Anderson Cooper just said a C-130

[Suich]

is the only plane that can land at the bombed-out Beirut airport. Those planes are huge. Anybody know what he meant?

:shrug:

One was in Seattle yesterday for Seafair! They called it Hercules!

[bloom]

1. There are some planes that land by going straight down

without a runway - is that it?

[Aviation Pro]

8. Nope....

...that would be a VSTOL aircraft (such as the Harrier or the F-35), not a cargo plane.

[beam me up scottie]

9. No, that's a Harrier.

And awesome it is.

[Aviation Pro]

15. The best way to turn JP-8 into noise....

...lol

[Recursion]

67. You obviously never rode an Osprey

As a pilot told me: "V-22: because helo insertions just aren't dangerous enough yet"

[nealmhughes]

40. I used to see those Harriers take off at the Royal Naval Station

at Faslane. There would be a sudden motion on the other side of the hill from the Holy Loch, then a very loud boom, and there it was, going straight upwards...I pitied the fool who messed with the RN in one of those things...

[beam me up scottie]

53. I wish I had been able to see that.

I've always been fascinated by them.

[Ready4Change]

14. You're thinking of a Harrier.

And while it can land vertically, it wants a clean, hard surface. It's jet engines will tear up weak surfaces, and the engines don't like debris.

Helicopters would work ok, but they don't carry a 130's load, nor get it there as quick.

[JesterCS]

63. V-22 Offsprey as well, but its still conceptual i believe n/t

[Recursion]

68. Not "conceptual" so much as "abandoned after multiple deaths"

Until Iraq, the V-22 was DoD's favorite way of killing Marines.

[Phoonzang]

2. C-130s can land on a very short runway

And takeoff in a very short distance. They're meant to be used in warzones where there are no long, paved runways.

[Major Hogwash]

3. Really? I thought C-130's were huge planes.

How short of a runway can they land on?

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

10. They are largish, but not enormous.

You might be thinking of a C-17 or a C-5, which are very big. A C-130 is a 4-engine turboprop that was designed back in the late '50s to land on short or unimproved airstrips. Means the Beirut airport is badly damaged if nothing else can land there.

[BrotherBuzz]

58. C-17 are pretty small, are you thinking of the C141?

C-17's are often affectionately called an SST (short stubby thing). C-17's are four engine jets designed to do a lot of the C-130's tasks and don't require a long runway, although an 'unimproved airstrips' might present a problem.

[Kingshakabobo]

69. The jet-assisted take-off(JATO) helps for short-field take-off!

[MercutioATC]

16. I believe you're thinking of the C-5.

The C-130 can land on an 1150' runway empty...2020' fully loaded.

[Aviation Pro]

20. Center, TRACON, Tower or FSS?

Inquiring minds want to know. Also, how are the negotiations going? Administrator Blakely skirted the issue at Oshkosh.

[MercutioATC]

34. Cleveland Center. Negotiations are over...they won.

They declared impasse and sent it to Congress. Of course, Congress refused to address it. The FAA imposes its contract as soon as they get their managers trained...probably with the start of the new fiscal year on October 1.

We're not happy campers.


Thanks for the inquiry...Aviation Pro...what company?

[Aviation Pro]

36. No company right now, just a lowly IP.....

...I do the simulator side of our company.

One of our dispatchers just departed for Oak City and he was not happy (he drew Miami Center). I think that user fees are going to be imposed on GA and biz-av in the near future and with the introduction of VLJs I will probably ground myself in the ensuing madness as scud running becomes the norm.

[MercutioATC]

38. ATC is not a fun place to be right now.

Between hiring the man who ran American into the ground (Russ Chew) as a COO and some of the new policies, it's a pain in the ass...but I still love the job itself.

I think you're right about user fees, but it'll be 4-5 years before that happens. Keep flying...we need all of the good pilots we can get. Some of these rookies don't have a clue...

[TahitiNut]

37. Yes.... but NOT fully loaded.

The C-130 is a 'heavy-lifter' - which means it's designed provide massive lift and high power in order to carry the loads. Thus, without a full load it's able to lift off and land in amazingly short distances.

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

51. A C-130 landed on an aircraft carrier

Is that short enough for you?




Here's a description of the event, including videos.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

4. Delete-dupe

[Aviation Pro]

5. In spite of its size a C-130

...can land on a relatively short, unimproved runway. The camber change induced with full flap extension makes it an ideal short landing aircraft. I believe it has blown air over the wings, which aids lift on approach and allows for a slower airspeed to touchdown. An even better choice, however, would be the C-17 which can stop in 2000' of runway.

