeant Major!

Sargeant (John Cleese, shouting throughout):
Right sir! Good evening, class.

All (mumbling):
Good evening.

Sargeant:
Where's all the others, then?

All:
They're not here.

Sgt.:
I can see that. What's the matter with them?

All:
Dunno.

Chapman (member of class):
Perhaps they've got 'flu.

Sgt.:
Huh! 'Flu, eh? They should eat more fresh fruit. Ha. Right. Now, self-defence. Tonight I shall be carrying on from where we got to last week when I was showing you how to defend yourselves against anyone who attacks you with armed with a piece of fresh fruit.

(Grumbles from all)

Palin:
Oh, you promised you wouldn't do fruit this week.

Sgt.:
What do you mean?

Jones:
We've done fruit the last nine weeks.

Sgt.:
What's wrong with fruit? You think you know it all, eh?

Palin:
Can't we do something else?

Idle (Welsh):
Like someone who attacks you with a pointed stick?

Sgt.:
Pointed stick? Oh, oh, oh. We want to learn how to defend ourselves against pointed sticks, do we? Getting all high and mighty, eh? Fresh fruit not good enough for you eh? Well I'll tell you something my lad. When you're walking home tonight and some great homicidal maniac comes after you with a bunch of loganberries, don't come crying to me! Now, the passion fruit. When your assailant lunges at you with a passion fruit...

All:
We done the passion fruit.

Sgt.:
What?

Chapman:
We done the passion fruit.

Palin:
We done oranges, apples, grapefruit...

Jones:
Whole and segments.

Palin:
Pomegranates, greengages...

Chapman:
Grapes, passion fruit...

Palin:
Lemons...

Jones:
Plums...

Chapman:
Mangoes in syrup...

Sgt.:
How about cherries?

All:
We did them.

Sgt.: Red and black?

All:
Yes!

Sgt.:
All right, bananas.

(All sigh.)

Sgt.:
We haven't done them, have we? Right. Bananas. How to defend yourself against a man armed with a banana. Now you, come at me with this banana. Catch! Now, it's quite simple to defend yourself against a man armed with a banana. First of all you force him to drop the banana; then, second, you eat the banana, thus disarming him. You have now rendered him 'elpless.

Palin:
Suppose he's got a bunch.

Sgt.:
Shut up.

Idle:
Suppose he's got a pointed stick.

Sgt.:
Shut up. Right now you, Mr Apricot.

Chapman:
'Arrison.

Sgt.:
Sorry, Mr. 'Arrison. Come at me with that banana. Hold it like that, that's it. Now attack me with it. Come on! Come on! Come at me! Come at me then! (Shoots him.)

Chapman:
Aaagh! (dies.)

Sgt.:
Now, I eat the banana. (Does so.)

Palin:
You shot him!

Jones:
He's dead!

Idle:
He's completely dead!

Sgt.:
I have now eaten the banana. The deceased, Mr Apricot, is now 'elpless.

Palin:
You shot him. You shot him dead.

Sgt.:
Well, he was attacking me with a banana.

Jones:
But you told him to.

Sgt.:
Look, I'm only doing me job. I have to show you how to defend yourselves against fresh fruit.

Idle:
And pointed sticks.

Sgt.:
Shut up.

Palin:
Suppose I'm attacked by a man with a banana and I haven't got a gun?

Sgt.:
Run for it.

Jones:
You could stand and scream for help.

Sgt.:
Yeah, you try that with a pineapple down your windpipe.

Jones:
A pineapple?

Sgt.:
Where? Where?

Jones:
No I just said: a pineapple.

Sgt.:
Oh. Phew. I thought my number was on that one.

Jones:
What, on the pineapple?

Sgt.:
Where? Where?

Jones:
No, I was just repeating it.

Sgt.:
Oh. Oh. I see. Right. Phew. Right that's bananas then. Now the raspberry. There we are. 'Armless looking thing, isn't it? Now you, Mr Tin Peach.

Jones:
Thompson.

Sgt.:
Thompson. Come at me with that raspberry. Come on. Be as vicious as you like with it.

Jones:
No.

Sgt.:
Why not?

Jones:
You'll shoot me.

Sgt.:
I won't.

Jones:
You shot Mr. Harrison.

Sgt.:
That was self-defence. Now come on. I promise I won't shoot you.

Idle:
You promised you'd tell us about pointed sticks.

Sgt.:
Shut up. Come on, brandish that raspberry.
Come at me with it. Give me Hell.

Jones:
Throw the gun away.

Sgt.:
I haven't got a gun.

Jones:
You have.

Sgt.:
Haven't.

Jones:
You shot Mr 'Arrison with it.

Sgt.:
Oh, that gun.

Jones:
Throw it away.

Sgt.:
Oh all right. How to defend yourself against a redcurrant -
without a gun.

Jones:
You were going to shoot me!

Sgt.:
I wasn't.

Jones:
You were!

Sgt.:
No, I wasn't, I wasn't. Come on then. Come at me. Come on you weed! You weed, do your worst! Come on, you puny little man. You weed...

(Sgt. pulls a lever in the wall-
CRASH! a 16-ton weight falls on Jones)

Jones:
Aaagh.

