A Win-Win Solution: Change Israel's Name to Something Else.

[IdaBriggs]

The folks who don't want "Israel" to exist "win" because its got a new name, and then the inhabitants of the region can do a "one person/one vote" thingy where they install a new government that represents everyone.

Granted, its not a religious theocracy for either side, but its got possibilities.

My two cents on the middle east disaster. :)

[ComerPerro]

1. Actually, changing the name would end a lot of confusion

on behalf of the over-the-top pro-Israel people.

I think a lot of them confuse todays Israel with instances of the word "Israel" in the Bible.

[liberal N proud]

3. Exactly - they all call it the promised land

The feel the need to force the prophecy

[IdaBriggs]

8. I agree. It was a brilliant marketing ploy to name the country Israel

in the first place -- most people think its been around for thousands of years thanks to a lack of basic reading comprehension.

[cali]

2. Actually, it has no possibilities

except for genocide of one group or another. Not to mention that neither Palestinians nor israelis want to live together in one country.

Not much of a solution.

[IdaBriggs]

7. Wow -- and yet they did it for thousands of years!

The middle east used to be the only "safe" place for those "Jesus Killers" (sarcasm) to live where they were allowed to own land, have a profession, and live in peace. European countries were anti-Semite to the point of murder. Remember the three big things that happened in Spain in 1492? 1) Columbus discovers the New World, 2) Granada is back under Spanish control, and 3) all Jews are ordered out of the country, leading directly to the Inquisition.

Personally, I don't want to live in a country with Religious Right Wing Wacko Republicans, but somehow, it still kind of works out.

[cali]

9. Actually,

Jews and Christians lived under a two tiered system under the Ottoman Empire in Palestine. Of course it was better than the violent bigotry that erupted so often in European countries, but it's simply a myth to suggest that there was equality for non-Muslims.

But that's hardly the point. This isn't 1550 or 1750. Conditions have changed. Hatred has grown. A one state solution would lead to something unthinkable at this time. And the hubris of people ignoring what Palestinians and Israelis clearly want, is somewhat amusing. Polls clearly indicate that they don't want a one state solution. Who are you to try and dictate to them?

[IdaBriggs]

15. Polls also clearly indicate they don't want to die. Or sectarian violence

Hatreds come and go -- ask our friends "the Germans" and "the Japanese" -- and since the only other alternative appears to be ethnic cleansing, perhaps it is something that ought to be considered.

Also, the current two tiered system -- Israel citizens and Others -- doesn't appear to be working for the majority of the people of the region. While the elite folks (currently the Israelis?) might not have a problem, history shows its not a good long term lifestyle choice.

And, as for your question about who I am -- LOL! I'm someone who is trying to help find a solution so that people can live without fear of having their families blown up. Please note that I said PEOPLE, because I don't care what religion your ancestors followed, I don't want your children to die because of it. Do you have a problem with that?

[azurnoir]

10. Does anyone know

if there has been any testing of mitochondrial DNA between the two groups, Jews and Palestinians? Both groups claim to be native to the area. The mitochondrial testing could give a clue as to which really group is native
If such tests were,I bet I know what they will find.
edited for spelling

[cali]

11. Are you talking

about Jews in general or Israelis?

[azurnoir]

18. Both

There is no difference between Jews in Israel and Jews else except that in Israel there is a cross section so to speak that might not exist elsewhere, compared to the non-Jewish population that was living in Palestine.

[megatherium]

17. No one seriously doubts that the ancestors of modern Jews are

native to Palestine. The archaelogical evidence is abundant and overwhelming that the territory was Jewish until late antiquity -- for example, the Dead Sea Scrolls include well-preserved copies of books of the Hebrew Bible (these date to the first century CE).

[rock]

4. We could call it "Feratzinal"

A name I just made up. So it has no connotations.

[rfranklin]

5. It still has the name Izrael hidden inside...

That will never fly.

[elfin]

6. Armageddonia nt

[warrior1]

12. Canaanites

http://www.truthbeknown.com/exodus.htm

"The truth is that virtually every modern archeologist who has investigated the story of the Exodus, with very few exceptions, agrees that the way the Bible describes the Exodus is not the way it happened, if it happened at all," Wolpe told his congregants.

Wolpe's startling sermon may have seemed blasphemy to some. In fact, however, the rabbi was merely telling his flock what scholars have known for more than a decade. Slowly and often outside wide public purview, archeologists are radically reshaping modern understanding of the Bible. It was time for his people to know about it, Wolpe decided.

After a century of excavations trying to prove the ancient accounts true, archeologists say there is no conclusive evidence that the Israelites were ever in Egypt, were ever enslaved, ever wandered in the Sinai wilderness for 40 years or ever conquered the land of Canaan under Joshua's leadership. To the contrary, the prevailing view is that most of Joshua's fabled military campaigns never occurred--archeologists have uncovered ash layers and other signs of destruction at the relevant time at only one of the many battlegrounds mentioned in the Bible.

Today, the prevailing theory is that Israel probably emerged peacefully out of Canaan--modern-day Lebanon, southern Syria, Jordan and the West Bank of Israel--whose people are portrayed in the Bible as wicked idolators. Under this theory, the Canaanites who took on a new identity as Israelites were perhaps joined or led by a small group of Semites from Egypt--explaining a possible source of the Exodus story, scholars say. As they expanded their settlement, they may have begun to clash with neighbors, perhaps providing the historical nuggets for the conflicts recorded in Joshua and Judges.

snip

[IdaBriggs]

16. Way cool -- thanks for sharing! nt

[megatherium]

13. How about Judah? nt

[NoPasaran]

14. While we're at it. let's go for corporate sponsership

WalMartonia anyone?

[maddezmom]

19. locking

does not meet guidelines
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=1809690&mesg_id=1809690