[beam me up scottie]

13. I used to love watching them take off and land.

They were so huge, they looked like they were moving in slow motion.

[Aviation Pro]

17. That's an optical illusion based on relative size....

...same thing applies to C-5s, C-141s, and 747s.

[charlie]

24. C-5s are impossible

Everytime I've seen one in flight, I've gotten a twinge in my gut that said RUN, that thing's coming straight down now, Ka-WHOOMPH! That huge stumpy blubbery thing just doesn't look right hanging in midair.

[beam me up scottie]

27. YES!

They used to fly right over the interstate on their way down, it was amazing.

[bluedog]

6. hope something lands there

they are trying to starve the people out..........and the need for medical..food .....gas........is getting critical

[Ready4Change]

7. Maybe only military cargo carrier.

130's don't need much runway. There are plenty of planes that need even less, but they won't carry a 130's load.

Although the C-17 aint no slouch on landing in a short distance. But maybe the C-130s aren't so heavy that they'll further damage a weakened runway?

[Buck Turgidson]

11. Capable of short takeoffs and landings from unprepared runways,

C-130 have powerful engines, lots of tires, and stout airframes

[Aviation Pro]

12. And great crews....

...don't forget about the crews.

[Buck Turgidson]

18. Oh, yes! The crews are special.

May 23, 1969, a drunken U.S. Air Force crew chief started up a C-130E, 63-7789, c.n. 3856, of the 36th Tactical Airlift Squadron at RAF Lakenheath and took off in it. He crashed into the English Channel off Alderney shortly thereafter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C-130

[Aviation Pro]

23. I could point out dozens of stupid human tricks in every endeavor...

...in my experience every airman I've ever met has been the epitome of professionalism. But what the hell do I know.

[Buck Turgidson]

32. I'm sure that you are right.

Hell, I can't even spell epitomie.

[Suich]

21. I never forget about the crews, AP!

:hi:

[alfredo]

19. They don't need a long runway and depart and arrive at very

steep angles. They can take off unassisted from an aircraft carrier. Looks like it can land unassisted too.

http://www.airspacemag.com/ASM/Web/Site/QT/HercOff.html

[Aviation Pro]

30. There is only one incidence of a Hercules landing and departing.....

...from a carrier and it was only a test. Ultimately it proved untenable and the tests were abandoned.

[alfredo]

47. You can't store many of those on a carrier. Still it is

interesting to see such a rare event.

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

22. Well, that is utter crap, because there are

lots of planes with shorter roll outs than C-130's'


Piper Cubs

Harriers

Helicopters

c-47's

et cetera

[Aviation Pro]

26. Yeah but among these, how many can deliver the kind of payload....

...that a Hercules is capable of?

(Side amusing note: Piper Cub = kite with fan).

[jrd200x]

29. None. a Cub is 2 people and fuel.

A C130 is tons of people and cargo.

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

49. My post was meant to be humorous

for those who may have missed it.

[jrd200x]

28. yeeeeeaaa. Those are tiny planes though. The 130 is big.

and it's a prop plane.

The 130s strength is in lift and short field performance. It has four prop engines.

[Aviation Pro]

35. And lotsa wake turbulence behind them....

...everytime I fly behind a Coast Guard C-130, I get real vigilant about staying above them and landing well beyond their touchdown point. I take tower's advice, "caution, extreme wake turbulence," verrrrrrry seriously.

[jrd200x]

25. I've flown on them - it's both the plane and the technique that makes it

possible.

The plane can land on short runways, and ha huge tires. It's somewhat "high wing" so can land on rough landing strips. It was designed to land on temporary stips during the vietnamese war.

The military pilots use a special landing technique where they "circle down" to a landng in a spiral to avoid rocket fire from outside the airport. Again, something the plane ws designed to do.

[dorktv]

31. Only plane Israel will recognize that does not belong to Hezbollah

so they do not accidently bomb it.

Although if Hezbollah does have such planes then I am really scared.

[Suich]

41. I think that's why they haven't been able to use

helicopters or small planes...they'd get shot down.

:hi:

[dorktv]

48. See that is something I was wondering about...why not just helicopter

in food and supplies and helicopter the injured out but then again...with all the bombs blowing up...

