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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:41 AM
Original message
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.2006...

Battles leave Afghans nowhere to turn


KANDAHAR AND SARTAKHT, AFGHANISTAN Rozi Mohammad had been digging for hours and he was nowhere near finished.

I am digging because I will not leave this village like I left my home village, the 24-year-old said, his three children by his side. When the bombs come again we will hide in here.

Like hundreds of families who live in Pashmul district, Mr. Mohammad had left his home among the fertile grape fields 40 kilometres west of Kandahar city that have been the scene of some of the fiercest fighting between Canadian troops and Taliban rebels. He thought he was safer here in Sartakht village. Though still in Pashmul, it's closer to the main highway and closer to Kandahar city. He was, however, not taking any chances, and so he began digging.

The villagers in this rural area are put in an impossible position. The Taliban are forcing us to give them food and shelter and the coalition are bombing us, said Sultan Mohammad, a man of 50 with five children who also fled. We hate the Canadians and we hate the Taliban.

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Truthiness Inspector Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:46 AM
Response to Original message
1. The Taliban
put them in an impossible situation.
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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:50 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. What are the Canadians doing over there?
You think they are still chasing international terrorists around Afghanistan?

Don
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:55 AM
Response to Reply #3
7. Aren't they just helping keep the pressure on to get that pipeline
Edited on Wed Aug-09-06 02:58 AM by sfexpat2000
put in? I mean, aren't they hoping to find bin Laden golfing around Kandahar?

Free Canada.

/ack

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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:53 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. Afghanistan is an occupied nation, no?
Afghanistan is an occupied nation, no. We get rid of the Taliban we disliked and replaced with one of our own....and he is doing a good job, no?
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:57 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. We didn't get rid of the Taliban. We just redistributed them. n/t
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:04 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. I doubt even that
Most of the "rout" was probably guys turning their shirts inside out and saying, "Me? Taliban? Naw, I'm one of the Jones boys."
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:07 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. You're probably right. n/t
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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:32 AM
Response to Reply #12
26. Actually it was the color of their turbans they changed. Really
Black = Bad Taliban

Any other color = Double plus good

Don
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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:07 AM
Response to Reply #9
15. silly me I thought we freed Afghanistan from tyranny..n/t
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:09 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. How would WE know?
lol

:)
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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:18 AM
Response to Reply #17
21. LOL...let us ask our man in Afghanistan Mr. Hamid Karzai
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:25 AM
Response to Reply #21
24. Yeah, "our" man in Afghanistan.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 06:22 AM
Response to Reply #24
54. He actually advised UNICOL
same diff though.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 07:26 AM
Response to Reply #54
55. You're right. n/t
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:49 AM
Response to Original message
2. Foriegn will always be hated
Isnt is surprising that if the NATO pull out fighting stop.

Oooops Taliban now back in power.

They are the people of Afghanistan and they not going anywhere..... maybe to their grave but they NOT GOING ANYWHERE else.

Russia learn this hard truth.

NATO or any do gooder countries that think they there for good cause better think again.
You there fighting the people.
What the heck for.
So you get to give them their Democracy, Liberty and Freedom.
You do not need guns and bombs for that
You give them job food and peace
You give them chance to rebuild their future.
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Truthiness Inspector Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:53 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Would you like to live under the Taliban?
Would ANYONE want to live that way?

You say "give" them the chance to build their future, as if that can happen on a keyboard.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:57 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. (It's pretty much a given that most governments which
people develop on their own are better than anything America imposes on them.)

(And, before 9/11, the Taliban were our allies.)
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Truthiness Inspector Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:58 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. So you would prefer to live under the Taliban?
Get real. If you did, you wouldn't be able to post at all.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:06 AM
Original message
The point is, America only manages to make bad situations
Edited on Wed Aug-09-06 03:10 AM by sfexpat2000
ten times worse.

As for myself, I'd join those women who work underground. They never have stopped -- Russians, Taliban, Americans, whoEVER.

/-n
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:24 AM
Response to Original message
23. These guys are so desparate
They trying so hard to create a reality.

They really no looking at the result of their reality

And they do not realiase how dangerous this reality is to them or their future generations.

What is so important to them is that they must be right.
So maybe they so weak that they cannot bring them to admit that they could be wrong.
Really sad to see them suffering so much.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:29 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. It's just weird after a while. Like someone rushing INTO
Edited on Wed Aug-09-06 03:31 AM by sfexpat2000
a burning building.

:shrug:

/oops
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:41 AM
Response to Reply #25
28. He talks like he expert on muslims
:rofl: I am from a Muslims country

Gee you can walk in Malaysia and say you a gay and everyone just give you a smile that is all.

It is really strange to think that woman in muslim country are downtrodden lots.

