Israel is withdrawing its Ambassador to Venezuela

[theHandpuppet]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5254882.stm

Israel withdraws Venezuela envoy

Israel is withdrawing its ambassador to Venezuela as a row grows between the two countries over the war in Lebanon.

At the weekend President Hugo Chavez recalled his envoy to Israel and described the Jewish state's campaign in Lebanon as a "new genocide".

On Monday Israel said it would be flying its ambassador back for "consultations".

The BBC correspondent in Caracas says the row marks an all-time low in relations between the two governments.... MORE

[Nikki Stone 1]

1. What do you think about this, HP?

I'm not sure what it means.

[theHandpuppet]

4. All for show, methinks

I don't believe the two countries are much in the way of trading partners or that would affect "business" at all. Perhaps it's an attempt to further isolate Chavez and Venezuela, but Israel is doing a lot of isolating all on its own.

Now, more seriously, we have similar situation which just occured between India and Pakistan. THAT makes me nervous, not this.

[Nikki Stone 1]

8. India and Pakistan scare the crap out of me too.

I have to say, though, that sometimes Chavez just likes to shake it up.

[theHandpuppet]

10. Agreed!

Which is why, whether or not I agree with him all the time, it's amusing to watch a single hornet causing so much ruckus in the barnyard.

[theHandpuppet]

11. Nikki, I was ill-informed

I think folks might find this of interest for any number of reasons which will be clear if one reads the whole article -- and I would highly suggest reading the ENTIRE article.

http://coanews.org/tiki-read_article.php?articleId=1143

This was dated July 28 but apparently flew right under the radar of the American media.

[magellan]

38. Mm-hm!

"Trade pact with Israel – Mercosur leaders were expected to sign trade accords with Cuba, Pakistan, and Israel. Human rights organizations and Islamic groups in Argentina had requested that the nations suspend the trade negotiations with Israel until Israel suspends attacks against civilians in Lebanon. The Mercosur nations refused to sign the accord and signed an official document calling for a cease fire and end to the attack against Lebanon."

Thank you, Handpuppet!

[MercutioATC]

2. Israel and Venezuela relations at an "all-time low"? Whatever will we do?

:eyes:

[Erika]

3. Venezuela has oil we depend on

Israel doesn't.

[Selatius]

5. And we helped attack Venezuela's elected gov't, so...

we've pretty much burned our bridges a long time ago with respect to getting preferential treatment unless you happen to be one of the poor Citgo made deals to sell oil to for cheap, or you happen to be one of the victims of Katrina who were airlifted out by officials of Citgo/PDVSA who were sent there by Chavez to evacuate NOLA and other damaged areas. It was he and Al Gore and several others who deserve credit for what they did.

[jerry611]

9. But Israel has political power in the US....Hugo Chavez does not

The political landscape in America is so split that the Jewish vote could change entire election and could change the balance of power in congress either way.

Chavez, even with his oil, has no power in the United States. If Chavez cuts off his oil, we simply buy more from the Saudis. The price may be more, but it won't do anything to the economy.

[Erika]

13. Chavez is gaining political power here

Big time.

[jerry611]

14. No he isn't

Maybe among far-leftists but that makes up what...10% of the electorate at best?

I've met maybe a half-dozen people from Venezuela over the past few years. Every one of them hates Hugo. I have yet to meet a Venezuelan that has immigrated here that favors Chavez or thinks highly of him.

And then he going around making friends with Kim Jong Ill and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad? What's up with that? Are you saying that you support those two clowns? Them two are trying to start world war 3!

He's turning into the next Fidel Castro. He's making friends with America's enemies. That's what Castro did after he came to power. It's a gamble that he played with JFK, and he's still paying for the loss. I doubt Chavez will be any more successful.

[Selatius]

20. Chavez has oil we desperately need. Castro never had that advantage.

If Chavez has any influence, then it's that oil that will give him leverage.

[jerry611]

21. Chavez though doesn't have a Soviet Union to protect him

Without the Soviets, JFK would not have even hesitated a moment to invade Cuba and remove the missiles.

Who is going to protect Chavez if Iran is blown to hell by Israel? North Korea?

[Selatius]

22. Chavez doesn't need anybody to protect Venezuela

Those jungles are good enough for guerrilla warfare for anybody willing to invade and repeat Viet Nam.

[jerry611]

27. We wouldn't need to take over the country....

Venezuela's oil is mostly offshore or just a little ways inland. We cut that off and Venezuela's economy falls into pieces. In fact, many of Hugo's oil refineries are in the Gulf of Mexico. And Hugo has no Navy to protect them.

Also add in the fact that Columbia and Peru hasn't been getting along well with Hugo. In fact Columbia has moved at a lot of it's military assets to the Venezuelan border. And earlier this year Peru accused Venezuela of interfering in their political campaigns. So Hugo isn't exactly the most popular kid on the block right now.

[Selatius]

29. I don't see it as likely, the US is overstretched in Iraq as it is

We've got a ton of problems in the Middle East that need addressing before we add to the plate.

[jerry611]

34. Who said anything about it being right now?

We are talking 10 years from now. And believe me, in 10 years, this world is going to be one really f-ed up place.