[theHandpuppet]

33. So why aren't we using them for aid relief?

Just wondering.

[Suich]

39. They're going to, according to Anderson Cooper.

That's why I was wondering how they could land in Beirut. He named 2 things they would be bringing....the only one I can remember is blankets.

:hi:

[theHandpuppet]

42. Blankets in August?

Yeah, that'll really help. If I were the Lebanese I'd have them checked for smallpox first.

[Suich]

43. I think blankets help a lot if you are injured

or in shock.

:shrug:

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

52. There are mountains there too

and I don't think it is that warm up there

[Posteritatis]

56. Ever been at altitude, or directly on a coast? (n/t)

[Selatius]

45. Israel hasn't yet given assurances they won't shoot aircraft down

This is why groups like the Red Cross are lamenting the fact that Israel destroyed the roads and bridges because they don't want to fly in Red Cross cargo planes without assurances Israel won't shoot them down.

[TheWraith]

66. Now if we wanted to make some friends in the region...

We'd be offering US military escorts for ICRC aid flights in and out of Lebanon.

[NNN0LHI]

44. I notice Anderson Cooper is embedded with the IDF now too

I wonder if Anderson Cooper has ever been to Iraq?

Don

[Suich]

46. He's been to Somalia, Bosnia, Rwanda, and Sri Lanka.

If you pm me, I'll send you his book...it's just sitting on a table here.

susan

[NNN0LHI]

50. I appreciate the offer but my eyes are getting so poor about the only...

...think I can read is a computer monitor with the fonts set to huge.

I try reading a paper every day but I have to squint and close one eye to see anything up close. Distance is no problem. Just close stuff. I have to have my wife tighten up the little screws in my glasses.

Getting older isn't no fun.

Again thank you very much for the offer and take care.

Don

[Monk06]

54. Could it be the AC 130 ????????

http://www.globalaircraft.org/planes/ac-130_spectre.pl

Just sayin.............

[Suich]

55. Anderson Cooper said C-130.

Is it raining there yet?

:hi:

[Monk06]

57. Anderson Cooper doesn't know a C 130 from a moped. It's the same aircraft

The Spectre is the nastiest worst kept secret
of the US military.

It is an area acquisition weapon system, meaning
anything below it within it's target radius is
eliminated. Check the spec. It delivers 100,000
rounds of 50 cal, a hundred rounds of the 105 mm
is delivered by a high recycling computer guided
howitzer.

Two mini guns two electric 20mil cannon and it can
deliver an hour and a half of continuous fire in
one mission.

If you think Spectres aren't being landed in Beirut
you're a bit naive.

[muriel_volestrangler]

59. If you think "Spectres" are being landed in Beirut, you're war crazy

Beirut airport is in Lebanon, and under control of the Lebanese government. What on earth makes you think they suddenly have a heavily-armed American plane? The USA isn't providing Lebanon with the means to attack Israel, for gods' sake. The use of C-130s, however, a cargo plane widely used around the world, especially on short runways as many people have said, isn't at all surprising. Unarmed, it's a C130, and Cooper is correct to call it that.

[Monk06]

64. Not war crazy just a bit pessimistc and cynical about this war ......

The Spectre is flying regular missions in Iraq
on the Syrian border which depresses me because
it's a murder machine.

But your right I is unlikely that US aircraft
are operating in Lebanon ........ for now.

[Suich]

70. Does that mean I'm not a "bit naive?"

:shrug:

[Monk06]

71. OK, I'm sorry. You're not naive

:blush:

[Zhade]

60. Hey, that's my dad's old unit.

AFSOC, 24 years retired as a Master Sergeant. 16th SOS Ghost Riders.

Those planes have unfortunately been used to kill civilians.

[Ganja Ninja]

61. C130's have actually landed and taken off from an aircraft carrier.

They only did it once to see if it was possible. After that they decided it was too dangerous.

[malaise]

62. The first aircraft that landed

at Beirut airport since the Israeli bombing was from Jordan. They were military aircraft but I don't know what make.

[ThomWV]

65. Those Things Are The Boxcars Of The Military - They Can Land Anywhere

Well, not anywhere, but they can land in places you would not immagine possible.

[vapidave]

72. C-130 specifications

They are pretty durable planes, you can see the specifications here.

[Suich]

73. Welcome to DU, vapidave! First post!!!

:party: :bounce: :toast: :bounce: :party:

Love, Mom