Gee Maybe they should just google members of parliments for all the muslim country
Then sit down and try figure out how they got there :rofl:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:47 AM
Response to Reply #28
30. Sorry, Everybody. We Tried Really Hard.
:)
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:51 AM
Response to Reply #30
32. Dont worry
I watch the mass media too.
They do try damn hard to paint a picture
But they do not yet realiase that they going to alienate a very big customers base.

As a business concern is you keep selling snakeoil you end up losing all your customers.
If CNN goes on this way they digging their own grave.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:53 AM
Response to Reply #32
34. Our newspapers lose subscribers every quarter except the NYT
and they only pick up a few, last time I saw a report.

People are catching on.
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:15 AM
Response to Reply #34
41. Haha lastest trend indicated in US
media study habit.
That people watching TV not buying goods.

In simple language, you means I spend so much in TV advertising and customer not buying my products.

So does it mean that TV advertising not working?
People now spend less?
Or less people watch TV?

I think less people watching TV because of all the garbage they spewing.

However they better wake up to trend cause if they do nothing they can all kiss their advertising revenue goodbye.

The respected mass media are losing support. Yes they are the mass media. But they still a product. When you start selling snakeoil for news customer leave. Maybethe mass media do not want to be leader anymore cause they themself to blame for selling snakeoil. So consumer now look for different source for news. In the end REALITY IS A BITCH.
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:08 AM
Response to Reply #10
16. What make you think they do not have internet
Gee you dumb like little frog living under coconut shell.

:rofl:

You seriously need to go out more visit all the nice places in the world and learn.

They even have traffic jam and rush hour jam :rofl:
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:02 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. If the people dont want to them fight them
They been living under the Taliban before after the long war with Russia. There was peace then.

There always has been Muslim countries in this world.
They been around for a long time.
They have skyscaper.
They have healthcare.
They have their mosque.
They can even buy up Americans company or share.

And so you look at yourself and think you superior to them
Like they do not have brains.
And they so bloody poor and always suffering under oppresive leaders.

The world is changing. You can go live in your bubble with you little image of what reality is.

But when you try to make it like it is real. You create a monster.
And that monster one day will visit you.
Then your bubble will burst and you say WHAT HAVE WE DONE?

You just hold on tie to the ideas, support it you small pathetic thoughts with all you might.

BUT REALITY IS A BITCH.
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Truthiness Inspector Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:06 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. Strange
I've been to a Muslim country, the United Arab Emirates, and no one beat me down as a woman. It's very open, for the most part.

We are talking about the TALIBAN. How you can you support such an oppressive regime, unless treating women like shit is your cup of tea?
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:11 AM
Response to Reply #13
19. Hello
please look at rape statistic in US and Afghanistan.

You want to talk about mistreating woman.

You been drinking to many kool aid.

Why dont you try going there and rape a woman.

Maybe you find out how harsh they really are about protecting the dignity of their women folks.

Seriously you cannot look at a one side issue.
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Truthiness Inspector Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:14 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. Good night
The Taliban is great, best thing that ever happened. Unreal.
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:19 AM
Response to Reply #20
22. Haha
:rofl:

Goodnight.

Well talk before I am well aware of your talking points.

Any success with convert so far.
How many DUer you driven nuts so far?
How many can claim that you successful chase off?
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Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:00 AM
Response to Reply #20
39. Strawman much? Pfft!
Yeah, UNREAL is the word, alright.

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pelsar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:48 AM
Response to Reply #19
31. the dignity of women under the taliban....
Edited on Wed Aug-09-06 03:48 AM by pelsar
i dont believe there was ever a more primitive/violent/pathetic group worst than the taliban in modern history:

forbidding females to get an education

made to wear "potatoe sacks"

stoned to death for infractions


shot to death in stadiums as "enterainment with a message"

the list is endless...and for those that defend such monsters...such twisted mentality....
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:56 AM
Response to Reply #31
36. If one want to pick a certain incidents
and say that it is representaive of the entire country I have nothing much to say :rofl:

They need to be a country full of saints to meet your standard.

I can point to incidents in US and paint the same picture.

Thats pretty easy.

The reason they are news is that it is a rare event. :rofl:
As if everyday happening is news :rofl:

Good spin good result good propoganda BAD REALITY CREATION.
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pelsar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:32 AM
Response to Reply #36
45. yes look at the laws of the land...
not particluar incidents-those are the LAWS...

...so as i understand you defend the taliban and they're way of life?

perhaps you can explain how forbidding females from getting an education is a good thing?...lets start with that....
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:58 AM
Response to Reply #31
37. It's not necessary to defend the wretched Taliban to
object to American "intervention" which only makes the Taliban look good in comparison.