Plus if Iran is nuked, there is going to be one hell of a jihad against Israel. It may be best for us to tip-toe our way out of there.

[eridani]

39. If they are affluent enough to move here, of course they hate him

The poor majority that can't afford travel has a different opinion.

[KaptBunnyPants]

40. He's like Castro except for the whole elected thing...

That must really piss you neo-liberals off. No matter how much you vilify Chavez, the people who benefit from his rule support him. The last thing you want is for mainstream America to wake up and realize that they have options too, because outside of your wealthy far right enclaves no one in this country supports free trade, exploitation and slavery.

[Mr_Spock]

32. lol

It does seem silly on it's face, no?

[NobleCynic]

43. Here here

Not to demean the conflict in the middle east, but in regards to this. Woot? It's kind of like hearing of a diplomatic hissy fit between Guam and the Netherlands. What horrors! What horrors!

[Endangered Specie]

6. Well, this just keeps getting more interesting...

[theHandpuppet]

7. BTW, folks, please do not recommend this thread!

I ask this because I also posted this info to LBN and I don't wish to duplicate one topic on the greatest page. If you feel this is worthy of a recommendation, could you please post it on LBN instead? Thanks and sorry for any confusion I may have caused.

[theHandpuppet]

12. Um... I think I need some sleep

It would appear my post to LBN was a dupe anyway. The other thread already has six recommendations so this news will certainly make it to the greatest page anyway.

Night, all. Even coffee has its limits. :boring:

[dweller]

16. the power of recs have no boundries. n/t

:kick:

dp

[SoCalDem]

15. Boo-Hoo...

I think they need to do some regrouping, so it may be a good idea to call all the ambassadors home for some consultation..

[Pachamama]

17. That's not the real reason - the real reason is because Israel is going to

nuke the shit out of Iran soon and because Chavez has promised to aid Iran, Israel knows they better get the hell out of Caracas now before they are in danger there.

[Selatius]

18. Yes, that's why I suspect he visited Iran, since they both are OPEC states

If a war is launched against Iran, I have a hunch Chavez will stop oil shipments to the US until a ceasefire is called. No oil for the war machine.

[Pachamama]

24. Imagine, two of the biggest suppliers and oil reserve countries shutting

down shipments of oil (both by choice and by shipment cut off through war and the Gulf being blockaded)....imagine for a minute the price of oil on the world market...imagine the effects across the board...not a pretty picture for anyone....China wouldn't be happy either.... :eyes:

[evox]

19. Nuke the shit out of Iran?

They can't even nuke the shit out of a guerilla made up of a few thousand people armed with semi-ancient weapons. I think not.

[Pachamama]

23. So you think that Israel does not possess nuclear arms?

Just because dropping a bunch of bombs and daisy cutters from their planes while they bomb Lebanon into the stoneage while trying to supposedly destroy a group of a few thousand guerillas, doesn't mean that they don't have the ability tommorrow to do that to Iran or Lebanon....

[evox]

26. Never mind what weapons they got...

hence the point I made about cannot destroy their enemy which is right next door. I do agree that they have the power to Destroy homes, cities, civilians, innocent women and children, yes. But getting rid of guerillas, no. So how are they supposed to get rid of Iran? It's irrational to think that they will.

[Pachamama]

33. Why get rid of Iran? I said nuke the shit out of them...

The goal isn't to get rid of Iran...its to unleash chaos and to eventually have the US in charge of the oil supplies and the Israelis feeling as if they are safe from everyone who wants to destroy them. I guess if one thinks about it, Israel will not sleep until every single person that they think is a threat to their existence is gone. So, if it means bombing/nuking the shit out of everyone, what would stop them? And if some women, children and innocent civilians are in the way, I guess that is just the fault of the bad guys because they were hiding amongst civilians at different points in time, so they are just collateral damage. If the cause is just, then they are justified right?

[The Magistrate]

30. There Is Not A Chance, Ma'am

Of Israel launching a nuclear first strike against Iran, certainly not anytime soon.

[Pachamama]

31. Don't be so sure....

That is a bet, I don't want to make, not because I think your right and I'm wrong, but rather because I pray it ain't so....

[The Magistrate]

35. One Can Be As Sure Of That, Ma'am, As Of Tomorrow's Sunrise

[Pachamama]

36. Is the sunrise there if no one can see it?

:hi:

[The Magistrate]

37. Yes, Ma'am

And a tree falling in a forest always creates the vibration in air some sensory equipment detects as "sound", whether any such sensory equipement is present or not.

[KaptBunnyPants]

41. I hope that you are right.

The only thing I see that would stop them is Pakistan, otherwise why not? Arabs are proving resistant to normal methods of intimidation, and Israel has a far right government and nuclear weapons just gathering dust. They have shown a willingness to preform preemptive strikes before, why would you assume that they would wait to be attacked first now?

[The Magistrate]

42. Pakistan Would Not Defend Iran, Sir

To the peoples of the Kush and the Indus valley, Persians are old imperial conquerors and hated foes of long standing.

This sort of apocalyptic dream simply is not going to come true.

[SensibleAmerican]

25. Good for them

Venezuela has become the new Argentina.

[evox]

28. or maybe it's just

sticking to its roots as a South American country.

[EstimatedProphet]

44. How?