Sgt.:
If anyone ever attacks you with a raspberry, just pull the lever and the 16-ton weight will fall on top of him.

Palin:
Suppose there isn't a 16-ton weight?

Sgt.:
Well that's planning, isn't it? Forethought.

Palin:
Well how many 16-ton weights are there?

Sgt.:
Look, look, look, Mr Knowall. The 16-ton weight is just one way of dealing with a raspberry killer. There are millions of others!

Idle:
Like what?

Sgt.:
Shootin' him?

Palin:
Well what if you haven't got a gun or a 16-ton weight?

Sgt.:
Look, look. All right, smarty-pants. You two, you two, come at me then with raspberries. Come on, both of you, whole basket each.

Palin:
No guns.

Sgt.:
No.

Palin:
No 16-ton weights.




Sgt.:
No.

Idle:
No pointed sticks.

Sgt.:
Shut up.

Palin:
No rocks up in the ceiling.

Sgt.:
No.

Palin:
And you won't kill us.

Sgt.:
I won't.

Palin:
Promise.

Sgt.:
I promise I won't kill you. Now. Are you going to attack me?

Palin and Idle:
Oh, all right.





Sgt.:
Right, now don't rush me this time. Stalk me. Do it properly. Stalk me. I'll turn me back. Stalk up behind me, close behind me, then in with the redcurrants! Right? O.K. start moving. Now the first thing to do when you're being stalked by an ugly mob with redcurrants is to - release the tiger!

(He does so. Growls. Screams.)

Sgt.:
The great advantage of the tiger in unarmed combat is that he eats not only the fruit-laden foe but also the redcurrants. Tigers however do not relish the peach. The peach assailant should be attacked with a crocodile. Right, now, the rest of you, where are you? I know you're hiding somewhere with your damsons and prunes. Well I'm ready for you. I've wired meself up to 200 tons of gelignite, and if any one of you so much as makes a move we'll all go up together! Right, right. I warned you. That's it...

(Explosion.)

[kentuck]

49. And don't wear any clothes with buttons on them...

Because enough explosive can be put into a button to bring down a plane. A terrorist could stand up pull off a button like it was a hand grenade and threaten the world. How far do we permit this paranoia to go? Anybody that wants to do something bad will find a way to do it if they so desire. My conclusion: the terrorists have won already.

[Catchawave]

51. credit cards can be used as a weapon....

two together can slit a throat.

[MichaelHarris]

52. McGuiver could do it. n/t

[myrna minx]

55. Can you imagine what an unholy union of McGuiver and the A-Team

would make? :scared:

[htuttle]

56. A really, really, really bad show.

[myrna minx]

62. Yeah, but I'd buy the lunch box.

:hi:

[htuttle]

64. That WOULD be one hell of a lunch box!

And just IMAGINE all the action figures you could get out of a show like that!

[MichaelHarris]

69. I pity da fool

who sits next to me and tries to light their shoes.

[kentuck]

59. The bottom part of your pants could be sewn with strong nylon....

which could be unraveled in the bathroom and used as a garrote to strangle every passenger on board a 747. No one is safe. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

71. Don't buy any strong nylon string in the near future.

Now they'll be watching you and following the pattern of your sewing notions purchases. :P

[Show_Me _The_Truth]

63. Not these items

The items they are concerned about could be placed in the containers after they are emptied.

The items that they can use can be inert in their own right, but are explosive when mixed. They can form gels, foams, and liquids.

Some of these items are EXTREMELY dangerous in small amounts. Several formulations are more potent than C4 and can be made with items commonly available in university research (and some High School) labs. Having worked in a university research lab, I can tell you that security or inventory tracking is virtually non-existent.

Some of the less potent but still dangerous items can be made with items from Home Dept and your friendly Garden Shop.

These items have advanced far past nitroglycerine.

The theory behind having people sip the items is that even though the items are non-explosive they are very toxic or caustic.

[KoKo]

68. But packaged in containers how could they be mixed...toothpaste, lip gloss

deoderant? These are semi-solid products. And how would one get them out and proceed to mix them in the Airline bathroom? I can understand how the terrorist plot with Yousef ws done with contact lens container and a trigger in his shoe..but I haven't seen anyone reporting that "contact lens solution" is on their "discard list" and the items they are targeting would seem to be odd to use to mix to create a bomb on board. If they were already mixed in the container..maybe. But getting stuff into a deoderant container (assuming it's a roll on which most folks use) would be hard to do and squeezing stuff in a toothpaste container then having to trigger it...

I guess it can all be done...but one would think that this is a little OTT since they already supposedly have a databank of "profiles" of what to look for to identify a terrorist. Subjecting the whole flying population to this kind of "seize and search" seems extreme. :shrug:

[KoKo]

74. CNN is now saying Makeup and Creams not allowed. Woman had to

throw out over a $100.00 in makeup...and I can believe this because throwing out even the most inexpensive cosmetics and creams could cost alot of money. They interviewed a couple of students who said that throwing out this stuff when you are on a tight budget is not easy...and that's true..with folks stretched thin on budgets and tickets up in price.