Oh dear.
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Oversea Visitor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:35 AM
Response to Reply #37
47. It is the mindset
To me when I read the post of this people it is like they live on different planet.

When one look at their words is like all the male there hate their woman degrade them.
Do not love them like wife and daughters.

But human are humans and humans here no different from humans anywhere.
If those picture of grieving men do not make connection to them when thier families killed what can one say.
Mother do not cry less, father do not cry less. All human we get hurt when our family get hurt.

Sad...no?

And finally the saddest of all

The Taliban and Afghanistan was attack because of OBL.
But till today not prove of OBL guilt.
Infact FBI position is clear on this.

But the reality is Agfhanistan today.
What have we allow to happen.
Why are we still allowing this to go on.
What has the Taliban done to deserve all this.

IF OBL cannot be proven to be responsible for 911
Then what do we call what happen to Afghanistan? ...... Oooops a mistake?

This many around the world see.
bush fuck up more then you guys think.

He spin but WE WANT PROVE or US wear this taint forever.
This is world HISTORY.
You can rewrite the history in US but you cannot rewrite history around the world.
This little dirt ball we call earth same dirt ball where US is.
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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:44 AM
Response to Reply #5
29. until OBN "attacked us" on 9/11 we had no problem with such
dreadful government...infact we had no problem with them when their officials visit with George and Ken Lay in Taxes.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:55 AM
Response to Reply #29
35. We didn't even blink when they ate the zoo!
You have to laugh because, there are so few other alternatives. lol
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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:12 AM
Response to Reply #35
40. the "zoo"? you mean the rescue of a Lion in Afghanistan...
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:23 AM
Response to Reply #40
42. No, I mean they ate exotic animals and tortured the rest.
This link only says "warriors ate rabbits" but the Taliban leaders ATE exotic animals in the zoo.

http://www.planetark.com/dailynewsstory.cfm/newsid/1352...
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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:25 AM
Response to Reply #42
43. I beg to differ
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:31 AM
Response to Reply #43
44. Your article says animals were eaten n/t
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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:45 AM
Response to Reply #44
48. I am aware the artice
"Most of the animals have died, been killed, or been eaten, according to Dr. Jones, who visited the zoo in 1988."

Indeed, but there is no proof these animals were eating by humans. Again, the irony is that Talibans and their control of Afghanistan cared for these animals before the US attack of Afghanistan, whilst the attacking nation has the responsibility to care for all human, and animals involved, the occupying forced cared not....we saw that in Iraq as well.
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:58 AM
Response to Reply #48
49. Taliban didn't care for the animals
The zookeepers complained about how Taliban soldiers tormented and killed animals for sport. I'll cede that the US invasion left the animals suffering from neglect, but I'm not interested in letting those Taliban miscreants off the hook for what they did.

http://www.rawa.org/zoo2.htm
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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 05:09 AM
Response to Reply #49
50. Here's better read, and I hope we agree
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 06:08 AM
Response to Reply #50
51. Sorry, can't say I do
That document is about the efforts of NGOs (primarily international) to create a dependable and comprehensive veterinary care system for livestock, not zoo animals. Their work spanned the years of the warlord factions, through the Taliban, and after. What they did was largely independent of whoever had purview at the time. So again, the Taliban did not care for or protect the animals of the Kabul zoo.
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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 06:13 AM
Response to Reply #51
52. I beg to differ, Sir. Did you take time to read the entire document?
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 06:15 AM
Response to Reply #52
53. Yes
I read it all.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #50
56. This article doesn't speak to the acts of the thuggery in the Taliban.
Seems they were very comfortable terrorizing animals as well as people.
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Bombtrack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 02:55 AM
Response to Original message
6. Didn't read the article but I blame Nickelback
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AlamoDemoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:11 AM
Response to Reply #6
18. lol...Nicleback?...you mean the canadian rock group? I guess ama mistaken
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Dead_Parrot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:52 AM
Response to Reply #6
33. You mean Bryan Adams, surely
Edited on Wed Aug-09-06 03:54 AM by Dead_Parrot
The are un-contacted tribes of pygmies in the Congo who hate Bryan Adams.

Especialy that f--ing Robin Hood song. Makes me want to wipe out Canada myself...
:nuke:
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ShrewdlyDone Donating Member (39 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:37 AM
Response to Original message
27. Well... its complex
Since there are some Afghans that are ok, and some that are the reason we make bullets and bombs... just telling the difference most of the time is the hard part... and it cannot be done from a plane.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 03:59 AM
Response to Reply #27
38. What? There were no Afghans hijacking planes on 9/11.
:wtf:
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Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-09-06 04:35 AM
Response to Original message
46. OMFG, that man sounds like my parents 40 years ago in Viet Nam
"We hate the Americans, and we hate the Viet Cong."
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